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Nessus posted:Are they electric horses? They have good remote product/warranty support because they have to, as the quality of mechanical and electrical components is so very low. The diagnostic process if it is an electrical issue can literally be a series of parts mailed to you in diagnostic sequence that you have to replace yourself in sequence to see which one eventually is the one that is causing the problem. I also hope your bike is available and not a preorder
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Apr 9, 2021 03:20
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Cabbages and Kings posted:for me that was "none of them, unless you want a $5000+ e-MTB, or you consider it service if someone will take your hosed Bafang hub off and throw it away and install a new one, which it sounds like is every bike shop here will". Dude I know who works at one says they are accumulating a small empire of hosed Bafang hubs in their back room hmm I wonder what they are experiencing, over the years I have seen very few 500W/750W motor failures. the 1000W motors are by far the most robust (now that they replaced nylon gears with steel) motor on the market, that system is downright ironclad in my experience
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Feb 13, 2023 04:49
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foutre posted:Is it possible to restrict a class 3 ebike to class 1 and ship it to the EU to use? Like, can I get it certified as class 1 or something? Do they even check? I don't know about Europe, but I do know there is no way to check if it's a Bafang unless you have a diagnostic emotor tool and those are hella expensive. I can tell wattage from eyeballing or reading the serial number, but I am in the business. Almost every 500W Bafang motor is 750W regardless, they just limit the top speed which limits the output. And you'll never convince me that the "250W" mids aren't pushing more than 250W of power. The whole legal aspect of limited wattage is basically impossible to prove or enforce, other than the throttle. Knowledgeable law enforcement could figure out how to go through the display to check max speed, but there are a zillion displays and they are all different. No one but a total nerd with a chip on their shoulder is going to bother. Someone might make you disconnect your throttle if you have one. I know the cops in the cities I live in couldn't care less and deliberately buy the bigger motors to ride around in class 3 mode. Parks are patrolled but that's mainly for speed limit and staying on the paths and even then out here there are dirt bikes everywhere and no one bats an eye. incogneato posted:This isn't really ebike specific (is there are cargo bike thread?), but I figured it was worth asking: Do not buy a RadWagon. They have a proprietary wheel size which is one of the stupider things they have done. They come with garbage mechanical disc brakes, there is only the single, low amperage battery (a good cargo ebike has a second battery option) - just a cheap, dangerous waste of money. The company is also failing. I used to work for them and left after they shipped out 5000 RadWagons without a single replacement tube or tire on the continent. They're remarkably stupid and greedy. Huggybear fucked around with this message at 04:24 on Mar 8, 2023 |
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Mar 8, 2023 04:19
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The Radrunner type is a mini cargo ebike. The problem with these bikes is that they are tremendously heavy for the size and typically one or 6/7 speeds of very low quality - you'll end up throttling everywhere. The "long bikes", or the RadWagon type are usually better quality drivetrains and better ride quality. Of these, the Bennos and Terns are the best, but there are lots of other brands out there including Yuba and several ecomm models which are decent. Ecomm presents its own issues with having to build the bike yourself and god help you if you have an electrical error or PAS problem.
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Mar 9, 2023 03:10
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Terminus Est posted:Tongsheng vs bafang mid drive kit. I'm leaning toward tongsheng for the torque sensing as I'm not interested in a throttle and am not convinced on cadence sensors. Planning to throw it on State single speed and use it to tow a ride-behind for my daughter. You've got good instincts. Torque sensors are far better, and the bigger the battery, the better. Basically amp-hours is the amount of hours you can ride your bike at level one in perfect conditions. Range varies highly because there are so many variables (elevation, resistance, wind resistance, fitness, gear usage, tire pressure) so just bet that you'll be riding your bike a lot more and make life easier for yourself with a bigger battery. Go at least 17Ah imo. raggedphoto posted:I have a routine maintenance question. I am currently racking up mileage to the point where the maintenance symbol is lighting up every other month, with my local shop charging $120 for each visit I need to start doing my own maintenance. I've done a lot of work on my mountain bikes so I can handle the basics but would usually leave bigger things to a mechanic. It's fine with Tern, just don't tell your LBS you're doing it. That little maintenance icon thingy (Bosch?) is so they can update firmware and lighten your wallet for no reason. I am pretty sure you can download the software for the different systems yourself and it's extremely user friendly. Buy a torque wrench and keep your fasteners tight, inspect your brake pads every couple of weeks, check the firmware every thousand klicks or so and bring your bike in if you have legit issues over your head and they likely won't even notice the mileage differential unless they are anal enough to track it. That said LBS owners are a higher than average proportion of assholes. Personally, I see a modified ebike and I just look the other way unless it's a safety issue. Otherwise the industry is going to go the John Deere route and that would loving suck edit: warranty repair work usually refers to warranty issues, like an electrical fault or a bad motor or I don't know, squished headset bearings out of the box. It's not like a car lease where you must have the oil changed by the dealer every six months or whatever. It doesn't usually mean regular maintenance or firmware updates. YMMV as some bike shops suck. Huggybear fucked around with this message at 04:21 on Mar 10, 2023 |
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Mar 10, 2023 04:18
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kimbo305 posted:The reviews note some blind spots, like REI (or anywhere) not carrying a Presta 20x2.4 tube, and needing a taller front ring, which REI already respecced. Just drill out to Schrader. One can always go back with an adapter. Jabarto posted:Do torque sensors offer any material benefits over Cadence sensors if I don't have any specific issues with the latter? Vastly superior. Cadence sensors are not an accurate rendering of pedal assist. Mid-motor drive torque sensor is the most natural and seamless as well as an accurate rendering of pedal assist.
