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Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Spacesballs lightsabers being ring-mounted. It's gonna rotate and cut off your other fingers!

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Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Death Sticks.

SidneyIsTheKiller posted:

The rings didn't actually do anything, they were like a placebo for getting you to believe in your own power. Remember, "The Schwartz is in you. The Schwartz is in YOU"

It's true.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




The best mech anime is Patlabor, because it's about keystone cops using their giant mech to cover up when they gently caress up fishing.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Khizan posted:

I have to go with stormtrooper armor, because it's clumsy full body armor that I don't think has ever stopped a single attack. I can't recall a single time in any of the movies or the Mandolorian when anybody every had to hit a stormtrooper twice, with anything. Blaster, club, rocks, doesn't matter, it won't protect against it.

For all the design flaws of the Stargate, at least it loving works. Stormtrooper armor is just a sign letting you know that you can kill the wearer without feeling bad about it.

Blasters seem to only be dangerous to people wearing storm trooper armor, which is nuts. Leia gets shot in 6 and it's like, not even quite as bad as a rubber bullet, let alone a regular bullet.

I know armies tend to build weapons that are really designed to counter their own armor, but it's pretty nuts to have a weapon that's not even effective against unarmored people.

e: To be clear, I'm tossing in star wars blasters as a contender for shittiest piece of garbage tech

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Ghost Leviathan posted:

\
Warhammer 40k also has all of those things, though I think only Terra and maybe Mars are full on city planets.

According to the 40k wiki, there are about 32,380 planets that share the designation of "Hive Planet."

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Ghost Leviathan posted:

For the post part, Hive Worlds are usually worlds that have massive Hive Cities, huge arcologies that stretch high into the sky and below the ground, with most of the planet's surface being polluted wasteland. Actual full-on city planets are rarer.

I'm just going off the wiki; a lot of the Hive Worlds have populations of 20-25 billion, which is small compared to Earth ('unknown, hundreds of billions') but perfectly comparable to Mars, which is 20 billion. AFAIK there's no special canon designation for "larger than Hive World" - Earth is also a "Hive World" though apparently it can be called a "super Hive World."

Mars, obviously, is not a Hive Planet at all, because it is Forge World (and a ludicrously huge one at that - the only other Forge World I found population for was Agripinaa, which was is 0.08 billion).

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Ghost Leviathan posted:

I was just guessing on Mars, so okay, fair.

Most sci-fi basically treats planets as... countries is often generous, more like individual cities, Warhammer at least is self-aware about it.

Yeah it's a definite improvement over Star Wars, where each planet is apparently a four block area tiled endlessly without variation.

I rather liked Warframe's handling, where the one solar system on representation is a significantly contested series series of zones. It doesn't do that good at like, making most of them feel alive or like an actual planet, but it's nice that they don't just say 'it's fractious,' they put in the legwork.

Also going to submit "most of Warframe" for shittiest sci-fi tech. Of the 4 most impressive and incredible Orokin inventions, 4 of them became autonomous and revolted against the Orokin, including 2 that were explicitly weapons to protect the Orokin.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Space stations are a pretty good conceit if you're in a fiction where habitable planets and terraforming are not significant/easy, but when you've got like, DS9 and Star Trek tech, it mostly raises more questions than it answers.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Necromunda's cool.

Ghost Leviathan posted:

Deep Space Nine is specifically an ore refining facility and basically watchtower over Cardassian-occupied Bajor, and after the pilot becomes the checkpoint for the Bajoran wormhole. It's basically a frontier fort slash port town.

Starbases have been a thing since TOS, with the sensible reason that it's much easier to dock and maintain a starship at them than to land on a planet, especially given many Star Trek starships were never meant to enter atmosphere, let alone land.

Ore refining is such a weird thing to do in orbit that it raises really confusing questions.

Really the issue here is that DS9 in particular can't decide if resource scarcity matters or not. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't, who knows!

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




I liked that terraforming in Player of Games was explicitly an idle pursuit for the deliberately rural with access to nearly unlimited power.

SlothfulCobra posted:

I mean, if you're gonna call out sci-fi technology just for being scientifically implausible without absurd power and scale requirements, you'll never be happy with anything.

How about Plasmids from Bioshock? Radical genetic engineering that drives you insane along with granting superpowers, and in order to maintain the supply of slug juice, you gotta brainwash little girls to harvest and process it, but to protect the little girls, you gotta brainwash people and strap them into a diver suit.

Why did any of that sound like a good idea?

I'm here to ask you a question: is a man not entitled to the sweat of his brow?

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Machado de Assis posted:

How did this get to page 5 and already mention a weapon from Star Trek without anyone pointing out what a piece of poo poo the bat'leth is

Honestly I always thought it was kind of one of the little jokes of ST: Klingons are like many warrior cultures (e.g. Sparta) and are basically pure marketing that performs poorly in actual combat.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




frogge posted:

Subspace communications.

