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sephiRoth IRA posted:OK, here's a situation that I friend and I argued about and I think I might be wrong. Flop check is GOOD. This is not a hand you ever want to bet 3way. In general you want to bet less often, and using smaller sizes when it's multiway. As for the turn play, if we get jammed on we are never ever folding for 100bbs. I expect an unknown player at the micros to sometimes have JT, sometimes 55, sometimes KQ, sometimes AJ etc. You have a hand that has very strong absolute value, you generally don't want to fold strong absolute hand value against randoms at micros. Your friend can not know for certain that there are no bluffs. Even if there aren't, we actually beat some valuehands, like bottom set and all the 2pair, and like I said I think it's completely reasonable to expect these hands to sometimes shove. Regarding whether or not jamming JT makes sense, I obviously haven't ever looked at a spot like this in a solver but I'd imagine that it would only shove the JTcc and JTdd that can get outdrawn by a flush on river, but it probably would just make a smaller raise with those too rather than shove. Straight+flushdraw is such a strong hand that it would rather raise to ~35bbs and jam the rest on river. Or just call the turn bet too at some frequency since they can literally close their eyes and call any river. tl;dr you have too good of a hand to fold for 100bbs against an unknown at the micros Leperflesh posted:Also, are the two of you discounting BB with AA KK AK combos? Does BB have to three bet these hands preflop? sephiRoth IRA posted:You raise some good points, but I don't think I put either on AA or KK. I think going into a multi way like that your opponents would be 4betting with a hand like that. Do people smooth call AA or KK out of the BB in that spot? I feel like over time that's a negative EV move but I, too, am bad at poker I would rule out AA/KK and AK from anyone who I considered even remotely competent at poker. Finnish Flasher fucked around with this message at 16:08 on Jun 2, 2022 |
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Jun 2, 2022 15:56
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I think I was out kicked here. Or potentially losing to two pair. But maybe there are other options? UTG limps, folds to SB who raises to 3bbs, hero in BB flats with As4s, UTG folds Pot 7 Flop 7d Ah Jd Sb bets pot. Hero calls. Plan was to check call down to the river, but a pot sized bet felt like maybe an A (or a J) trying to close down the pot so the diamonds didn't get there, or maybe they had the Ad and were freerolling. In retrospect the call here feels weird, especially in light of the turn. Pot 21 Turn 7dAhJd 2c SB bets pot again, hero folds. That second bet feels like a strong A, but like I said, I'm willing to hear other opinions. Probably should have folded or raised the flop.
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Jun 17, 2022 04:27
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sephiRoth IRA posted:I think I was out kicked here. Or potentially losing to two pair. But maybe there are other options? I think it's fine played as is, although microstakes he could be a maniac. But he's bet into you three times at this point. What are you really beating here? Honestly, a case could be made for folding flop, but I like calling in position just to see what happens.
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Jun 17, 2022 04:58
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Unless the guy is a turbo nit I would call here and call river Can post more when I’m not on phone Hm well I didn’t see utg limped when I posted that so maybe not river but I really don’t think you can fold turn with top pair
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Jun 17, 2022 05:09
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Stefan Prodan posted:Unless the guy is a turbo nit I would call here and call river I'm curious why you call turn here? I know you're a stronger player than me, so I'm curious what I'm missing here. SB raise after an UTG limp projects strength. Then a pot sized flop and turn. If he's doing this with middle pair, kings, queens, or Jacks, he has bigger balls than I have. It feels like the only hands he's doing this with better than what we have.
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Jun 17, 2022 05:29
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He should also have a lot of bluffs like gut shots, flush draws, etc and we have a lot of stuff that has to fold turn like pocket pairs, lower pairs from suited connectors, that kinda thing, and having top pair also blocks a ton of his top pairs The pot bet does make it a little weird and he’s certainly tighter with an utg limper in the pot so maybe you can fold river but probably not turn Under normal circumstances with no limper and normal bet sizes, there’s no chance of folding any street here like if he just bets 2/3 on every street or something
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Jun 17, 2022 06:06
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I agree with that. But I think the 3bet out of the SB with an UTG limp, then two pot sized bets are very big bets for a bluff or guys chasing there. I'm probably calling down any bet lower than 2/3rds.
