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Fister Roboto
Feb 21, 2008




Buglord

Hello friends, this is the spoiler discussion thread for your favorite catgirl dressup simulator. Everything up through the end of the 5.3 story is on the table here. No need to use spoiler tags.

IF YOU HAVE NOT FINISHED THE MAIN STORY QUEST "REFLECTIONS IN CRYSTAL", CONTINUE READING AT YOUR OWN RISK









































So, the biggest plot bomb by far is the fact that the Warrior of Light might be the incarnation of Azeyma, or Azim, or countless other sun gods throughout Eorzean history. The first thing that made me think is that it really shines a different light on Magnai asking you if you're his moon. Turns out he was only slightly off.

Also Hythlodaeus is a sassy bitch.

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Jetrauben
Sep 7, 2011

Yelling at clouds.

I do wonder if the Twelve are "just" the Convocation, or if the Convocation were in turn appealing to the same powers that the Twelve represent.

erenoyo
Jun 30, 2019


Why can't Elidibus remember? Emet-Selch didn't have much difficulty.

Arist
Feb 13, 2012




Oven Wrangler

I mentioned it in the other thread but the Convocation crystals looked suspiciously like soul crystals, wonder if that'll be anything.

Also, lmao, after 5.0 I posted that I couldn't believe they made me care about the Ascian plot, but that I was worried about it going forward because Elidibus is boring. Egg on my face, that's for sure. Wasn't quite sure if I got the details right on his story, though: basically, he was supposed to be part of Zodiark, but he had to withdraw at the last second because there was internal disagreement, so he got left behind by all his Convocation buddies, leading to his obsession with the Rejoining? Is that the gist of it?

Orcs and Ostriches
Aug 26, 2010




The Great Twist

Jetrauben posted:

I do wonder if the Twelve are "just" the Convocation, or if the Convocation were in turn appealing to the same powers that the Twelve represent.

The Twelve are actually Thirteen, and there are Fourteen members of the convocation including Azem anyways. None of the other names link up that I can tell either.

I more expect that since Azem was a wanderer that traveled the world making friends, different people the world over would remember them, and they'd have a crew in each location.

I couldn't match up any of the signs on their stones to any of the current symbols of the twelve. Azeyma's still feature's a circle, but that's the only real simularity. I only have screenshots of a couple though.

erenoyo posted:

Why can't Elidibus remember? Emet-Selch didn't have much difficulty.

Elidibus is long dead, as the heart of Zodiark. Zodiark summoned him back as a primal to be the world's salvation. He exists only for his mission.

Orcs and Ostriches fucked around with this message at 01:13 on Aug 12, 2020

Fister Roboto
Feb 21, 2008




Buglord

erenoyo posted:

Why can't Elidibus remember? Emet-Selch didn't have much difficulty.

Elidibus became a primal, which meant that his identity was being slowly subsumed by Zodiark. He knows his purpose and nothing else.

Pharohman777
Jan 14, 2012



The best part is that the WoLs job in the convocation was literally diplomat/adventurer, and presumably thats how Azem started popping up everywhere as a sun god.
The symbol on the crystal of azem is the alchemical symbol for the sun, and azem is Hebrew for 'strength'. So the seat of Azem is the 'wandering star' of the convocation as well as the 'sun'.

Arist
Feb 13, 2012




Oven Wrangler

See, I guess I missed the bit where it was implied (or stated outright) that Elidibus is a primal. Where was that?

Orcs and Ostriches
Aug 26, 2010




The Great Twist

Arist posted:

See, I guess I missed the bit where it was implied (or stated outright) that Elidibus is a primal. Where was that?

Right when Y'Shtola wakes up in Amaurot. She walks up to Eli and basically says, "So you're a primal, right." and he confirms.

Orcs and Ostriches fucked around with this message at 01:19 on Aug 12, 2020

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007



Arist posted:

See, I guess I missed the bit where it was implied (or stated outright) that Elidibus is a primal. Where was that?

Y'shtola reveals it straight up.

It's also the entire point of his plan. He is, effectively, the primal of heroism. By creating more faith in Warriors of Light he ended up empowering himself because he effectively the source for Warrior of Light as a shorthand for heroism, which is why it comes up so often and in multiple shards. (Since both the First and 13th had Warriors of Light too and we clearly see plenty more.)

Groggy nard
Aug 6, 2013

How does into botes?


Beating myself up was great, 10/10.

Jetrauben
Sep 7, 2011

Yelling at clouds.

I was under the impression Elidibus was mimicking the iconic vision of heroism, not that he had been the OG Hero?

