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generally yes, but with lithium cells it's more about temperature. high charging rates result in high temperatures and that's what kills the cell. if you could like pump cryogenic fluid through the pack while it was charging and keep the whole thing cool, fast-charging would cause much less damage. cars with liquid cooled batteries do this but they can't remove all the heat fast enough and from deep enough to fully counteract it. one way to think of it is that charging the entire battery in 30 minutes requires the same current flow as driving fast and hard enough to deplete the entire battery in 30 minutes. it would be kind of ridiculous to size the radiator and cooling system for that scenario since you wouldn't use it 99% of the time. that's why supercharging gradually kills the tesla batteries.
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Jan 9, 2021 09:20
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Maybe the fast charger could also have a hookup to a bigger compressor+condenser, so you can have a bigass cooling setup when charging the battery but not have to haul it around all the time while driving. Would have to be using a cheap and essentially disposable refrigerant though
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Jan 9, 2021 13:15
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PIZZA.BAT posted:apparently the energy necessary to keep them at temperature is made up for their better efficiency compared to lithium. iirc the big obstacle now is making the ceramics necessary to house the batteries but it's mostly a scale thing, not an engineering or science problem
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Jan 9, 2021 15:43
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echinopsis posted:im sure 500c liquid metal wont be bad to get on your skin or in your eyes idk. worked for wolverine.
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Jan 9, 2021 17:25
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Sagebrush posted:generally yes, but with lithium cells it's more about temperature. high charging rates result in high temperatures and that's what kills the cell. i was watching one of the insane rally mach e videos where the engineers were walking through everything under the hood and thinking to myself, ‘ok yeah this is all awesome but that much power is gonna generate a shitload of heat how the gently caress are they gonna cool that?’ then they got it ready to drive and dumped giant bags of dry ice into the radiator. it was badass and the cloud of CO2 vapor was the perfect cherry on top for the cyberpunk aesthetic
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Jan 9, 2021 17:32
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found it- not a mach e https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUwRnBhtevE
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Jan 9, 2021 17:40
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that is neat and all but the words “hoon” and “hoonigan” make me angry for some reason
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Jan 9, 2021 17:47
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President Beep posted:that is neat and all but the words “hoon” and “hoonigan” make me angry for some reason goonigan
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Jan 9, 2021 17:55
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goonigan’s aisle (it’s where the mountain dew is)
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Jan 9, 2021 18:00
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President Beep posted:that is neat and all but the words “hoon” and “hoonigan” make me angry for some reason same but "beep" and "president beep"
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Jan 9, 2021 18:05
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President Beep posted:goonigan’s aisle (it’s where the mountain dew is) patrick mcgoonigan in the poster
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Jan 9, 2021 18:09
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Endless Mike posted:same but "beep" and "president beep"  Agile Vector posted:patrick mcgoonigan in the poster hell yeah. i loved the prisoner.
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Jan 9, 2021 18:46
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PIZZA.BAT posted:found it- not a mach e lol I can't get over how much it sounds like a regular electric model racer. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftjWHQO3NME&t=107s (running the original 80s Tamiya BIGWIG that I owned as a kid)
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Jan 9, 2021 19:42
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-----DO NOT STEAL THIS IDEA------ I've always wondered, why can't they make the batteries in electric cars modular so that instead of wasting an hour charging them at some service station, they just swap them out for you like they do for propane tanks at the hardware store. Obviously they're big and heavy but I'm imagining some kind of bay you drive into where they use a forklift or something to pull them out and slot the new ones in. What am I missing?
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Jan 9, 2021 21:33
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same reason we don't have modular batteries in laptops anymore. there's a heavy size and reliability cost that comes with making it swappable
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Jan 9, 2021 21:35
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cheque_some posted:-----DO NOT STEAL THIS IDEA------ size and weight penalties, impossible to standardize across manufacturers, logistically insane
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Jan 9, 2021 21:50
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wow. look at these haters.
