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The best EV is the one you have in your garage
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Jul 14, 2020 06:40
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| # ¿ Apr 17, 2024 00:54 |
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Shamino posted:Even the Fiat 500e or Mitsubishi imeev? Corollary: the worst EV is the one you have in your garage
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Jul 14, 2020 06:42
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Nessus posted:I'm a literal child, what does TSLAQ mean, is it a hashtag or something? I will remove this if I am poo poo stirring I literally do not know https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TSLAQ Apparently it has a wikipedia article
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Jul 14, 2020 08:13
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I'd bet pricing was not a primary concern. I'd guess things like providing a warranty for the intended use and even supplying the packs at all would trump cost any day of the week. In 2016, someone claimed it was 16k for an i3 battery pack, but I'm not sure if that was ever really official or if it's still current.
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Jul 14, 2020 08:35
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In other news, nissan is doing some reveal event for the ariya today. Maybe it will be good! Or at least cheap!
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Jul 14, 2020 20:27
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I mean I'm perfectly okay with generic car look. I'd rather have something more generic car look than the pseudo-coupe profile suvs that are all the rage right now. I know those are done for aerodynamics and thus rated range, but I don't care since they have all the size of a suv but not the back-end space of one.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:37
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Elviscat posted:Maybe they'll put in active thermal management, finally, I'm amused that Nissans EV offerings will be a choice between. CCS would also be cool :P
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Jul 14, 2020 20:37
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McStephenson posted:On the “so close but probably shouldn’t” front: My mileage threshold hasn't changed at all since it's around going to the airport which I do 1-2 dozen times a year to pick people up. 60 miles round trip all highway which I'd like to be able to do twice in a day in the winter without needing fast or L2 charge and ideally with some amount of battery degradation. Basically around 200+ rated is what I'm shopping for. If I was a regular road tripper, I'd want to be able to go 3 hours between stops, or about 210 miles of real range--probably not winter range since who road trips in the winter. For normal driving, I just need about 30 miles of real range in the winter to cover my commute. Basically everything does that.
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Jul 14, 2020 20:42
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May as well leave this link here if anyone is interested. https://www.thenissannext.com/ Virtual event is in 6.5 hours, but they've already "leaked" some photos today. I'm tentatively interested in what they're doing with the ariya, but it is nissan. The rumor mill is saying something like 300 miles range, 35k price, but we'll see about that.
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Jul 14, 2020 23:30
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I would have guessed more, but 20k isn't actually that big of a cost once you're talking home construction....like at $250/sqft which i hear is basically the minimum you can get away with, a 2k sqft house would be 500k to build. What's another 20k at that point 
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Jul 15, 2020 02:14
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Yuns posted:Yes I literally meant just the charger itself and installation. Not the ancillary costs of all the extra work that would be required to make your house able to deal with those electrical needs. Yeah that makes a lot more sense. I was going to guess that just getting the cables run to your house would easily be at least 20k, and probably a lot more, before even talking about anything inside your house.
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Jul 15, 2020 02:42
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Nessus posted:Has grover become a home charger installer yet? With Grover Electrical Services, you can have as many 14-50 outlets on one 50 amp circuit as you'd like!
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Jul 15, 2020 02:55
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Elviscat posted:Oh yeah, if you live in the greater Seattle area and want someone to look at your service to see if it supports an EVSE, or help you install a 14-50 or 6-50 for an EVSE, PM me or post your email in this thread, I have a lot of time off and love getting more people into EVs. I might hit you up in like 6 months. Or maybe not because the housing market is awful again
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Jul 15, 2020 04:05
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Elviscat posted:The salesman who sold me my Leaf drives one, and says he exclusively charges using the CHAdeMO charger at the dealership, because it's free. I'd like to see how long his battery lasts. Maybe he gets a screaming deal on degraded warranty-replaced batteries I guess while we're talking about silly charging, how much would it take to have a house be able to support one of those 80A clipper creek chargers? Presumably, you'd want/need more than 200 amp service for that, right? gwrtheyrn fucked around with this message at 04:33 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 04:28
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Nissan stream is up if anyone cares to watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fbo4-2tH3qk looks like they haven't actually started yet
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Jul 15, 2020 05:50
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gwrtheyrn posted:Nissan stream is up if anyone cares to watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fbo4-2tH3qk looks like they haven't actually started yet This is live now Elviscat posted:For those who want to do their own load-calculations: Cool poo poo. It's kinda a moot point right now since no vehicle will take 80A as far as I know. The korean cars are 7.2kw and TM3 is like 11kw. Would be funny to have though
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Jul 15, 2020 06:01
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. Big takeaways are, 3W per square foot for general house loads and lighting (referred to as "volt-amperes" by the NEC, volt-amps and Watts are equivalent terms for a residential service, on 3phase systems you have to consider inductive and capacitive loading, is why that's distinguished that way) then 100% of the nameplate rating of any dedicated appliance circuit, 100% heating load for furnace/heat pump/AC (take the biggest of heat or AC loads, don't need room for both for obvious reasons) 65% of your installed heating capacity nameplate rating for 4 or less baseboards, 40% for more than four. Divide the number you get by 240V, and that gives you how many amps of your service you need. There's a 70% demand rating allowance on wire sizing and stuff for residential services, so if you have a big honkin' 80A charger you might want to talk to your electrician about upsizing your feeder wire for a 100% rating, but in practice I doubt it'll matter, load calcs are pretty conservative as is.