I can suspend disbelief at FTL travel, but for some reason what's essentially a facetime call that has a good connection and also not have any delay or feedback with a caller light years away irks me.

I know WH40K gets around that with psychics. But I just expect interstellar communications basically devolving into text messages or telegrams at best.

In Planetes they'd have phone calls from like, the moon to earth, and the phones would have a little loading bar to make sure you were aware of the lag between you and the recipient. You'd see really heated arguments where the person you were watching would would go through a whole range of emotions every time they were waiting for the response from the other side.

That said, thing about FTL is that once you've engineered your way around c, then all bets are off on any element of physics working any more. Things like "conservation of mass" and "causality" become suspect.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Ghost Leviathan posted:

It's kind of a miracle that Quark's holosuites work as well as they do, with the only real malfunction coming from either deliberate loving with them or the time they plugged the transporters into it to deal with THEIR malfunction, considering Rom has to keep them working with whatever he can scavenge from Ferengi, Cardassian, Bajoran and Federation tech, and used parts from Quark's old pistol and a spatula, probably because Quark won't give him the budget to get proper replacement parts. It's no wonder he's as good as O'Brien, in some ways even better, when he actually gets a proper engineering job.

Rom is probably the most competent person on DS9.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Schadenboner posted:

I really really liked early Star Wars where Han Solo was just a dirtbag with a ship that was p.deece but that fundamentally amounted to one of the hot rods in American Graffiti and the gift of gab.

No, parsec didn't need to be re-defined as a measure of time you loving assholes, he was just fleecing a rube. No every road in the galaxy didn't need to somehow run through Mos Eisley.

Imagine instead that those narratives are by Luke himself using sockpuppets to make himself look less dumb.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




High Precision Transporters would be an incredible medical advance.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




It's also valuable for genre objectives: the whole theory of space war in Star Wars is WW2 Pacific Front, and part of American self-perception with WW2 and the Pacific Front especially was a notion that American choices about military equipment and engineering was not just technically superior but morally superior as well. As the IJN got more desperate and found itself resorting to subpar equipment and suicide attacks, Americans came to treat this as a moral failing of the Japanese people.

While the political parallels of Imperial Japan vs United States of America are basically not applicable, the film memory of Zeroes getting dunked on by Hellcats was maintained in the scifi.

(also fun to point out that for ep4, when the special effects weren't done, dogfighting stock footage was used both for inspiration and as placeholder)

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Admiralty Flag posted:

I'm the Mass Effect Citadel, the product of an incredibly old and technologically advanced race

They knew how to build Mass Relays, but faster-than-walking-pace elevators eluded them

I think they knew how, they just liked slow elevators.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




SlothfulCobra posted:

How fast do you walk straight up 5 stories?

Not faster than it takes your squadmates to have a little conversation and the next area to load I bet.

Admiralty Flag has the thighs of a Dwarf Fortress dwarf: can climb a full flight of stairs in the same length of time they can walk 10 feet.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Robot Style posted:

There's also distinctions between different kinds of shields. Ray shields only protect against lasers and blasters, but allow physical objects through. Though that's not even consistent within the movies, since ray shields will allow a torpedo through to blow up the Death Star, but also trap Anakin and Obi-Wan in ROTS.

Maybe Ray Shields are called "ray" shields b/c they go one way.

The funniest thing to me about Star Wars ships is that SDs don't seem to be built for any particular purpose. They're comically undergunned for their size, they have a fighter contingent but it doesn't seem primary, and they have a ton of AT-ATs but they're battleships. I think they're just converted from civilian ships.

Also according to Wookipedia they cost 150,000,000 credits. Han tries to charge Luke and Kenobi 10,000 credits for a one way trip to Alderaan. That's just...lmao

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Schadenboner posted:

Why wouldnt this be weaponized by the Klingons or Romulans or whomever else?

The Federation are so staggeringly bad spycraft that this would never occur to them.

E: to defend against, that is

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Sanguinia posted:

The old legends specs for an Imperial II Star Destroyer say it's carrying about 75 Turbolaser Batteries, 50 Turbolaser Cannons and 20 Ion Cannons on top of those 8 big broadside mega-guns. So I'd say that's solid for the size.

That's...very small by warship standards.

So this is what I am aware of about the largest guns on an ISD




This is, generously, twice as big as a WW2 16" gun system, though I could understand how it could be smaller. Having 6 by this source or 8 by yours, the ISD has between 4 and 6 times as much total volume dedicated to its main cannons as an Iowa, while the total volume of an ISD is something like 2000 times (being extremely sloppy on this one, I'm treating the ISD as a pyramid of height 1600 and side 600, while the Iowa is treated as a rectangular prism of 262*33*11). So proportionally, the ISD is about 0.3% as dedicated to its main cannons as a USN Iowa. The secondary weapons don't really move the needle - 75x turbolaser batteries vs 80x 40mm cannons, 50x turbolaser cannons vs 49x 20mm cannons, 10x ion cannon vs 12x 5" guns, honestly a kind of fun parallelism.