Fister Roboto
Feb 21, 2008




Buglord

I legitimately laughed out loud at the end when Alisaie straight up complained about not getting any character development.

Also I'm gonna bet that's hinting at the twins getting new adult character models in the next expansion.

SpaceDrake
Dec 22, 2006

So I give this all about equal odds of either going super well or, uh, gettin' us all killed. Messily.

So a couple of prayers from you guys wouldn't hurt, yeah?


Elidibus is a bit complicated because he himself was a catalyst for summoning a primal, who then got splintered off or splintered off himself because "his mission" as Emissary required him to intercede again. He can't not do it as part of his personality, even before he became one with Zodiark. So he's an Ascian who is also a primal. And either way, this makes him vulnerable to getting vacuumed up by a auracite piece a mile tall.

BTW, do we have a running tally of the vacant Ascian offices now? Assuming nobody was raised to re-fill the positions, it seems like the Convocation is now missing Lahabrea, Emet, Elibidus, Igeyorhm, Mitron, Loghrif, Nabriales, and Emmerololth. With Fandaniel on the stage, that just leaves Pashtarot, Altima, Halmarut and Deudalaphon unaccounted for. That is not a lot of teleporting jerks left. (I also wonder if we'll finally see which one Travanchet was/is?)

SpaceDrake fucked around with this message at 01:34 on Aug 12, 2020

MelvinBison
Nov 17, 2012

"Is this the ideal world that you envisioned?"
"I guess you could say that."



Pillbug

Pharohman777 posted:

The best part is that the WoLs job in the convocation was literally diplomat/adventurer, and presumably thats how Azem started popping up everywhere as a sun god.
The symbol on the crystal of azem is the alchemical symbol for the sun, and azem is Hebrew for 'strength'. So the seat of Azem is the 'wandering star' of the convocation as well as the 'sun'.
I just realized it was supposed to be the Sun. I looked at that stone in the cutscene wondering why it wasn't a constellation.

Jetrauben posted:

I was under the impression Elidibus was mimicking the iconic vision of heroism, not that he had been the OG Hero?
He was. Primals are people's idealized versions of actual figures brought about by belief, so that caused him to turn into FF1 WoL.

Fister Roboto
Feb 21, 2008




Buglord

Oh btw, Unukalhai has a little more to say about Elidibus when you finish the story.

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011

I'm just goin' with the FLOW, baby.




I didn't realize the DPS check in the Sapphire Weapon was a DPS check so I died but hey I got some screenshots.







SpaceDrake
Dec 22, 2006

So I give this all about equal odds of either going super well or, uh, gettin' us all killed. Messily.

So a couple of prayers from you guys wouldn't hurt, yeah?


MelvinBison posted:

I just realized it was supposed to be the Sun. I looked at that stone in the cutscene wondering why it wasn't a constellation.

Yes. Being the member most concerned with the world at large, Azem's place in the constellation system inherited from FFXII and Tactics is that they represent the Sun itself. I was wondering how that'd work.

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007



Jetrauben posted:

I was under the impression Elidibus was mimicking the iconic vision of heroism, not that he had been the OG Hero?

He was not the original Warrior of Light, any more than Ifrit or Garuda are the original basis.

He was a primal dedicated to spreading heroism as a counterpart to the Ascian's villainy in order to achieve their overall goals though.

Hunter Noventa
Apr 21, 2010


Fister Roboto posted:

I legitimately laughed out loud at the end when Alisaie straight up complained about not getting any character development.

Also I'm gonna bet that's hinting at the twins getting new adult character models in the next expansion.

That was pretty great.

Right after the trial, when Elidibus of Light took one step and then there was that pillar of light, all I could think was 'You've activated my trap card!'

Regarding Zenos, I think we all knew his little buddy was going to be that fucker, and man did he have some great faces. Looking greatly forward to smashing his face in personally, since we didn't get to do it the first time. I just hope Zenos actually gets excited again, before we smash his face in too.

Defiance Industries
Jul 22, 2010

A five-star manufacturer




Those were some very easy Zodiac Brave Stones to collect

MelvinBison
Nov 17, 2012

"Is this the ideal world that you envisioned?"
"I guess you could say that."



Pillbug

Admittedly, I'm in livetweeting mode right now but I'm chiming in to say SETO GOT CLOSURE I DIDN'T KNOW I WANTED THIS

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011

I'm just goin' with the FLOW, baby.




