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Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!




Morbid Hound
Oh of course, The Merry Adventures of Robin Hood. Pyle generally really. His The Wonder Clock is great also.

Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 13:23 on Aug 21, 2021

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Kestral
Nov 24, 2000

Forum Veteran

yaffle posted:

That is a tricky one, Shirley Hughes does this well, "Dogger" and "Alfie gets in first" come to mind. If you want books for older readers, Judy Blume and Cynthia Voight both seem (to me) to capture something of the reality of being a child.


Thanks for this! Cynthia Voight's Kingdom series in particular looks like it could be really useful. And I've always meant to read Judy Blume, so maybe now's the time. If anyone else has recommendations I'd be happy to have them.

Trin Tragula
Apr 22, 2005

Kestral posted:

An adjacent question: can you recommend books - for whatever age of reader - that faithfully / accurately represent a kid's internal life? It occurs to me that most fiction with young protagonists doesn't really ring true in the way they think, speak, act.

Part of what makes me ask is, I'm working on a roleplaying game project that takes generations of protagonists from childhood to adulthood, then loops back around to playing the children of your previous characters. It'd be helpful to have some fiction where its young protagonists feel like real people instead of Small Adults, so that I can embed those feelings into mechanics.

Swallows and Amazons. There is nothing that better captures the imaginative process of kids at play with no adults around. They're privileged children of the Empire, so we may not necessarily approve of some of the subjects of their play, but that doesn't invalidate the depiction of the process itself.

Selachian
Oct 9, 2012

https://twitter.com/AP/status/1369339479702507526

Dammit. Besides reading The Phantom Tollbooth, of course, go read (or watch) The Dot and the Line.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSWH3hK7dyw

Chatrapati
Nov 6, 2012
I'd like to get my niece a fairytale book; I used to have a few British and Scandinavian ones growing up, and she likes it when I tell her the really gruesome ones. Recently she saved up her pocket money to buy her own book and was a bit disappointed that the stories weren't as macabre as the ones I (kind of) remember, which was sad. Also, I can hardly remember them at all and have ran out of stories.

A couple of tales which I remember her liking were a story where a farmer forgets to leave milk out for a local troll and ultimately gets his skin peeled off in the bathhouse, and one where a guy gets tricked by some fairies to become their slave and dance until his legs break. I believe that she likes the tension up to these terrible events, as one realises that everything is going to go badly.

She does own a copy of Arabian Nights, but it was my grandmother's copy from the early 1900s and the language is super inaccessible (nevermind racist) for a 9 year old, so ideally I would like something she can read at her own leisure.

The Voice of Labor
Apr 8, 2020

scary stories to tell in the dark isn't fairy tales and it pr'lly isn't gruesome enough but it's pretty good and has really good art

Chatrapati
Nov 6, 2012

The Voice of Labor posted:

scary stories to tell in the dark isn't fairy tales and it pr'lly isn't gruesome enough but it's pretty good and has really good art

Just looked this up and literally jumped up on my seat- those pictures are really scary, even for an adult!
Thanks for the suggestion, but I really would like a collection of fairy tales since she seems entranced by the idea. I'm not specifically looking for a book filled with gruesome folk stories, but enough in to excite her and maybe allow her to show off how brave she is with her friends or something.

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!




Morbid Hound

Chatrapati posted:

I'd like to get my niece a fairytale book; I used to have a few British and Scandinavian ones growing up, and she likes it when I tell her the really gruesome ones. Recently she saved up her pocket money to buy her own book and was a bit disappointed that the stories weren't as macabre as the ones I (kind of) remember, which was sad. Also, I can hardly remember them at all and have ran out of stories.

A couple of tales which I remember her liking were a story where a farmer forgets to leave milk out for a local troll and ultimately gets his skin peeled off in the bathhouse, and one where a guy gets tricked by some fairies to become their slave and dance until his legs break. I believe that she likes the tension up to these terrible events, as one realises that everything is going to go badly.

She does own a copy of Arabian Nights, but it was my grandmother's copy from the early 1900s and the language is super inaccessible (nevermind racist) for a 9 year old, so ideally I would like something she can read at her own leisure.

