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What I like most about the Dead trilogy as a whole is that I love each of them for completely different reasons. Night is impressive for its originality, the obvious effort that went into it from enthusiastic and talented filmmakers without a budget, the isolated creeping dread to it (its mood is one of my favorites from any movie), the b&w photography, and Jones is a great lead. Dawn is paradoxically more fun and also more melancholy. Its a full apocalyptic prep movie, and I enjoy watching characters going through plans and setting up a perimeter, corralling the dead, looting the stores for supplies, all that poo poo. The amped up gore. And unlike Night, none of the main characters are unlikable. They're just people trying to create a normal life in an increasingly abnormal world. Day is the death of that dream. It's post apocalyptic nihilism. The only survivors are armed madmen and those they deemed valuable enough to keep alive. Any trace of humanity or intellectualism is seen as a weakness or a threat. What's left of mankind is worse than the zombies. That's why Rhodes is so over the top, to clearly differentiate him and his followers as being far more dangerous than the living dead, a militarized political continuation of the roving bikers in Dawn. Half the cast are some brand of psycho, but it plays like an exaggeration because it needs to, and thats why I love Pilato in the role. The score is great, and the gore is the crown jewel of Savini's career. If Night was a latent commentary about racism, and Dawn is about consumerism, then Day is at least about militarized fascism and our tendency to backslide into it, and all are revealing that the end of the species is ultimately due to some great flaw that lies within the human heart.
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Aug 27, 2020 01:00
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The best part of the Dead trilogy is how goddamn right Romero was about everything.
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Aug 27, 2020 01:04
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Yeah, ultimately the trilogy is just so good because they all do different things so well. Even if Day is my least favorite because its too nihilistic for my tastes, its still got so much to it and I get what Romero was saying. They all have a voice and a purpose beyond "zombie movie."
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Aug 27, 2020 01:11
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Jedit posted:That's a good assessment, but it's not an argument for Dawn being the weakest of the trilogy. Day lacks the very heart that you're lauding Dawn for possessing. Weakest is on a very high scale here. All three are masterworks and it comes down to personal preference. Day is perhaps the most hostile, and that's perhaps what I respond to about it most. You feel how trapped the characters are and the military hierarchy bearing down on the survivors. It's a grueling film, one that makes you wish you could jump in there and beat Joseph Pilato's captain silly. You also get Bub, who brings that humanity back into focus. It works precisely because it's the point in the narrative where people have lost their sense of humanity, they've begun losing hope, they're destroying themselves more than anything (a theme in all the films, but perhaps felt to its most dire, extinction level extremes here). But through Bub you get this regained sense that humanity still exists, that what makes people people is still inherently there. Night is still my favorite of the three however. Such a perfect lightning bolt of a film, easily the most politically daring and still among the most gruesome and tragic of them all.
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Aug 27, 2020 01:32
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I enjoy Day the most and the writeups on the trilogy itt are very appreciated. Good stuff all around.
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Aug 27, 2020 01:51
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As tonight is the final night of voting for this round, I would just like to quote and repost Burkion's amazing defense of Ishiro Honda. I wanted to write my own argument for Half Human and Honda, but there's nothing I could write as perfect as this. I do believe he is right about how we navigate this tournament, for the same reasons Fran and others defended Stuart Gordon (winning over my vote in the process). Ultimately, this may be a film vs. film competition but it's a tournament of directors. Parasite may be a better film, but Honda's work has so much charm, enthusiasm and vigor that I can't just quietly watch him lose without a fight. I implore you all to re-read Burkion's words here and weigh your final decision this round carefully before tomorrow's results come in. Go Go Godzilla. Burkion posted:What to say, what to do, what to say
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Aug 27, 2020 02:11