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Jun 17, 2022 07:02
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Sataere posted:I agree with that. But I think the 3bet out of the SB with an UTG limp, then two pot sized bets are very big bets for a bluff or guys chasing there. I'm probably calling down any bet lower than 2/3rds. This is where I was. Pot bets were just broadcasting strength, anything less and i would have been comfortable calling. Effective stack was 100bb, so I was looking at potentially getting most of it in with A4 on the river and that didn't feel great since I needed a 4 to improve, probably
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Jun 17, 2022 12:55
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He didn't 3bet tho utg just limped and he made a probably too small raise One thing you gotta remember too is like the idea of "I have to decide now if I'm gonna call both turn and river" is very dicey because then it lets people just bet on the turn and sort of get all the fold equity they had on river for free on you and then never bluff you on river, if they knew that was your thought process So you do actually have to have a range of hands that calls turn and folds river and I think still I'd have a hard time folding top pair on turn in position, but I also don't play these games, if you have some read that people who are betting pot are just never bluffing or this guy is a huge nit or whatever it might be an ok adjustment Stefan Prodan fucked around with this message at 15:55 on Jun 17, 2022 |
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Jun 17, 2022 15:52
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Stefan Prodan posted:He didn't 3bet tho utg just limped and he made a probably too small raise This makes sense. Never thought about it from this point of view. Honestly, these assessments are always hard without some type of read to me.
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Jun 17, 2022 18:40
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Sataere posted:This makes sense. Never thought about it from this point of view. Honestly, these assessments are always hard without some type of read to me. Yeah this actually is tough for me because like in lower games you're going to have people playing way off of what a common strategy is and so it really depends on the person and you need to figure out fish behavior very quickly because it's going to make such a gigantic difference in your decisions. I totally agree that with some people the pot thing is just like never a bluff and is pure strength and if the guy is 70 years old or something you can definitely just fold turn, but there's also guys that might have learned that betting a lot is good and they should be barreling a lot but just don't know they aren't supposed to bet pot So like in terms of "how do I play a pot where someone limps, someone else makes it only 3 bb, then they pot flop and turn" it's hard for me to answer too because I would just not think about situations like that too much and it would just depend a ton on the opponent.
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Jun 17, 2022 18:55
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Stefan Prodan posted:Yeah this actually is tough for me because like in lower games you're going to have people playing way off of what a common strategy is and so it really depends on the person and you need to figure out fish behavior very quickly because it's going to make such a gigantic difference in your decisions. Your comments have been really helpful. For this particular guy in this particular situation, I felt okay letting A4 go. But I'll keep what you've said in mind
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Jun 17, 2022 19:39
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Yeah, to give a pretty extreme example I just thought of, a friend of mine was in the Run It Up Reno tournament a few years ago, 2019 I think, and he had a very similar spot where I want to say he flatted in position vs like an old guy who opened in EP and a coldcaller with a low suited ace, and the flop came Axx and the old guy bet pot and my friend just fuckin folded flop and the announcers couldn't believe it but the old guy just had AK or something. Sometimes they really do play like that and that's fine if you know it, especially since similarly to your hand he bet flop into 2 people.
Stefan Prodan fucked around with this message at 20:09 on Jun 17, 2022 |
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Jun 17, 2022 20:06
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This was an insanely frustrating hand and I think it's just too tough to get away from it after I reviewed. Raise out of BTN to 3bbs with Qh8h SB calls- SB is a known idiot, frequently calls draws and other dumb hands. Pot: 7bbs Flop is Qs 6h Jh I bet 4bbs, SB calls Pot: 15bbs Qs 6h Jh Turn: 9h I bet 11bbs, SB calls. Pot: 37bbs Qs 6h Jh 9h River: Qd So at this point, I'm thinking I'm good. I block all the weird Qx combos, and with no raise from the flop I assume he doesn't have a set that just improved to a boat. It's possible he has a better flush. I bet 13 bbs. SB raises to 40bbs. Do you ever fold here? Answer is no, right? Personally I'd call every time but lately big river bets have really hosed me over on some hands. I decided to call, and he showed Q6.
