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Yes, it's mostly this. There are so many factors to consider when it comes to flying, that being focused on the ground is just better. Plus, wasps, bees and ants all have the same ancestors, that most likely were able to fly more regularly than ants do today (but also probably less than what bees and wasps are doing) and so it seems possible that they went the ground way simply because the ecological niches for flying insects were already getting occupied as the genera and species evolved away from their origins. Another insect example of a probably similar situation are roaches, of whom many, many can fly, but most rarely ever do. There are species out there that have fully functional wings and are able to fly just fine and yet they never spend a single second in the air throughout their (quite long) lives. Most of these adapt away from being able to fly altogether in favor of more special abilities that are bound to the ground. Ants are, anatomically, not too different from this, as basically all ants have the technical ability to fly - as in, they do still own the muscles for this - but only the alates, which is the fertilizied queen and the drone caste, are actually developing wings. After mating, queens of modern ant species do not lose their wings either - they actively rip them off and afterwards start consuming their wing muscles as well as the wings in order to provide food for the upcoming first few babies. In that sense, ants almost actively choose not to fly in favor of feeding their offspring.
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Jun 11, 2022 14:19
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I mean there unironically already are vampire ants that feed on blood, it's only a matter of time until they get together with the honeypot ants to capture medium to large sized mammals, extract their blood and store it in combs for later consumption.
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Jun 11, 2022 21:55
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So the question is, why did none of us get kidnapped by bees yet to be kept in a hive for later consumption? Or who of you did and is actually a bee in disguise, reveal yourselves
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Jun 14, 2022 07:29
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It is NUPTIAL FLIGHT SEASON people!! If you live in Europe it probably already happened (here in western Germany it started over the past few days) or will happen in the next few days, in the US depending on where you are it also will start in the next few weeks! East coast is probably already there or will be soon, so go out and watch some tiny birds!! If you look on the ground on any regular street, you might notice suspiciously big bugs crawling around, relatively long and sometimes with or without wings. If that's the case, you might be looking at a freshly hosed ant queen! Chances are good, because colonies in a given area synchronize their nuptial flights and thus there tend to be millions and millions of them everywhere. They look exactly like ants, but are usually up to thrice the size you would expect from that species and what makes them obvious in comparison to other insects you might see these days is that they tend to be abnormally long, due to their ovaries getting bigger and bigger. If you do see one and she lost her wings already, that means that she has very recently had a very sexy time with any number between 8 to 22 males and is now extremely satisfied and loaded with mixed ant sperm in a special organ she has just to store it and keep it happy and alive for years, called spermatheca. If you see one with wings still attached, it means that she either has not broken those off yet after sex, or she is still unfucked and in search for a male. You should leave her be if so, sometimes they might get lucky and find their Romeo even when arriving late to the party. If you wish to get into ant keeping, now is the time! You can safely collect a wingless, pregnant queen carefully and offer her a home to get started on baby production. You can release them back into the wild later on and just having has a small little family to live with your for a few months, or expand into an actual setup. Either way, please do not crush those little ladies on purpose! It is the most dangerous and most difficult time of their lives, they had to fly for miles and miles without ever having practiced before, deal with the relatively violent procreation traditions involved and most of them will not make it as it is already. No ant queen is in any way aggressive, dangerous, poisonous or anything, they never possess a sting or a venom sprayer and their mandibles are even too weak to properly bite. Even if you have other insects around, no worries, they are as peaceful as they could be!
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Jun 23, 2022 11:24
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I didn't go on ant collecting spree this year, but I found pictures from my last endeavor! The safest and easiest thing is to use a test tube, some cotton wool and some water. That's all they need, no food necessary.  Those were three ladies I picked up right in front of my door. Later on one of them showed themselves proudly  I kept all three for about four months at home, they do not eat or run around at all, so all they need is a tiny little amount of space, access to water and darkness. The red foil exists because ants are unable to see the color red and so it appears dark to them, while allowing a bit of insight for the human. All three of them successfully hatched their babies and as soon as the first baby came out, they needed to look for food, so that was the time for me to decide whether to keep them or not. Back then I decided to not keep them and placed all three of them in the wild, in safe distance to each other, dropped some honey nearby to get them started and that was it. That was two years ago and while two of those new colonies moved away so if don't know how they are doing, one of them is actually living next door to this day. She gave birth to a lot of babies and survived two winters already, chances are her colony will continue to grow for years to come and I am excited for that.
