Pirate Jet posted:

If fun is stuff like Wonder Woman 1984 I hope this film is the least fun I’ve ever had in my life.

Roman posted:

it's amazing how they took something that would at least appeal to Snyder fans and made it into something for absolutely nobody

RBA Starblade posted:

It sounds like Watchmen's the zenith there

KVeezy3 posted:

Comic-book superheroes are largely structured to be a certain way, that is - extremely insular (Detached from history/culture), and petrified of taking risks/tackling big ideas, which results in deeply conservative works, both creatively and politically. But this extends far beyond just superhero fiction, to what I think is the reason for a lot of bad genre fiction as well as contemporary U.S. literature (U.S. authors even say they’re proud that their fiction is about nothing, as a way to proudly emphasize their dedication to pure craft and the aesthetics of language).

But as you’ve said, Watchmen & The Dark Knight Returns were watershed moments for the comic book genre, because it presented genuine new possibilities for the form by shedding the insularity of its past in a turning to the world. The problem is that the comic book industry used the new spotlight to exploit the ‘serious’ and ‘adult’ aspects purged entirely of their social/political content, and so the traumatic opening created by Moore and Miler was closed up and the extant history is used to justify its own continuance: superhero fiction has always been this way, so it can’t be any other way and compelling stories can’t be told otherwise. But there’s no such thing as inevitable forward progress.

Superman previously destroyed slums to force the U.S. government to improve the material conditions of the underclass. Where did this guy go? Sure, it's kind of dumb, but when was the last time a superhero did anything as interesting as this?



Brawleh is right that the real contention about Snyder is politics & ideology, since the typical complaints about his DC work is beloved in other superhero films and even the most ardent critics admit that his films are well designed. Nerds are cool with the TDK Joker killing a bunch of people, but committed to Batman killing none [b]is[/i] political. People deride his films for being CGI-fests, but the Avengers films, particularly the latter ones, are far more egregious.

As a genre filmmaker, Snyder not only isn’t afraid to touch sacred cows, but often finds that that’s the most creatively interesting thing to do (Hence Zod’s snapped neck). What makes him not simply a contrarian or nihilist, in the vein of Brightburn (2019) or Super (2010), is his commitment to following through as honestly as he can. Post-Watchmen, he doesn’t think there is a ‘going back’ to a world where Raimi’s Spider-Man 2 is considered the platonic ideal of comic book filmmaking, and in the process wants to redeem the mistake of the comic book industry in the realm of studio blockbuster filmmaking.

Of course, you can say that Snyder is failing to do it well, but I disagree that it’s not worth trying in the first place because of tradition.


Certainly, the death of Batman’s parents has been a staple of every Batman film, but we should recognize how Snyder does it differently and how dependent the entire structure of the film is on that opening. “Martha” memes aside, the theme of parental figures permeates the film. While Batman is having nightmares about his parents and his mother being a monstrous vampire, Superman is able to turn to his mother and (The idea of) his father to find a calm island in times of crisis. The film makes Lex Luthor into a Jr., and although Luthor Sr. is long gone, his presence remains an ominous specter over the film.

Robin’s murder is an important event, but far more crucial to Batman’s descent is Snyder’s critique of Batman’s entire vigilante career. Clark investigates Batman and is deeply troubled that he’s mostly targeting the underclass with the consent of the police (An investigation that his boss doesn’t want him to do in lieu of puff pieces, the film’s critique of private news media under contemporary capitalism). Batman reflects on the fact that he hasn’t been able to cause real change, that “Criminals are like weeds” - the trauma of losing his parents to street level crime has him blinded to a structural analysis, which he comes face to face with at the end of BvS when the justice system lets Lex Luthor off free.

MacheteZombie posted:

I like his armor design but I don't think DS really pops in that still image the way I'd like him too.

Bongo Bill posted:

It looks like the idea is to give Apokolips itself a consistent design - super stark black and orange accented with silver, so dark that even the light is sickly and frail, visually connecting to the Knightmare sequence and carrying that palette to its farthest extreme. I'm not expecting Darkseid and his inner circle to have a large role, aside from Steppenwolf, who's the urgent invading threat.

McCloud posted:

It's hilarious that the execs were sure they had a super hit on their hands after the Whedon changes and we're shocked when it blew up in their faces.

SuperMechagodzilla posted:

John Wick of Dogs posted:

Thompson or Waynes?

Both would be fine by me

Jimbot posted:

Reminds me of this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzNS4U_aE28

Mr. Apollo posted:

I wonder how all the stars of JL feel about the positive reviews.

teagone posted:

Lol. I would have loved seeing pre-viz animatics using the explosion sound effects Snyder was making during his MoS/BvS commentaries.

teagone posted:

If a Suicide Squad Ayer cut comes out complete with Steppenwolf, motherboxes, and parademons, I will take a 1 month probation.


I'm down.

teagone posted:

Why to the Ayer cut probe? Or why to the Snyder Goku reboot? Lmao.

Shageletic posted:

I was still wincing. She's not a good actress.

John Wick of Dogs posted:

Adrian Palicki Wonder Woman was a David E Kelley joint

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

Lex: i can control Superman by using Martha

Superman: i can get Batman to relate to my humanity by mentioning Martha

Martian Manhunter: oh okay i see how this works

Asteroid Alert posted:

This film looks absolutely beautiful on a CRT.

Schwarzwald posted:

Honestly, that'd be a really good take. Retail work as a life without hope. Consumerist mediocrity as hell.

Retrowave Joe posted:

It'd have to be IHOP because Waffle House is Life.

Zaphod42 posted:

As cited earlier, warhammer fans lean into it.

John Wick of Dogs posted:

I don't think some of you realize how op Martian Manhunter is.

Most of the powers of Superman:
Flight
Invulnerability
Super Strength
"Martian Vision"(more like Cyclops beams than heat)
Survive in space

Also:
Shape Shifting
Density control(walk through walls or become super hard)
Professor X Level telepathy

Only major downside is his weakness is very common and easy to access: Fire

HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:

After like 8 years I still don't know what makes people so angry about Snyder.

Blood Boils posted:

Hilariously Ang Lee is the only one who actually thought about giving this character a backstory that would explain rage issues.

At least in movies, I dunno if Banner has an abusive father in comics