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That Italian Guy
Jul 25, 2012

Rocky uses Explosive Punch!
Paid by the Spines-for-Lowtax Committee.


banned from Starbucks posted:

The cop that chased them to the train tracks was one of the ones in the woods/cabin? I thought he stopped at the tracks? Did he radio the other cops ahead and then join them? Was kinda confusing how they edited that part. Is that how he knew his name?

Yeah he stopped at the tracks, but then he was with them while they were being rounded up. Tbh, the roadblock was literally on the other side of the train tracks, and I think there's an exchange where the cops acknowledge each other (something like "I told you you were going to get something" or something along those lines).

E: snipe. The 2nd story Lovecraft ever wrote was "Dagon" (July 1917). It's the story of a WW1, opium addicted navy official getting marooned on a weird and decaying island that may as well be a section of the ocean floor pushed to the surface by volcanic activity. Exploring the island, the protagonist finds a weird monolith with carvings representing sealife and what happears to be fishmen, worshipping some gigantic creature. He then gets jumped by a one-eyed titanic sea monster and loses his mind for good. He wakes up in an hospital in San Francisco, and as the opium leaves his body, he starts getting more and more sure that the beasts of the sea will surge from the depths and drag everyone under the waves. This is the point where we realize this whole story was a suicide note all along.

That Italian Guy fucked around with this message at 13:33 on Aug 18, 2020

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mary had a little clam
Apr 23, 2003

Well I am
over-fucking-whelmed...


Young Orc

Adding to the praise from everyone else, I liked the first episode a lot.

One thing I think is a nice touch is how, in a typical Lovecraft work, you have this menace simmering below his stories. Characters are in old towns or strange mansions or weird islands and you The Reader know some icky poo poo could pop off any second, but worse than that, there's a pervasive Wrongness that just hangs over Lovecraft's worlds. Even if nothing bad happens, the Bad is everywhere and all around you and you're just lucky, not special, if you survive.

In the show, that same dread is racial terror. And yeah, a trite way to say it is "The real horror is racism!" but what I like is that the show does the work to go, Yeah actually racism IS a pervasive horror. You never know when a diner is safe, what it means when a passing pedestrian looks at you a beat too long, when a town is deadly after dark... I felt such a grave tension on that road trip and I think it was a great way of marrying horror tropes with political commentary.

I'll be interested to see how this stacks up against Watchmen (HBO), just because of the shared trope of "existing work recontextualized to feature prominent Black themes". I thought Watchmen did a pretty good job (with some flubs and choices I wouldn't have made here and there) but I have high hopes LC will go a little harder.

Drunkboxer
Jun 30, 2007


banned from Starbucks posted:

The cop that chased them to the train tracks was one of the ones in the woods/cabin? I thought he stopped at the tracks? Did he radio the other cops ahead and then join them? Was kinda confusing how they edited that part. Is that how he knew his name?

They knew the sheriff because they had newspaper clippings about him and said that the NAACP had filed complaints about him.

Milo and POTUS
Sep 3, 2017

I will not shut up about the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I talk about them all the time and work them into every conversation I have. I built a shrine in my room for the yellow one who died because sadly no one noticed because she died around 9/11. Wanna see it?


Drunkboxer posted:

Like That Italian Guy said there's already been Burroughs references

Where?

Drunkboxer
Jun 30, 2007



The opening dream sequence, then he talks about reading A Princess of Mars.

zoux
Apr 28, 2006



Preem Palver posted:

I'm digging it. Some minor changes from the book but so far it's all stuff that serves to make it work better for a visual format.

Do have a small quibble with the OP though- they went to Massachusetts, not the Deep South. While things were generally worse in the South, it's not as if sundown towns, segregation, and lynching stopped at the mason-dixon line. It wasn't as prevalent in major Northern cities, but suburbs, small towns, and rural areas across the US were all pretty terrible for minorities. I'm not in any way defending the South, but it usually takes the lions share of the blame despite the rest of the US only being slightly less likely to murder, sterilize, or deny basic rights, liberties, and services to black people.

https://twitter.com/MorganJerkins/s...679009485922304

Obviously not comprehensive or scientific, but they were everywhere. There's a fair famous few here in Texas so I knew about them, but until recently I also thought they were almost all in the South

Also Jonathan Majors, wow

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001

Mind Explode!
Out Come Dogs!