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Jun 23, 2022 11:43
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Hell yeah!! Everyone is welcome to post some pictures if you get a chance, I love to see those little buggers!
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Jun 25, 2022 12:32
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it was so warm lately in Europe, so that's most likely why so many nuptial flights happened. It's not too weird if they have not yet started in Denmark, might make to mid July before it goes off. Also it is quite funny to me to think that there are ant colonies trying to cause a cave in of your greenhouse, that's so typical ant
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Jun 26, 2022 11:39
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Awww amazing, especially the asslicking is so much fun! Even though it might anger your wife, I do hope they can continue to prosper and there is a peaceful coexistence on the way
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Jun 26, 2022 23:46
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Yeah pretty much, the flying ants obviously would never do that, but ok I know he's doing some technology magic yada yada to make it happen. Still, while male ants and queens can fly, no ant of any species is particularly good at flying. Why would they? Males fly exactly once and die due to the violent process of mating and they probably are the only ants that even get the chance to fly for extended periods of time (like, a few hours, maybe), while queens also fly exactly once during their lifetime, mate with a bunch of guys and then break off their wings and consume their own wing muscles to feed their children. In fact, especially young queens leaving their nest for nuptial flights, are notorious for being bad at flying. The first few attempts of queens taking off have a devastating rate of queen ants crashing into something, falling down, be crushed by something, get eaten by a predator or drown in the pool of water you thought was solid ground. During a nuptial flight, it is highly optimistic to assume that even 50% of the queens leaving the nest via flight ever get to mate with a male, as they usually die long before reaching the mating spot due to being bad at flying. They do have an impressive endurance, some species can travel dozens of kilometers for the mating ground, but only because nuptial flights of all kinds exclusively happen when the weather is beyond perfect. They wait weeks, even months for the right weather conditions (no wind, no rain, very warm, no risk of weather turning bad for at least 12 to 20 hours) before even taking off. Also, they take a perfectly straight route if possible, do not fly around mountains or anything and try to basically just move forward as much as possible. As such, assuming they are agile flyers is entirely unrealistic, ants do neither have the muscles, nor the wings, nor the experience - as mentioned, alates only use their wings exactly once in their life - nor the eyes or other forms of senses to do so. You also have to add that by far most flying insects are surprisingly bad at flying, there is only a handful of insect groups that really got that one covered and only due to massive adaptations for that. Like flies, who even changed their wings entirely to be able to, you know, fly. Other things shown in the movies are not entirely unrealistic, like ants building very efficient roads to accomplish a task (that they do because he somehow mentally told them to or whatever), of course they are not capable of telepathy or something, they just use pheromones and a very efficient process called stigmergy to make it happen. I think I have written down some details on that ITT somewhere, too. Bottom line is, they require time to do it, simply because thats how coordination works for ants. I think the biggest thing from the concept of the ant man is the entire premise, though. As far as I am aware, correct me if I'm wrong this is truly not my area of expertise, ant man got to be some sort of superhero because he is able to shrink down in size and have the strength of an ant and thus do superhuman stuff. Sure growing and shrinking in size is very useful and superhero-y but it is a very common misconception to assume that ants are super strong. The idea of ants being strong comes from people assuming that the strength of a muscle grows linearly with its mass. An ant that weighs 10mg may be able to lift a 1g leaf, but that does not translate to a 100kg ant being able to lift 10000kg. The mass of an organism grows by the power of three, while the mass of the cross section of a muscle only grows with the power of two. Take a 10mm long ant and let it grow 200 times, so that it would be 2m long - the mass would grow by 200³, so say 10mg of weight turns into 80kg of weight. The mass of the muscles, which is what matters when it comes to lifting, would grow by 200² - which means the ant that was able to carry the 1g leaf, could now lift 40000g - or 40kg. That's rather normal for most animals. So saying something can carry "x times its own weight" is not a very useful statement to make in biology. I do think they toned down the being able to lift heavy part in the modern movies, though, at least I can't remember ant man running around lifting cars or something. Seems to be more about the shrinking, right? I only just recently even watched the Avengers, so not sure! Goons Are Gifts fucked around with this message at 18:25 on Jul 17, 2022 |
