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CopperHound
Feb 14, 2012



evil_bunnY posted:

An e-bike hambini would own
I found my calling in life. I just need to get people to send me their bikes so I can poo poo on them.

I can see most of my reviews saying something like:
"If you take of the 'e' from this e-bike you got an absolute shite bike underneath"


I should have made a recording when I fixed a rad bike that had bearings poo poo the bed in less than 150 miles. I had to unlace the rim to open the hub.

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Voodoofly
Jul 3, 2002

Some days even my
lucky rocketship underpants
don't help


kimbo305 posted:

Have you tweaked your suspension settings yet?

Not yet also planning this week. Front shock can definitely take some air out as I rarely use more than half the travel according to the little o-ring. Rear shock is using most of the travel on my last few rides.

Plan was to do new fitting, service and tweaking after ~20 hours, which was somewhere over my last two rides.

emf
Jul 31, 2002





On the topic of reputable reviewers: I know nothing about E-bikes, but the reviews from Outdoor Gear Lab have impressed me with their insight and accuracy on other gear purchases I've made. Their e-bike page is here with links to roundup reviews for Best Electric Bikes, Best Budget Electric Bikes, and Best Electric Mountain Bikes.

I'm interested to know what knowledgeable goons think of their suggestions, rationale, and methods.

kimbo305
Jun 9, 2007

He is I, and I am him



emf posted:

On the topic of reputable reviewers: I know nothing about E-bikes, but the reviews from Outdoor Gear Lab have impressed me with their insight and accuracy on other gear purchases I've made. Their e-bike page is here with links to roundup reviews for Best Electric Bikes, Best Budget Electric Bikes, and Best Electric Mountain Bikes.

I'm interested to know what knowledgeable goons think of their suggestions, rationale, and methods.

I looked at their review for the top pick of budget bikes:
https://www.outdoorgearlab.com/reviews/biking/budget-e-bike/macwheel-ranger-500

Outside of mentioning the Tourney groupset, not a single component, even the electrical stuff, is identified. I'd be very surprised if they kept the bike for more than a couple days. The range section can be fairly interpreted too mean they rode it less than 50mi total, which speaks nothing to reliability.

The ergonomics and handling commentary is extremely casual, though possibly sufficient for people in the price range.

That's not to say they're not applying a consistent process too all ebikes they review, just that a $2000+ piece of equipment needs a much more thorough review.

French Canadian
Feb 23, 2004

Fluffy cat sensory experience


Did an eBike ride today!





emf
Jul 31, 2002





kimbo305 posted:

I looked at their review for the top pick of budget bikes:
https://www.outdoorgearlab.com/reviews/biking/budget-e-bike/macwheel-ranger-500

Outside of mentioning the Tourney groupset, not a single component, even the electrical stuff, is identified. I'd be very surprised if they kept the bike for more than a couple days. The range section can be fairly interpreted too mean they rode it less than 50mi total, which speaks nothing to reliability.

The ergonomics and handling commentary is extremely casual, though possibly sufficient for people in the price range.

That's not to say they're not applying a consistent process too all ebikes they review, just that a $2000+ piece of equipment needs a much more thorough review.

Click "Show full specification details", and there's this link from the comparison discussing methodology which begins, "We tested all of the electric bikes in this review over the course of several weeks and hundreds of real-world riding miles. Each bike was put through the same rigorous testing process for consistency and comparison to one another."

kimbo305
Jun 9, 2007

He is I, and I am him



quote:

In order to test straight-line and high-speed stability, we rode each bike down the same moderately steep hill as fast as they would go, which was approximately 20 miles per hour for most models
Consistency is important, but if any ebike can go faster than 20mph, then they should try to get all bikes up to that speed. 20 isn't that fast, and a comprehensive test should be harder on the bike.

The range test being throttle only is interesting... are all pedal assist bikes excluded from their ebike category?

emf
Jul 31, 2002





They state that all bikes in that review were Class 2 and all have multiple pedal assist levels. All Class 2 bikes legally cannot provide electric assist above 20mph, hence the max speed of their test.

I feel like you didn't really evaluate their evaluation very thoroughly ... ironically.

kimbo305
Jun 9, 2007

He is I, and I am him



Touche -- it makes sense for the test to be easily comparable, in which case throttler only for Class 2 is easier than power meter instrumented testing with only Class 3 pedal assist.

I was hoping the full specs would mention the specific components -- usually brakes are named by model in reviews. After some digging, looks like Tektros of some ilk. Brakes are important because ebikes are heavier and need reliable braking, and knowing which model would let you do your own pad changes, likely the most frequent service to be done besides lubing the chain.