Fun Shoe

Jerusalem posted:

Loved the first episode, I never knew about Sundown Towns and goddamn what a horrific and monstrous concept that this was just an accepted thing in the not-too distant past.

Also I loving adore Uncle George, please don't hurt him!

Courtney B Vance has always been really good and hopefully this leads him to being used even more. That conversation he had with Atticus about his father, while Letitia fought with his brother inside the house, just had so many layers. The whole cast is amazing but I don't want anything bad to happen to Uncle George.

You could make a horror movie about just being black in the USA. Loved that lead up and the diner scene. Also Letitia going "we got to get the gently caress out of here" made me laugh like a goon. Also backing up the Aunt Jemima sign in the background of that one scene was even more chilling when you realize they JUST changed that this year.

banned from Starbucks posted:

The cop that chased them to the train tracks was one of the ones in the woods/cabin? I thought he stopped at the tracks? Did he radio the other cops ahead and then join them? Was kinda confusing how they edited that part. Is that how he knew his name?

Goons already mentioned how Leti's brother told them about NAACP complaining about Hunt. Why the chase? It's an old hunter trick. You flush out a deer/rabbit out of the brush and into the direction of your buddies with guns. Again, its an old trick and one Hunt has probably used a bunch. Find your prey, get them nice and scared and keep chasing them till they are wide eyed, shaky and sweaty. You radio your buddies and tell them you got someone suspicious coming their way. When they pull them over they see the suspects acting suspicious. You can now shoot people in the backwoods and everyone feels happy for a job well done and the world is safe.


Between this and Watchmen bringing attention to the Tulsa massacre I'm kinda pleased with HBO as a whole.

Shneak
Mar 6, 2015

"Doctor, listen to me and listen to me closely.
You're gonna witness all the days..."




That was a really great pilot episode. The sundown chase was horrifying.

davidspackage posted:

The one thing I disliked was how clearly those CG monsters were shown, as they looked kind of boring. Would've perhaps been better to obscure them more, show little shadowed glimpses.

If I have one complaint it's this. The creature transformation was much scarier in comparison but based on the dream sequence and the preview for the next episode this show isn't going to be holding back on the weird.

zoux
Apr 28, 2006



I mean, I looked directly at the eldrich abominations and my sanity remains intact...surely it does...

LifeLynx
Feb 27, 2001

Dang so this is like looking over his shoulder in real-time

Grimey Drawer

Oasx posted:

First episode was good, I would have preferred a bit more Lovecraft and monsters, but perhaps that will come in later episodes.

One thing that confused me When they are being chased by the truck, that white woman parks her car in front of it in order to stop it chasing them. But the truck starts flipping over several meters before hitting her car. I can't tell if they messed up the effects for that, or if it really just flipped over for some mystical reason

I assumed it was because the car looked expensive, and they couldn't damage it. Also why when they see what I assume was the same car parked in front of the mansion we're only shown half of it. But it could be magic powers of some kind, because CGI could've taken care of that otherwise.

Alehkhs
Oct 6, 2010

The Sorrow of Poets


It's meant to be caught by the audience that the cars never actually collided - something strange has happened.

Later on, when Letitia, Atticus, and George are talking about the crash at the table, Marvin asks "Wait, what actually happened that caused the crash?" Letitia looks uncomfortable, and Atticus finds the words "Your sister's precision driving. They couldn't keep up."

I think even they know something doesn't add up.

Alehkhs fucked around with this message at 16:18 on Aug 18, 2020

AFewBricksShy
Jun 19, 2003

of a full load.



I was going to post about how I really like this show, but instead now I'm mad about people thinking that HBO just hosed up the car crash shot and decided to air it anyway.

The casting is fantastic and I quite liked the show, and I'm glad that something awesome to watch followed up Perry Mason.