There are a few genuinely good options.

My first and strongest recommendation would be "Best-Loved Folktales of the World" by Joanna Cole. It has a really good selection of stories often not found in other collections, including not just classic european stories but also ones from the Pacific Islands, the Caribbean, and South America.

There's the Andrew Lang [Color] fairy books but they tend to be a bit sanitized; still a very good choice if you want the European fairy tale tradition.

There's Howard Pyle's Wonder Clock which is its own thing and lavishly illustrated -- make ABSOLUTELY sure you get a copy with the illustrations.

I wouldn't recommend the original Brothers Grimm collections unless your niece is older as the Grimm's collection contains a number of stories with extreme antisemitism.

Lady Gregory's Complete Irish Mythology is pretty good if she wants more of the Irish stuff after reading Best-Loved Folk Tales.

None of those options are particularly gruesome though. If she's a little older Gaiman's "Snow Glass Apples" but it has sexual themes in it.,

Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 13:26 on Aug 21, 2021

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004

Chatrapati posted:

Just looked this up and literally jumped up on my seat- those pictures are really scary, even for an adult!
Thanks for the suggestion, but I really would like a collection of fairy tales since she seems entranced by the idea. I'm not specifically looking for a book filled with gruesome folk stories, but enough in to excite her and maybe allow her to show off how brave she is with her friends or something.

There's a tonne of really good post-modern takes on fairy tales by Janet and Alan Ahlberg. Not particularly gruesome but It Was A Dark And Stormy Night and Ten In A Bed are great stories about children taking ownership of Folk/Fairy Stories in order survive some light danger.

Selachian
Oct 9, 2012

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

None of those options are particularly gruesome though. If she's a little older Gaiman's "Snow Glass Apples" but it has sexual themes in it.,

I mentioned this recently in the SF thread, but Tanith Lee's Red as Blood is a collection of fairy tales rewritten with a horror spin, usually with heroes and villains reversed -- for instance, the title story, much like "Snow, Glass, Apples," is a retelling of "Snow White" where Snow White is a vampiric monster and the wicked stepmother is trying to stop her.

As much as I like it, though, Red as Blood is probably too advanced, in vocabulary and themes, for a nine-year-old.

Chatrapati
Nov 6, 2012
These are some superb suggestions, thank you very much guys!

fez_machine posted:

There's a tonne of really good post-modern takes on fairy tales by Janet and Alan Ahlberg. Not particularly gruesome but It Was A Dark And Stormy Night and Ten In A Bed are great stories about children taking ownership of Folk/Fairy Stories in order survive some light danger.

She's a bit too old for the Janet and Alan Ahlberg stuff (she also read some of them when she was younger, so might see them as 'kids books' regardless), but I agree that they are great.

Selachian posted:

I mentioned this recently in the SF thread, but Tanith Lee's Red as Blood is a collection of fairy tales rewritten with a horror spin, usually with heroes and villains reversed -- for instance, the title story, much like "Snow, Glass, Apples," is a retelling of "Snow White" where Snow White is a vampiric monster and the wicked stepmother is trying to stop her.

As much as I like it, though, Red as Blood is probably too advanced, in vocabulary and themes, for a nine-year-old.

I think she'd love the idea of inverting the fairy tales in Red as Blood, I'll have to trust you on the contents though.

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

There are a few genuinely good options.

My first and strongest recommendation would be "Best-Loved Folktales of the World" by Joanna Cole. It has a really good selection of stories often not found in other collections, including not just classic european stories but also ones from the Pacific Islands, the Caribbean, and South America.

There's the Andrew Lang [Color] fairy books but they tend to be a bit sanitized; still a very good choice if you want the European fairy tale tradition.

There's Howard Pyle's Wonder Clock which is its own thing and lavishly illustrated -- make ABSOLUTELY sure you get a copy with the illustrations.

I wouldn't recommend the original Brothers Grimm collections unless your niece is older as the Grimm's collection contains a number of stories with extreme antisemitism.