Cicero
Dec 17, 2003

Jumpjet, melta, jumpjet. Repeat for ten minutes or until victory is assured.

emf posted:

On the topic of reputable reviewers: I know nothing about E-bikes, but the reviews from Outdoor Gear Lab have impressed me with their insight and accuracy on other gear purchases I've made. Their e-bike page is here with links to roundup reviews for Best Electric Bikes, Best Budget Electric Bikes, and Best Electric Mountain Bikes.

I'm interested to know what knowledgeable goons think of their suggestions, rationale, and methods.
Their most expensive recommended regular e-bike is $2,400, their least expensive recommended mountain e-bike is $4,800. Is that weird? It seems weird to me, that the extra components needed for a mountain bike would make an e-bike cost 2 or 3 grand more.

Or looked at from another angle: there are decent budget non-electric mountain bikes, surely, so shouldn't there be some decent electric options that don't cost several thousand?

CopperHound
Feb 14, 2012



Cicero posted:

Their most expensive recommended regular e-bike is $2,400, their least expensive recommended mountain e-bike is $4,800. Is that weird? It seems weird to me, that the extra components needed for a mountain bike would make an e-bike cost 2 or 3 grand more.
No. Look at the price difference between a decent full suspension mountain bike and a budget town bike. Then look at the difference in price between a mid-drive ebike with torque sensing vs a basic cadence based assist hub motor bike. Add those differences together and the prices make sense.

Cost cutting on a full suspension bike is a recipe for disappointment. You can get away with primitive pedal assist on the road, but it would be unacceptable on any sort of technical terrain.

Pitre
Jul 29, 2003



Last July my wife and I bought a camper trailer and we have been camping at state parks once a month. These are all lake state parks for fishing. A few of the parks have their camp grounds about a mile from the lake so we just take the truck with our stuff there and back after dehitching. We are eyeballing e-bikes for this task instead, plus maybe get some extra exercise there and at home.

My requirements would be to be to have at least a rear wheel rack for a beer cooler and mounting fishing pole holders. Front racks are welcome also for more storage. I have done a bunch of looking around online and as much review and comparison as I can find and am suffering from choice paralysis.

I can't afford a pair of >$2,000 bikes, but I'm also afraid that if I cheap out and go with an $800 Ancheer from Amazon, It will fall apart by looking at it wrong. They would maybe get used once every couple weeks at home around the neighborhoods and when we go on our 3 night camping/fishing trips each month. It's hard to spend a bunch of cash on something used that sporadically. The RadWagon and RadCity are pretty cool looking with good accessory options but they are pushing my budget, especially the wagon.

I welcome any comments or suggestions to help me make up my mind!

Hdip
Aug 21, 2002


https://lectricebikes.com/

That's what all the surfer guys use to get down to the beach and back. They haven't failed them in the first year yet. Lots of reviews on youtube for them.

Voodoofly
Jul 3, 2002

Some days even my
lucky rocketship underpants
don't help


Pitre posted:

Last July my wife and I bought a camper trailer and we have been camping at state parks once a month. These are all lake state parks for fishing. A few of the parks have their camp grounds about a mile from the lake so we just take the truck with our stuff there and back after dehitching. We are eyeballing e-bikes for this task instead, plus maybe get some extra exercise there and at home.

My requirements would be to be to have at least a rear wheel rack for a beer cooler and mounting fishing pole holders. Front racks are welcome also for more storage. I have done a bunch of looking around online and as much review and comparison as I can find and am suffering from choice paralysis.

I can't afford a pair of >$2,000 bikes, but I'm also afraid that if I cheap out and go with an $800 Ancheer from Amazon, It will fall apart by looking at it wrong. They would maybe get used once every couple weeks at home around the neighborhoods and when we go on our 3 night camping/fishing trips each month. It's hard to spend a bunch of cash on something used that sporadically. The RadWagon and RadCity are pretty cool looking with good accessory options but they are pushing my budget, especially the wagon.

I welcome any comments or suggestions to help me make up my mind!

If one of you already has a nice bike you like, maybe spend a little more on one e-bike to haul everything and just ride the other one without the load? You can also get one of those elastic tow cables or something to help give someone a lift over a hill or something if you needed.

Safety Dance
Sep 10, 2007

Five degrees to starboard!


After having ankle surgery in October and just shoving my bike around the apartment for five months, I finally got out and rode for a few miles yesterday. Neither of my Bosch battery packs lost a significant amount of charge (which is to say, they both stayed at 2 or 3 bars respectively). The bike itself is more of a joy to ride than I remember. All it needed was a quick cleaning of the brakes and for me to pump up the tires.

