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Sankis
Mar 8, 2004

But I remember the fella who told me. Big lad. Arms as thick as oak trees, a stunning collection of scars, nice eye patch. A REAL therapist he was. Er wait. Maybe it was rapist?



AccountSupervisor posted:

That would literally defeat the entire purpose of bronze being more valuable and useful a resource than copper and tin alone, both in game and IRL.

Not really. You can't make weapons and armor out of tin and copper alone. Costs are still pretty high to fully outfit someone in bronze. It'd mostly just mean that a trek to a copper vein for 40 ore or whatever would get you more than maybe one item out of the deal. Making bronze is tedious and way more time consuming than maybe anything else.

Each tier seems to have a basic gimmick for resource gathering. Bronze's just seems to be tedium.

Sankis fucked around with this message at 16:02 on Feb 23, 2021

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PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

Yes, it's like a lava lamp.



It's especially bad when you have like 8 people playing on a server. It's taken expeditions and whole secondary industrial areas just to get everyone kitted out with axes and pickaxes.

Saxophone
Sep 19, 2006





Sankis posted:

Not really. You can't make weapons and armor out of tin and copper alone. Costs are still pretty high to fully outfit someone in bronze. It'd mostly just mean that a trek to a copper vein for 40 ore or whatever would get you more than maybe one item out of the deal. Making bronze is tedious and way more time consuming than maybe anything else.

Each tier seems to have a basic gimmick for resource gathering. Bronze's just seems to be tedium.

This is where I'm at. I actually liked setting up a ramshackle base of sorts at the copper node and harvesting it and then going on tin runs, but I more or less have to make them separately and a tin trip and a copper trip net me about one item. I've made a bronze sword, an axe, and a pickaxe. In the same amount of time, I've killed enough trolls to have a full set of troll hide armor AND upgrades. So bronze armor is barely worth it anyway.

So I'll probably make a bronze shield and then start scouting swamps. I've have absolutely outfitted and upgraded to bronze everything had it been more efficient.

Edit:. Not to mention any further copper, tin, and resulting brass is getting squirreled away because I'm inevitably going to be making more bases and those will need all the upgrades to benches and forges.

mastershakeman
Oct 28, 2008


Inzombiac posted:

So?
Making bronze is much harder than iron, so much that the common advice is to skip the bronze armor and weapons, if possible.

Loads of games don't require carbon in addition to iron to make steel products. This is just a weirdly designed material gate that doesn't really add anything to the experience.

i just hit the bronze age and spent two days mining copper/tin and smelting nonstop and am like...ok should i just stop at the bronze axe that was obviously what i want? there is SO MUCH bronze stuff and it it seems like it's going to take me a day of mining for each piece of bronze

Starks
Sep 24, 2006



I got by with just bronze pick and axe as far as equipment and then went straight to iron. I did like 2 trips to the dark woods to get copper. I was pretty underpowered against swamp enemies though and getting through my first two crypts required quite a bit of cheese with the bow.

Inzombiac
Mar 19, 2007

PARTY ALL NIGHT

EAT BRAINS ALL DAY


mastershakeman posted:

i just hit the bronze age and spent two days mining copper/tin and smelting nonstop and am like...ok should i just stop at the bronze axe that was obviously what i want? there is SO MUCH bronze stuff and it it seems like it's going to take me a day of mining for each piece of bronze

Stick to troll armor, upgrade it when you can. Make a bronze/copper pick to make getting iron easier.
gently caress bronze.

Fart Car '97
Jul 23, 2003

o fuk traffic

I think people would freak out about metal scarcity less if they paid more attention to the stats of items and were generally more aware of which things are very minor upgrades, and which things were important: i.e. Flint->bronze axe is very important. Troll armor ->bronze armor much less so. You see similar repetitions in basically every tier, so I don't think it's a bad thing that you often have to make critical choices about where you spend your resources.

Meiteron
Apr 4, 2008

Whoa! You're gonna be a legend!


SynthesisAlpha posted:

So I finally found a swamp dungeon and holy poo poo so much iron. I popped a portal on top of it and fenced it in, then built a smelter on site so I could start processing the iron right away.