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Jul 6, 2022 22:08
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Yeah, never fold here, and I would bet a bit bigger on every street since he's a fish, I'd be betting like 80-90% pot or even full pot if you think he'll call that with pairs and flush draws and stuff, and I'd bet also closer to full pot on turn Even against regulars I think like 5 bb is the least you can bet on this type of flop where it's pretty connected and two tone On river he can definitely have all sorts of lower flushes if he's a fish, he can just have T7hh or something and that sort of thing, enough that we definitely can't fold getting decent odds Bet bigger on river as well, he's not going to fold any queen most likely. Granted it's now tougher if you bet like 28-30 bb and he jams, at that point you might be able to fold if he's a big station but if he's the type of idiot that would overplay hands and shove a low flush then you have to call, but I think if it's a guy who calls a ton and never raises himself once he actually jams maybe you can fold But you can't ever fold for 40 bb I don't think.
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Jul 6, 2022 23:08
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Yeah, easy call here. Especially if he's an idiot. Guys like this who will play any random garbage out of position are gonna take your money sometimes when they wake up with a hand. More often than not, you're just gonna take his money.
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Jul 6, 2022 23:36
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Stefan Prodan posted:Yeah, never fold here, and I would bet a bit bigger on every street since he's a fish, I'd be betting like 80-90% pot or even full pot if you think he'll call that with pairs and flush draws and stuff, and I'd bet also closer to full pot on turn Thanks, that's what I thought too. I've been playing solid poker recently but haven't had much luck- missing a lot of flops and having opponents catch rivers. The bet sizing advice you suggested is well taken.
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Jul 7, 2022 00:44
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Here's another. I am at a local bad luck downswing, down about 6 buyins at 10NL :/ Effective stack is 100bbs CO opens to 3bbs. BTN folds, SB flats, I'm in BB with AKo. I raise to 10bbs (probably should have sized up one unit), CO flats, SB folds. Flop is QK7 rainbow. I bet 24bbs into a 29bb pot, CO jams 90bbs. I've never played before with this guy but at these stacks a lot of times an overbet like that is huge strength, so I gut read queens, but then I talked myself into a call. Guy shows QQ and I lose my buyin. Lol, fifth hand of the session. Do you ever just release top top against a bet like that? With no read on the player?
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Jul 9, 2022 22:46
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sephiRoth IRA posted:Here's another. I am at a local bad luck downswing, down about 6 buyins at 10NL :/ I would not increase the 3bet size much unless you decide to 3bet shove here for some reason. I don't like flipping coins that much.
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Jul 9, 2022 23:26
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leper khan posted:I would not increase the 3bet size much unless you decide to 3bet shove here for some reason. I don't like flipping coins that much. No, I just mean going to like 4x with the extra caller, but maybe that's not such a good plan with Ako...
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Jul 9, 2022 23:41
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sephiRoth IRA posted:No, I just mean going to like 4x with the extra caller, but maybe that's not such a good plan with Ako... I think the 3 bet sizing, and the flop bet sizing is fine, personally. I would have a hard time calling that shove though because as you said, QQ imo is solidly in the villains range, I can’t think of much else he’s gonna shove with there tbh. Definitely can be hard to get away from that hand though so I don’t blame you for calling.
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Jul 9, 2022 23:56
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i would prob bet a little bit bigger preflop and once it's on the flop, i'm probably just betting like half pot or something. no need to bet 80% of the pot here. i think generally losing with AK at 100BB isn't too bad, especially without any reads. but in my experience, this kind of move is almost always a big hand. i've had reads where it's like "overvalues TP" during the session and you see them here with like KT or KJ. but playing at these low stakes i err on playing more conservatively against unknowns. so i'm not looking to lose 100BB here. considering the guy also knows nothing about you and has seen you 3-bet in the BB then c-bet into a K-high dry board. his play seems really strong. like maybe the worst hand you can see here is JT suited that has a backdoor flush possible..? ---- also generally, it's better to not reveal the results of the hand, or at least spoiler the results. i think you'll get better discussion waiting a bit before you reveal the results.