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Bong Joon-Ho's Parasite vs. Ishiro Honda's Half Human Wow, Parasite really lived up to the hype. I wasn’t sure it would. I didn’t love Memories of Murder and I was worried I’d feel the same way about this mid way through. I was enjoying it more. It was funny and clever and had heart and the main characters were flawed and doing unethical stuff but it wasn’t asking me to empathize with abusive cops framing people. But as it was going on 90 minutes I wasn’t really feeling the level of award and praise and wasn’t sure how it could tie up well without taking forever. But then holy poo poo, the whole final act(s) kick in like a ton of bricks. From wacky to dark to angry to HOLY poo poo to sad. Just a captivating ride that completely delivered. A complicated and deep messaging asking who the “parasites” are and making me feel like the answer is “maybe we all are, lets have more empathy and decency for each other.” Just a great film I’m really looking forward to watching again, that left me breathless and unable to watch more afterwards, and has me adding a bunch of Bong films to my watchlist. I wanted to like Half Human. I really did. Burketts put in so much effort and Parasite is an iffy horror film. Plus, I love an underdog. But I just didn’t like it. And honestly, the stuff i didn’t like were probably the director’s fault. I though the pacing was bad. The first act moves to slow and then just as the movie gets going there’s this whole side story that is important but is entirely self contained and removed from the main story. So then 30 minutes later i’m just returned to me regular film and its like, “huh?” I get it but do I care? The other thing I really didn’t like was that thing Revenge of the Creature did where they spend the entire film making the “monster” sympathetic and as unmonster as they can, and it works and I feel for it. But then it goes and makes him a full monster at the end so everyone can go heroically save the damsel in distress. I guess points for Chika being the hero but it felt unnecessary and a betrayal to me. I didn’t like it and it feels like a cheap way to get to an ending. So as much as I kinda want to vote for Honda I don’t think I can. Parasite isn’t really a horror film but its dark enough in those finale 40 minutes or so that I can make peace with voting for it. I respect Honda’s influence and want to see more of his films, but I’m finally open to all the hype about Bong and want to see more of him. I’ll be watching the Host in October anyway if it doesn’t come up here and I’ll probably do a couple of Kaiju/Toho nights too. So I’m not voting on what I want to see next. Ultimately I just loved one film and didn’t like the other at all.
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Aug 27, 2020 06:36
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STAC Goat posted:Bong Joon-Ho's Parasite vs. Ishiro Honda's Half Human This is fine, but you fundamentally misunderstand the whole thing with the Yeti. The monster is sympathetic from start to finish- he doesn't go out of his way to kill people beyond those that killed his son and last relative and taking his rage out on the village- but most of them survived. They just fled further into the hills. Chika's grandfather would have also survived if he hadn't been shot. The only people the Yeti killed directly were those who attacked him. Chika also isn't exactly the hero. She goes into the cave wanting to kill the Yeti- you can see her contemplating the knife the entire time. She blames the Yeti for her entire life, for how she was raised, for how her village is, and for what he has and has not done- even though, as the movie shows, the Yeti was more humane and more moral than her own grandfather OR the poachers. She never intended to save the other girl, it was always a ploy to try and stab the Yeti. Now you can understand why she would, just like you can understand why the Yeti would be a mite upset after his child was killed and all of his race died out. This doesn't make her the bad guy- but the movie in no way paints this as black and white clear cut. The monster is still sympathetic, even as it plunges into the sulfur below. Just as Chika is. The two are linked in that way, lashing out in a moment of weakness despite being otherwise good 'people'. Its fine to prefer Parasite over Half Human, I fully expect Honda to lose this, but don't misunderstand the film. It's not exactly a subtle story.
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Aug 27, 2020 06:47
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I mean, even if we can assume the Yeti somehow had the ability to know he'd only kill the rear end in a top hat elder he still destroyed their village. A bunch of them are gonna die and life is gonna suck for awhile. Aren't they in snow too? Those villagers are hosed. Also the lady from the exploration party he kidnaps and ragdolls leading to the Chika fight. Its that same tired monster trope where the monster kidnaps the damsel so you can have the end. But like it kind of undermines everything before. I really did feel for the guy up until that point. Poachers had it coming. The village was tough but I was still riding residual empathy. But then he just goes all Fay Wray and it felt very lazy and hackneyed to me. And maybe saying something from 1955 is "hackneyed" is a tough call but it just didn't work for me at all. And I was already on shaky ground due to the pacing stuff I said. I get what you're saying about the Yeti and Chika having that shared thing of losing everyone and blaming each other. But Chika had a slightly stronger case because at least she was lashing out at the same Yeti. Yeti just lashed out at all people, and again, I think that's my key issue with the film. Having the poachers, main team, and village all so detached from each other messed up the flow of the story for me and made Yeti's path of rage indiscriminate. I don't blame the Yeti for this. He had a rough run. I blame the story. Also I have no idea why I called you Burketts. A weird autocorrect. My bad.