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Jul 17, 2022 18:20
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Ah, I see. Well, in that case that sort of works out! I get it, too, I'd trust my ants with my life, too
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Jul 18, 2022 09:07
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I remember reading some uhh short story or something? or theory? I can't tell, but a small story for sure about ants actually being aliens sent from another lifeform as von-neumann probes right here on earth, as the evidence is right here, it's a self-replicating, well- oiled machine running for at least around 250 million years - more than most other complex life we still encounter today - some of which highly adapted over time, others barely changed, yet still functional! What I'm saying is, bow down to our ant overlords, goons
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Jul 30, 2022 19:00
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ninjewtsu posted:Are there any species of ant where the males do anything other than gently caress and die? Raenir Salazar posted:There are some born without mouths. I sometimes wonder if that's an upgrade for them. However, as implied, no, not for ants. Of course, I can provide you with an overly long nerdy answer to elaborate for no reason, too.  It works as much as it works for bees and wasps and hornets and stuff, too, as well as other related groups of animals, so the assumption (I dont thnk we have evidence on that yet, but might be wrong) is that this property developed in the common ancestors of all hymenoptera and it prevailed to this day. Even in the most primitive ants, bees and so on that we know to date, species that really have barely changed at all over the past 250 million years, we see this phenomenon where males are practically barely more than living bags of DNA. There are sometimes very rare cases where the males live along in the nest for a few weeks before flying off and even rarer sometimes they are allowed to help around the nest here and there, but they never fulfill any actual important tasks and always wither away and die off at some point. Hell, bees even scare their own males off once the time has come or just kill them if they didn't move away when it was their turn to do so. The reason for this is also kinda fascinating, because in contrast to what some documentaries imply, where the males die off naturally after "they have fulfilled their purpose" and stuff - which isn't wrong, but, you know, also really right - simply because there is no practical check if someone has done that. It's not like the males decide to die after they hosed around and then do so, or that there is some magical force that kills them after action X is fulfilled, but it's mostly because the act of spreading semen is incredibly violent. The sperm is sitting inside a male's abdomen and the genitalia apparatus is not exactly user-friendly. It's basically sealed behind a cork if you will and in order to have the ant equivalent of an orgasm, they forcefully have to press until that cork goes boom - ripping apart most of the male's body and leaving them lethally injured. They mate in the air, so usually they fall down already dying as soon as the act is done, sometimes they survive and die later, or just fall prey to whoever finds them afterwards. This is vastly different for other eusocial species, especially termites, who are not hymenoptera at all and in fact closely related to roaches, where males and females live along in the nest and both have a vital role in the colony. Plus the queen lives alongside a king who fucks her on a daily basis to provide fresh semen and DNA all the time. Don't be a man in ant biology if you want to live, is what I'm saying.
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Aug 14, 2022 12:15
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Oh no they do all of those. Pheromones is where it's at for sure, alarm pheromones as well as "nest under attack come home and defend now" pheromones are the most common thing. However, if ants are further out and can't smell it or the wind is making it harder, there are alarm and scout ants that cover themselves in said alarm pheromones from head to toe and then walk outside and poke any ant they find, recruiting them to defend the nest manually. It's less a thing than it is like for many bees or bumblebees, who tend to actively recruit fighting squads to defend stuff, but it absolutely does happen to make sure everyone is around when an emergency arises. However, most of the time ants do not travel off the nest too far. Even hunting and scouting parties stay in a designated area nearby the nest, so usually they realize there's stuff to defend way before anyone has to call them. Since ants tend to scout and expand their area in a very structured manner and not just "go outside and walk randomly around to find out what's out there", they usually can be called in rather quickly. Like, even if there's a hunting party going out, they walk the path walked before most of the time and always leave behind a "We are this way!!" pheromone trail behind while walking, making sure other ants know where they went. There are even gravedigger ants sometimes, that walk the paths used by those parties before if a squadron does not return, to find and carry back the corpses of the hunters who died on duty, so they can be buried in the ant graveyard. So usually ants have a more or less good idea where the other ants of the nest are.