Then my dumb rear end realized bars are also blocked from teleporting. Now I have to decide if I'm ferrying all this stuff home or building a second base (and getting enough copper and bronze for a new forge). I'm thinking new base, especially since my first one is a godawful half open hodgepodge house with no aesthetic value whatsoever.

Remember that weapons and tools are not blocked from teleporting, with nails also being included. Depending on the size of the swamp and sheer amount of iron you have a couple options for how invested you want to be. You will need to source some bronze for at least two levels of forge, however.

Me and my friend built a forward base at the edge of a neighbouring black forest and lived in the swamp for a couple of days cleaning out all the crypts we could find; we made all our iron stuff on site, and our current plan is to make a longship at a nearby ocean edge and sail 100-200+ ingots back to our base that way. You may not want to do all that but we found we didn't really want to live near a swamp because the enemy spawns are annoying and all our infrastructure is back in our meadows camp.

Generation Internet
Jan 18, 2009

Where angels and generals fear to tread.


pik_d posted:

Wait you guys are getting The Elder on the same landmass??



I took the long way to my base last night after defeating the second boss, and while I think there's technically a river separating where the Elder is from where I started, I would count it as the same thing.



The terrain generation in this game is real neat.

Inzombiac posted:

Stick to troll armor, upgrade it when you can. Make a bronze/copper pick to make getting iron easier.
gently caress bronze.

Counterpoint: bronze armour looks cooler

CRAYON
Feb 13, 2006

In the year 3000..

I would say If you're really trying to conserve on bronze usage just skip the bronze pick axe as well. You can craft 3 antler pick axes, and take all of them. That will give you a lot to work with for mining crypts. Antler pick axes can also be repaired with a regular workbench so you don't even need to teleport home for repairs. Just make the iron pick with your first 20 iron and you're in business.

I would say the bronze axe, followed by bucker, are the most important bronze items. With a lvl 2 buckler I was able to just block everything from the second boss and that helped a lot.

CRAYON fucked around with this message at 16:29 on Feb 23, 2021

The Battle Axe
Mar 30, 2011



If we’re posting mapgens, my world seed gave us a sort of upside down Italy:

Fart Car '97
Jul 23, 2003

o fuk traffic

People should keep this in mind: A max upgraded item has the same stats as the first tier item in the next tier. So level 4 troll armor is the same armor class as level 1 bronze. If your seed has a ton of bronze go for bronze armor. If you don't, farm trolls to armor 4. If you don't think you're going to upgrade the next tier past level 1.... consider skipping it. IMO iron armor can be skipped entirely in favor of tier 4 Bronze until you eventually find your swamp with a shitload of crypts in it.

Sometimes there's no items at a certain tier. Sometimes certain tiers ARE outright better than the previous onelike Silver armor -> padded iron. But usually you can make up for lacking one resource by focusing on the other areas, like Harvesting the best food and getting more comfort to allow you to get the rested buff longer.

Tempora Mutantur
Feb 22, 2005


re: metal needs, shields are VASTLY better investments than body armor, because blocking (and especially parrying which always avoids 100% of a hit's damage) absorbs way more on lower tiers than equivalent higher tier body armor; keeping high tier food available and getting block/parry timing down in this game is way more important

like I solo'd bonemass in trollhide using an iron shield + mace off less than 2 sunken caverns, just parrying his hits then backing off to kill his adds when he spawned them (archers being the most annoying just cause you have to dodge a little more) then back to tanking his poison (with poison resist mead) and whacking him with the mace between parries

this is all from this video which I think I actually found in this thread: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwElWHMmBEY

I don't plan on giving up my trollhide unless/until there's a lower-movespeed-penalty armor, I don't really care about the sneaky bonus as much as I thought so much as being fast with 0% reduced movespeed (except for the 5-10% loss of equipping bow or 1h+shield which all armor faces)

Badly Jester
Apr 9, 2010


Bitches!


Inzombiac posted:

They're saying that since you're putting in 2 bars of copper and one bar of tin, you should get 2 or 3 bars of bronze out of the deal, not 1.

How am I this dumb? Thanks for clarifying.

I guess it is kinda weird that bronze is so much harder to produce than iron despite being the inferior material, but at the same time, I don't mind what this does to the pacing of the progression. Getting your first metal equipment feels like a much more important step than getting better metal stuff. This is probably the first game where I'm actively trying not to min-max everything, though, so my perspective may be different.