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Yuns posted:Nissan Ariya - CUV EV We can more or less estimate the range around 4x the kwh, so ~240 to 360 miles. It's a rough estimate but it will probably not land too far from that. You can also work back from their fast charging numbers for another estimate. Assuming it's a 10-80 charge in 30 minutes, that's ~334 miles of range at 100%. If you assume a 250Wh/mile rate, that's 117kW on average charging for 30 minutes Did you catch what they said around when they were talking about the 'intelligent key'? I thought i heard they said the door opens itself, which is a dumb feature. I hope it doesn't do that They also have built-in nav that will navigate including charging stops, which was a huge gap between tesla and everyone else. Obviously, still no superchargers, but it's a step up. 5.1s is almost certainly AWD. I'd assume the 87kwh model since larger batteries can pull more current safely gwrtheyrn fucked around with this message at 06:46 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 06:42
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https://electrek.co/2020/07/15/nissan-unveils-40000-300-mile-ariya-electric-suv-with-liquid-cooled-battery/ From this article: 130kW DCFC, 7.2kW AC CCs for export models, charge port on passenger side (wtf why not driver) NMC CATL cells 40k starting price, 2nd half of 2021 for US delivery. Did anyone see if it's RWD or FWD for the 2WD model? I'd assume front, but I don't know for sure
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Jul 15, 2020 07:00
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Yuns posted:I was initially put off by the front fascia but in all I like the exterior design as far as CUVs go and I love the copper color. Honestly, I like what I'm seeing about it right now, but it is nissan and also it's not coming to the US until late 2021 so it's not an option for me
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Jul 15, 2020 07:04
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Elviscat posted:That's a hell of a deal if it retails near 35 (base) Nissan's been pretty solid EV tech wise, besides the noted dumb issues with their batteries, which this seems to fix. Elviscat posted:E: nvm, I'm sold: "The Ariya's grille has a large sunken area with a subtle pattern that's supposed to resemble a traditional Japanese kumiko design. It also has a slightly redesigned Nissan logo that lights up." I remember someone telling me that light up badges were illegal in the US. Is that not the case? The display model definitely had it though Here's what appears to be an official press release https://usa.nissannews.com/en-US/re...ew-era%EF%BF%BC gwrtheyrn fucked around with this message at 07:25 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 07:21
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Yeah, the whole one-pedal thing is already on a bunch of cars. Pretty sure tesla effectively does that too. Hyundai/Kia don't quite do full stop by letting off the pedal unless you also hold the regen paddles. It's definitely an EV thing though. A lot of them let you change the amount of regen if it bothers you too much
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Jul 15, 2020 07:37
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Westy543 posted:The quarter that triggers the phase out and the one that follows it both get $7,500. After that, it cuts in half for two quarters, then cuts again, then is gone. Cool, so no surprises--if they were under the limit when you bought, you're good to go. Also more ariya stuff. The european press releases have the specs broken down by model. https://uk.nissannews.com/en-GB/releases/nissan-ariya-an-all-electric-coupe-crossover-for-a-new-era . The 5.1s is unsurprisingly the AWD version with the big battery "performance" version. The slowest model is the FWD with the big battery at 7.6s 0-100km/h
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Jul 15, 2020 08:11
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Ola posted:Interest tidbit, it has CHAdeMO in Japan but is getting CCS in Europe and North America. Beginning of the end for CHAdeMO. Wish they'd put the charger on the driver's side for all markets. Is this because japan drives on the other side of the road, or will the UK variant also have the charge ports on the passenger side?
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Jul 15, 2020 08:19
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The electrek article said the double side doors is only for japan domestic models with L2 on one side and DCFC on the other, and passenger side for presumably the US model. I guess maybe they'll have L2 on both sides, though I'd still prefer DCFC on drivers side so I don't have to walk around my car at an uncovered chargerquote:The charging port will be on the passenger side of the vehicle. In Japan, the Ariya will use the CHAdeMO standard with the port for DC quick charging on one side and Level 2 on the other.
