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What is the black goo? It's never explained. Huge plothole in the series imo, but the biggest one is the science team in Prometheus being dumb. It's never explained why they are that stupid. The crew not caring about Shaw or the squid is also a plot hole.
End of Shoelace fucked around with this message at 11:42 on Aug 31, 2020 |
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Aug 31, 2020 11:38
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doverhog posted:It's a bio weapon the engineers made for ???? reasons. Yeah, but what IS it?
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Aug 31, 2020 11:43
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doverhog posted:???? They never clearly explain what it is. It's a big problem for the series canon. It's also disappointing that the origin of the most iconic sci-fi slasher villain ever is never explained. I was extremely disappointed after seeing Prometheus in the theater. It would have been better if, like, Weyland genetically engineered the aliens out of greed, and the movie was about stopping him. Think of a baby between Alien and Avengers, and you have a good movie. I mean, the black goo can't just be all there is to it. There's nothing.
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Aug 31, 2020 11:53
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Joe Chill posted:Nah, they just can't articulate that the third acts in both movies are absolute garage. What makes Alien and Blade Runner good movies?
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Aug 31, 2020 12:32
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Mozi posted:atmosphere? What qualities make the atmosphere of the movie "Alien" so good that it, in turn, makes "Alien" a very good movie?
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Aug 31, 2020 12:59
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Joe Chill posted:What doth film? How much does the atmosphere of the movie "Alien" weigh?
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Aug 31, 2020 14:39
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Personally, I would have liked if it was discovered that the Aliens have a fully translatable language, but it turns out communicating with them is hard and they tend to be violent, so it becomes more OK to kill them than ever before.
End of Shoelace fucked around with this message at 14:55 on Aug 31, 2020 |
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Aug 31, 2020 14:51
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Drink-Mix Man posted:I agree. Aliens is a super memorable action movie, but all the Ridley Scott-directed ones generally have more to offer in terms of atmosphere and having something to say. What does "Alien" have to say?
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Sep 1, 2020 02:25
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toggle posted:Especially the part when the scientists took off their helmets in the temple, cave thing. That makes a good movie? Did you lose your poo poo at "Saving Private Ryan" when the characters took their helmets off, when only minutes before in the movie's runtime, the surrounding area was proven to be extremely dangerous without a helmet?
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Sep 1, 2020 11:14
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Malkina_ posted:Humans are worse than the aliens. I'd argue that the humans effectively ARE the aliens. That is one reason why the "Alien" series is so striking; fundamentally, the movies are about human conflict, and the xenomorph is a manifestation of this violence in a more literal form. The xenomorph literally cannot exist without a host; they are borne of humans in all of the movies. The temperamental crew of the Nostromo kinda tolerate eachother, and begin to actively dislike one another once the life of a crewmember is possibly at stake, and conflict arises. Once this loathing is suppressed (but not gone) at the dinner table, the xenomorph emerges from the subject of the tension between the crew. Had the ship not self-destructed and were to be discovered later, the aftermath of the xenomorph slaughtering the crew of the Nostromo would be indistinguishable from a bout of manic destructive energy by the crew itself.
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Sep 1, 2020 11:32
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Collapsing Farts posted:movies dont have to have something "to say" wtf All "Salo, or the 120 Days of Sodom" needs to do is to be entertaining.
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Sep 1, 2020 11:35
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There is something extremely weird with Prometheus where a lot of people watch it and don't say "this research team does some questionable things; they are not so professional it seems", but instead say "this research team does some questionable things; this is a huge loving plothole and they were written like this by mistake! Ridley Scott is senile!"