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Jul 11, 2022 02:13
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I wanted some feedback for a hand I played recently. Just recently returned to playing live poker after 2 years of taking a break due to COVID/life: Villain: A very loose preflop player who can mix aggression in at times both preflop and postflop, but usually opts for the passive route. He stacked me earlier in the session when he had a pair+flush draw and hit his flush on the turn after we got it in on the flop. I feel like he’s been “gunning” for me if that makes sense. We’ve been playing together for a few weeks now and he likely sees me as a loose aggressive preflop player. $2/$5 NLHE Preflop: EP limp. Villain (HJ) raises to $20. Hero (BTN, $1400 effective) with 9  9 raises to $75. EP folds. Villain calls.Flop ($155): 8 32Villain checks. Hero bets $105. Villain raises to $300. Hero calls. Turn: ($755): 8  Villain bets $450. Hero…? Preflop seems standard against a loose player. Flop also seems standard enough given a somewhat wet flop and me having an overpair. The turn is where I want input. I feel like my options are to shove or fold given that calling would only leave me with $575 behind and a $1655 pot. While I’d prefer not to have the 9 I feel like it’s less relevant than having the A, 4, 5, or 6. I’m blocking some flush draws but I’m not blocking combo draws like A4, 56, etc. Also naked flush draws like AQcc, JTcc, etc. I unblock. And pair+fd like A3cc, 34cc and 35cc.I think he could have some overpairs that slowplay preflop and then play aggressively on the flop and he could certainly have 22/33, but I like the turn card because it reduces his 88 combos and doesn’t complete any draws. I also kind of doubt he’s c/r the flop with just an 8 and 83/82 are unlikely combos. I think I’m mostly worried about like QQ+, but he also plays draws aggressively. What do you think I should do?
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Aug 18, 2022 03:05
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Mind_Taker posted:I wanted some feedback for a hand I played recently. Just recently returned to playing live poker after 2 years of taking a break due to COVID/life: You mention that he slow played preflop, but he didn't slow play preflop. He raised. Then he check raised you on the flop. Then bet turn. Your initial read of the guy seems to be loose and passive, with occasional aggression. The fact that he's being aggressive here would give me pause. Honestly, I'm not sure what I'm beating here. I'm not 100% sure I call the check raise. This feels like he either has a set or a better overpair. Actually, I'm definitely calling the check raise based on your description of villain. The one thing that gives me pause is that you indicated this guy seems to be coming after you. If he is betting into you a lot, then his range is probably a lot looser and might have a bunch of overs with flush draws. I still think this hand as played screams you are dominated, but I can see shoving here with a regular player just to get information if you know you are going to be seeing him again. EDIT: To commit to an actual answer, I probably fold here. This guy has only shown aggression here and the board doesn't really favor the type of three barrel bluff he is representing. If he is doing this on a draw, he'll give me all his money later. Sataere fucked around with this message at 03:56 on Aug 18, 2022 |
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Aug 18, 2022 03:54
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Sataere posted:You mention that he slow played preflop, but he didn't slow play preflop. He raised. Then he check raised you on the flop. Then bet turn. Your initial read of the guy seems to be loose and passive, with occasional aggression. The fact that he's being aggressive here would give me pause. Honestly, I'm not sure what I'm beating here. I'm not 100% sure I call the check raise. This feels like he either has a set or a better overpair. Actually, I'm definitely calling the check raise based on your description of villain. QQ+ (maybe TT and JJ) would normally be a 4-bet preflop. That's what I mean by slowplaying preflop. Maybe he just opts to call me 3-bet with these types of monsters. Sorry for the confusion. I think I'm beating draws or pair+draws, of which there are several. I'm blocking 9x of clubs but I'm not blocking any combo draws or many straight+backdoor draws for instance. As I mentioned I see a lot of these hands playing flop as a c/r because my 3-betting range doesn't really connect with this board and he can really put pressure on me here with hands like flush or straight draws where I just have to fold hands like AQ/AK/KQ to aggression, but on the other hand his 3-bet calling range also doesn't connect with this board either. Yeah he can have 22, 33, or the one combo of quads but he can't really have any flopped 2 pair and I kind of doubt he plays an 8 as a raise on the flop. I'm also not sure that he always raises this flop with overpairs, though he probably does a decent percentage of the time. I don't have the greatest gauge of his willingness to let opponents bluff their stacks off vs. opting to protect their own hands against overcards or scare cards. With a better read on this particular aspect of his game I suspect I'd have a better handle on this particular hand since his value range seems more weighted toward overpairs vs. full houses/trips. Mind_Taker fucked around with this message at 04:54 on Aug 18, 2022 |
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Aug 18, 2022 04:52
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Was waiting to see if there was other feedback on this because I'm curious what the final results were. What did you end up doing? Also, I hope all of you guys have a home game as fun as my monthly poker game. 11 games a year. First ten games are a $20 rebuy. Winner of the first ten get a seat at the championship game. $100 buy in. No rebuys. Winner take all and last year we bought a WWE championship belt to give to the winner. Last hand of the rebuy last night were the three shortest stacks just shoving to try debuting. I'm all in with 55 value 62s vs 74s. Flop is dealt really slowly. 7 7 74s starts doing victory laps 5 And then we all start losing our minds. I would later bust out to the eventually winner to a one outer on the turn of a three way all in. Just wild swings. I had five pocket pairs, a set, and two full houses, yet someone was barely breaking even all night.