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Nov 1, 2022 10:55
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In general they scouting parties made out of two or three ants that from the nest walk in a zigzag in a straight line away from the nest. Once they reached a certain distance, they walk in a circle around the nest while maintaining their zigzag movement, governing a huge area and minimal time until they basically formed a filled circle around the nest, covered in pheromones. From that point on they repeat with a longer distance to further explore their surroundings while covering the entire area. Hunters do a similar thing, but they mostly focus on using the area the scouts have explored and covered in pheromones before. They form hunting parties of five or six ants and also heavily move in zigzag in a rapid succession to cover more area and increase the likelihood of running into prey. Once they found something, they attack and follow it in a straight line to hunt it down and carry it back home once subdued. Medic and gravedigger ants follow those paths to look for corpses or hurt ants and carry them back home or to the next available burial ground to avoid having ants stumble into rotting and therefore potentially dangerous corpses, due to bacteria and diseases feeding from dead matter.
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Nov 1, 2022 14:04
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Yeah they do and it's super cool because it's the injured ants are the ones determining whether or not they should get any help. They want to avoid having any ants waste resources and effort on them if they know they're a lost cause and effectively hinder their own rescue, while those ants that still can be of service will make their own rescue as easy as possible. They are willing to sacrifice themselves for the colony even if it's just to make sure no resources get wasted on them, once their fate is sealed.
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Nov 1, 2022 17:00
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ninjewtsu posted:How do ants assess threats? Some ant species are blind and even the ones that can see I assume can't do so very well - more for navigation than for determining how large a snail is vs a frog right? Do they throw themselves at food until x number of ants have died without biting into flesh, then retreat to either stay away or bring a bigger hunting party? In general, it's a simple trial-and-error situation. For an ant, everything that is not one of your sister ants and not part of the environment, is automatically a threat. A threat is automatically also prey. If it smells different than your sibling ants, you should attack it for so long that it stops moving. That goes for a huge primate hand that's flying around as well as any bug crawling around, even that moist bear nose. If it moves, it's a threat, if you can bite it, it's food. The real question is whether or not they bother hunting and killing a threat, which is mostly limited to what they feel like they can realistically hunt down and eat. That also relies on experience, a bug probably tastes similar to a different bug you ate before, so it seems like that's a suitable source of food. Plus, you can always observe your siblings and look at what they do. 20 ants eating on a thing is probably a good sign that it's good food, so you join them. Most of ant coordination relies on the simple yet genius mechanic of stigmergy, where one successful act leading to a result leads to a higher likelihood of that act being repeated by other individuals. You just do the same thing everyone else is doing and by simple logic and math you will automatically do the right thing over time. There's this biological theory floating around where individual intelligence like we know it for humans is actually not an advantage but a disadvantage in evolution, since it makes processes like that harder to do. We tend to question things we do due to it, but ants have been around for more than 250 million years, multitudes longer than we are, so maybe their idea of structure is superior than ours in that regard!
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Nov 2, 2022 09:51
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In the worst case, yes! But in general, you can see the results of an action, so you can just repeat the things that lead to a specific result and don't repeat those attempts that do not. The more successful an action is, the more ants are motivated to do it, leading to a self-increasing cycle of repetition with more and more ants joining the cause, doing something great a single ant could never do on its own.
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Nov 2, 2022 11:30
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The simplest example is an ant road. An ant is hungry, walks around to look for food, it finds some honey after walking a straight line, so it goes there, finds the honey faster than ants walking a different route, so it can go back and forth faster than others, ever intensifying the pheromone track it leaves behind. More ants see that happening, more ants take the same, fast route and the track of pheromones gets more intense, motivating more and more ants to take that route, while abandoning the longer, slower route, that does not get an intense line of pheromones. More ants, more pheromones, more food being transported, more ants being fed and a new ant road has been constructed.
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Nov 2, 2022 11:34
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Oh that's lovely! I loved their last series on the global colony, this one is going to be even better I think!
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Dec 9, 2022 06:43
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A lovely outworld! How's the brood coming along? What's all their individual names left to right?
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Feb 7, 2023 23:16
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We have a lot of those ants around here, so.... 
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Feb 13, 2023 00:06
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I wanted more ants in it! 