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Aug 27, 2020 08:25
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STAC Goat posted:James Whale's Frankenstein vs. Stuart Gordon's The Pit and the Pendulum James Whale's Frankenstein vs. Stuart Gordon's The Pit and the Pendulum - Redux I rewatched it. I really, really like it. Great lead performance. Great Karloff. EReally enoy how there's no real villain of the story. Frankenstein is a scientist who stops when he realizes the danger of his situation. The Monster is just a confused thing. Victor, Baron Frankenstein, Burger Meister. They're all fine. Fritz is kind of a dick but I interpret him as a guy who has spent his entire life being looked down on taking that out on the person he meets who he thinks might be "less human" than him. Which enhances it to me. I know its not Bride, its still really great. And it has the greatest opening in horrir history. BARNONE. I gave it a rewatch because of the effort posts made for it. I definitely think my sleep deprivation hurt that first viewing. The film itself looked much livelier and better. Insomnia does that to you. Everything is in a fog. I didn't even notice some of the actors or plot points the first time. I found it more confusing and this time, it was fine. Simple. I was just out of my mind. Still, I didn't really like it that much. It was fine but it didn't do anything special for me. And I still found the comedy really strange and out of place. It felt like Gordon watched Mel Brooks' History of the World before filming and couldn't get it out of his head or something. It felt really out of place to me and I've seen Gordon work comedy into horror better. But I'm glad i gave it the rewatch. It was a better film than that first time totally and I shouldn't watch when I'm sleepy. But that's hard when you're an insomniac and on a deadline. Still. Frankenstein gets it. Its closer this time. I could have voted Pit and The Pendulum over other moveis in this round or elsewhere. But not over Frankenstein. Sorry.
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Aug 27, 2020 08:56
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Pit was originally supposed to be more of a comedy, in line with Re-Animator. Henriksen, however, chose to play his part method and refused to add the comedic touches, as they didn't match his vision for the character. The result is a more serious tone that admittedly drowns out a lot of the humour.
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Aug 27, 2020 12:26
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I'm really excited to see the results of this round. It was not easy. There were a lot of good posts, notably Burkion's Half Human post, Debbie's Pit & Pendulum post, and the discourse about the Dead series.
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Aug 27, 2020 14:15
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Results! Miike being at his gross-out best is enough to tangle with the Tingler, with a plurality so Deathdream didn't even factor in. Take that, Nader supporters! Stuart Gordon got just enough to advance!  Romero won.  Burkion you beautiful bastard, you Mr. Smith Goes to Washington'd your way into a bad 380p archive.org film of a lost rubber-suit monster movie tying with the consensus Best Picture of 2019 and highest-rated movie in Letterboxd history. Take a bow! 
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Aug 27, 2020 14:19
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Holy poo poo. Just...man. Did not expect those results. I voted for Honda! My vote made a difference!
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Aug 27, 2020 14:22
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Holy poo poo, did NOT expect these results apart from Romero crushing de Palma.
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Aug 27, 2020 14:22
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Wow. Just wow. Lil sad to see De Palma go. I always knew he was a great director, but he seems to get left out of the conversation of horror directors, outside of Carrie and Phantom of the Paradise, and he's got enough heavy hitters to be as much in the conversation as Wes Craven and John Carpenter. Happy to see Miike and Stuart Gordon move on as well! And more Honda! What a ride.
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Aug 27, 2020 14:23
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Of note: Tinseltown and Rome have collectively sent 8 out of the top 8 seeds (plus Bong Joon-Ho) into the sweet six-scream. Rome unceremoniously dumped their 1,2 and 3 seeds and Duos didn't even let their #1 seed get out of the culling stages. Top brackets are for traditionalists, bottom brackets for  Also, side note: the third post isn't just the link to vote if you don't want to dig for the post. I've been updating the links to go to the results post instead of the voting post, so you can see the reactions to each one by scrolling down. Duos round 2 up in a bit.
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Aug 27, 2020 14:27
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I never thought Gordon would have a shot against Frankenstein. I think it's a good thing for the tournament going forward because yea we all know Bride of Frankenstein is a masterpiece but I think Gordon has some super entertaining stuff still to come that not everyone has seen.