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Sep 1, 2020 11:44
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Xaintrailles posted:It is in fact a plot hole that humanity's most distant exploratory mission, a huge expensive spaceship, and the life of the guy paying for it all have been entrusted to the D-team, without anyone noticing or commenting on it. I mean, in the world of the Alien movies, space travel is so commonplace and integrated that sending a group of everyday workers into deep space, several months of travel outside radio range, is akin in danger and rarity to sending a crew to operate an oil rig. Also, Weyland hired cheap because he pretty much knew what was on LV223. He wouldn't have come along otherwise, as it wouldn't make sense for Weyland, an ancient and frail man, to tag along for what could potentially be his last trip if he wasn't atleast VERY sure that his destination was on the planet. That's also why he had his own facilities and loyal subordinates who took the reins after sufficient discoveries were made. Pretty much all Weyland cared for was: 1. Getting himself and David to LV223 2. Confirming the location of Engineers or their technology on the planet 3. Meeting an Engineer personally or acquiring their technology He literally did not care about the lives of the team he hired. All they had to do was land on the planet, make sure it was safe for Weyland and map it out. Did you think his weird AR projection pep talk was sincere? You could say that the crew was... Expendable. End of Shoelace fucked around with this message at 13:34 on Sep 1, 2020 |
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Sep 1, 2020 13:30
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Mozi posted:as an audience member i felt the crew acted in unrealistic ways in order to further the plot, which annoyed me It's a plot hole. The fact that the majority of the Prometheus crew are an annoying bunch of neuroses is an obvious sign that the writers painted themselves into a corner, gave up, and rolled around naked in their textual paint. This is NOT how they should have acted. I looked at the screen for clues of an ancient alien civilization, became very excited seeing that the ground was FILTHY with alien fossils and bones, but then became bitterly disappointed upon discovering that idiot Ridley Scott did a total blunder, revealing in a nonsensical, weightless plothole that the artifacts littering the landscape of LV223 are, apparently, just loving rocks. The writers are idiots who do not care. They are just lazy and out to make a buck.
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Sep 1, 2020 13:44
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Colonel Cancer posted:These here plotholes signify the hubris of man, you absolute rube, don't you watch any kino? And this bad acting represents men drawn to the edge of sanity, it is absolutely brilliant work! You think the movie directors cheaped out on the set? You drat idiot, they were building for authenticity, the gorilla suit robot represents what the characters would see through their limited mindset upon encountering alien technology of incomprehensible advancement Effective parody requires solid knowledge of the source materials.
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Sep 1, 2020 17:56
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Collapsing Farts posted:Yeah but the quesiton was "what makes the characters interesting?" My problem is that the whole theme of refraction, dispersion and integration has nothing to do with the "troubled women" thing. These two major subjects of the movie, ironically, do not mingle in any way whatsoever.
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Sep 2, 2020 14:37
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Mozi posted:i don't have a problem w/ the map maker getting lost. ok, i get the point, it's not very subtle This line of complaints is a trap one can run into when they do movie critique. One says: "It should have been explained precisely why the map maker got lost." When they are asked if giving the viewers an in-depth reason of why the map maker got lost would fix the movie, the answer is guaranteed to be no, and another "error" is brought up. This creates a near-infinite list of small details to change, derailing the person into analyzing hundreds of disconnected tidbits and offering alternatives, to "fix" the "errors". This sends the critic into a goose chase where the ultimate "fix" to the movie is searched for in uncountable little details, but never found. A more pressing reason why this kind of endless, often looping investigative work is ineffective: honest errors in movies, especially anything in it's writing, are a lot more rare than people tend to think. The lack of a precise reason for the map maker becoming lost is not an error in the movie's writing. The map maker simply becomes lost. Does a regular person need an in-depth, hidden meaning to why they might get lost somewhere unfamiliar to them? The most pressing reason: offering alternatives to what happens in the movie is not analysis of the movie. One begins to write about an entirely different movie which exists in their head, refusing to engage with the real movie itself. The analysis for the movie is to be found in what the movie presents to us. The map maker became lost. What is the relation to this in the writing of the movie? This kind of trap also swivels smoothly into basic difficulties in reading a movie. It's claimed that the map maker becoming lost is a plot hole, because map makers, inherently by nature, should not get lost. One sees a shot of a picket fence and hears barking. Then, a cat saunters from behind the fence. Difficulty in reading causes one to claim the filmmakers are dumb as hell for portraying the worst dog ever in cinema history. End of Shoelace fucked around with this message at 18:23 on Sep 2, 2020 |
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Sep 2, 2020 18:19
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Mozi posted:*biologist reads computerized screen on his wrist saying the air is safe to breathe and takes off his helmet* The scan of the planet's atmosphere concluded that, yes, the air IS totally safe to breathe. This is absolutely true; however, the spores are still dangerous, but they and the fungi have nothing to do with the atmosphere of the planet. It's a case of computer logic.
