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I figured the no kids thing is Wanda not wanting to hurt children subconsciously, so they’re all “elsewhere” but safe whilst she mind whammies the town, which we see in this episode to be painful for the victim.
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Feb 7, 2021 02:46
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TheBigBudgetSequel posted:My favorite thing Perlmutter did when he had involvement in the films was have Subway cater the press junkets. loving Subway. "Hope you like our movie, you shitheads, eat fresh!" He is legendarily stingy with money, a huge part of why the Netflix Marvel shows sucked (especially Iron Fist) was him absolutely adamant they should require less money than they needed.
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Feb 10, 2021 05:35
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They’ll discover the Heart Shaped Herb growing on T’challa’s grave. It’s likely all the previous monarchs would have taken the counter drug before dying, as they pass the mantle of Black Panther on to their successor usually before they pass away.
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Feb 15, 2021 17:03
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I’m pretty sure Wanda still is a good person doing bad things out of grief and pain. Agatha clearly arrived after the Hex and has been trying to guide/manipulate Wanda into doing a specific action, that is not suggestive to me of someone who is at all responsible for the initial bad situation, but simply using it for their own purposes. Which is a thing people do to grief-stricken people sometimes, take them and guide them like a tool to a purpose. In this case it seems Agatha was focused on reanimating of the dead, hence The Dog and all the stuff with Vision. I sincerely think the show isn’t trying to make this not a thing Wanda did, Wanda even outright says I made the alternate reality I created bigger, and nothing Agatha does is to expand or control the Hex itself, merely direct it and Wanda’s powers.
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Feb 19, 2021 18:50
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xeria posted:Yeah, the feeling I get is that Wanda started the Hex out of grief but Agatha's been trying to manipulate her from inside it for at least most of the time, seemingly with the end goal like figuring out out to raise the dead or something similar. That said, it's possible that Agatha was responsible for putting the "steal Vision's body and turn a whole town into a new sitcom-idyllic reality" idea in Wanda's head, but it's absolutely been Wanda starting/maintaining/growing the Hex this whole time. Agatha's powers seem focused on suggestion/manipulation more than outright reality-bending. Like, it's probably less outright puppet-control between Agatha and Wanda, and more suggestive "Aren't you celebrating your anniversary? Don't you want kids?" etc., while also obviously playing the other side with planting weirdness directly in Vision's view presumably to get him to question his reality. Thinking about it she might be trying to get Vision to die again so she can specifically see Wanda bring him back to life. It would explain her showing him a bunch of weirdness and guiding him to investigate if she’s either trying to get him to leave and die, or fight Wanda and die. Either way Wanda then revives Vision and Agatha gets to see how it works. But now Vision is gone and the Hex expanded and she’s deciding to go for the direct control approach having ingratiated herself as Wanda’s friend enough to do so.
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Feb 19, 2021 19:02
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Bottom Liner posted:So why is the stinger scene a big deal? Without the stone a reactivated Vision has no power he’s just an advanced Stark suit. No flying, no power beam, no mass manipulation. Looked to me like he had some sort of power stone in his head, blue glow and all.
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Feb 27, 2021 02:17
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socialsecurity posted:How did they keep her locked on the Raft? They must have some way of keeping her powers in check. The Raft is underwater and at the time she didn’t know she was reality rewriting powerful.
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Mar 8, 2021 02:03
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BrianWilly posted:Time to clarify: SHIELD also at least started as an American thing (hint, the name is SHIELD as in Captain America's Shield), it likely led into the creation of the World Security Council post Cold War if anything. The WSC might also have been under the UN in all fairness. Isn't SHIELD also actually named Strategic Homeland Intervention, Enforcement and Logistics Division, which seeing it was founded in America suggests it was originally for the American Homeland and then became global later. Which would explain a lot about why it's full of American Leadership but no longer an American Organisation.
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Mar 8, 2021 19:19
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Desperado Bones posted:New Loki poster: Where is each of those letters stolen from aesthetically, they’re all different MCU title fonts.
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Mar 19, 2021 05:12
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All the Loki fans losing their poo poo in the comments, I love it.
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Spacebump posted:Lol if you think all the Avengers won't be well known in the MCU. Bucky was well known enough in the WW2 Cap exhibit to have his own little bit...before he came back. People are obsessed with c list celebs that do nothing. A group of 10 or less people that saved the world (multiple times) would be the most well known people on the planet. Bucky was well known as Captain America's sidekick during World War 2. I'm sure in 40 years if they'd kept it they would've added the Falcon as his modern sidekick, but the big draw was always the man in the propaganda suit.
