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garfield hentai
Feb 29, 2004


PageMaster posted:

very minor last boss spoilers:

Does the game help you out after enough fails during what I'm guessing is the final phase of the last fight where you have to unscramble the magic circle with the gas rising? I can't do it at all and I've already retried 6 times with no prompts or changes that I can see, so if not and there's no other gameplay afterwards I'm about ready to just watch the ending and call it a day

I had a weirdly hard time with this enough that I remember the exact solution when I finally got it right:

Start off by sliding stuff around until everything's solved but flipped 180 degrees (so the color in the stationary little bit in the middle matches the puzzle on the opposite side of the board), then rotate the whole thing so it's right side up.

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Capfalcon
Apr 6, 2012

No Boots on the Ground,
Puny Mortals!



Got to the part where the game turns into Wind Waker and my jaw dropped. I'm loving this game.

Honestly, the combat is great while also being skippable when I'm not feeling it, the bosses are some of the most fun puzzles in a JRPG, and the open world exploring is a blast. So far, it's basically on par with TTYD for me, and I won't be surprised if it ends up topping it.

Amppelix
Aug 6, 2010



Araxxor posted:

Interviews basically stated the lack of individual characteristics is due to a mandate from Nintendo, not Kensuke Tanabe’s fault. Dude said it was a difficult challenge the team was forced to work with.
also kensuke tanabe is not someone nintendo is going to get rid of lol

he's a producer on shittons of games not just the "haha i make paper mario bad" guy

John Wick of Dogs
Mar 4, 2017

The plan here is to reinvent Rin Tin Tin as a modern action star, the John Wick of dogs.


You know Super Mario basically followed the exact same rules. It had child and old toads and Boshi, but apart from that none of the toads or goombas were really unique. All the weird enemies and characters were completely new and alien.

The Mario and Luigi games basically have the same rules too. They're in different kingdoms with different characters, and the ones in the mushroom kingdom don't have any special kinds of toads or koopa troopas.

Morbi
Aug 7, 2013

CONTRABAND

Amppelix posted:

also kensuke tanabe is not someone nintendo is going to get rid of lol

he's a producer on shittons of games not just the "haha i make paper mario bad" guy

A lot of people do not seem to realize that Tanabe has literally been with Nintendo since Doki Doki Panic/SMB2, which he directed, a fact that is probably not unrelated to how much love Birdo continues to get in newer Paper Mario titles.
The man co-wrote Link's Awakening (Which, again, may have had something to do with Wart getting a cameo beyond the shared "dream" theming), he's not going anywhere.

Araxxor
Oct 20, 2012

My disdain for you all knows no bounds.


Version 1.0.1 released. Fixed the softlock in Green Streamer as well as a bunch of other 100% prevention glitches.

Torquemadras
Jun 3, 2013



Araxxor posted:

Interviews basically stated the lack of individual characteristics is due to a mandate from Nintendo, not Kensuke Tanabe’s fault. Dude said it was a difficult challenge the team was forced to work with.

Sounds like a poo poo mandate then

I'm not seriously advocating anyone should be fired for the crime of toadification, especially not someone on the level of Kensuke Tanabe. I'm sure restraints can lead to all sorts of interesting results, but banning individuals aside from the known big names seems just plain awful. Especially since it runs counter to what the games were doing with NPCs before: bizarre sidestories with updated dialogues, tattle, etc.

I suppose there just is no upside to this, especially in a text-heavy game, where most of the characters can only do short gags before they vanish. I just miss that.

Then again, these last three games have definitely turned away from classic RPG mechanics; it's basically an adventure game with more frequent action setpieces now. Kinda makes me wish they'd remove the RPG remains completely. No anemic QTEs and gimmicks, just battle everyone in realtime, like you do in OK already several times. Turn the game into a moderately action-y dungeon explorer game. Might be worth it, considering how many action setpieces we got already.

Al-Saqr
Nov 11, 2007

The Islamic Orb Illuminati.

I gotta say the Pink streamer section was definitely a low point for the game, the game was starting to lose me a little, however once I was past that point and moved on to the green streamer the game picked up massively again! I'm fighting the boss of the green streamer right now and this entire segment of the green streamer beginning to end is just loving awesome.