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Feb 25, 2023 12:39
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palindrome posted:Would anyone like to help identify this creature? I couldn't find an entomology thread but you folks seem knowledgeable. For scale, it's a little longer than a penny, just found it yesterday. I'd say that's a termite yeah, probably a wood termite? ninja edit: I should read the whole post before answering
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Apr 27, 2023 11:48
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Certainly open for all discussion in this area! Hell, we even had termite chat already, this might as well be sometimes-eusocial-species-talk imo 
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Jun 30, 2023 14:51
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DildenAnders posted:Alrighty then, I may be less of an expert at that last, but at least, to my knowledge, the common wasp, Vespula vulgaris, the German wasp, Vespula germanica, and most real wasps, Vespinae, rarely actively kill their queen by force, rather than that she dies naturally from exhaustion and her body being mostly worn out in general, or she's left alone, either actively or because the workers just die off without replacement, as she stopped producing eggs and the workers and especially the young virgin queens ate those left. There is, however, for wasps as well as bees, the Battle of the Drones, where workers and soldiers kill drones that haven't left the nest after nuptial flights, either due to missing it, being too young, failing to fly, not feeling the weather or just being dorks. Either way, for any hymenoptera, in fact for pretty much any eusocial species that is relying on pheromones and the sense of smell, the lack of a queen or otherwise offspring producing individual, is a big deal. Even for ancient ant species, like primal ants in Australia that never developed a biological difference between castes and all workers can also be queens, lacking the proper pheromones kicks off a game of thrones styled race to the throne for those queens that feel entitled and manage to organize a faction that supports her. Once someone is coronated, those who supported her are rewarded, those who opposed her, if still alive, are either killed, or at least have to eat their own eggs and babies. This is all coordinated via smell and pheromones or the lack of them. Ants, bees and wasps all have the same ancestors and these are very old, primal functions, so in that sense, it's entirely biological possible if not even likely for the lack of a queen leads to a wasp frenzy. I don't know if it's true, it seems rather unlikely, simply as there is no obvious biological advantage for them to do that, other than provoking their own dead, which in regard to the weather doing so for sure anyways, seems redundant. The only thing I could imagine is that queen less wasps are more than willing to kill other wasp workers and especially virgin queens they encounter, to eliminate possible contenders for their own virgin queens in the next spring. Bug Squash posted:Yellow jacket behaviour in Autumn has a lot of things feeding into it. A wasp professor described it to me as a mix of "dementia" and drunkenness from fermented fruit. That, in fact, is entirely true. Various animals get crazy drunk and even want and plan for it doing so, even bears and wolves do this sometimes.
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Jul 3, 2023 19:38
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It's nuptial season time for the third time in this thread, for the approx 250 millionth time in total!. Everyone in Europe, North America and most parts of northern Asia can keep their antenna out to see all the virgin ant queens and drones flying around, loving and burrowing new nests! The exact day of a given region will be synchronized for all swarms and colonies by weather conditions, fleeting pheromones and various mechanisms we don't yet understand, so once you see the first winged ants, you probably are going to see many, many, many more at that day, too!, You can easily identify both queens and drones by looking weird. They are oversized ants in anatomy, having long and wide wings they don't seem to be very agile with and, in general, they just look like weird insects you don't usually see. I usually notice them on the ground nearby, simply because they often don't look like the usual insects you see around and once a closer look is taken, it's obvious it's a weird looking ant with wings! Now is a great time to get started with your own ant colony in your garden, a spot of grass nearby, or even in at home in a formicarium of whatever kind you may choose! Of course, don't just go out and collect anything if you don't have a plan and know what to do, be gentle to nature and your ant friends. This is the most difficult and dangerous time in their lives, most will not make it, but they are a super cool sight to behold and to spend time observing them planning their upcoming kingdoms!
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Jul 5, 2023 14:57
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That looks great! I'm a big fan of concrete nests like that! You don't really need to dig them in, but I would highly recommend not to use those for the freshly hosed queen. They want something much, much, much smaller, something that has no space where dangerous scary things might lurk, something they barely fit in and have entire control over, like a test tube or something. Only once she has the first babbies around that can be brave and scout around, then she will want to move into a an actual nest. It can be quite a while! Depending on the species and how willing they are to move - some are very lazy and slow in that regard - they can easily stay up to a year in a tiny tiny test tube, not bothering to move into a really nice, big nest. So maybe you offer the queen a nice little test tube for now, I'm sure you know the kind of test tube setup I mean with water in the back and sealed with cotton and stuff, and place it nearby those nests. Or you generally wait and have the queen inside with you until she gets her first babbies and only bring her outside with the nests once she's ready to move. Usually freshly mated queens enjoy chilling in a cupboard or drawer for months, completely sealed off the environment until she feels ready to tackle the scary and dangerous outside world.