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Mar 20, 2021 05:42
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Marsupial Ape posted:We can’t really blame Bucky for the assassinations he was forced to commit, can we? He was captured by Hydra and put through years of medical experimentation and brainwashed. They would erase his memory and put him on ice for years at a time. He was a victim. He had no control of his actions. Yes, but he absolutely can blame himself and have massive guilt for the things he remembers doing with his body even if his mind had no real control over those actions.
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Mar 20, 2021 06:58
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Would Vision technically count as Tony Stark's son/child and have access to the Stark Bank Accounts/Money? He's partially made of JARVIS who definitely was purchasing things on Stark's behalf.
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Mar 20, 2021 19:06
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He's not looking for money for himself, he's trying to offer to pay for a loan for his sister. The bank isn't interested in giving his sister a loan (that he's going to help pay for), it doesn't necessarily matter how much money he personally makes from his job when the whole point is the bank screwing him and his sister over for being black. He could pay for the boat himself, but that makes his sister reliant on him directly, instead of simply him helping her out in a way she can actually pay-back (and his income might be going towards maintenance of his gear if he's a contracted agent instead of military employed).
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Mar 20, 2021 20:14
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Thundercracker posted:I think we to actually get on the same page what's even happening in that scene because I think people are getting confused the actual details. Like, for example Sam isn't offering to pay the loan. He's just co-signing it. You know what, fair. I used the wrong language but his is kind of what I was getting at, sure they could give them the loan they're asking for, but they can mealy-mouth plenty of semi-reasonable reasons to disguise the fact that it's institutional racism, or at least we're meant to consider that it is institutional racism given that's clearly what Sam's sister is thinking, and it's then followed up with the reveal of the government chosen new Captain America. Who is of course a lantern jawed white man.
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Mar 20, 2021 21:00
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FlamingLiberal posted:Like are we supposed to be concerned that a Swiss bank got robbed? I think that is one of my biggest problems with the episode, that the Flag Smashers are some mysterious nefarious group, but all we've seen them do is rob a bank. Using super soldier level strength is the concerning bit, not the bank robbery but the method. Hence the message/communication to Sam about how the guy got beaten to hell by super strength, not that he tried to stop a bank robbery.
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Mar 20, 2021 22:22
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Ravel posted:Nobody is disputing the racism. Sam experiences discrimination as a black man. Sam enjoys privilege as a globally recognisable superstar Avenger and one of the most famous people on Earth. The latter completely dominates his ability to raise 20k dollars without needing to go to a bank in the first place. Which does nothing for the situation where his sister does not want his money or privilege so they go to a bank that denies them a loan. Because it doesn’t my matter how much money or influence Sam has in the face of systematic racism. It’s followed by the American military literally walking all over his ideals and gesture by using the shield he gave to a museum for their new super soldier, who is some white guy with a huge jaw.
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Mar 21, 2021 05:33
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Bust Rodd posted:Yeah I can’t emphasize this enough. It’s not that we don’t understand or recognize racism, it’s that fame and celebrity of a certain status invalidate the specific type of racism being displayed here, to a degree that it feels extremely contrived, and it didn’t have to be. The show has them go through how he has money, a job, is world famous, and still the bank denies him a loan on a technicality because racism (even systematic racism) isn’t logical, that’s the point. Open Source Idiom posted:Exactly. If the scene had been about the Falcon's anonymous sister trying to secure this loan, and not the Falcon, no one would be having this conversation! I mean she is, he’s co-signing as insurance for the bank that the loan will be paid back, either by her income or his existing money, they deny the loan anyway.
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Mar 21, 2021 05:36
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Is he recognised by Tunisian civilians, or fellow military operators. Because if it’s the second then we’ll, that’s not quite the same thing as being famous, so much as being a known operative by other operatives. I actually cannot immediately recall. I mean, he has to literally prompt the bank employee on him being a hero. He’s not as famous as those people locally, which in of itself is commentary on the structural racism of America. One of their homegrown heroes is having trouble getting a loan even with his world saving, whilst his nominal employees decide to effectively replace him as the chosen legacy of Captain America. Ravel posted:The bank is not necessary at all for Sam to access credit. Even if all the banking institutions were overtly white supremacist, Sam can give one speech at a gala and earn ten times the amount that his kitchen renovation would cost He could do a community fundraiser and earn that much. That's the incongruity. That’s nice, Sam’s ability to access money isn’t the problem, because his sister does not want his money. Hence going to get a loan, where he’s meant to be the assurance it will be paid back because his sister is in debt.