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Jul 15, 2020 08:31
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Jimong5 posted:14-50 is the best choice because the cost to install would be similar but if you have capacity issues a 14-30 is perfectly fine for residential use. A 30A charger can deliver 5.7kw an hour which should be good for 20-30 miles of range. I'm having a hard time imagining a residential use case that would need much more than that. This is from a while back, but most current models are limited what you can get out of a 40A circuit. The only exceptions I can think of right now are teslas that aren't the model 3 SR/SR+, the e-tron, and the porsche taycan. A 30A circuit is still more than enough for the most part. Higher amps could let you hit lower rates if you have get off-hours pricing, but you should be able to fill up overnight either way.
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Jul 15, 2020 09:20
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The soul ev is available in canada too right? I think the niro/kona are a little over the top end of 40k in canada, and I've heard the availability is also somewhat questionable. The soul is closer to 40k and you might be able to get a dealer to let you get one for 40k. I haven't heard of someone getting >5k off a niro other than on previous model years or some weird dealer that just really wants to get rid of them, so you may have to see what dealers are selling 2019 niros/konas and 2020 souls for right now
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Jul 15, 2020 22:07
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the spyder posted:I am back on the fence about a Model 3. I had canceled my original reservation due to quality control issues (paint, glass, etc). These appear resolved. I drive ~1000+ miles per month due to work. This has reduced due to our current situation, but will go back to normal in the next year. What have I missed? What's out there in the same price range? I'm even considering a VOLT, but I've never been a big Chevy fan. My main holdback with any electric is the lack of indoor parking and living in the rainy PNW - however I'm tired of visiting the gas station multiple times per month. I don't know when you last looked, but probably the same stuff before tax/manufacturer incentives. Niro, kona, leaf+, and bolt. The ioniq is quite a bit cheaper if you don't want/need a heat pump, and just a little cheaper if you do. Similar thing with the non plus leaf gwrtheyrn fucked around with this message at 23:08 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 23:05
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Alright, hypothetical question. I was originally looking at getting a niro this year, but there's a lot of upcoming stuff that looks interesting in the next year or two. If I wanted to just get a used EV to tide me over until companies get 1-2 years into their dedicated-ev models, what would be a good model to look at? It seems like 2016 leafs and egolfs are available at ~10k and i3s around 14k. Ideally, i'd be able to make a 70 mile highway trip when it's about 20F out, which I think There's a non-zero chance I'd just pass off the car to my parents in around 3 years. gwrtheyrn fucked around with this message at 23:49 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 23:44
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I never use cruise control to begin with so while adaptive cruise control would be cool, it's not a deal breaker. I only see 2016/2019 listings when I'm looking at golfs, presumably 2017s aren't off lease yet and dealers are trying to dump their 2019 inventory. I'll just have to keep an eye on that, since the 2017 range is enough for what I need, and worst case I know there are a couple evgo chargers in the cell phone lot at the airport
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Jul 16, 2020 03:37
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Shamino posted:Once you've used a really good lane centering and adaptive cruise system you won't want to go back. You can do 200 mile drives with no mental or physical drain. I can count on one finger how many times I've done that in the last 5 years. Not saying it's not good, just I don't make that kind of trip a lot where it's a gamechanger, and on a ~120 mile range vehicle it's not like I'm looking to make those kind of trips
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Jul 16, 2020 06:23
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Elviscat posted:You're in the Seattle area, right? Roughly yeah. The golf is 2016 like all the others I've found so it's only like 87 miles range which is a little too short. Leafs are super easy to find, so that's not really a huge problem, but the potential battery issues aren't really appealing if I can get something else for a similar price. No sales tax up to certain price thresholds...then you get your $600 annual tabs and wonder if it was all worth it , Well more like $300 since I'm not in the RTA area
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Jul 16, 2020 18:44
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Elviscat posted:The eGolf is still air cooled AFAIK, still supposed to be a little better at it than the Leaf though, and there's no problems like there are with the 30kW battery. Checking out this site, it seems like <2015 is where things get really bad for the leaf, while 2016 and onwards is 'only' about 2.5% a year so far, where the 2017 golf is around 1.5%. VW claims that the cooling has not much of an effect on longetivity, and i've seen people claim that the nissan leaf's battery issues were primarily chemistry issues. I'll keep both on my radar RZA Encryption posted:I've bought two cars from these folks. They specialize in used EVs. Super nice to do business with. Not looking to buy in the next 3 months at minimum, but I'll bookmark this for future use. Thanks
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Jul 16, 2020 19:29
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big crush on Chad OMG posted:I can’t understand how Tesla can continue to sell vaporware for a car that it will never deliver on. Well, I can, but I don’t understand how it’s allowed by regulatory agencies. If you paid up for FSD and the car is totaled in a fire, you’re not getting any extra money on your total loss settlement and Tesla won’t refund you. MomJeans420 posted:It's not made clear it doesn't stay with the car, people have purchased cars that have FSD on the window sticker and then it's taken away (which would have factored into the purchase price), and it's the only thing you can pay thousands more for which now won't help you on resale. Those are the obvious factors, then you can add in that people have paid for it, owned the car for four years, never had a chance to use it (because it will never exist), and now don't even get the benefits when they sell the car. I don't keep up with tesla news too much because it's like 70%  but didn't they back down from the whole 'remove FSD from sold cars' although only after it was plastered all over social media? Also, wouldn't you get FSD on your insurance claim if it was totaled as long as you ordered the car with it and it was put on the window sticker? I'd guess anything you pay for afterwards through the tesla app or w/e you'd probably just get hosed on, but I would hope the as-delivered configuration would be covered since it has a documented cost.