Shangri-Spa Toads Rule and that was super funny how they owned the minions, Kamek Rules, the thunder boss rules, the entire hype rear end fight to re-take the castle ruled (you better believe I helped the minions kill everyone , and the turn the game takes into legit horror (those stick figures man holy poo poo and Face Homonculus and all of boswers minions just shredded holy poo poo), also the boss is rad so far, this segment is so much better than the pink streamer.

Thankfully I avoided the softlock, will report back when I'm done with the game which should be soon!

Al-Saqr fucked around with this message at 14:37 on Aug 7, 2020

Augus
Mar 9, 2015

BORN TO DIE
WORLD IS A FUCK
Kill Em All 2010
I am trash mon
410,757,864,530 DEAD COPS


John Wick of Dogs posted:

You know Super Mario basically followed the exact same rules. It had child and old toads and Boshi, but apart from that none of the toads or goombas were really unique. All the weird enemies and characters were completely new and alien.

The Mario and Luigi games basically have the same rules too. They're in different kingdoms with different characters, and the ones in the mushroom kingdom don't have any special kinds of toads or koopa troopas.

I mean part of what made Thousand Year Door and Superstar Saga really stand out to me is that they took place ENTIRELY outside of the Mushroom Kingdom, in places that played by different rules and had their own unique feel to them. Rogueport was a wretched hive of scum and villainry and Beanbean Kingdom was just an insane land filled with weirdos.

Something else I liked about the Mario and Luigi series was that its original characters weren't treated as completely disposable. Fawful appeared in three different games and got a major role in two of them. Starlow also got to appear in 3 games (She didn't just suddenly turn around at the end of BiS and suddenly go "I must go now, my planet needs me" and then die) and even the Shroobs got a small appearance in Bowser's Inside Story.

John Wick of Dogs
Mar 4, 2017

The plan here is to reinvent Rin Tin Tin as a modern action star, the John Wick of dogs.


I did enjoy this game having several references to other paper Mario's. They're minor but I'll spoil them

Toad: It's too bad I don't know anyone who's an expert on bridge experts


Bobby: It would be cool if a bob-omb was a ship Captain. Or even an Admiral!


the return of the Fan Thing in purple streamer

The toads in The Ringer are the Toad Brigade from Color Splash

the return of stickers in the environment

Birdo's recurring role of making Mario uncomfortably horny. There's even an Easter egg with the same burlesque routine from the previous game


And a more major spoiler that's the difference between Olivia and other partners

The other partners survived their sacrifice. Olivia is loving dead

Al-Saqr
Nov 11, 2007

The Islamic Orb Illuminati.

Just Finished the game!

HOLY COW, the sheer ramp up in scale and awesome events starting from the final green ribbon all the way to the end was loving incredible. an absolute blast from beginning to end!

Also story wise:-

BOWSER! BOWSER! BOWSER!!!

the final slide puzzle was rear end difficult lol but eventually I got it

Olivia.... Thank you..... you're the greatest, thank you for the memories....

I dont understand why people are hating on the ending, I thought it was perfectly good and appropriate to the themes of the game.

Olivia sacrificed herself to save the mushroom kingdom, the theme of the game is the acceptance of loss and living your life to the fullest with the time you have, we had this before with bob-omb and now we have it with olivia, Olivia had a wonderful time and had to say good bye to save everyone, I for one think this is a very nice disney-style way to sell a theme to kids, and much like any disney movie and nintendo game, obviously the day had to be saved and things would go back to normal, anyone expecting anything else are insane, the final shot with the floating baloons teared me up quite alot not gonna lie, I am a huge sucker for nice endings with charismatic music like that. I do wish they did something with olivias memory by the end though.

Overall, I give this game a very solid, highly recommended 9/10, the only real drawback of the game was it's overly simple regular battle system while it's snappy and quick, the fact that you only had two ways to beat enemies made it too simple and not as interesting as it could be, it needed more. but thankfully, the game did not overdo it or overstay its welcome and this was more than balanced by the abundance of very clever boss and mid-boss fights.

The pink ribbon was the lowest point of the game.

the MUSIC is loving incredible, whoever made the music for this game had the time of his life and half the fun and experience of this game is the music alone, utterly loving fantastic music. It doesnt stop getting more awesome until the very end.