I did break part of the chain tensioning system on my weirdo dutch bike. I'll call the shop I bought it from to see if they can get me a replacement. Otherwise, I'll spend $40 to ship a $2 part across the Atlantic. In the mean time, I made a lovely replacement out of kydex that seems to mostly work for the time being, but I'll keep an eye on it.

Pitre
Jul 29, 2003



Hdip posted:

https://lectricebikes.com/

That's what all the surfer guys use to get down to the beach and back. They haven't failed them in the first year yet. Lots of reviews on youtube for them.

Thanks for that! I'll look in to these, they look a lot easier to haul around also than a standard size bike.

To answer Voodoofly, we don't currently have any bikes at all. We have only had cheap rear end ones over the years that were worthless. We never really got into bike riding since we have horses and ride those hah!

CopperHound
Feb 14, 2012



I've made some more progress on this e-trailer project
After spending countless hours making drawings, I got together with this dude to help me build the project (https://www.instagram.com/francescycles/)

finished frame:

Brake cable and throttle stuff. The fork is gutted just to be used as a linear bearing:

Still need to do some cable management


I'm going to take this thing for it's maiden voyage at work today. If you don't hear back, you can assume the worst.

Safety Dance
Sep 10, 2007

Five degrees to starboard!


RIP Copperhound, launched off a cliff by poorly tuned bike trailer PID values

CopperHound
Feb 14, 2012



Safety Dance posted:

RIP Copperhound, launched off a cliff by poorly tuned bike trailer PID values
RIP me:

Nobody to blame but myself.

Safety Dance
Sep 10, 2007

Five degrees to starboard!


In reality, I think this is awesome. How's it feel?

Literally Lewis Hamilton
Feb 22, 2005

#JusticeForBreonnaTaylor
#BlackLivesMatter
#StillIRise
#Blessed




CopperHound posted:

RIP me:

Nobody to blame but myself.

What am I looking at here?

French Canadian
Feb 23, 2004

Fluffy cat sensory experience


Literally Lewis Hamilton posted:

What am I looking at here?

Software to set up the motor controller for the hub motor.

Nessus
Dec 22, 2003

To witness titanic events is always dangerous, usually painful, and often fatal.





Pitre posted:

Thanks for that! I'll look in to these, they look a lot easier to haul around also than a standard size bike.

To answer Voodoofly, we don't currently have any bikes at all. We have only had cheap rear end ones over the years that were worthless. We never really got into bike riding since we have horses and ride those hah!
Are they electric horses?

I ended up ordering a Radrunner 1 after due consideration. Do Rad Power have a really bad warranty process or is it more "since the components may be budget, you're more likely to have to deal with it"

CopperHound
Feb 14, 2012



Nessus posted:

Do Rad Power have a really bad warranty process or is it more "since the components may be budget, you're more likely to have to deal with it"
Not great quality control, but they seem to be good about sending replacement parts out to first hand customers.

CopperHound
Feb 14, 2012



Safety Dance posted:

In reality, I think this is awesome. How's it feel?
My benchmark for good e-assist is not even noticing it is there until you go without it. It worked out pretty good picking up 285lbs of trash without anything particularly sketchy happening, but it isn't quite where I want it.

This gutted fork compressing pulls the brake cables and extending pulls the throttle:

There are a couple problems with this setup:
-Under heavy braking the trailer still pushes pretty hard. There should be more mechanical advantage for the brake cables, so I might try using a couple travel agents.
-The spring of the brakes themselves pushes to extend the fork slightly, so often the linkage finds a resting spot that applies throttle slightly. On flat ground the empty trailer will push enough to keep me at a jogging pace without pedaling.
-The brakes actually stop me from pushing the trailer backwards
-I really should use a linear position sensor for the throttle, because having a cable pull a thumb throttle is some Rube Goldberg poo poo.

There is one more problem that I probably need to use a micro controller to solve:
-When stopped on an incline, the motor will just sit there stalled with power running thru it. I think I want to cut the throttle if the wheel isn't turning for some small amount of time.

Huggybear
Jun 16, 2005
Cuddle a bear today!

Nessus posted:

Are they electric horses?

I ended up ordering a Radrunner 1 after due consideration. Do Rad Power have a really bad warranty process or is it more "since the components may be budget, you're more likely to have to deal with it"

They have good remote product/warranty support because they have to, as the quality of mechanical and electrical components is so very low. The diagnostic process if it is an electrical issue can literally be a series of parts mailed to you in diagnostic sequence that you have to replace yourself in sequence to see which one eventually is the one that is causing the problem.