Looking at Wookiepedia, I do find something pretty funny: the ISD has 37,000 crew (so, 10x as much as an Iowa, sure), but also is designed to hold 9,700 storm troopers and a similar number of passengers on top of that, with enough supplies to last for 2 years, including water. Which is bizarre - ISDs have extremely good strategic speed, they shouldn't need to operate independently for 2 years. The ship is ready to just gently caress around for 2 years with 1/3 of the people on board not actually manning engines or guns. This thing's a war-themed luxury cruise line.

Also this is one of the funniest things I've read

https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Imperial_I-class_Star_Destroyer posted:

Like other Star Destroyers, a single Internal Affairs officer was stationed aboard the ship to scan the crew for signs of disloyalty and sedition, as well as interrogate any captured prisoner

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Some Goon posted:

Star Destroyers are the Empires main projection. The longer they can operate without stopping the more force the empire can spread around.

So, two things. First, if there's anything we know about Star Wars, it's that everything is very, very close. Basically everything inside the Empire's territory seems to be like, a day trip. For example, Alderaan and Yavin are about 40kly apart, and supposedly that took the Death Star (which is canonically slow) about "a few hours." So really, it's like 12 hours go end-to-end on the galaxy (100-120kly, I'm seeing different numbers). A really narrowly purpose built reactive battleship probably doesn't even need toilets.

The other part is that warships are purpose-built, and the ISD is all over the place. It's simultaneously a battleship, a carrier, a troop transport, and an ultra-long-range endurance enforcer. Oh and of course has space for 9000 passengers even when fully laden which lmao.

SlothfulCobra posted:

"War-themed luxury cruise line" is an interesting thing to call them, considering how the rebel Mon Calamari cruisers were originally cruise ships complete with elaborate artificial water features that were repurposed for warfare.

"A top priority for Star Wars ships is that they be good for war tourists" would explain the gigantic viewports and extremely close range fighting.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




1000 Brown M and Ms posted:

Was that ever mentioned in the shows? Admittedly it's been a while since I've watched DS9 but I thought Cardassians had cloaking devices. Of course, I could be confusing that with Star Trek Armada in which the Cardassians definitely had cloaks.

It's a plot point than the Cardassians get cloaking tech from the Romulans in I think S3

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Schadenboner posted:

Aren't bedrooms supposed to have more than one point of egress for, like, fire code?

If so every set of quarters on DS9 appears to be noncompliant (space windows aren't creditable points of egress because of that whole "Hard Vacuum" thing)?



The Cardassians don't want more than one point of egress, that would interfere with their centralized control ethos.

(they really need to remodel that place a lot more thoroughly)

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Ghost Leviathan posted:

There seems a real trend in sci-fi where main characters that would previously be bland and boring or vaguely annoying obvious self-inserts for the target demographic become actively more obnoxious, lovely and creepy. (while still being self-inserts for the audience, and somehow thinking the audience is meant to like the idea)

The Transformers movies might be a good example, even SMG admits Shia LeBouf is absolutely awful, but also that Bay MIGHT be doing that on purpose. (also, I never forget to remind people that Megan Fox's character is named Michaela Banes)

Michaela also has the skillset and character arc that are on theme. Sam Witwicky being the perspective character is loving weird.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Federation ships are smaller b/c they skipped out on fire suppression.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Jiminy Christmas! Shoes! posted:

In a post-scarcity future where energy and material are basically unlimited why wouldn't you prioritize human comfort and privacy over costs?

If we're talking about Scotty's reaction - fashion and expression. Having a more tight, controlled, contained space can communicate more broadly a more professional persona. That or he finds small spaces cozy I guess.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Honestly I think even G's a pretty big drop from R.

The chapter about construction on Mars ruled especially for how it inverted the portrayal of Maya after multiple parts.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Owling Howl posted:

I feel having lethal and non-lethal settings on the same device is more of an issue.

This reminds me of O'Brien aggressively mocking the Cardassians for their redundant systems.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




galagazombie posted:

My favorite was "Cetacean Ops" where they were supposed to have a tank full of dolphins who navigated the ship. Because living in the ocean means they understand 3-Dimensional navigation better you see.

This general idea wound up being an entire major faction in Sword of the Stars.