Also we're in spoiler heaven, post your Exarch screens



Fister Roboto
Feb 21, 2008




Buglord

Fister Roboto
Feb 21, 2008




Buglord

MelvinBison posted:

Admittedly, I'm in livetweeting mode right now but I'm chiming in to say SETO GOT CLOSURE I DIDN'T KNOW I WANTED THIS

I cried like a baby at this scene

drat this game for making me feel things.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006





I cried about four times over the course of the MSQ and outright bawled at least twice. Pretty impressive for a story that I last got an update for six months ago.

SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008







Aenor's thirst knows no bounds

SpaceDrake
Dec 22, 2006

So I give this all about equal odds of either going super well or, uh, gettin' us all killed. Messily.

So a couple of prayers from you guys wouldn't hurt, yeah?


also wrt the zenos discussion in the main thread: frankly I'm also just happy to have an excuse for Matt McCooey to come back and consume ham through a microphone. Fandaniel is an absolute delight to listen to and I am looking forward to the sympathetic villains of Shadowbringers being contrasted by dudes who are just, straight up, no excuses, no sympathy, absolute loving monsters and played by talented actors who are having a ball with the production.

MelvinBison
Nov 17, 2012

"Is this the ideal world that you envisioned?"
"I guess you could say that."



Pillbug

Waffleman_ posted:

Also we're in spoiler heaven, post your Exarch screens
Hell yeah!

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011

I'm just goin' with the FLOW, baby.




I can't believe the climax of Shadowbringers was the Tron poster.

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007



Is there anyone who has done 3.5 but hasn't done the Eden stuff yet? I'm curious if they actually adapt for that or if Thancred and Urianger just get to exist in plot time for it. I know the plot namedrops Gaia if you've already done it.

SpaceDrake
Dec 22, 2006

So I give this all about equal odds of either going super well or, uh, gettin' us all killed. Messily.

So a couple of prayers from you guys wouldn't hurt, yeah?


ImpAtom posted:

Is there anyone who has done 3.5 but hasn't done the Eden stuff yet? I'm curious if they actually adapt for that or if Thancred and Urianger just get to exist in plot time for it. I know the plot namedrops Gaia if you've already done it.

I have not finished it yet and it didn't come up and Gaia was not namedropped; I'll let you know if they vanish midway once I pick Eden up again.

Relatedly, I am very eager to see how Ryne and Gaia wrap this up, now that it's just the two of them with no dads.

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011

I'm just goin' with the FLOW, baby.




It'll probably just be plot time.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006





SpaceDrake posted:

also wrt the zenos discussion in the main thread: frankly I'm also just happy to have an excuse for Matt McCooey to come back and consume ham through a microphone. Fandaniel is an absolute delight to listen to and I am looking forward to the sympathetic villains of Shadowbringers being contrasted by dudes who are just, straight up, no excuses, no sympathy, absolute loving monsters and played by talented actors who are having a ball with the production.

A sign of how much their writing has improved since Stormblood is that they're deliberately pairing Zenos with an off-the-wall goofball type to serve as a straight man and provide contrast to his more dour, brooding personality. I think it's hard to stomach too much of a vollain whose primary personality trait is "terribly bored with everything," so having a secondary character who can do all the usual villainous antics lets you have your cake and eat it.

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007



Waffleman_ posted:

It'll probably just be plot time.

Maybe but it'd be a bit odd for someone coming in once everything is done because they could very well do all of Eden before hitting 3.5 in the story and I assume they'll have something to address that

Waffleman_
Jan 20, 2011

I'm just goin' with the FLOW, baby.




ImpAtom posted:

Maybe but it'd be a bit odd for someone coming in once everything is done because they could very well do all of Eden before hitting 3.5 in the story and I assume they'll have something to address that

In that case, the last tier had a scene where Urianger and Thancred explicitly go "Well, we're gonna leave it in your hands, girls" and leave the storyline, so there shouldn't be that much issue.

Arist
Feb 13, 2012




Oven Wrangler

Maybe they'll just lock the last tier of Eden until you clear 5.3

Rand Brittain
Mar 24, 2013

"Go on until you're stopped."

ALPHINAUD: "I hereby swear to get an updated model in 6.0, and I can never take this back."

Vanderdeath
Oct 1, 2005

I will confess,
I love this cultured hell that tests my youth.





I hope the twins show up in 6.0 fully Giraffe'd up without further explanation.

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Rand Brittain
Mar 24, 2013

"Go on until you're stopped."

Vanderdeath posted:

I hope the twins show up in 6.0 fully Giraffe'd up without further explanation.

There is absolutely no way they would ever get their growth spurt without telling everybody in Eorzea.

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