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Mar 18, 2023 02:48
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evil_bunnY posted:Meh. Good direct drive hubs with a torque sensor are great too (go-swissdrive for example), slightly less performance on climbs but almost silent. Geared mid-drive motors with torque are significantly better in every aspect except affordability. Hub motors are fine, they're less expensive but they overheat due to being less efficient and encased. They push the entirety of the weight of the bike and rider, whereas a hub motor is pulling the drivetrain with capacity for higher wattage due to placement, plus because of the placement cooling grills keep temperatures down. I've been working on ebikes since their inception and the Bafang 1000W mid is the best motor I've ever ridden or worked on (just not super fun to remount). And they're quality. e: Bafang software is hot garbage however. kimbo305 posted:Yeah, I wouldn’t do it on most bikes, but a 20” rim that’s probably heavy and overbuilt wouldn’t risk much. But I also wouldn’t recommend people here who are getting into bikes for the first time to go off and do that. You can totally drill out any rim. I've drilled hundreds in my time. You just need a deburring bit to finish. And newbies, I kindly disagree, with the right tools and instructions anyone can do most work on their own bike. Maybe not building wheels or suspension overhaul but for the most part it's an easy and even fun trade to learn.
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Mar 20, 2023 00:42
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I don't really get if y'all are joking but I wasn't providing instructions, although I would if asked. And no one would obviously ever drill a carbon rim (nor do ebikes come equipped with them), that kind of goes without saying. Any aluminum rim can be drilled to schrader and this does not require heavy handed caveats - it is the simplest operation in the world. As someone who has been working in the bike industry and wrenching for 25 years I do admit to speaking to assumptions that sometimes seem obvious to me, but not always to folks with lesser experience and knowledge. I will try to keep that in mind. This is starting to turn into a bit of a silly derail so let's move on.
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Mar 20, 2023 03:50
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Man_of_Teflon posted:imho cheap suspension forks basically end up feeling like springs, and they weight like 3-4x as much as rigid forks. they also are an energy suck if they are springing up and down a bit with each pedal stroke. every criticism here is negated by the existence of pedal assist. All efficiency variables on an analog bicycle are negated by the motor. That's why the fat tire bike is so successful, you get all the inclusivity of all of its off and on road comfort and capacity and all the drawbacks are meaningless because it's an ebike Cheap suspension is for comfort, not performance. Tern IMO makes the best cargo bikes in terms of what you get for the price other than the hard core types like Bullitt and Butchers and Bicycles
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Apr 26, 2023 03:08
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Man_of_Teflon posted:Check out Grin Technologies in Canada (https://www.ebikes.ca) if you really want to DIY - very solid components engineered in-house, high quality parts sourcing, fantastic customer support... quite expensive. Don't do this. This is needlessly expensive and complicated. Plus the company likely won't exist within a year or two. At least buy a complete bike from a reputable ecomm site if not your LBS or dedicated ebike shop. This site is ridiculously overpriced with way too much technicality that 99.999 percent of buyers don't need. The 1000W M600 Bafang system with DPC18 display is by far the most widely produced, best and most overengineered ebike motor and system combination currently available on a wide range of quality ebikes. If you don't need the power and want local servicing, or you prefer a dedicated Class 1 just go with an LBS variant with a Bosch or Shimano 250W mid drive and pick a price point. What you want to avoid is having to depend on a single source for proprietary parts that is likely just shy of bankruptcy, and also to steer clear of known warranty issues. The 1000W mid drive is powerful enough to require regreasing every so often, a little more complicated than changing the oil but perfectly doable by any decent bike shop if they are willing to service Bafang.