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Aug 27, 2020 14:27
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Basebf555 posted:I never thought Gordon would have a shot against Frankenstein. I think it's a good thing for the tournament going forward because yea we all know Bride of Frankenstein is a masterpiece but I think Gordon has some super entertaining stuff still to come that not everyone has seen. It's incredibly exciting. This tournament has now turned into a battle of New Favorites vs Underdogs vs Genre Defining Directors. Gonna be a sweet sweet bloodbath.
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Aug 27, 2020 14:29
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Basebf555 posted:Holy poo poo. Just...man. Did not expect those results. I voted against Bong because Parasite isn't a horror movie. But Jesus, people, some of those results are travesties.
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Aug 27, 2020 14:32
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Jedit posted:I voted against Bong because Parasite isn't a horror movie. But Jesus, people, some of those results are travesties. It's a free-for-all baby. Nobody is safe.
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Aug 27, 2020 14:33
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I genuinely thought The Tingler had it in the bag, with how much of a crowd favorite it is. However, I think Miike is just much more creative and interesting as a director than Castle, despite his fun gimmicks and infectious sense of theater. I really miss his brand of interactive cinematic experiences. 4D theaters weirdly miss the mark, despite being more advanced than a rubber skellington falling from the ceiling during the climax or asking the audience to scream as loud as they can. But Miike's movies make me sit and think for a while afterwards, and his genre-hopping career makes his films even more fascinating.
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Aug 27, 2020 14:40
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Goddamn not the results I anticipated at all (except Romero romping De Palma, that was clearly coming). Also, holy poo poo that means Round 3 we have to figure out a Romero/Bong/Honda triple threat.
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Aug 27, 2020 14:53
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TrixRabbi posted:Goddamn not the results I anticipated at all (except Romero romping De Palma, that was clearly coming). Also, holy poo poo that means Round 3 we have to figure out a Romero/Bong/Honda triple threat. (I don't know what the matchups are, it gets randomized day-of)
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Aug 27, 2020 15:01
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The Host couldn't tangle with either of those one on one but I could see Godzilla and NotLD splitting the vote allowing The Host to come ahead.
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Aug 27, 2020 15:02
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Speaking of results, where did we come down on Peter Jackson's film lineup?
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Aug 27, 2020 15:08
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TrixRabbi posted:Speaking of results, where did we come down on Peter Jackson's film lineup? I feel like the response was completely in the pro-Heavenly Creatures inclusion. The movie begins and ends with horror, it's entire 2nd half is a thriller with horror elements, and even it's fantasy elements has a horror-adjacent feel with the clay figures alive (like golems). And if you find homophobia, sexual repression, and parents who don't know how to accept their children at all dark or horrific, well, there you go.
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Aug 27, 2020 15:15
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I can only conclude from these results that voters have been pretty involved and interested in the thread posts this round. That's groovy. Even the biggest titans and legendary horrors need an effort post going forward, taking nothing for granted.
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Aug 27, 2020 15:15
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Yeah. Part of the thrill of this tournament is that of course a lot of the big guns have stomped their way through the first couple rounds. Now it's tightening up and truly anyone could go down on one bad draw.
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Aug 27, 2020 15:18
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TrixRabbi posted:Yeah. Part of the thrill of this tournament is that of course a lot of the big guns have stomped their way through the first couple rounds. Now it's tightening up and truly anyone could go down on one bad draw. Yes. It's been rapidly apparent, especially in the last two rounds, that if you want your movie to win, classic or not, you better write about it. No one's gonna call you an idiot or fool for sharing your feelings or insights. Legacy only goes so far, as shown with Frankenstein. And name and cultural significance hasn't saved big names like Wes Craven.  and then rapidly edit your post two or three times to clarify points and add thoughts like I do.I don't know how Romero's going to move forward, though. For me, Dawn and Martin were his meal tickets. Night and Day are solid*, but Crazies and Bruiser and The Dark Half and Monkey Shines could send him home. (I have no idea what else he has in the running.) *don't @ me you cowards Franchescanado fucked around with this message at 15:37 on Aug 27, 2020 |
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Aug 27, 2020 15:35
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Lol go Honda. Burk, keep it up, your boy might just win it all! There was some real good movies this round.
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Aug 27, 2020 15:39
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I think Night or Day both give him a very strong chance of getting through, depending on what the other two draw. If I end up having to choose between NotLD and Gojira that's gonna be real tough.