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Mar 21, 2021 05:43
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Bust Rodd posted:What in the entire MCU leads you to believe that they aren’t world famous celebrities on a level we don’t have in the real world? Do you really think actual real life superheroes wouldn’t be as famous as movie stars and athletes? Think about how famous they are on OUR earth, where they aren’t even real! You honestly think these people would have gigantic, obsessive cult like fan followings if they really existed? Sam was a military asset (not famous), then he was helping veterans (not famous), then he was Captain America’s sidekick (kinda famous but also not anywhere near as recognisable as the Captain plus not from world war 2 not a super soldier so who cares), then he was a criminal (and explicitly tried to stay hidden, plus I cannot imagine the American Government was particularly happy to put Captain America, international fugitive, on the news), then he was dusted and returned to a fight that whilst big was not televised, and now he’s back to being a semi-covert military operative. He’s famous amongst military sure, but to the average person he’s probably not recognisable (in fact we see someone fail to recognise him) outside the suit. All of which has nothing to do with the fact the bank won’t give him and his sister a loan because they are black and can use a technicality to do so. He’s probably less famous than Barack Obama, honestly I’d say he’s as famous as a mid-level WWE wrestler, if you follow the scene you know him but otherwise you’re vaguely aware he exists but need to be prompted to recognise him. Open Source Idiom posted:It's a civilian family. Neat, so a Tunisian civilian family recognised the Falcon easier than an American citizen. That’s a good subtle show of the whole deal with Sam so far is that he is being mistreated by his own country on a systematic (the bank) and idealogical (the new Captain America) level, which is of course the point. Lord_Magmar fucked around with this message at 05:55 on Mar 21, 2021 |
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Mar 21, 2021 05:49
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Spacebump posted:All classified information was leaked on the Avengers during Winter Solider. That combined with what the Avengers have done, there is no way they aren't all extremely famous. Sam was not an Avenger in the Winter Soldier he was still an American Military Asset who was deciding to help Veterans after finishing his tour of duty. His information was not leaked and after Winter Soldier the Avengers appear to have ended up being pay-rolled by Tony Stark and continued to act as international pseudo-covert operations.
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Mar 21, 2021 05:57
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Bust Rodd posted:Ok, I guess we’re just meant to assume that Sam has absolutely no cache and no friends who could possibly help. No military assets, no SHIELD contacts, no STARK industries allies, no nothing. He’s just a black guy on paper with absolutely nothing of value or importance, the same as anyone else, just a regular guy who can’t co sign a bank loan. That’s perfectly believable and not at all hokey and contrived. This is good writing that accurately reflects how the real world works. Again, Sam’s ability to get money is not in question, the bank acknowledges he can get money and denies him the co-sign loan anyway. His sister doesn’t want his money, she wants to be self-sufficient, her compromise was going to the bank and letting him help her get a loan that she can pay back, and he’s simply so the bank will give her a loan at all. Then the bank does not give them both a loan, because they are experiencing systematic racism where Sam’s actual income means jackshit.
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Mar 21, 2021 06:08
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Golden Bee posted:After the scene, Sam says he will go to other banks and his sister believes that their experience will be the same. This is also a mirror of how their circumstances affect their view of race relations and systemic power. She hasn’t teamed up with billionaires to fight aliens, and mocks him for doing so. He also likely would eventually offer to go through his contacts if she’ll allow it, but the whole point is him helping her get money, not he himself getting money. Marsupial Ape posted:Because he’s a grown-rear end adult with dignity and self-respect? Also this, he should absolutely be able to get a loan, he’s capable of paying it back in full with a few months of interest, he’s here effectively to help his in debt sister get a loan that he can promise the bank if she cannot pay it back he will. The fact that this is not enough to secure a loan, is intended to be gross and wrong. That’s why it’s systematic racism. If this was Captain America trying to do the same thing for Bucky Barnes he would have gotten the loan no questions asked, the fact Sam does not is intended to be bullshit. Lord_Magmar fucked around with this message at 06:28 on Mar 21, 2021 |
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Mar 21, 2021 06:23
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socialsecurity posted:He 100% was an Avenger at the end of Age of Ultron for ?? years until Civil War. Yes, which is after Winter Soldier (the movie in which all the Avengers information was leaked) which was the thing I was specifying. His work as an Avenger is after the information was leaked, which is the bit where they become pay-rolled by Tony Stark as international peacekeeping. Which I doubt Tony Stark would let the information of their work be easily accessible except for specific marketing purposes or when dealing with militaries and governments. So sure Sam is an Avenger, and known as such, but I imagine he's remembered about as much as Hawkeye by the public. Kind of cool but not as cool and popular and famous as literal super billionaire Tony Stark who builds his own suits, or the living legend Captain America, or the Norse God Hunk Thor, or the Harlem Shattering Hulk (Bruce Banner is likely less remembered).