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May 5, 2023 03:09
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Man_of_Teflon posted:grin is definitely at the top end of pricing, but again you are paying for very high quality equipment - they design and build their own charger, controllers, and some of the motors and batteries (all-axle and ligo) with top quality parts. I should have been more specific. Proprietary tech is the bane of the cycling industry, as cool as it definitely can be. For the average consumer/cyclist, they are far better off buying from a LBS and a bike company that builds their bikes with standardized motors and electrical. Batteries are almost always proprietary in their casings but the cells and electronics can usually be repaired or replaced by any decent battery tech. And it might sound a bit ominous, but I have been working in the cycling industry for 25 years and I have never seen a niche so saturated as the current ebike market, and companies are hurting. There are over 400 ebike companies in operation right now, and a proportion of them - and any LBS that has oriented their market to them - are definitely going to fail this year and next year. Rad Power is an excellent example - they invented the fat tire ebike and went scalar in 2018-2019, peaking at 450 employees and a full c-suite of top tech executives in 2020; an ecomm darling that was making hundreds of millions and selling millions of ebikes. Now they are a shell of their former self with about 100 employees, their mobile wing was completely eradicated at immense loss, and they just canceled the RadMission after unveiling an etrike that had a proprietary tire size just like their RadWagon, which is the cycling industry equivalent of starting a land war in Asia. Also I vastly prefer the mid drive motors, the 1000W Bafang M620 is easily the best motor that the industry has ever produced. It's powerful, efficient, affordable (albeit heavy af). Anywhere but flatland the mid-drive is the better motor. Nothing wrong with hub motors, it's just that they push instead of pull, and they have a propensity to overheat in hot weather. Glad you got a cool custom rig though.
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May 9, 2023 02:50
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evil_bunnY posted:Meh. BionX and Neodrive motors still ride better than any mid-drive I've been on (granted I haven't ridden the newer bafangs). Any hub motor with a torque sensor will probably "feel" better than any mid drive with just a cadence sensor, as torque sensors are a more accurate reflection of assist levels, and that can also be subjective. Cadence alone is noticeably less expensive. BionX went out of business unless I missed something. BionX largely made direct drive hub motors which are obsolete and are a good example of why most people should steer clear of kits for that exact reason. For pure torque and ride assist a mid-drive is more powerful and more ideally placed for e-assist. As someone who has extensively ridden virtually every kit and motor out there and sold ebikes since they came out, I can say you are entitled to your subjective and anecdotal opinion, but generally and objectively you are incorrect. The M620 has both cadence and torque sensor and it absolutely leaves any hub motor in the dust. Hub motors will also shut off when they are about to overheat; mid drives do not overheat. Mid drives are typically more powerful and serviceable. Hub drive motors have all kinds of servicing issues, not the least of which is simply accessibility. My company has a battery refurbisher specialist who has been working on lithium ion from day one who would also disagree with you. It might still be expensive but your old battery is rebuildable. Shimano and Bosch may deliberately build their batteries and motors to a difficulty of rebuilding them concomitant with planned obsolescence but it is always doable with parts and practice. Shimano says the same thing about its IGHs (i.e. don't rebuild them; deliberately overengineered) and I managed a service department that learned to rebuild those from scratch and provided that service regularly to people with worn out IGH hubs of every known brand - because Shimano publishes exploded diagrams and parts specs for every single part of their systems as do all IGH manufacturers from Sturmey Archer to Rohloff. You should not presume to speak to authority when you are an ebike enthusiast with anecdotal experience as opposed to myself, an industry specialist with decades of aggregate experience assembling, working on, having ridden, and selling thousands of ebikes. I have to say that these opinions are very much reflective of the tinkery, home garage type bike mechanics I have hired regretfully over the years because they have these weird, entrenched assumptions based on internet confirmation bias recycled opinions with no basis in actual problem solving. Hence why I only hire young people with no experience because I can train them to always assume anything that was engineered, standardized at least to proprietary levels of hundreds of units and then built in a factory and sold en masse can be fixed. It's funny because ebike company CEOs can range from people like Mike Radenbaugh, owner of Rad Power, who rejects ISO to his evident peril, or to specialty niche brands who conform religiously to ISO as closely as possible to render their product serviceable in near perpetuity. Planned obsolescence is its own problem, but it perpetuates disloyalty so it is disingenuous and bad business in the long run. Huggybear fucked around with this message at 04:08 on May 10, 2023 |