Drunkboxer posted:

I have no idea where the show will take it but one thing to make clear is that the book was not really in the Lovecraft Mythos at all. If I remember correctly, only the first story (which was the basis of this episode) felt explicitly Lovecrafty. The other stories have other genre author influences. Like That Italian Guy said there's already been Burroughs references and the book felt pretty Steven Kingy at times. I also remember thinking how some stories reminded me of Ray Bradbury and Arthur C. Clarke. It's like a big genre mashup.

I wish I could remember the book better because I having a hard to telling what are changes and what are things I straight up forgot. I guess it doesn't matter in the end but it's going to nag at me.
Is it an anthology? I looked it up last night and already found out spoilers that I didn't want to know, but it didn't say anything about it being multiple stories.

AFewBricksShy fucked around with this message at 16:28 on Aug 18, 2020

That Italian Guy
Jul 25, 2012

Rocky uses Explosive Punch!
Paid by the Spines-for-Lowtax Committee.


Alehkhs posted:

Later on, when Letitia, Atticus, and George are talking about the crash at the table, Marvin asks "Wait, what actually happened that caused the crash?" Letitia looks uncomfortable, and Atticus finds the words "Your sister's precision driving. They couldn't keep up."

Yeah, not only there was something obviously wrong outside of a Bollywood action movie, the characters themselves notice how wierd it was and they were not even seeing the events from the advantage point Goons have.

ZZZorcerer
Jul 24, 2007



Alehkhs posted:

It's meant to be caught by the audience that the cars never actually collided - something strange has happened.

Later on, when Letitia, Atticus, and George are talking about the crash at the table, Marvin asks "Wait, what actually happened that caused the crash?" Letitia looks uncomfortable, and Atticus finds the words "Your sister's precision driving. They couldn't keep up."

I think even they know something doesn't add up.

The car is also in the city they live if Iím not mistaken

That Italian Guy
Jul 25, 2012

Rocky uses Explosive Punch!
Paid by the Spines-for-Lowtax Committee.


ZZZorcerer posted:

The car is also in the city they live if Iím not mistaken

Yes, it's outside/close to their house. Also, it's mentioned that, when Atticus's dad disappeared, he was last seen getting on board of an expensive gray/silver car with someone who looked like a lawyer.

Alehkhs
Oct 6, 2010

The Sorrow of Poets


ZZZorcerer posted:

The car is also in the city they live if Iím not mistaken

Yeah, it's parked outside when Atticus visits his father's home.


That Italian Guy posted:

Yeah, not only there was something obviously wrong outside of a Bollywood action movie, the characters themselves notice how wierd it was and they were not even seeing the events from the advantage point Goons have.

Exactly. Something was so off about the situation that they can't even bring themselves to examine it.

Another moment that caught my eye, where we had a camera angle to ourselves, was when Atticus said that the letter from his father was "about my momma". George gets up and puts the Lovecraft book back on the shelf, but stumbles on his words with a worried look on his face, "What, uh.. wh-w-what'd he say?"

When Atticus responds "He said he found out where her family came from," George's face briefly changes to one of relief, before he turns around to scoff at the pursuit of her ancestry.

George also appears to have a photo of his brother's wife in his wallet, so I think there's some drama brewing there.

Alehkhs fucked around with this message at 16:47 on Aug 18, 2020

davidspackage
May 16, 2007



Exciting Lemon

Jerusalem posted:

Also I loving adore Uncle George, please don't hurt him!

I thought he was a goner like 3 times in the woods, really happy he made it out alive!

Alan G
Dec 27, 2003


Pillbug

I assumed the car flipping was similar to Eleven flipping the van in Stranger Things. Wonder how the shots compare in the two shows and if it was a close copy of it.

That Italian Guy
Jul 25, 2012

Rocky uses Explosive Punch!
Paid by the Spines-for-Lowtax Committee.


^^^ They look very similar.

Alehkhs posted:

Another moment that caught my eye, where we had a camera angle to ourselves, was when Atticus said that the letter from his father was "about my momma". George gets up and puts the Lovecraft book back on the shelf, but stumbles on his words with a worried look on his face, "What, uh.. wh-w-what'd he say?"

When Atticus responds "He said he found out where her family came from," George's face briefly changes to one of relief, before he turns around to scoff at the pursuit of her ancestry.