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Mar 21, 2021 07:09
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I think recognising Tony Stark would be the easiest, he’s just as famous outside the costume as in it after all.
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Mar 21, 2021 17:58
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I would assume that they’re going to meet up fairly quickly in episode 2. I very much expect it to open with Bucky watching the new Captain America reveal and having a bad moment, followed by him and Sam both heading to investigate the new guy and meeting up because of that.
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Mar 22, 2021 02:45
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Also, a pretty common thing for Batman in the comics is that he uses his money as Bruce Wayne to help the city. He funds Arkham and Blackgate to be modern, comfortable, healthy places. He has an across the board policy for Wayne Industries to hire ex-convicts so they don’t have to go and work for the gangs and mobs and super-criminals after they’re out. I think at least once or twice he straight up hired Frieze to work on cryogenics (usually in stories with defined endings) and he supported Edward Nygma’s detective agency. The problem then becomes the status quo is god, where comic books cannot change because everyone wants to tell their version of the story. The idea he doesn’t use every method at his disposal to fight crime is one uniquely from the movies, or the comics where the point is that he’s a broken monster. It’s honestly kind of frustrating how often the comments are that Batman only goes out to beat up the homeless and mentally ill and all that, because the stories where he does spend time as Bruce Wayne trying to fix Gotham with money aren’t action stories, they tend to be backgrounds for whatever new villains are showing up, like the Court of Owls. The Court of Owls should absolutely be in a movie about Bruce trying to fix Gotham with his money because they’re explicitly a bunch of equally rich people who want Gotham to be a shithole. There are plenty of versions of Batman who use Bruce Wayne for good, it’s just never in the movies except I guess the Nolan ones and it’s barely in the Nolan movies. Lord_Magmar fucked around with this message at 22:23 on Mar 23, 2021 |
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Mar 23, 2021 22:20
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ONE YEAR LATER posted:Famous Marvel characters Batman and Flash To be honest I actually thought this was the general comic book movie thread when I posted that. To turn this into actual Marvel discussion. Iron Man is never really portrayed as spending his money in the way Batman does on humanitarian efforts, global sometimes but rarely local, and usually it’s more about technology advancement. I guess what I’m saying is one of the legitimate failures of the MCU in my mind is technological propagation being visible, the Arc Reactors should be in way more places than they are and that’s an actual shame.
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Mar 23, 2021 22:30
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Marsupial Ape posted:It’d be hilarious if a writer explicitly spelled out in a Batman comic that the Wayne Foundation’s social initiatives have significantly reduced public ills like homelessness, domestic violence, substance abuse, childhood malnutrition and poverty, even raised test scores across the board, etc...but there’s just something in Gotham’s water that turns some people into costumed bank robbers. Zil posted:Wasn't it a thing for a while in Batlore that Gotham was placed over a literal gateway to Hell? Hellmouth or something they called it? Yes, Gotham is built over a seal containing a demonic bat god, or was for a while in the comics lore.
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Mar 24, 2021 00:37
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achillesforever6 posted:IIRC wasn't it because RDJ didn't want to do the storyline with Alcohol? He explicitly was uncomfortable with doing a substance abuse based story because of his own history with substance abuse yes.
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Mar 24, 2021 03:19
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Hobo Clown posted:That's interesting... were snapped people considered "missing" though? There's at least one story so far that someone who pretended to be snapped to leave their marriage and start a new life somewhere else. Which was discovered when the un-snap happened and they didn't re-appear.
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Mar 26, 2021 05:34
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Goffer posted:I still like the theory that the super soldier serum has always been right, it just reacts differently for everyone depending on their internal being. Cap, Red skull, hulk, abomination, all reflections of their interal character. I don't think it's necessarily the "right" serum, but it's certainly still always done stuff based on the internal being of the person. Banner before Hulk was always too weak to defend himself even when angry or terrified or whatever, so the Hulk is able to do that for him. Also I'm absolutely calling it now JW and Battlestar are gonna end up getting a serum from Power Broker somehow and will need to be neutralised because of it.
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Mar 26, 2021 16:02
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Jagermonster posted:it seems like JW already has the serum? How else would he have been kicked off a truck into a car and not even gotten a scratch? Falcon and Bucky and even Battlestar weren’t around to see it. . . I guess that's possible but he's definitely not showing the sort of strength you'd expect of such yet. He certainly seems to have something going on given his obviously bullshit off the charts natural capabilities.