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May 10, 2023 03:59
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evil_bunnY posted:Given their financial situation I wouldn't get a Rad at any price. They keep downsizing after a bunch of stupid startup mistakes after they went scalar. They abandoned the Rad Mission completely, even replacement warranty frames after announcing that a single speed hybrid was the next generation of ebikes and it tanked and sucked, a total joke of an idea from a company owner that loathes the bike industry and thinks he knows better. The Rad Wagon has a proprietary wheel size and the original tires were recalled after exploding randomly. A proprietary wheel size is, for anyone in the bike industry, one of the stupidest mistakes a bike brand could make - no one has done this for decades without industry wide buy in (700C is a good example, even though you can still easily source 27" tires decades later) The industry desperately needs - and is finally starting to conform to - ISO/industry standards, especially for parts that wear quickly, so tires, tubes, chains, grips, pedals, and so on, all need to conform to existing standards, and this is not for the industry, it is for the common cyclist who depends on their bike. The backstory is, Rad hired some overpaid c-suite morons in 2019 who didn't know gently caress all about the industry and they are still doing stupid poo poo, like a trike with 18" tires, lol. They built out a Velofix-style mobile repair wing in 2020, except unlike Velofix they only fixed Rad bikes and it cost them untold millions when it didn't make any money, surprise. Then they were hit with a massive lawsuit when a couple of children died on a RadRunner - not sure of the specific details. The Rad Runner is a decent utility bike and there are a dozen models of electric mopeds that are made by better ebike companies that aren't slow motion imploding because they are relatively mildly okay at business. Rad is basically the Elon Musk Twitter takeover of the bike industry.
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Aug 2, 2023 18:04
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evil_bunnY posted:I’d never put a chinesium pack in my house. The cheap stuff is SO unsafe. I've worked in the ebike industry on and off (recently) for a while and can confirm that batches of batteries cause multiple fires and this is the topic ebike companies keep the quietest about and receive threats to litigate consistently. So much so that a major manufacturer, let's call them Dad Tower Bikes, has an entire container in a PNW HQ bricked out to try to force "thermal events" and in the retail stores the brand new batteries are all stored in fireproof drums. I think the companies must require the people affected to sign a NDC after some cash and a brand new ebike. It's absolutely a smart idea to buy an ebike with proven cells like Sony or Samsung; if not, charge your bike and/or battery on a concrete floor a good distance from any other objects
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Aug 14, 2023 00:08
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PRADA SLUT posted:Hm.. would it be better to upgrade to a gazelle or something? They seem to have better components. Aventon has a two year warranty which is rare in the industry and a big plus - ebikes have way more warranty issues than regular bikes with the motors and electrical added in. It is probably better priced, as Aventon is the North American factory direct brand of the Chinese factory that manufactures a ton of the ecomm ebike brands.
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Sep 27, 2023 03:47
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Saukkis posted:E-bikes with limits that can be trivially disabled should just be classified as motorcycles. That would cause an immense amount of red tape, licensing fees, impose enormous restrictions on usage and implementation, new infrastructure (signage, designated lanes). Ebikes cannot go fast enough to use highways or parkways with speed limits in excess of 50-60kmh, and yet would require the same steps to acquire as, for example, a dedicated 1200HP motorcycle...? There are millions of ebikes with larger motors that when the limit is removed still cannot go faster than 60kph, even with a dedicated bicycle drivetrain and proper pedalling capacity and e-assist. In no world does this make sense. I hate those stupid moped bikes too, but this would be so detrimental to most e-bicycle owners that this would affect.