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Sep 2, 2020 19:00
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I'm starting to feel a little pretentious, so just go read Supermechagodzilla's long analysis on "Alien: Covenant".
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Sep 2, 2020 19:04
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Prism Mirror Lens posted:where dis http://prequelsredeemed.blogspot.com/2017/06/rpi-smg-and-alien-covenant.html Here's his longform posts up to the time he got permabanned. He did get unbanned, so click the links to the posts in the article to get to the original thread, and continue reading from there. Clunky, I know, but what can you do.
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Sep 2, 2020 19:30
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Biohazard posted:Yeah no one should ever be critical of the writing of a movie cause it happens to exist within a genre amirite What kinda moron would walk into a dark, enclosed and cluttered hangar while everyone knows that a murderous alien who's whole MO is striking from the shadows is hidden somewhere on the ship? WTF is he doing, he's just standing there and letting dirty engine water drip on his face! It must be full of toxic chemicals! How did he not see the alien swinging from the chains while looking directly up? Why would he act so stupid because of a CAT?! This story is full of plot holes! The writers don't care and they are shills, out there to wring us movie goers of our money!
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Sep 2, 2020 20:56
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Honestly, the fact that they would walk into the laboratory, knowing full well that the face-attacking alien is loose in there, without at least duct-taping a sieve or strainer of some kind onto their heads makes my blood boil. I was disgusted in the movie theater.
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Sep 2, 2020 21:02
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Why did Kane look into the egg after seeing it open? How did the facehugger get him through the helmet of the spacesuit? If it used acid to eat through it, how did the acid not melt his face off (the objective of the facehugger is specifically to not harm the host)? How did Kane not suffocate while they slowly dragged him onto the ship? If the facehugger converts the surrounding gases into a type that is breathable for it's host (which is incredibly convoluted and just plain dumb), how did it know to convert it to oxygen specifically? How did it detect the oxygen on the ship is breathable for it's host? Ridley Scott is losing his loving grip.
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Sep 2, 2020 21:09
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Biohazard posted:Yeah, you're right, you can play that game and poke holes in anything. Which is were actual, competent writing comes in, and helps you suspend that disbelief, instead of leaving you feeling like "wait, what the gently caress, why is this guy....". And by the way, writing good scripts that do that and then translating it to screen is really loving hard, which is why every movie isn't a masterpiece, or honestly even very good. If a well done suspension of disbelief is the basis of actual and competent writing, would you consider "Meet the Fockers" one of the best written films ever? Are we just supposed to swallow that these incredible space battles with astonishing technology happened a long, long time ago in a galaxy far, far away, but in our shared universe? Thinking of how widespread, easy and advanced long-distance space travel is, it's extremely improbable we would not have found some artifacts in the history of our planet's archeology, like a Stormtrooper helmet. Finally: suspension in the disbelief of what? That we are not actually looking through a window into another reality, but just watching a movie?
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Sep 2, 2020 21:17
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I generally like to know what I like or dislike, what is good and bad, and what makes them so.
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Sep 2, 2020 21:24
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Hell Yeah posted:i would like to just bring this post to the attention of people in the thread who are saying people only complain about plot holes in these movies. i'm not complaining about a plot hole, the movie is just poorly written and edited, which is a good criticism. like for instance there was a scene in prometheus where the extreme geologist guy with a mohawk throws his little flying orb mapmaker things into the air and calls them his pups and then howls. i guess i can understanding writing that in the movie, or even filming it, but leaving it in the final cut of the movie that showed in theaters? that's an insane decision and there are several examples of similar things that are just dumb as gently caress and make you question why you're even watching this movie. Why is that choice bad? You've claimed that it's bad, and claimed that claiming so is good critique. That's not reading, or even analysis.
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Sep 3, 2020 01:24
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Hell Yeah posted:are you saying you like that scene? Yes. This rear end in a top hat called "DA LONE WULFF" sends the equivalent of 400 dollar camera drones he calls his dawgs to fly around a cave and he howls. Then he gets lost and gets killed by a snake. He comes back as a werewolf. These people are on a mission to find god. It owns.