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Aug 22, 2022 05:45
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Sataere posted:Was waiting to see if there was other feedback on this because I'm curious what the final results were. What did you end up doing? I want to wait at least a few more days before posting results in case anyone else wanted to provide feedback.
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Aug 22, 2022 14:19
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I think I fold. It's real easy to do some wine in front of me analysis here and consider what you're unblocking, but bottom line this doesn't feel like a bluff with AK or AQ of clubs, not with the turn barrel.Sataere posted:
Basically I agree with Sataere here. The check-raise followed by the turn bet make me think I'm beat, and if I'm not there are going to be better spots to exploit the villain
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Aug 22, 2022 15:39
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if you think he's aggro hes probably raising nearly all fds on flop and maybe also things like A4 or 45, this deep im not surprised to see QQ get flatted pre but I would be somewhat surprised to see JJ-TT get raised on flop unless he thinks your 3b range is quite aggressive, so that leaves around 15 combos beating us and if you think hes aggro enough to continue with his flop semibluffs we really dont have to find that many combos to call turn and river or just rip it here given how many rivers we dont like and the likelyhood of his equity being high. plus tbh if he does have QQ-TT type hands he's in a really lovely spot if we just rip it. so yea i might just slam it in, but people are bad so im not really banking on him doing enough analysis to realize we're crushing him when we shove here and he has JJ or whatever.
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Aug 24, 2022 00:55
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MY INEVITABLE DEBT posted:if you think he's aggro hes probably raising nearly all fds on flop and maybe also things like A4 or 45, this deep im not surprised to see QQ get flatted pre but I would be somewhat surprised to see JJ-TT get raised on flop unless he thinks your 3b range is quite aggressive, so that leaves around 15 combos beating us and if you think hes aggro enough to continue with his flop semibluffs we really dont have to find that many combos to call turn and river or just rip it here given how many rivers we dont like and the likelyhood of his equity being high. plus tbh if he does have QQ-TT type hands he's in a really lovely spot if we just rip it. so yea i might just slam it in, but people are bad so im not really banking on him doing enough analysis to realize we're crushing him when we shove here and he has JJ or whatever. Yeah this is kind of where I was at with my thinking. There are just so few value hands in his range aside from some overpairs but even then he’s not always raising them on the flop I don’t think. And I don’t know that he’s then following up with a decently big bet on the turn either. I think he’s usually 4-betting KK+ and probably also QQ sometimes. I did end up moving in on the turn and he ended up calling with 77 which is a hand I didn’t expect him to have as played. Thanks for the analysis. Hoping to start playing some more soon and posting more hands.
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Aug 26, 2022 00:04
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30NL 6max cash 100bb effective. Hero dealt AJo in BTN. UTG folds CO checks (just joined, posted) Hero raises to 4bbs SB calls BB folds CO calls Pot: 13bbs Flop: 5TA rainbow SB bets 1bb. CO folds. Hero raises to 8bbs SB calls. Pot: 30bbs Flop 5TA / Turn: 6 Still no flush draws SB leads 11bbs. At this point, I've made the decision to check call. I think my ace is good, but I'm asking you all whether this lead should have told me to get out. Hero calls. Pot: 52bbs Flop 5TA / Turn: 6 / River: 4 SB checks. Hero checks. I genuinely thought I was good until the SB flipped over 6To. In retrospect, I wonder if I should have saw the turn lead as serious strength, but I think if I started folding more in that spot it would be a leak. I think this was just an insanely stupid player that got lucky. But let's say that it wasn't. The turn lead is definitely a telegraph of strength. What is our fold frequency in that spot? What if we don't have the A but we have a T instead?
