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Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

RoboCicero posted:

In Library of Ruina is there a known bug where swapping Key Pages can mulch all the combat cards assigned to that deck? I feel like I keep losing cards that way unless they're stored somewhere else.

Combat cards are assigned to the key pages themselves, you need to go and remove them from the old key page to use them on a different one.

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Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
Claws can also just outright be overpowered, such as when Kali killed two of them at once. A lot of the Head's MO seems to be sending in arbiters and claws at the target's lowest point when they're unable to put up a strong resistance, and even then that doesn't always work out for them.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
It's worth noting that even in Ruina It's entirely possible to be winning that final fight, it's rough especially with how weak Roland is, but that's not a fight they were guaranteed to win even with attacking the library at its weakest if you play well. Also I'm pretty sure Gebura is still notably weaker than Kali by the end of Ruina, especially without the Library strengthening her, on top of the fight ending before Gebura can actually use her EGO. The Head isn't nearly as invincible as it wants people to believe.

Cirina fucked around with this message at 09:57 on Sep 23, 2021

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
For Library of Ruina, does the game ever actually give a solid answer on if losses or refights are things that actually happen like the loops in lobcorp? I don't actually remember if it ever did and just assumed that was all just a gameplay thing with a rare exception like Kali.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
So apparently the attack power difference (which raises are you level up) gives you a bonus in clashes, so if you're really struggling in a fight it could be that you're simply underleveled rather than have a bad team.

Also my code is L318859111, I've got 000 Don and Gregor uptied, as well as 00 Lobotomy Corp Faust and Mariachi Sinclair.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
So is it just me or is that ego gift that unstaggers enemies at the start of a turn and gives them bleed for a few rounds instead kinda bad.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

Einander posted:

Something subtle in chapter 2 I realized a while after doing the conclusion: the other people at the table would have destroyed the Limbus team if they tried relying on wishpower because they were impersonating people famous for abusing it, so Dante "unluckily" discharging all that power to get them a bunch of money and to make them rely on Rodion to win was actually the best possible use of that sticker. Aside from it losing Ishmael's respect, anyway. :v: That's pretty clever! Good job, Project Moon.

I'm still slowly going through Chapter 3. It seems to me that once you have the Mirror Dungeon unlocked, it's best to do exactly three new story stages a day until you run out of story stages, since that's a Daily Battle Pass mission and you don't seem to get much for redoing missions. Apparently the reward for Battle Pass levels past the last set reward is selectable character shards, so maximizing BP points seems important if you actually want to hit that 400 shard pity.

I did pull R Corp Ishmael with another 10 and Threaded her up because my team lacks Gloom for Gregor and Hong Lu, so I'm glad it sounds like she'll be useful at the end of the chapter! ...when I get there this weekend. Haven't messed with friend supports, so if there's any reason you need a second person with one, she's on my Friends setting, my code's in a post or two of mine back in the thread.

Something to note is that it doesn't need to be three new stages, it just needs to be any three. Mirror Dungeon clears count for this too and those also get you battle pass progress, as far as I can tell they're completely unmatched in exp per stamina spent as well even once you start getting half rewards after the first five per week. 60 stamina for 6000 exp vs 239 exp for 8 (maybe later chapters give more exp per sanity but I used 1-5 for ease and speed of testing).

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
Oh you're right, the mirror dungeon doesn't count for a stage clear. Could've sworn it did but I was wrong.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
The current level cap for identities is 30.

Also finished chapter 3 tonight. That was a pretty great finale to the current story and I'm looking forward to more.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
edit: nevermind, mixed up identities

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

Einander posted:

Finished chapter 3. Great dungeon! There was way more going on with the events than the prior two, and the final boss was tricky without being TOO rude. And I appreciate that the ending is willing to kill her off and move on, after the first two chapters didn't do that with their antagonists. I particularly liked the dungeon mechanic of "get three pieces of this mark through quests before the boss to buff Sinclair for the big fight" (with there were seemingly four opportunities to get the three pieces); I hope that sort of mechanic is present in future dungeons too. Also had an interesting story detail related to that mark: Demian had the full mark on his head when he showed up at the end, and between that and the mention that Damian never talked to Sinclair when Kromer was around (though they instead put it that Kromer seemed to stay away when Sinclair was talking to Demian), I'm half-expecting it to be a Fight Club situation, where he's supposed to be Sinclair's ideal self or something. Him half-vaporizing Kromer with a wave of his arm feels like evidence for that. Though presumably it happened way before the Days and Nights spilled the Light all over the city, so I'm not sure what could cause it if EGO didn't. Abnormalities, I guess!