I wonder if we have ourselves a Shadow Over Innsmouth situation with Atticus's heritage

IBroughttheFunk
Sep 28, 2012


zoux posted:

https://twitter.com/MorganJerkins/s...679009485922304

Obviously not comprehensive or scientific, but they were everywhere. There's a fair famous few here in Texas so I knew about them, but until recently I also thought they were almost all in the South

Also Jonathan Majors, wow

Yeah, if that was a comprehensive map, it would be far, far fuller. I don't see any locations marked off in Connecticut where I live, and I can easily think of several towns off the top of my head.

Xealot
Nov 25, 2002

Showdown in the Galaxy Era.



IBroughttheFunk posted:

Yeah, if that was a comprehensive map, it would be far, far fuller. I don't see any locations marked off in Connecticut where I live, and I can easily think of several towns off the top of my head.

I'm from CT, and I'm very curious as to which towns these would've been. I grew up outside Hartford, in a mostly-black town that's surrounded by majority-white towns because of redlining. And it wouldn't surprise me in the least if many of those towns were "sundown towns" once upon a time.

Hakkesshu posted:

You are correct, I somehow missed that they were going to Massachusetts and just assumed it was the south because it's visually coded like the south. My bad.

Yeah, if you missed their explanation, it's an easy mistake to make. Very few places in New England look anything like that, the massive corn fields and flat landscape and what-not. It makes sense for the iconography of the show, though: the popular white imagination of "racist America" looks like the South and the Midwest, but the reality is that it is ALL racist America.


I'm also very worried for Uncle George. He's introduced in a happy marriage and is way too kind and paternal NOT to die horribly just to raise the stakes.

McSpanky
Jan 16, 2005







IBroughttheFunk posted:

Yeah, if that was a comprehensive map, it would be far, far fuller. I don't see any locations marked off in Connecticut where I live, and I can easily think of several towns off the top of my head.

Illinois should probably be way fuller too, especially Little Egypt. I mean, during the Civil War the state militia had to divide their duties between blockading the rivers and making sure the south third didn't pull a reverse West Virginia and join the Confederacy. It hasn't exactly changed much since.

davidspackage
May 16, 2007



Exciting Lemon

Xealot posted:

I'm also very worried for Uncle George. He's introduced in a happy marriage and is way too kind and paternal NOT to die horribly just to raise the stakes.

Oh God. Oh gently caress, he told his wife next time he should take her along.

Chairman Capone
Dec 17, 2008



IBroughttheFunk posted:

Yeah, if that was a comprehensive map, it would be far, far fuller. I don't see any locations marked off in Connecticut where I live, and I can easily think of several towns off the top of my head.

Xealot posted:

I'm from CT, and I'm very curious as to which towns these would've been. I grew up outside Hartford, in a mostly-black town that's surrounded by majority-white towns because of redlining. And it wouldn't surprise me in the least if many of those towns were "sundown towns" once upon a time.

Haha. Another Connecticut native here. I found this post that talks about some of the CT sundown towns. Not surprisingly it also seems like Italians and Jews were targeted.

https://www.newenglandhistoricalsoc...-sundown-towns/

I also found this list but it seems less reliable. If you click the links, a lot of the entries aren't about sundown towns but places where there was racism in the 1960s/70s, which... I mean, that's pretty much the entire state.

https://sundown.tougaloo.edu/sundow...ow.php?state=CT

That Italian Guy
Jul 25, 2012

Rocky uses Explosive Punch!
Paid by the Spines-for-Lowtax Committee.


davidspackage posted:

Oh God. Oh gently caress, he told his wife next time he should take her along.

Ive heard he's only a couple of weeks away from retirement.

Clipperton
Dec 20, 2011


Grimey Drawer

DogsInSpace! posted:

There was a hilarious racist HP Lovecraft cameo in an issue of Planetary like 20 years ago

OTOH, while a prodigious letter writer, Lovecraft never once used his correspondence to groom teens

Niwrad
Jul 1, 2008



I feel like the only person who didn't like the first episode.