I also hope your bike is available and not a preorder

Nessus
Dec 22, 2003

To witness titanic events is always dangerous, usually painful, and often fatal.





Huggybear posted:

They have good remote product/warranty support because they have to, as the quality of mechanical and electrical components is so very low. The diagnostic process if it is an electrical issue can literally be a series of parts mailed to you in diagnostic sequence that you have to replace yourself in sequence to see which one eventually is the one that is causing the problem.

I also hope your bike is available and not a preorder
well that's not encouraging news!

It was in fact in stock and is going to arrive at Local Bike Mechanic on Tuesday

BIG DRYWALL MAN
Jun 2, 2011



Dang Ebikes are hella fun, I rented a pair to go riding around with the other day with my partner. Too bad they are banned on a bunch of trails otherwise I’d totally “invest” in one for MTB.


Edit: are these bans actually enforced or is it cool if I am not an rear end or are there lycra clad patrols roaming the single tracks of the western states? (Colorado in particular)

BIG DRYWALL MAN fucked around with this message at 13:52 on Apr 11, 2021

bicievino
Feb 5, 2015



BIG DRYWALL MAN posted:

Dang Ebikes are hella fun, I rented a pair to go riding around with the other day with my partner. Too bad they are banned on a bunch of trails otherwise I’d totally “invest” in one for MTB.


Edit: are these bans actually enforced or is it cool if I am not an rear end or are there lycra clad patrols roaming the single tracks of the western states? (Colorado in particular)

Don't ride trails where they're banned unless you actually need it for ADA reasons.

BIG DRYWALL MAN
Jun 2, 2011



bicievino posted:

Don't ride trails where they're banned unless you actually need it for ADA reasons.

Gotcha, thanks.

evil_bunnY
Apr 2, 2003



So in the US when they say no e-bikes on this trail does that include even 250W pedelecs? E-bikes are a total non-issue around here so I'm wondering.

CopperHound
Feb 14, 2012



Some places, such as Henry Coe state park, specificaly only allow class 1* ebikes.

*Most people do not have class one ebikes in the US.

French Canadian
Feb 23, 2004

Fluffy cat sensory experience


evil_bunnY posted:

So in the US when they say no e-bikes on this trail does that include even 250W pedelecs? E-bikes are a total non-issue around here so I'm wondering.

Yep

evil_bunnY
Apr 2, 2003



CopperHound posted:

Some places, such as Henry Coe state park, specificaly only allow class 1* ebikes.

*Most people do not have class one ebikes in the US.
Lol I looked it up and not only do you have 3 classes of ebikes, there's no loving federal standard.

French Canadian
Feb 23, 2004

Fluffy cat sensory experience


evil_bunnY posted:

Lol I looked it up and not only do you have 3 classes of ebikes, there's no loving federal standard.

Safety Dance
Sep 10, 2007

Five degrees to starboard!


evil_bunnY posted:

Lol I looked it up and not only do you have 3 classes of ebikes, there's no loving federal standard.

We're actually 50 countries wearing a trench coat.

evil_bunnY
Apr 2, 2003



For comparison's sake, in the EU anything without a throttle and less than 250W constant output is legally a bike, and anything over is a moped and better be registered and plated as such.

French Canadian
Feb 23, 2004

Fluffy cat sensory experience


evil_bunnY posted:

For comparison's sake, in the EU anything without a throttle and less than 250W constant output is legally a bike, and anything over is a moped and better be registered and plated as such.

Do your part! Enter the bike smiley contest!

https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3964819

Safety Dance
Sep 10, 2007

Five degrees to starboard!


Duck and Cover posted:


Ride1up lmt'd. Good enough for the hills around here which was the goal.

Hey Something Awful Forums User Duck and Cover, how is your Ride1Up bike holding up? I have a coworker who is thinking about one.

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Cugel the Clever
Apr 5, 2009

BLORANGE


I see that the Specialized Vado series is in the $3-4k range and weighs in at 33 pounds, while something like the Trek Allant+ 9.9S is $6k and 51 pounds. I'm curious what sacrifices the Vado might be making. The specs otherwise appear very similar, with the only noticeable difference being the Vado using a proprietary motor and battery vs. Bosch.

I'd really love a lighter bike and 33 pounds seems wildly better than any other hybrid ebike I've spotted, but there has to be something to account for it not also being wildly more expensive.

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