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Aug 27, 2020 15:40
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MacheteZombie posted:Lol go Honda. I really liked the skiing and mountain landscapes of Half Human. No joke, it's a very pretty movie in many ways. Great framing.
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Aug 27, 2020 15:41
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If Honda draws Godzilla he may win next round. But Romero has Night and Day of the Dead in his roster and I feel like if Honda gets anything but Godzilla it's gonna be tough to overcome either of those. Romero's got Creepshow and The Crazies also in the cannon, which are lesser entries but he's got a 50/50 of getting a Dead film whereas Honda has a 25% chance of Godzilla. I don't know if Bong's remaining films are strong enough to stand out on their own, though he could benefit from a split vote.
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Aug 27, 2020 15:41
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TrixRabbi posted:If Honda draws Godzilla he may win next round. But Romero has Night and Day of the Dead in his roster and I feel like if Honda gets anything but Godzilla it's gonna be tough to overcome either of those. Romero's got Creepshow and The Crazies also in the cannon, which are lesser entries but he's got a 50/50 of getting a Dead film whereas Honda has a 25% chance of Godzilla. I don't know if Bong's remaining films are strong enough to stand out on their own, though he could benefit from a split vote. Oh, well, my top 3 Romero movies are Martin, Dawn and Creepshow. Not a fan of The Crazies; Monkey Shines is my B-tier Romero that I like a lot. And Bruiser is really interesting, and has been so appropriate for the last few years, with class warfare being such a popular theme in films. edit: Can I get the cheat sheet on Honda's remaining films, please? Spoiler'd of course, for those that wanna remain in the dark.
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Aug 27, 2020 15:46
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Franchescanado posted:I really liked the skiing and mountain landscapes of Half Human. No joke, it's a very pretty movie in many ways. Great framing. Yeah, it'd be a great movie for a remaster just to get clearer looks at those landscape shots. e: tourney crew needs a gang tag
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Aug 27, 2020 15:51
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Ishiro Honda Rodan Half Human Godzilla Matango The Human Vapor Frankenstein Conquers the World He's got a mixed bag. I don't think that last film is going to do him too well if he draws it, but it's weird as hell. Never seen The Human Vapor so not sure how that would hold up. Godzilla is easily his strongest, Matango is second best, though I personally find it a tad too slow. Honestly, I'm probably already in the bag for Romero next round but will wait and see to reserve final judgment.
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Aug 27, 2020 15:51
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DUOS! Shindō has his work cut out for him. Onibaba is very pretty, but Eggers essentially made a foreign-language film where a baby gets eaten in the first ten minutes for his first movie and it landed with universal acclaim. Oh, and Chuck Russell defined Freddy as the slasher of the 80s with some of the best practical effects and a fun-as-poo poo movie that brings back Nancy Thompson  Nothing to say here except Toni Collette was absolutely robbed of an Oscar, hell she wasn't even nominated which is insane because she carries this movie on her back. Meanwhile Babadook is gay and GET OUT is the best movie of the last 10 years (non-Parasite Division)  Yuzna might sneak this one through. Society is not great, but has the best last 20 minutes of any movie possibly ever. Hooper draws his last dud, a 3 hour made-for-TV movie that he isn't even credited with directing on his Letterboxd page.  Folks. Christine is real good. It's better than you remember and a lot of what it's doing is both scary and fun as poo poo. It's the rare good King adaptation. Christine, in a word, well: Christine Slaps. But Alien Fucks This is your reminder that we are voting on THESE FILMS AND THESE FILMS ONLY, not on a Director's ouvre. I watched Wes Craven get knocked out in the first round, you fuckers better not vote for Carpenter on principle. If you think Christine is better than Alien, I wanna see at least 500 words explaining your vote. VOTE HERE! VOTE NOW!
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Aug 27, 2020 15:53
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MacheteZombie posted:e: tourney crew needs a gang tag I feel like the slogan has gotta be "Who will survive and what will be left of them?"
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Aug 27, 2020 15:53
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TrixRabbi posted:I feel like the slogan has gotta be "Who will survive and what will be left of them?" *hand clap emote* wow small round for new watches for me. Onibaba and Salem's Lot. Though Hooper getting a tv movie that he's not credited for seems iffy y'all.
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Aug 27, 2020 15:56
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