Generation Internet
Jan 18, 2009

Where angels and generals fear to tread.


The Battle Axe posted:

If we’re posting mapgens, my world seed gave us a sort of upside down Italy:


I do really enjoy seeing people post their maps, especially since generally it's just the coastline like a lot of early historic maps.

Super cool how on top of everything else the mapgen makes really interesting terrain to explore by sea, the rivers, lakes, and bays I've seen are so cool.

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

Yes, it's like a lava lamp.



Yeah I'm completely unwilling to use armor that reduces move speed, since it's pretty easy to side step/dodge/block enemy attacks.

Doh004
Apr 22, 2007

Mmmmm Donuts...

I haven't killed a troll yet, they scare me. How many trolls do you need to kill to upgrade the armor to be worth it over bronze?

esquilax
Jan 3, 2003



TBH I think bronze is a lot easier to come by than iron when you take into account that the bronze recipes are cheaper - bronze helmet is 5 bronze but iron helmet is 20 iron. Iron requires you to find a new swamp with a crypt, or wishbone an annoyingly small amount of it. Copper and tin are everywhere.

I think all my early game problems with the copper & tin grind were because I chose to walk to a faraway node and schlep it back, instead of just making a boat, sailing along the coast of a forest, looking for convenient nodes to mine, and setting up a portal for repairs/resting.

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009



Doh004 posted:

I haven't killed a troll yet, they scare me. How many trolls do you need to kill to upgrade the armor to be worth it over bronze?

Only the first troll is scary, it's funny how routine they become after you've done it a couple times. Just make a bunch of arrows and kite them around, as long as you don't get hit they're easy.

They seem to drop ~5 leather each kill.

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

Yes, it's like a lava lamp.



I've gotten pretty comfortable just running up and axeing them to death too, but you need a good shield and food for that.

Galaga Galaxian
Apr 23, 2009

What a childish tactic!
Don't you think you should put more thought into your battleplan?!


Maps?

Inzombiac
Mar 19, 2007

PARTY ALL NIGHT

EAT BRAINS ALL DAY


xzzy posted:

Only the first troll is scary, it's funny how routine they become after you've done it a couple times. Just make a bunch of arrows and kite them around, as long as you don't get hit they're easy.

They seem to drop ~5 leather each kill.

Trolls can be parried very easily. Two swipes, parry and repeat.

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

Yes, it's like a lava lamp.



Oh, you're sushi base reminded me, how the gently caress do you catch fish? I've grabbed some that were just sitting on the shore before, and somebody said they managed to snatch some out of the water, but even when I can get them to come close to me (close enough that the UI says Fish when I look at them) I can't grab them?

Galaga Galaxian
Apr 23, 2009

What a childish tactic!
Don't you think you should put more thought into your battleplan?!


trader sells a fishing pole and bait.

Seems kinda silly we can't just make one ourselves...

Xaris
Jul 25, 2006

Jacking Out; Jacking In



Fuzzysocksucker posted:

Saw this over on reddit. If you're really stuck trying to find the trader: Valheim Merchant Finder. It can either give you a general hint like 'roughly 8km west from a circle of chained rocks', or display a map for you (its not the actual map, just a white circle with black dot.)

My trader really is at -7800, 2000 so I guess it works?

You could spend days sailing around and never find him so this is super helpful.

Great thanks! They really need to have breadcrumbs for trader or just have multiple traders spawn per map. One is ridiculous given the size and variation of biomes spread all over

The Battle Axe
Mar 30, 2011



Xaris posted:

Great thanks! They really need to have breadcrumbs for trader or just have multiple traders spawn per map. One is ridiculous given the size and variation of biomes spread all over

Honestly they ought to do it like the bosses, just find a runestone that reveals the location.

PIZZA.BAT
Nov 12, 2016





esquilax posted:

TBH I think bronze is a lot easier to come by than iron when you take into account that the bronze recipes are cheaper - bronze helmet is 5 bronze but iron helmet is 20 iron. Iron requires you to find a new swamp with a crypt, or wishbone an annoyingly small amount of it. Copper and tin are everywhere.