TheAardvark
Mar 3, 2019



One thing I was surprised by was the decision to play blatantly out-of-era music on the soundtrack, specifically:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-8qrzg-vgQ

Thom and the Heads
Oct 27, 2010

Farscape is actually pretty cool.


Niwrad posted:

I feel like the only person who didn't like the first episode.

It definitely made me temper my expectations about what tone the show is going for. I didn't see any trailers or previews for the show and was sold based on the title alone. After watching the first ep, the tone is decidely more pulp-y than I was hoping for and I didn't love the CGI mess at the end. I was hoping for slow-burning small town weirdness and cosmic horror shenanigans rather than shotgunning eldritch monsters right off the bat.

FWIW I didn't know this was based off someone's novel until I read this thread. I'm interested in the show for sure though.

Grem
Mar 29, 2004

It's how her species communicates!

Niwrad posted:

I feel like the only person who didn't like the first episode.

You are, that makes you a bad person of questionable morals.


Watch out for this guy everyone!

Frankenstyle
Dec 3, 2005



I thought it was great. I also thought the first episodes of The Outsider and Watchmen were great, so I'm super worried that once again I'm Charlie Brown and HBO is Lucy holding the football.

a kitten
Aug 5, 2006



Fallen Rib

Frankenstyle posted:

I thought it was great. I also thought the first episodes of The Outsider and Watchmen were great, so I'm super worried that once again I'm Charlie Brown and HBO is Lucy holding the football.

I'm a little worried about that myself after the Outsider, but whatever, so far i'm in.

Milo and POTUS
Sep 3, 2017

I will not shut up about the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I talk about them all the time and work them into every conversation I have. I built a shrine in my room for the yellow one who died because sadly no one noticed because she died around 9/11. Wanna see it?


Alehkhs posted:

George gets up and puts the Lovecraft book back on the shelf, but stumbles on his words with a worried look on his face, "What, uh.. wh-w-what'd he say?"


This was the only line delivery that negatively stood out for me lol.

Doltos
Dec 28, 2005


This first episode was good I hope they keep it up. I'm glad this wasn't slow burn. Insidious cult stories are a dime a dozen and Atticus jumping straight into the poo poo makes this feel like a more serious version of Ash vs the Evil Dead.

muscles like this!
Jan 17, 2005



AFewBricksShy posted:

Is it an anthology? I looked it up last night and already found out spoilers that I didn't want to know, but it didn't say anything about it being multiple stories.

Basically it is structured like a book of short stories but they're all about the same group of people, which we've pretty much all met. So, like, Letitia gets a story where she's the main character but Atticus and George and everyone else is still around for it.

Frankenstyle
Dec 3, 2005



Doltos posted:

makes this feel like a more serious version of Ash vs the Evil Dead.

I know it can be easy to see stuff that isn't there, but I replayed the cabin scene a couple of times when I was watching and I'm 93% convinced it was a nod to Evil Dead. The windows (and the boards on them) , the porch, the set dressing down to the location of the mounted deer head, all blatantly scream the cabin from ED. I hope I'm right, because I really love that.

*Oh yeah, also the hole in the front door.

Frankenstyle fucked around with this message at 05:49 on Aug 19, 2020

That Italian Guy
Jul 25, 2012

Rocky uses Explosive Punch!
Paid by the Spines-for-Lowtax Committee.


Frankenstyle posted:

I know it can be easy to see stuff that isn't there, but I replayed the cabin scene a couple of times when I was watching and I'm 93% convinced it was a nod to Evil Dead. The windows (and the boards on them) , the porch, the set dressing down to the location of the mounted deer head, all blatantly scream the cabin from ED. I hope I'm right, because I really love that.

*Oh yeah, also the hole in the front door.

I too commented on the parallels with Evil Dead, but I'm not 100% sure how much of that is down to "Evil Dead set the tone for this is how a hunted cabin looks like". They do look quite similar, and there were a ton of references to other pulp sources in the show:


If they did it on purpose though, I'm glad it was not too on the nose.

Ceramic Shot
Dec 21, 2006

The stars aren't in the right places.