Story spoilers related to your own Did you notice that the buff the marks give him is called Courage to Triumph Fear? Sure reminds me of Lobotomy Corp and Library of Ruina there.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

Irony.or.Death posted:

OK, the UI question I'm too dumb to figure out: how do you bring a support unit along? 3-17 is stomping me even with max upties on a full-blunt squad.

You need to click the edit team toggle, then click on someone like you were going to change their identity and ego, there's a support tab up on top. If you don't include them in your team there's a bug(?) that includes them into your party as a 6th member, which I'm not actually sure is a bug since the game functions and accounts for having 6 party members perfectly well.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
Something I've noticed so far is that every single identity we have is small time, also they seem less like 'a path that this person could have taken' and more 'Person A takes on Person B's role' like Faust's Lobotomy Corp identity is just Yuri, complete with the same weapon and missing eye. Corporation grunts and gang leaders for rather pathetic syndicates at most. I wonder if there's going to be higher rarities for actually dangerous people or not.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

Quackles posted:

More questions!

A Sinner's sin resistances are based on the lowest level of EGO they have equipped, right? So if I have Crow's Eye View [ZAYIN, N-N-En-N-F-N-F] and Wishing Cairn [TETH, N-N-In-F-F-N-N] equipped to Yi Sang, his resistances are those of Crow's Eye View, but if I unequip it, he gets the resistances of Wishing Cairn?

What about if I go into a battle with out any EGO equipped?


For Clashes, is it just [Base Power + Coin effects] that determines the number that tracks a clash? Or is there anything else that affects the numbers?

It's impossible to go into battle without an ego, and you will always have a Zayin ego, since if you try to unequip a non-default zayin, it automatically equips the character's default even if you have higher leveled ones. The higher level ego resistances are only relevant in that if they're higher than the zayin's you get an upgrade (but never a downgrade) to them when you use it.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

Ariamaki posted:

You can't unequip your ZAYIN, but it's likely that characters will get alternate ZAYIN in the future given the phrasing on that tooltip... and I think some folks have whaled super-hard on Bus Pass levels and confirmed at least one of those is a ZAYIN EGO.

As for the Clashes, there are a few other effects: Generally speaking it's Base Power (+ or -) Heads Flip Modifier for each coin in the attack, flipped individually, plus effects that grant Coin Power, plus any advantages from overwhelming differences in the Attack Power stat (the sword that is listed next to attacks, the first full +1 comes in around a 5-point difference), and then any relevant effects of EGO Gifts, Passives, or other special mechanics from dungeon events or w/e.

The level 20 free track EGO is a Zayin yes, no need to whale just have to farm mirror dungeons for 3 battle pass points each which well, you have nothing else to spend your stamina on after finishing the story at the moment.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

Nagel und Hammer definitely have access to N corp's singularity though, based on what we know of it from Leviathan and Kromer having used it to see an alternate world where Sinclaire joined her.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
I've played a number of gacha games, and at least with the current setup it feels incredibly generous. Paying $11 every three months to get the ability to get anything you want from the gacha without ever rolling seems more than fair to me. It also seems like a game with an end point in mind rather than one that will continue on forever.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
I got Faust's Fluid Sac EGO from the paid battle pass and it's stupid good as you would expect from an EGO is that is simply her base ego but better. At max uptie it's 16-24 power, aoe targets 5 slots over 3, restores 15 SP and 15% of max hp to the party and its sin requirements are much easier to meet and matches Lob Corp Remnant Faust's skills perfectly. I've always struggled to get pride into a decent party, but it uses Gloam, Lust, and Envy so I can pretty much spam it in any fight with my usual go to of Lob Corp Faust, W Corp Don, and Tingtang Hong Lu.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
I have no idea what the dog does because I have never seen it attack. The thing lasts three turns on the level 30 fight without ever managing even a single clash, I feel bad about what I'm doing here.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
Notice how it doesn't have the indiscriminate tag.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
I was under the impression that Ayin's plan could distort people, since that's based on the mental state of people themselves, but that (stuff from late Leviathan and LoR) Carmen herself is actively sabotaging it to make more people distort.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
Of all the things to confirm that Dante's head really is a prosthetic (rather than him being a distortion like I expected), the april fool's day scene wasn't what I was expecting.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

GilliamYaeger posted:

I'm not sure it does? It could still very well be EGO or a Distortion. Just because there's actual parts in there doesn't mean that it's manmade - just look at all the robot and machinery Abnormalities. You could probably open up something like You Must Become Strong or the ticket booth robot abnormality that's about to be in the Railway and tinker around in their innards and get a similar bizarre result to what happened to poor Dante.