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Aug 27, 2022 01:36
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Yeah before I read the rest of the post, that minraise on the flop followed by a 1/3 pot raise on the turn, with rainbow and some low straight draws, says low pair on the flop turned to two pair; But I was crediting BB with maybe A6s or 56s. I think 78s wants to see a cheap river to try and complete a straight, same with JQ or QK. I considered flopped low set (pocket 5s) but the 1BB raise on the flop doesn't make sense to me there, I think most players either raise more strongly or slow play a set, maybe favoring a bigger raise given the ace on the board. Pocket 6es should fold to your flop raise, right? Either way, I don't mind calling 1/3 pot turn bet with aces on an unpaired, rainbow board, but I question the river check behind after that. The 4 completes only a 23 or 78 drawing hand, it misses KQ and QJ, and villain doesn't raise like he should with AT/A5/A6/A4. Are you worried about a check raise or check shove from a set? His call preflop was with BB and CO still to act behind him but I think you can still give him some sets but his flop play suggests not 5s or Ts so that takes some away probably. I think you raise river for value, your AA is good a lot of the time, and I am guessing you can make a 2/3 to pot sized raise as a semibluff to get some two pairs to fold. Anyway yeah to answer your question I think the turn call is fine with AA and would be very questionable with TT given the A on the board, villain has lots of Ax here.
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Aug 27, 2022 07:25
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need to raise way bigger on the flop. dude bet 1/13th pot you should not reward him by only raising him to 8bb. no issue with flatting the turn though although i may fold some rivers here if i know how villain plays. at 30NL you're going to get a wide range of lines that don't make much sense so you just have to not be too results oriented about it. not saying you are but calling turn here is fine and deciding you're A is good here on the river is also fine.
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Aug 27, 2022 07:51
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That pattern is definitely one I need to remember in most circumstances. It should telegraph a made hand, but I worry that overfolding against that pattern is exploitable. Should I worry less at these stakes? Leper to answer your question, I guess (and this might be a leak for sure) when a player leads OOP into me after I raised, I usually take a more passive check call approach when I don't have the nuts. AJ is strong here but there are things that are beating me.
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Aug 27, 2022 14:02
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Strong Sauce posted:need to raise way bigger on the flop. dude bet 1/13th pot you should not reward him by only raising him to 8bb. no issue with flatting the turn though although i may fold some rivers here if i know how villain plays. at 30NL you're going to get a wide range of lines that don't make much sense so you just have to not be too results oriented about it. Is an 8bb raise really that bad here? It's over half the pot. Just curious how much you think needs to be bet in this spot. I feel like if I'm reraising even a min bet, I'm going at least 2/3 and probably closer to a pot bet because 1bb feels weak and I don't want him chasing. Heroes bet doesn't feel that bad to me though. Regardless, I think the hand is fine as played. There are a wide range of hands he can have in this spot that you beat. I'm fine just calling down turn/river after that flop. I think I'm ahead most of the time, but the only people who are calling my raises on the river probably have me beat.
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Aug 27, 2022 17:12
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Sataere posted:. I think I'm ahead most of the time, but the only people who are calling my raises on the river probably have me beat. If you think you're usually ahead, the question isn't whether callers have you beat, it's whether you can get some better hands to fold; and secondarily, on the turn, whether you can get more info about villain's hand with a raise.