No tech in Sword of the Stars was lovely though the game's insistence on an actually 3D star map was 1) cool and 2) headache inducing enough that I get why most games don't do that.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




McSpanky posted:

I saw a fanon Star Trek map once that tried to do this to reconcile some of the distance discrepancies, having some territories/locations overlap on the Z-axis so that some of the Gorn Hegemony was "over" the Federation and such, and yes it quickly causes more problems than it solves. The big one being that it causes you to question how traditional terrestrial concepts of territory and boundaries would even apply to a topography composed of pinpricks of useful area surrounded by incomprehensibly vast regions of empty void.

tbh the main thing I think about when I see a Star Trek map is "isn't like 90% of the economy and political power of each of these empires in their capital, what's even the point of the rest of this, is it symbolic claims?"

SOTS it was actually relatively comprehensible, though if you were playing on some map types it did hurt to look at. One of the cool parts was that different factions had radically different FTLs, so like Hivers (my main bois) had a fairly uniformly expanding sphere while most people had networks or blobs with lunges.

e: The Punishment Sphere from SMAC. Not that it doesn't work, it's in fact worse that it does.

Tulip fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Aug 7, 2020

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




One of the oldest forms of land use relationships between humans, transhumance, rests on the groups involved understanding that in a fairly long term (annual cycle) and intuitive basis. Or else you get killed by herders.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Barudak posted:


On the note of stupid tech in Evangelion, the tiny dingy they put in the blood sea in central dogma. NERV has the budget for a graveyard of failed mechas, a geofront base, a city inhabited entirely by expensible specialists to make it work 24/7 and they gotta use a repurposed fishing boat to go inspect the god they keep locked up in their basement. The thing has one cheap rope mooring it, what the hell, this is where you cut costs?


I think they liked the ferryman aesthetic.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Box from Logan's Run. I don't even know what the gently caress the deal was with that.

Ghost Leviathan posted:

Fallout does have a big thing with shittons of unexploded nukes laying around, either failed to go off or didn't get to be launched. It's kind of the whole thing with Lonesome Road, also Megaton in 3 and the Chinese submarine in 4. And Mini-Nukes being a thing, too.

Fallout's definitely the least realistic treatment - nuclear weapons are intrinsically unstable and basically self-disarm over time. Most nuclear warheads today spend huge amounts of time in maintenance. The nuke in Megaton for example shouldn't be functional anymore, it should just be leaking poison into the drinking water.

Like a lot of SciFi, Fallout functions better if you ignore the IRL physics and treat it as magic being used for a literary end.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Ghost Leviathan posted:

Fallout in general more or less explicitly treats everything radiation related in a gonzo sci-fi way rather than realistically. Though also might have something to do with how America in the alt timeline was enthusiastically working on nuke technology nonstop for almost 150 years.

Fallout doesn't make much sense as a setting about nukes and war but does make sense as a setting about "I'm afraid of the world moving on after I die."
Amazing.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




SlothfulCobra posted:

Fallout 3 was the dumbest one

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Defiance Industries posted:

The NCR is pretty explicitly an Old West-level society that has some scavenged high tech gear they can maintain, but not reproduce. But that's Obsidian, who actually get the series.

FNV is on a whole other level. "In this setting about nostalgia and memory, let's have fascists who are Rome themed" is such an obvious choice that it's almost criminal negligence that Bethesda never uses anything similar.

BiggestOrangeTree posted:

Maybe all of fiction is an allegory for the nuclear bomb.

The time ring from Braid can do so much time travel, but can it make a creepy goon not creepy? Nope! gently caress that!

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




Barudak posted:

Which is baffling because the nuclear war that ended the world was, in game, 200 years prior to the events of Fallout New Vegas. Im not saying that the world should be perfectly hunky dory or whatever, just, you know within 150 years of the black death in Europe they discovered the new world.

Fallout is an unintended comedy about how little nerds think about anything that isn't nostalgia or action sets.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




SlothfulCobra posted:

The best post-apocalyptic settings are the ones where the entire world has moved on from just being depressed about the old world dying anyways, because in the real-world that's what would happen. Time marches on, and all the survivors have things to do to keep survivin'. Reign of Fire is an alright example; Nausicaa is a fantastic one.

The Crypt of Shuwa seems like a more realistic take on how a long plan to restore humanity would go compared to Asimov's Foundation.

I read Prince of Thorns a few years ago and I'd say it qualifies as a pretty cool setting that is well articulated and pulls off a good balance of "people think about the pre-apocalypse but they've also developed a society with art and philosophy since then that isn't 100% backwards looking." Unfortunately I'd also say the book is just not good as a book.

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Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

I have no country to fight for; my country is the earth; I am a citizen of the world.




aphid_licker posted:

Dumb question: why are there none? Too dangerous to use if you don't have heightened force reflexes or something?

Because the only people who would choose to bring a sword to an assault rifle fight are so hopped up on midiclorians that they're about to revolutionize jizz.

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