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Jul 16, 2020 19:42
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big crush on Chad OMG posted:An insurance claim only reimburses you for actual losses suffered. You don’t actually own a car with FSD at the time of the loss, because it doesn’t exist, so how do you prove the value? Is this a thing that has actually happened or is this wild speculation?
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Jul 16, 2020 20:33
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Sure, but they can also disable your supercharging which makes your car worth approximately gently caress all. My understanding is the whole 'disable fsd' thing was only for cars sent back to tesla that tesla then resells and that they restored FSD to all affected vehicles since removing it was questionably legal. So yeah, it does follow the vehicle?
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Jul 16, 2020 20:48
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Wibla posted:Just to be very, very clear: this happens to SALVAGED cars. Tesla's policy on salvaged cars is loving atrocious, but unless you are very, very stupid when buying a car, this will never be a problem. The point is they can not that they will/do. It is also a software flag, so does the insurance agency just get to pretend your tesla doesn't have supercharging and say it's worth like 10k?
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Jul 16, 2020 21:07
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Wibla posted:You're arguing from (imho) a flawed standpoint (strawman: no supercharging = car not worth anything), so I'm not sure why I bother responding further to this... but here goes: It's roughly the same argument for the FSD guy is complaining about. There is no question that a tesla without supercharging is worth less than one with it, just like one with the FSD is worth more than one without it. Both can be arbitrarily pulled from a technical standpoint, but neither are/should be done except in certain circumstances such as salvage titles and resale back to tesla. The basic argument was that software features that you pay for aren't insurable because they can be pulled, and if it's totalled, the car is going to be both sold and salvage titled, so it ends up the same as far as insurance cares. McPhearson posted:The thing in the Jelopnik article was that a dealer saw it at auction and it was shown with FSD, put it on his lot as having FSD, guy bought it, then Telsa took the feature away because the buyer, personally, did not pay Tesla for it. Except the apparently restored it 5 days later. And again, this was for a car sold back to tesla, sold at auction to a dealer, and the sold again. There is no evidence that I've seen that this happens in sales that do not include tesla. It's still scummy, but saying it never goes with the car and is thus uninsurable is silly. gwrtheyrn fucked around with this message at 21:31 on Jul 16, 2020 |
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Jul 16, 2020 21:27
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Wibla posted:Except they're not the same argument? Supercharging is a huge selling point for Tesla because almost all their cars support it (apart from some very early 40/60 kWh cars, and the original Roadster), Tesla won't remove it unless the car gets a salvage title. FSD is something you can choose to buy (or not). The whole drat thing was about insurance not paying out for features that could get removed when the vehicle gets totalled because "it's just software"
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Jul 16, 2020 21:55
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e-Kubel...yeah I'm not sure they're going to use that one
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Jul 16, 2020 22:29
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| # ¿ Apr 17, 2024 00:54 |
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YOLOsubmarine posted:But this is exactly what happened in the examples posted up thread? Guy bought a Tesla from a 3rd party and Tesla remotely disables his EAP and FSD and only re-enabled it after he kicked up enough of a storm on social media. Even if you assume that it was an error, why are they auditing software ownership on the car if the software is tied to the car? And what happens to people who can’t generate the relevant level of outrage to get it fixed? What happened, depending on who you asked, was the dealer bought a used car from tesla that may or may not have had FSD/EAP advertised on it. Tesla claims the price paid did not include FSD/EAP. The dealer goes on to sell it, advertising FSD/EAP. Someone buys it assuming it has FSD/EAP, which tesla realizes "isn't paid for" and disables it at date after purchase. The key here is from tesla--this wasn't a direct person to person sale, and there is no evidence that tesla will remove FSD/EAP from cars that are not sold back to them, at which point they presumably have the full right to add/remove value to the car.
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Jul 17, 2020 01:13
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