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Jan 9, 2021 21:57
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cheque_some posted:-----DO NOT STEAL THIS IDEA------ i cant remember why they gave up on it but probably for the above reasons
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Jan 9, 2021 22:42
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PIZZA.BAT posted:found it- not a mach e fuckin cool but god it sounds horrible
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Jan 9, 2021 22:47
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echinopsis posted:fuckin cool but god it sounds horrible https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEzXrDL4F3k
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Jan 9, 2021 23:14
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLnWf1sQkjY
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Jan 9, 2021 23:16
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PIZZA.BAT posted:found it- not a mach e The genuine look of terror when the presenter goes for a ride in it 
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Jan 9, 2021 23:29
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Word on the street is that the thing that tends to impress/terrify people the most when they’re a passenger in a rally car is the braking presumably how late they leave it
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Jan 9, 2021 23:33
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KOTEX GOD OF BLOOD posted:tesla briefly did this: https://youtu.be/H5V0vL3nnHY
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Jan 10, 2021 00:09
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i don't mind swapping bbq propane tanks with whatever pos is at the store but i'm not sure i trust whatever battery tesla has lying around at the charger station in the mcdonalds parking lot
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Jan 10, 2021 00:32
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cheque_some posted:-----DO NOT STEAL THIS IDEA------ a company called Better Place tried this in a few small countries. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qd0WPw3p2MQ
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Jan 10, 2021 00:39
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how much less mileage does a BEV get in cold weather? I can get >60mpg in my Prius most of the year without paying attention but once it drops below 45F I have trouble staying above 49mpg even if I’m actively trying to drive less wastefully, seems like it’d translate to a pretty significant dropoff in range for a BEV
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Jan 10, 2021 00:42
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:i don't mind swapping bbq propane tanks with whatever pos is at the store but i'm not sure i trust whatever battery tesla has lying around at the charger station in the mcdonalds parking lot yeah this would be my biggest concern with battery swapping. at least I can see if the propane tank is hosed up or old or whatever. also I don’t really trust Tesla’s safety or quality control
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Jan 10, 2021 00:47
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The Management posted:a company called Better Place tried this in a few small countries. so many people would drive right into the pit
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Jan 10, 2021 01:39
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KOTEX GOD OF BLOOD posted:tesla briefly did this: https://youtu.be/H5V0vL3nnHY thanks now I feel better knowing it was at least tried and failed The Management posted:a company called Better Place tried this in a few small countries. cool. this video led me to another one about "Why Hasn't Battery Swapping For Electric Cars Caught On" and one of the other things mentioned in addition to what you all said was that no one wants to standardize on battery sizes when the field is still evolving so rapidly. apparently it's done in some commercial applications where the vehicles are under constant use and they can do the swaps on-site.
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Jan 10, 2021 02:09
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The Management posted:a company called Better Place tried this in a few small countries. man that hook mechanism is naice
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Jan 10, 2021 02:16
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cheque_some posted:cool. this video led me to another one about "Why Hasn't Battery Swapping For Electric Cars Caught On" and one of the other things mentioned in addition to what you all said was that no one wants to standardize on battery sizes when the field is still evolving so rapidly.
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Jan 10, 2021 03:46
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put the batteries in the wheels
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Jan 10, 2021 04:06
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very long extension cords.
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Jan 10, 2021 04:08
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solar panels on the roof and a big magnifying glass attached to the hood for fast charging
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Jan 10, 2021 04:15
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a big sun lamp for cloudy days
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Jan 10, 2021 04:16
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isn’t the only economical process for making hydrogen at scale incredibly bad for the environment?
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Jan 10, 2021 18:23
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Doc Block posted:isn’t the only economical process for making hydrogen at scale incredibly bad for the environment? electrolysis is a pretty simple process. it's just a matter of how you generate the electricity. so it's bad for the environment in a roundabout way in how energy intensive it is. the process itself is just water -> hydrogen & oxygen
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Jan 10, 2021 18:43
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yeah you can get pretty clean hydrogen with wind, solar or hydroelectric, in that order of preference
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Jan 10, 2021 18:44
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The current most economical process for making hydrogen is steam reformation of methane, which is economical because of our massive deregulated fossil fuel industry. It's extraordinarily wasteful and it emits carbon dioxide. Electrolysis is theoretically one-to-one energy storage -- you put 1 million electrons through the circuit and get 1 million hydrogen atoms out, which can later move 1 million electrons in the fuel cell. Obviously there is some efficiency loss but it's better than the steam process. The problem with doing it on an industrial scale is the unimaginably vast amount of electrical power required to meet our needs. Talking like 10 times as many new nuclear plants are as currently operating today, carpet 2/3 of Nevada with solar cells, that sort of thing
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Jan 10, 2021 18:51
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