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Jul 9, 2023 12:22
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That works just as well! You won't see a newly founding colony moving in that nest, but you can just as well see established colony, probably about a year and older, trying it out. Depends on if it's the best suited nest for their needs, ants are very picky about that. Even if it's only option in an enclosed area like the setup I had before, they rather stay in a test tube with rotting cotton wool and empty water than even bother looking at the new nest beyond single scouts checking it for, like, two thirds of a year. No idea what was so bad about it, but ants are just ants ans they barely ever so what you might wish for. 
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Jul 12, 2023 09:13
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I was wondering where my ants had gone that day
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Jul 31, 2023 02:15
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Sorry, I totally forgot to post a reply to your question! I was in the ICU for a long while due to multiple surgeries and poo poo, so I read and then forgot about your post, sorry! I assume you already decided by now, what did you come up with? I for one would have gone with some silicone myself, I believe, but I can also see a version without it work! In terms of water, every formicarium needs moisture and a source of water to some degree, but it really depends on the ventilation and air that can flow in and out. I assume this one should have a rather good ventilation and therefore should lose water quicker than other setups, right? Based on the description the water towers exist for that reason and I would assume that you need to regularly refill them, too, at least in my experience setups like this tend to turn dry rather quick - which is good! - and thus you need water to keep a good amount of moisture in the nest at all times. I never should get too moist, of course, because that will lead to mold, but ideally you have a constant flow of air in and out, that will carry out moisture and allow it to dry off constantly, which constantly requires water. Getting the moisture right is really one of the toughest challenges in keeping ants, so a solid setup, good airflow and fresh water intake is vital.
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Mar 15, 2024 19:05
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As mentioned above, the gel is very bad for ants, yes, it exists as a way to temporarily show ants work in that substrate, it was never meant as a way to actually keep ants for any longer than a few hours, a day or two at absolute most! The gel neither has any value for them as a building substance, no nutritional value despite what some companies claim, it allows no ventilation, is unstable in various ways and will always lead to a whole ant colony's death if they ate forced to live in there. Let alone the fact that your ability to see them, equals their inability to feel safe at home. Ants need darkness, they have a total of three eyes, two oculi compositi and one ocellus. The former two are red-blind and they cannot perceive red light, which some gel producers claim would be sufficient to offer red gel instead. However, the ocellus on top of their head is able to determine the basic absence or existence of brightness, so it's not like ants behind a red foil are sitting in utter darkness, only two out of three eyes perceive darkness. Let alone any paths they bury that you can look into clear as day. As mentioned above, there are plenty of lovely and amazing, safe and natural ways to see them bury and build! Ants are natural builder and they will happily build in any substrate, so really, there is never a lack of watching them do stuff, believe me! You don't need some dangerous and unhealthy gel for them to see exciting things! Plus, in a natural substrate, you can see their natural behavior, too, instead for whatever they desperately try to make work in a weird artificial environment they are not used to. In general, in my experience, the more natural your habitat gets, the more exciting things your ants will do with it! You cannot and will not control them, all you can do is expand or limit their environment and the more artificial stuff you use, the more limits you set. In nature they build the craziest things for 250 million years now, because they learned how to work with those limits nature gives them and whatever we try will never be as big and great as nature, so we should at least do our best to try!
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Mar 21, 2024 23:10
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Raenir Salazar posted:Well, I contacted Tar Heel ants and we had some back and forth to discuss the details and then I asked for a quote so we could forward once I felt like we nailed down all details but he's so far sadly not gotten back to me in about a month. Uh, oh, apparently they decided that your out world equals their junkyard now, haha, I know that feel all too well! I tried to build a beautiful setup in their outworld once and they completely trashed it and used it to bury their junk and poop, clearly, ants have a very different understanding of aesthetics than we do!
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Mar 21, 2024 23:13
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#CurseOfTheSmallIndieBusinessOwner