Boss fights was great, Graphics were incredible, Characters were fun and funny, overall, I walked into this game with low expectations considering my love of the TTYD and wanting a disney-pixar style fun and emotional story and experience, I wanted to laugh, be enchanted, and cry manly tears, and I was completely and utterly satistfied, I got that and more. I recommend paper mario very much, and enjoyed my time thoroughly with it and will fondly remember the characters in it. I'm happy I bought it and experienced it.

9/10!

Al-Saqr fucked around with this message at 14:33 on Aug 8, 2020

ThisIsACoolGuy
Nov 2, 2010

Shaped like a friend



Al-Saqr posted:

Ending talk

Most people dislike the ending because

It feels kind of rushed. Olivia makes her wish, luigi goes 'wait where is she' then suddenly everyone is partying and having a great time and 'wow thank you origami!' when the only good origami was Olivia.

Also in Sticker Star Kersti does a heroic sacrifice so you can beat Bowser and is never seen again. Color Splash Huey does a heroic sacrifice so you can beat Bowser and you actually see his lifeless body in the true ending. In Origami King Olivia just offs herself when she very easily could of worded things or said 'except me' so it's just a repeat of the previous 'partners' dying. It sucks that these characters are doomed to die by the Mario Mandate, even if you didn't like them.
Next Paper Mario is going to introduce a new sidekick character and they'll probably kill it too during the final boss.

ThisIsACoolGuy fucked around with this message at 15:01 on Aug 8, 2020

John Wick of Dogs
Mar 4, 2017

The plan here is to reinvent Rin Tin Tin as a modern action star, the John Wick of dogs.


ThisIsACoolGuy posted:

Most people dislike the ending because

It feels kind of rushed. Olivia makes her wish, luigi goes 'wait where is she' then suddenly everyone is partying and having a great time and 'wow thank you origami!' when the only good origami was Olivia.

Also in Sticker Star Kersti does a heroic sacrifice so you can beat Bowser and is never seen again. Color Splash Huey does a heroic sacrifice so you can beat Bowser and you actually see his lifeless body in the true ending. In Origami King Olivia just offs herself when she very easily could of worded things or said 'expect me' so it's just a repeat of the previous 'partners' dying. It sucks that these characters are doomed to die by the Mario Mandate, even if you didn't like them.
Next Paper Mario is going to introduce a new sidekick character and they'll probably kill it too during the final boss.


but kersti and the bucket didn't actually die

Al-Saqr
Nov 11, 2007

The Islamic Orb Illuminati.

ThisIsACoolGuy posted:

Most people dislike the ending because


I guess that makes sense, I didn’t know anything about the previous partners so i wasnt aware of this pattern. I agree that they should’ve given Olivia a little bit of a better final note. But as someone coming into this fresh, I think it was appropriate, Olivia sacrifices herself to undo her brothers spell, and sadly her brothers spell included herself. I think the final shot on the throne in the ending and Peach’s acknowledgement of her sacrifice was good, but I agree they should’ve given us just a little extra something.

Overall I leave this game with very positive feelings and I don’t mind at all this new direction they’re taking paper Mario in as long as they actually deepen the regular combat system next time, that’s the only real drag on this game. Everything else has been A+

ThisIsACoolGuy
Nov 2, 2010

Shaped like a friend



John Wick of Dogs posted:

but kersti and the bucket didn't actually die

Don't fully recall Kersti but Huey is full on dead, the bucket doesn't even have eyes when it lands back in the fountain. It just clangs off the side and floats sidewise in the paint pool. You can say that it revives him off screen but the entire vibe is he's dead.

John Wick of Dogs
Mar 4, 2017

The plan here is to reinvent Rin Tin Tin as a modern action star, the John Wick of dogs.


ThisIsACoolGuy posted:

Don't fully recall Kersti but Huey is full on dead, the bucket doesn't even have eyes when it lands back in the fountain. It just clangs off the side and floats sidewise in the paint pool. You can say that it revives him off screen but the entire vibe is he's dead.

What, no. It landing in the pool is proof it's still alive and gonna revive. That'd be a hell of a macabre %100 ending, lol look at this corpse.

Violen
Jul 25, 2009

Well obviously it did happen in the end, but this was not pleasant...