DogsInSpace! posted:

Robert E Howard, a contemporary, even called commented on him being extreme (though Howard was from Texas he grew more tolerant as he met and talked with people not like him). Fear of the other and unknown were a large cornerstone of Lovecraft's work and combined with his prose really gives it a certain flavour that works even today, a century after. If it helps make it palatable for anyone, ol HP would probably really hate the casting and if they knock this out of the park then all the sweeter. I hope this goes well and I look forward to more.

I've seen similar comments about Robert E. Howard floating around, but would just like to add that he was a lot worse than I think a lot of people seem to realize too, at least if his correspondence with Lovecraft is anything to go by. I've been reading A Means to Freedom, the collection of Howard/Lovecraft correspondence, and holy poo poo is it (unsurprisingly) a sty of vileness at times. As prejudiced as those times were, I can't help but put Howard into the category of "racist even for his generation." Spoilered for some of the most ugly bare-faced racism you'll hopefully read for a while. All of the following quotes are from Robert E. Howard, from around the year 1931:

"I agree with all you say about foreign immigration. 'The melting pot' -- bah! As if we could assimilate all the low-lived scum of southern Europe without tainting the old American stock..." P. 88

"I'll freely grant an Englishman, Scotchman, Irishman or Welshman the right to become an American the instant his foot touches American soil, but as far as I'm concerned a wop or a Slav can't become American in five hundred years." P. 98

"...where in all the world is there an unspoiled, hardy race of clean-blooded barbarians, fit to take the reins of the world when the older peoples decay? ...Russians -- must eventually repeat the pages of history and conquer the civilized world, as all rising Aryan powers have done in the past. But it is a possibility which I contemplate with scant relish. There is too much Mongol blood in the veins of Russia for me to regard that nation as anything but alien." P. 99

"...he already had eleven or twelve killings to his name, though only nineteen years old -- that isn't counting Mexicans and Indians. No white man of that age who had any pretensions to gun-fame counted any but the regal warriors of his own race and color." P. 154 (On gunfighters)

"...its [sic] a drat pity that the Boskop people didn't have some Aryan traits to stiffen their spines and train their hands in fighting. I hate to think of white people being wiped out and enslaved by n------."

"I cannot think of Saul, David, Abner, and Joab as Jews, not even as Arabs; to me they must always seem like Aryans, like myself. Saul, in particular, I always unconsciously visualize as a Saxon king..." P. 161

"Its [sic] a dirty shame that the Polacks are selling those fine old stone walls and replacing them with wire fences. Another proof that traditions mean nothing to these aliens, who bring their own traditions with them and callously trample on those of the land they pollute by their presence." P. 167

"The Scandinavian and the n-----, the extremes of development! Well, it's glad I am that my Danish great-greatgrandfather was so fair-skinned, blue-eyed, and red-haired-and-bearded that no one could mistake him for a Virgin Islander!"

"Some day I must write of the success of the earlier Crusades to gratify my racial vanity."

"I certainly show no trace of Oriental blood -- thank God."

"I don't know whether an Oriental smells any different than a n------ when he's roasting, but I'm willing to bet the aroma of scorching hide would have the same chastening effect on his surviving tribesmen... I understand Hawaii is controlled by Oriental interests. Instead of a boycott, a noose should have been used wholesale. As for the attorney, for any white man who is low enough to crucify an out-raged child of his own color before a mongrel swarm, a roll down a hill in a barrel full of safety-razor blades is too good for him. It is my ardent hope that he will come to his end at the hands of some of his yellow-bellied pets." P. 294


Yikeseroni! They have some interesting conversations about the relative merits of civilization vs. barbarism and epistemology, at least, but the whole volume is kind of interwoven with this shared sense of fascistic racial destiny garbage.

Comrade Fakename
Feb 13, 2012



I thought this was okay, but not having seen any trailers it was very different from what I was expecting. I thought it would be foreboding, dark and gothic - instead it was bright and colourful, and pulpy almost to the point of camp.

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TheAardvark
Mar 3, 2019



Milo and POTUS posted:

This was the only line delivery that negatively stood out for me lol.

yeah that was about as un-subtle as you can get, he might as well have just straight up said he banged his mom

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