I think all my early game problems with the copper & tin grind were because I chose to walk to a faraway node and schlep it back, instead of just making a boat, sailing along the coast of a forest, looking for convenient nodes to mine, and setting up a portal for repairs/resting.

god damnit people

BUILD. AN. OUTPOST.

build all the poo poo you need where you source the materials. the only time you'll need to be schlepping is when you start getting into items that mix different types of metals and even then- your outposts should be set up near multiple biomes. build what you need locally then teleport back

Inzombiac
Mar 19, 2007

PARTY ALL NIGHT

EAT BRAINS ALL DAY


PIZZA.BAT posted:

god damnit people

BUILD. AN. OUTPOST.

build all the poo poo you need where you source the materials. the only time you'll need to be schlepping is when you start getting into items that mix different types of metals and even then- your outposts should be set up near multiple biomes. build what you need locally then teleport back

But then what will I do with the half dozen carts I keep making and losing?!

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009



PIZZA.BAT posted:

BUILD. AN. OUTPOST.

It's the viking way, head across the waters in search of resources, raid it, then build your own poo poo to live there until the wanderlust takes over again.

Protocol7
Jul 26, 2012

Cyber Hellcat is not amused


PIZZA.BAT posted:

god damnit people

BUILD. AN. OUTPOST.

build all the poo poo you need where you source the materials. the only time you'll need to be schlepping is when you start getting into items that mix different types of metals and even then- your outposts should be set up near multiple biomes. build what you need locally then teleport back

Yeah, besides it's good to get practice building structures. You get a better feel for how to build more effective chimneys, more useful home layouts, you start to recognize easier to defend areas of land that are good spots for bases, etc.

Also I have a lot of fun using my previous base as a logging outpost. Does mean I have to schlep wood back to the primary outpost, but that's really not awful with Eikthyr's power.

KingKapalone
Dec 20, 2005
1/16 Native American + 1/2 Hungarian = Totally Badass

We had a chest full of metals disappear from our mountain base last night. Then we built the new high tier smelter to smelt black iron and the entire thing disappeared with the ore inside of it. Is our 8-10 person 4th boss down server getting overloaded with stuff so it just deletes poo poo?

esquilax
Jan 3, 2003



PIZZA.BAT posted:

god damnit people

BUILD. AN. OUTPOST.

build all the poo poo you need where you source the materials. the only time you'll need to be schlepping is when you start getting into items that mix different types of metals and even then- your outposts should be set up near multiple biomes. build what you need locally then teleport back

Why would I mine and smelt new copper and iron to set up new infrastructure at every little mining node when I can just build a teleporter and rest every night in my 14 comfort luxury house surrounded by 5 smelters and an uncomfortable number of troll heads

Buller
Nov 6, 2010


It took me 30 minutes to sail to the 3rd boss in my world.

PIZZA.BAT
Nov 12, 2016





I guess maybe it's not fair for me to push hard on the outpost thing because this was what prompted our iron operation:



However this is what we knew of when we first built the outpost:



BUILD. AN. OUTPOST.

PIZZA.BAT fucked around with this message at 17:47 on Feb 23, 2021

Jinnigan
Feb 12, 2007

We shall pay him a visit. There will be a picnic. Tea shall be served.

running around with a hoe in the swamps spamming "level ground" on the water helps a bunch. even if it doesn't break the water level you can usually raise it to shallows and avoid the wading speed penalty. especially good if you're going to make multiple trips to a crypt

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009



Buller posted:

It took me 30 minutes to sail to the 3rd boss in my world.

Just wait until we have a reason to visit the extreme north or south biomes! Hope you got a couple days to do it.

Buller
Nov 6, 2010


xzzy posted:

Just wait until we have a reason to visit the extreme north or south biomes! Hope you got a couple days to do it.

Well at least I have a portal there now, He was on the same island as a Mistlands biome. Big scary spider webs there.

Nosre
Apr 16, 2002




Most important upgrades in silver tier? (after getting cold resistance)

My bow from previous tier is still doing fine, so the sword is looking pretty tempting

dogstile
May 1, 2012

fucking clocks
how do they work?


Bow is probably the most important, I think its the best in the game?

Everything else can easily be skipped but the silver armour looks the best, so i've fully upgraded it.

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Nosre
Apr 16, 2002




hm, fair enough. The previous bow is 2-shotting (or nearly) drakes and wolves with decent arrows, so it didn't seem like a priority

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