I just don't at a personal level care about owning the thematic and emotional spirit of a 'sacrificial wish' timeworn fairy tale ending to a very fairy tale story with facts and logic. not saying that's not valid criticism to how they structured and executed the concept necessarily but it doesn't factor into the impact for me, especially because of the presentation. if i try to appraise like that through my own purview it just comes off as hey just wish for infinite wishes kind of poo poo. I also didn't play color splash or finish sticker star though so who knows how tired that would've inherently made me if this were my third pass through the idea lol

anyway the bittersweet capstone/sendoff OP wanted is the 100% scene, I'd just look it up. between the ambiguity in the nature of everything and the craftsman calling his fold of olly's body his final fold of life, olivia's silent look toward mario implying understanding and resolution of consequence and intent and mirroring bobby's decision and influence, luigi and peach's lines, the little hopeful stinger of olly's theme in the ending music, and the collectible you find in the plaza postgame, I got everything I needed out of her story through the base experience. it reminded me a lot of how ramza and his sister are handled in FFT's ending philosophically. also this is a non-sequitur sort-of but I appreciated bob-ombs showing up on the princess peach in the character tour credits and bobby's memory becoming a part of shogun studios' festivities with the fireworks. I think the game handled the in memoriam stuff just fine tbh

ThisIsACoolGuy
Nov 2, 2010

Shaped like a friend



John Wick of Dogs posted:

What, no. It landing in the pool is proof it's still alive and gonna revive. That'd be a hell of a macabre %100 ending, lol look at this corpse.

I think it's just trying to be gentle and answer the last question. Early in the game when he has to absorb the black paint he talks about how it's ripping him apart from the inside and how terrible it is. Then the final boss puts you on a timer because Huey says he's going to die from taking too much in- his last words being that he'll find a safe place to deposit it and gives them all a fond farewell.

100% just shows the can with no eyes still dented and beat up clanking into the fountain while a music box rendition of the games theme plays (or just a soft version). Feels like how I saw people go 'yo are they reviving Olivia???' just because the Craftsman builds little paper dolls of her and Ollie being happy.

Al-Saqr
Nov 11, 2007

The Islamic Orb Illuminati.

Also, another poster said something earlier in this thread that makes the ending make more sense.

Olivia is a naive and child-like person, she doesnt think with her head but with her heart to do what's right, she made the wish the same way she made every other decision in her life, without thinking but with pure intentions.

Also, I just looked up the 100% ending, and it gave me EXACTLY the ending I was looking for, this game's story rules, thank goodness they tied that bow in the end. what a wonderful fairy tale, I teared up all over again



Violen posted:

anyway the bittersweet capstone/sendoff OP wanted is the 100% scene, I'd just look it up.

thanks dude, that was EXACTLY what I wanted and teared up quite a bit all over again, this game rules and I love this little wonderous fairy tale.

This game has tremendous heart and is a wonderful fairy tale game. I loved it to bits.

Al-Saqr fucked around with this message at 15:26 on Aug 8, 2020

Violen
Jul 25, 2009

Well obviously it did happen in the end, but this was not pleasant...


The headspace I was in experiencing the main throughline of the plot is also why I didn't get too beat-up about the logistics of olly's motivations or the general idea of unforeseen consequences of creating life which are treated seriously and played straight by the tone outside of a little meta-wink with the 'it's toads all the way down' thing, so that's how I treated it internally. like it's the symbolics that mattered to me and they worked for me through the lens of some dark pinocchio poo poo. it all felt like pretty established antiquity fable about the concept of automatons and stuff and it played its salon era heaviness and darkness where it wanted to just fine

also I actually don't agree with the read that Olivia bumbled her way into her own unmaking at all lol, her and olly definitely have a childlike perspective on everything and that's a critical part of their characters, but I don't think it extends to something quite that sadistic or that the exploration of those traits were interested in that direction. otherwise I don't see what the point of her long glance at mario before making her wish are meant to impart because otherwise from her perspective what's the big deal. I think a clear understanding of what she's about to do ties in to her relationship with bobby way cleaner, too

Violen fucked around with this message at 15:37 on Aug 8, 2020

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Al-Saqr
Nov 11, 2007

The Islamic Orb Illuminati.

Also, considering that now we found out through the articles that have come out since the games launch how many restrictions the team had on them to do with characters in the mario world, it's even more impressive that they made such a nice and fairy tale story as they did, those guys did a really great job with the restrictions they had.

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