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Oct 7, 2023 02:26
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acidx posted:Police don't have the knowledge/means/desire to call people out for lying about having a 750w motor, and there hasn't been a lot of pressure on them to adapt. They don't care. I have sold many 1000W motor equipped bikes to cops who max out the speed limit right in front of me, or deliberately purchase class 3 bikes to ride in the city I live in. They all say the same thing. If you're driving like an idiot, they will pull you over. Otherwise they couldn't care less. It's like a cop issuing a ticket because your gas powered vehicle has the capacity to go faster than the speed limit. Bylaw enforcement is different, their job is purely fine issuance so they can ticket you for speeds in excess - in posted zones, such as city cycling and pedestrian trail networks. But the 32km/h limit is peak throttle, and when e-assist stops kicking in - there is absolutely no law that limits an e-cyclist from going faster than 32km/h if they are obeying a higher speed limit. And there is absolutely zero way to prove this. Also most Chinese manufacturers do not have the wattage printed on their motors or anymore, so there is literally zero way to police this unless you can get someone on video throttling without pedaling well past 32km/h. Again, no one cares. I've been in the industry from day one of the original conversion kits and it has been nothing but doom and gloom from loudmouths with respect to mass regulation of the industry yet absolutely zero movement towards regulation other than where it was originally strictly enforced, which is western Europe and Japan where cyclists do ride en masse and tail lights and power restrictions make sense. But in North America the discussion is absolutely pointless, and the original boilerplate arbitrary impositions have simply gathered dust and grow more senseless as the technology and industry develop. Moped style "ebikes" notwithstanding
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Oct 8, 2023 02:15
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frogbs posted:In the budget 'small' wheel e-bike space, is the Lectric XP 3.0 any worse than similar options from RadPower, Blix or any of the other cheap manufacturers? I have a friend who wants to try an ebike on the cheaper side before upgrading to something like a Tern and Lectric is what they're leaning towards. Any opinions? It's pretty decent for the price. Assuming the bike is actually equipped with hydraulic brakes - the bikes depicted all show mechanical disc brakes. The main caveat with Chinese e-systems is that they have a higher rate of warranty issues. Worth reading TOS and making sure they have support contact and replacement parts here in North America.
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Oct 14, 2023 01:20
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7-speed Shimano is pretty flawless once it is set up. And generic hydraulic brakes are almost always fine out of the box. They probably don't list the brand because they have to take what they can get. There are still ripples in the bike industry's supply chain from the pandemic.
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Oct 16, 2023 23:42
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kimbo305 posted:Good news: the REI e-bikes are back at $900/1150 respectively These are neat bikes, like a bargain Tern but maybe without the option to carry children other than a baby seat. I scanned both bikes pretty quickly so I may have missed something, but it looks like the only difference is the battery, 10ah or 14ah if I read correctly. The higher amperage is worth the $250. They come with killer quality tires for an entry level e-bike. Seems like REI has got some smart product developers, I wish more Bafang-equipped ebike companies would follow suit. e: granted they are both being discontinued
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Nov 28, 2023 22:08
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CopperHound posted:The more expensive one coming with the front rack is more valuable than you might think. I didn't notice that, but absolutely a proprietary front rack on a soon-to-be discontinued Chinese-manufactured ebike, if one is in the market, is priceless if you're not a welder or a machinist
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Nov 29, 2023 01:01
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Qu Appelle posted:Thank you so much! Seconding the Aventon. If you buy from Costco, they have a one year no questions asked return policy (which in Canada, at least, does apply to ebikes, maybe the US too). Aventon also has a two year warranty policy which is almost unheard of - they can afford it because they are basically the North American direct to consumer brand for one of the biggest mainland Chinese ebike factories. Absolutely do not buy a Rad. kimbo305 posted:Kona is having a 50% off sale The bike industry in general is seriously bottoming out, the ebike market is very saturated, and it looks like it is a good time to buy an ebike
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Dec 14, 2023 04:29
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hark posted:I know this looks like poo poo lol This is super cool. Do you have any general plans for a bike frame/drivetrain etc, and how you're going to mount or house the battery? Also curious about the motor choice. A hub motor is easier to mount and interface but since there are a lot of options I am wondering if this is because you already have a frame to build up from, or if there is something obvious I am missing. Does the motor option include the controller/wiring/display? (I have a bit of an industry background but I know very little about the electrical side of ebikes other than what basic diagnostics and what plugs into what because every major brand just has their own plug and play proprietary parts and batteries and all any customer cares about is power, legality and whether or not they have a throttle)
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Dec 27, 2023 01:49
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Nocheez posted:That was my guess when reading it as well. I didn't even know they still made these. I've seen a few sets locally purchased used to upgrade the mechanical discs that specifically come stock on value-priced cargo e-bikes. Nice that it's an option, nothing wrong with them. I find a third hand tool can help to really get these set up crisply if you like monkeying around with stuff.
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Feb 5, 2024 18:27
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