Lady Gregory's Complete Irish Mythology is pretty good if she wants more of the Irish stuff after reading Best-Loved Folk Tales.

None of those options are particularly gruesome though. If she's a little older Gaiman's "Snow Glass Apples" but it has sexual themes in it.,

I'm going to pick up a copy of Best-Loved Folktales of the World based off your recommendation, and the blurb makes it sound quite enchanting too. If she likes it, I'll check out your other suggestions. :)
You say that they are not particularly gruesome, but I'd be surprised of not one of the 200 stories of Best-loved Fairy Tales has some horrific element to it.

I looked up "Snow Glass Apples" on wikipedia, and I think I'd be uncomfortable giving it to her. I don't know if she knows about rape or not, but I don't want to be the person who introduces that idea!

Selachian
Oct 9, 2012

I would like to necro this thread to mention that Natalie Babbitt is amazing and if you haven't read The Search for Delicious or The Devil's Storybook, you really should.

And while I'm recommending stuff, Jean Merrill's The Pushcart War is a very funny book and has an important message about how little people can defeat big bullies by organizing.

lifg
Dec 4, 2000
<this tag left blank>
Muldoon
If you’re looking for early cardboard books, Sandra Boynton books have an explicit musicality to them that I love. Barnyard Dance especially.

Selachian
Oct 9, 2012

lifg posted:

If you’re looking for early cardboard books, Sandra Boynton books have an explicit musicality to them that I love. Barnyard Dance especially.

Barnyard Dance was a regular in bedtime rotation when my daughter was small enough to carry around. Likewise, Hippos Go Berserk!, Your Personal Penguin, and Pajama Time (jamma jamma jamma jamma P! J!).

Also, Boynton's song books (Philadelphia Chickens, Dog Train, Blue Moo, et al.) are well worth checking out.

a friendly penguin
Feb 1, 2007

trolling for fish

Selachian posted:

Barnyard Dance was a regular in bedtime rotation when my daughter was small enough to carry around. Likewise, Hippos Go Berserk!, Your Personal Penguin, and Pajama Time (jamma jamma jamma jamma P! J!).

Also, Boynton's song books (Philadelphia Chickens, Dog Train, Blue Moo, et al.) are well worth checking out.

Jumping on the Boynton love train. Blue Hat, Green Hat made my son laugh and laugh. My husband also heard Moo, Baa, La La La so often he decided that it was actually a magical chant meant to summon the great demon Moobaalalala to do your bidding.

Pinus Porcus
May 14, 2019

Ranger McFriendly
Looking for short chapter books. Kid has been loving Dragon Masters and The Last Firehawk, but we've caught up with what the local library has for those series. Hoping for something very similar, around the same length (sub 100 pages), fantasy, and good stories for a 5 year old.

lifg
Dec 4, 2000
<this tag left blank>
Muldoon
My sister in law read This Is Not My Hat with a Vincent Price voice and it was perfect.

yaffle
Sep 15, 2002

Flapdoodle

Pinus Porcus posted:

Looking for short chapter books. Kid has been loving Dragon Masters and The Last Firehawk, but we've caught up with what the local library has for those series. Hoping for something very similar, around the same length (sub 100 pages), fantasy, and good stories for a 5 year old.

Similar to those would be Kingdom of Wrenley, maybe Geronimo Stilton? There's a series called Flying Furballs which seems popular right now, but that's less fantasy.

Kestral
Nov 24, 2000

Forum Veteran

lifg posted:

My sister in law read This Is Not My Hat with a Vincent Price voice and it was perfect.

This is an incredible idea and I am writing it down for future use. Gives me an excuse to work on a Vincent Price voice, which is its own reward.

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Pinus Porcus
May 14, 2019

Ranger McFriendly

yaffle posted:

Similar to those would be Kingdom of Wrenley, maybe Geronimo Stilton? There's a series called Flying Furballs which seems popular right now, but that's less fantasy.

Cool, thank you, Geronimo Stilton looks perfect! We tried Kingdom of Wrenly, but he wasn't interested in continuing that one. We did read Dragon Girls, which was surprisingly ok.

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