True, the idea that he distorted rather than somehow replacing his head with a prosthetic before dying isn't done for yet.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
There is a stamina tax, you're spending 12 modules to get 27 thread, instead of 6 modules to get 18. It's only 'even' if you were going to do another three thread runs after the dailies, which is not at all a given.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
I'm not sure if it only uses it after you break an eye, but one of the frog's moves restores SP to its target, so whoever has their SP lowered from an eye breaking can clash that while you pile as much damage into the broken eye as possible after. It's not too hard to have full SP again by the end of it.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
Part of my MVP list was Kurokumo Hong Lu (I finished in 114 turns), his second skill getting four coins if you don't have enough bleed on an enemy as well as stacking bleed for major damage are both great and much easier to proc than the extra hit on tingtang's mutilate or shank. At one point I had 34 power 10 count bleed on the 6th fight and watched as it killed itself with coin flips.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
You can beat refraction railway in under 120 turns using nothing but base identities and egos, I don't think the gacha is a huge issue at the moment.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
Do you have to use the event bonus egos/ids in the dungeon to get the bonus currency or is just owning them and having them set to party 1 or w/e fine.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
So since Don, Ryoshu, Sinclaire, and Gregor are forced includes into the hard mode dungeon if you want to minimize runs and thus box usage, who would be the best 5th member do you all think. I have all of Sinclaire's IDs although none of them seem good, Gregor and Ryoshu are forced into their event IDs although Ryoshu's is actually good, and Don I figured I'd just go W corp as usual.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
I'd like to see some kind of mechanic for having and using specific EGO combos to be honest, although if that ever happens it'd probably be later in the game.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
When did AOE egos like Faust's representation emitter and fluid sac start double targeting skills? It's a massive nerf to her in particular because now RE can only hit more than one enemy if they only have one skill each, while fluid sac only hits two enemies if they have two skills instead of three.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

Lt. Lizard posted:

If what you mean is that enemies with (for example) 2 skills "take" 2 targets from AoE attacks without taking any extra damage, then that was in the game from the beginning. Targeting of AoE attacks is on skill basis, so if a single enemy uses multiple skills, they can be targeted multiple times, despite still taking only 1 AoE attack. Abnormality parts are occasionally considered different entities, so they are an exception and some Abnormalities can be hit with multiple AoE attacks from one AoE skill.

If a single skill can now be targeted multiple times by an AoE attack, then that's new and probably a bug.

No I mean that for example: You have three enemies, they have 2 skills each. You use Fluid Sac, it for some reason targets the first enemy's skills twice, with a 2x label on them, and the second enemy's first skill once. The third enemy is untouched. Previously all three enemies would be hit because the first two would have both their skills targeted and then it'd overflow to the third. There is absolutely no increase in damage whatsoever to the first enemy either.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
After playing some more, it seems like it's not aoes that are bugged, but specific enemies. Specifically the new robot enemies seem to count as abnormalities for AOE targeting despite otherwise using human battle mechanics.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

Arcvasti posted:

(why does everything still resist slash).

this chapter's resists are a 'bring new rodya' because she has both blunt and pierce which literally everything in it is weak to one or the other.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
The bull has a second form? What triggers it?

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
Because IDs are based on other people, so it's an ID based on a TLA person who uses the EGO as their own equipment. It's not 'Heathcliff wearing an EGO' it's 'Heathcliff using an ID that puts him into the role of someone who has the EGO as their equipment'. Like how Faust has an ID that puts her into the role of Kromer, and another that puts her into the role of Yuri, etc. We just don't know who that is quite yet because we haven't seen anyone using it in the story. We'll probably meet them in part 2.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
Wow Project Moon I can't believe we get two Dongbaek IDs

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
It's also a bit odd that in said different world the role of Dongbaek is being split between two different people.

Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.

Ariamaki posted:

That's so people can learn the hard way that White Gossypium is actually a strictly-beneficial gift in 99.9% of fights and you shouldn't be scared of it, but should be leaning in to its benefits. :v:

I have never in my life gone "I sure wish I could get a bunch of bleed stacks onto this enemy rather than prevent them from acting while doubling all damage to them from every damage type"

Absolute garbage ego gift that downgrades your combat ability.

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Cirina
Feb 15, 2013

Operation complete.
Well guess I'm dropping the game. It's been fun, but gently caress off with that horseshit project moon.

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