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Aug 27, 2022 19:40
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Sataere posted:Is an 8bb raise really that bad here? It's over half the pot. Just curious how much you think needs to be bet in this spot. I feel like if I'm reraising even a min bet, I'm going at least 2/3 and probably closer to a pot bet because 1bb feels weak and I don't want him chasing. Heroes bet doesn't feel that bad to me though. So my read on the hand is this. I have AJ on a board where I most likely have the best hand. I'm devaluing the likelihood villain has AQ,AK,AT,sets here when he leads. Hard to believe I don't have the best hand. Next, the bet he makes looks like to me either 1) he doesn't know how to use the poker client interface and clicked on bet when it was at 1 unit, or 2) he's a bad player making a blocking bet. In either of these scenarios you should not oblige by making a raise that's in line with a normal bet. 8bb into the original 13bb pot is just a standard c-bet so you have not really gotten the most value you can, nor have you punished villain for making a blocking bet. But I assume this player is bad and I'm willing to pump more money in because it's likely I'm ahead. Also mathematically, you're offering him a $22 ($13 + $1 + $8) pot by putting in $7 more dollars. a slightly better than 3:1 offer for his money. You obviously don't know his exact range and neither does he know your exact range, but generally speaking getting 3:1 on your money against a regular range is pretty good odds wise. Put it another way if you somehow ended up in Villain's body after he makes that $1 bet, and Hero now raises to $8.. are you ever folding T6 here now that you're in this spot? I would argue that it's a pretty straightforward call at that exact point (ignoring how you would have ever gotten there). But if Hero makes a bet to say... even $20, the odds change and you're put into a weird spot of not knowing whether Hero raised you because of your misclick/blocking bet or if Hero has a legitimate hand. It's no longer a straightforward odds question. If I was going to bet $8 anyways if he checked, then you should raise more than $8 when he donkbets. Against good players who may try to induce a raise by making blocking bets I tend to be factor this in and may just raise to the $8 as though the person did not donkbet that $1. Might raise to the bigger number regardless until I get played back at. But against this guy? Probably going to raise big to get the most value.
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Aug 27, 2022 23:37
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That makes a lot of sense. I think I spend so much time trying to make my patterns look similar regardless of situation that I'm spewing value.
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Aug 28, 2022 01:34
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sephiRoth IRA posted:30NL 6max cash You should never fold any A on turn here vs this line. Donkbets from randoms are generally very weak and this was a mindonkbet on the flop. I am expecting AJ to be the best hand 99% of the time here vs SB. Once he donks turn I'm expecting villain to be really bad and show up with random combos that don't make much sense to play like this, like A2, JT, KJ, all sorts of stuff. Of course once in a while it'll be A5, A6 etc as well. In general at low stakes where people are bad and are clicking random buttons with silly combos a lot of the time, don't fold decent/good absolute hand value vs small bets. I think I'm vbetting river as played for halfpot and folding to a raise. Strong Sauce posted:So my read on the hand is this. I have AJ on a board where I most likely have the best hand. I'm devaluing the likelihood villain has AQ,AK,AT,sets here when he leads. Hard to believe I don't have the best hand. These are good points. It is just so much more likely that an unknown at nl30 who, called a 4bb open from SB donks 1bb on flop that isn't good for him is actually just a bad player instead of someone good who has come up with a good 1bb donking strat. Whether or not 8bb is too big or too small in general is irrelevant in this spot, we should just exploit our (probably) weak opponent by choosing sizings that maximize our ev against them. When we have AJ it's a definite possibility that our sizing should be much bigger. Finnish Flasher fucked around with this message at 11:08 on Sep 9, 2022 |
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Sep 9, 2022 10:56
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This topic is coming up frequently now with shot clocks being introduced so I wanted to ask more people. This came from a hand over 10 years ago but it’s a WSOP tournament so hour long levels. I’m not in the hand. Person A bets a decent sized bet on the turn. Close to the pot size bet and has 2-3x that remaining. Action is on person B who goes into the tank and B covers A by a good amount like 60BB to start vs 40 BB. We are in the money but not at the point of getting close to a big pay jump and there’s 8 tables about remaining. B tanked for ~5 min before I started thinking about an amount of time where I would call the clock. I settled or 3 or 5 minutes then asked the dealer to call the floor after an additional 3 or 5 minutes pass so all told the guy had 10 minutes to think. The floor starts the minute countdown and he ends up calling the bet. A snap pushed the river as soon as it was dealt and B folded after less than a minute. He was pissed afterward and was mad because he didn’t have enough time to think. How long would you let B tank before you call the clock on him?
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Oct 20, 2022 18:51
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