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Sep 3, 2020 01:33
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Randarkman posted:I'll call it what I want. That scene of cholecystectomy to remove the apartment building from the water key in the movie "Prometheus" was truly haunting.
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Sep 3, 2020 17:11
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T. Bombastus posted:Shaw knew she was pregnant, David tells her. It could be read as some "death drive" horror, where the aborted fetus persists even after termination. The movie does set a precedent for it, with the Engineer head coming back to life and Fifield continuing on as a corroded lump and whatnot.
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Sep 4, 2020 09:54
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Colonel Cancer posted:I thought it was well postulated within this very thread that characters in alien films are dumb mercenaries inept at their jobs and likely trained at whatever equivalent of a conservative Christian education centre they have in the setting? You're clearly missing the nuance in the film that should be obvious to a trained eye. These people are incompetent and misinformed from the start! Other than the weird non-sequitur about Christian schools: correct. Weyland needed a B-team that nobody in public would care about to smuggle himself, David and his own team to LV-233.
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Sep 4, 2020 20:14
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Prism Mirror Lens posted:I don’t think SMG’s take is his best work. It requires people to ignore a lot more of what the literal plot of the film is telling them than his Prometheus posts. It’s not very convincing to say that Walter and David are the same person so you need to ignore the fact that you know they’re two separate characters, and here’s a logically twisted explanation for why what every viewer thought happened in the plot, didn’t. “If this is a new character, why does he look identical to David? There is no immediate concrete answer.” The immediate answer from a plot-focused viewer would be: he’s a mass-produced robot, idiot, weren’t you paying attention? His insistence on just looking at the visuals of the current film and nothing else goes too far here. In his defense: mirroring is quite a large part of the visuals in Alien: Covenant. The neomorph that creeps up on the lady soldier is completely docile, attacking only after she reaches for her gun. When David acts calmly and slowly, he can even gently touch it. More to the point is the scene where the freshly hatched xenomorph mirrors David's pose. There is simply very few interesting things plotwise to be found in the notion that they look/are the same because they come from the same production plant, other than that David wants Walter to be more independent and loathes him (and by extension, himself). Unless you want to make a reading on how David is, in an ironic twist, taking the means of mass production for himself with the chamber full of alien eggs and such.
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Sep 7, 2020 13:07
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Prism Mirror Lens posted:The audio clip here where he says Shaw rebuilt him is from the released film. Well, you do agree that Walter and David are conceptually the same. So, conceptually, the android at the end is an evil Walter. I'll have to get back to you on the franchise thinking, because I am a dummy who doesn't really get it yet. End of Shoelace fucked around with this message at 16:04 on Sep 7, 2020 |
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Sep 7, 2020 15:33
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Away all Goats posted:Is convenant the one where the main character gets saved by a good android from a bad android (who look identical to each other) and rather than help the good android and make sure he wins, she just loving leaves? She doesn't care that much about androids. Noted hack Ridley Scott, one of who's movies is also Blade Runner, left this glaring plothole into the movie.
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Sep 7, 2020 23:09
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Cowslips Warren posted:Prometheus could have been better if: But now you're not talking about Prometheus anymore. You've invented a new movie to analyse ("Prometheus: The LV-233 Definitive Fan Cut" or whatever), with parameters of your own, already in accordance with your "criticism".
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Sep 8, 2020 00:55
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pop fly to McGillicutty posted:White knighting for covenant lol We're discussing a movie. Nobody prompted you into using the term "white knighting" in the context of softcore internet fantasy porn where an amazonian xenomorph lipservices a man. Just running into the Alien: Covenant thread guns blazing, screaming about the feminist agenda.
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Sep 9, 2020 22:11
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Eau de MacGowan posted:The alien wasnt in prometheus The only true "alien" was in the original movie. The rest are just different breeds, species and derivatives of xenomorphs.
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Sep 9, 2020 22:17
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I always imagined sour to the point of sharpness, like bile, on the account of them being 75% acid.
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Sep 10, 2020 01:37
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El_Elegante posted:That scene is badly written because her character is neither an rear end in a top hat nor shitfaced. It’s really cruel the way she comes down on Logan Marshall Green’s character for an innocent slip of the tongue. The reason she reacts badly to him in the movie is because she reacts badly to him in the movie.
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Sep 10, 2020 10:47
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