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Mar 26, 2021 16:32
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I saw a suggestion I kind of found interesting Isaiah might show up again to give Sam whatever shield Isaiah used, if they keep with him also getting the Captain America title.
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Mar 26, 2021 17:26
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Gaz-L posted:Speculation: Isaiah is going to pass away, maybe naturally (dude's gotta be nearly 100 even if he was a teenager when he got the serum) or maybe the bad guys get him. Either way, young Eli is gonna come to Sam with some stuff his grand-pop wanted him to have, which will include pictures from his service in the Korean War. Including him during that mission with Bucky, wearing a familiar uniform, and a certain triangular shield. I think this is plausible, him specifically passing on his own legacy to Sam would feel Poignant in some ways I think, given Sam's issues with the legacy of Steve Rogers (which are deeply mired in the sort of systematic racism that destroyed Isaiah's life, even if they manifest in new ways in the modern era). Bucky getting Steve's Shield from Sam and perhaps fully embracing a new title (or finally finding the option to just stop fighting at all in another direction) seems like it would end up being meaningful too, perhaps in a we'll share this shield because neither of us can be Steve alone, but together maybe we can make the world better the way he strove to. I think what's telling for Bucky is he corrects Sam to White Wolf almost instantly (even if it's for a comedy bit), and I could see him fully deciding he wants that to be his new title, even outside the Wakandan thing he's no longer a lone wolf, and it keeps his mind on the ice without delving into being THE WINTER SOLDIER.
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Mar 27, 2021 19:59
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I think if Sam becomes Captain America he’ll use it to let people know about Isaiah, that’s such a clear in-road for what Sam’s issue with accepting the Shield seem to be based in and provided he got the go-ahead from Isaiah to do so, I could see him sort of claiming the dual-legacy. Not just of the Captain praised, but of the one abandoned.
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Mar 28, 2021 03:19
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I also think it's a bit of Steve would ache knowing that's what his legacy became, that someone like Isaiah was so abused by the system that held Steve up. Especially when Steve already had a lot going on when he and Bucky were actually able to work together (which probably wasn't all that often even after Civil War). Bucky doesn't tell Steve in part because Bucky's priority is Steve, and knowing about Isaiah would distract and hurt Steve in all the situations it could've been discussed, I'm sure he'd have eventually shared in a quiet moment if he thought it was worth letting Steve know. Which you know, kind of ties into the themes of systematic racism as well.
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Mar 28, 2021 06:26
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404notfound posted:Did Steve ever use a gun like JW did on the truck? Never quite the way JW did, but Steve absolutely used guns (usually picking them up mid-combat to be fair) but especially during World War 2 he had a gun in at least one of the montage scenes of him working with the Howling Commandos.
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Mar 28, 2021 07:31
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With Isaiah now MCU canon, and the upcoming Black Widow movie with Red Guardian. I was thinking about the possibility of a Cold War era show, built around the secret battles between these midway super-soldiers and super-heroes, and I realised it would honestly be potentially very depressing. Isaiah ends up imprisoned for 30 years, Janet disappears and Hank loses himself to grief, Winter Soldier is put back on ice, Red Guardian I think is forcibly retired/discharged from service or straight up leaves (not so sure but he certain seems like he's not a fan of the Russian Government in what we've seen of the Black Widow movie so far). But that in of itself could be used to explore how Super-Soldiers/Heroes would interact with and ultimately mirror the M.A.D situation with the nukes, and perhaps that ultimately the big powers realise that this level of individual excellence is threatening and destabilising their control of the world. Could be quite an interesting short series I think.
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Mar 28, 2021 09:26
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Everyone posted:Am I a bad person for wanting a little pushback against the mythologization of The Shield with some flashback to Wakanda when Howard Stark obtained it? Howard made the shield out of an alloy of Vibranium and other things didn't he. He got the Vibranium from Wakanda but it was likely just a rock, or something not shield shaped. Not that this isn't a very funny mental image, I'm just pretty sure I remember Howard made the shield himself but got the materials from Wakanda.
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Mar 31, 2021 07:39
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Escobarbarian posted:Well she was blipped for five of them Or she used it to drop off the government radar and never managed to contact Steve to tell him she was still around. rabidcowfromhell posted:I wonder if that was supposed to be Black Panther originally I think this might actually be why the show came out after Wandavision, if they originally filmed with Black Panther/Chadwick Boseman and ended up reshooting every scene he was meant to be in that would along with COVID really slow their production down.
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Apr 2, 2021 09:09
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