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Internet Explorer
Jun 1, 2005


Oven Wrangler

Greetings goon friends!

Believe it or not, the admin/mod team spends a lot of time talking about how to make the forums the best place it can be. Sometimes we nail it, sometimes we don’t, but there’s a lot of effort that goes into it. And we’re constantly trying to get better at it.

One way we try to make the forums better is listening to feedback. That feedback can take many forms. Traditionally it has been PMs, QCS, or even conversations in-thread about an issue. Each one of these methods servse a purpose, but they also have their downsides. PMs are generally a 1-on-1 conversation. QCS can involve the SA population at large weighing in on an issue. In-thread can obnoxiously derail a thread.

A new idea that has been implemented in a few subforums is the concept of a subforum-specifc feedback thread. These have been used successfully in some of the more… contentious subforums and we would like to give it a try here. For the most part, SH/SC is very quiet and easy to moderate. But quiet and easy to moderate doesn’t mean there aren’t ways we could improve.

So that’s what this thread is. A timeboxed opportunity for folks to give feedback and talk things through. We’ll try to do these fairly regularly, and we’re open to thoughts about what exactly this should look like. We would like to keep it fairly open, but here are a couple of topics to get us started:
  • How is moderation going in general? Do you want to see more moderation, less moderation, or are things on track? Any specific threads or examples to go with this?
  • How are the megathreads doing? Do any of them need refreshing, combining, or breaking up? Do we need new ones? If you’d like to contribute to a megathread re-write or start a new one, we’d like to hear from you!
  • How do you feel about the SH/SC forum rules? Are we missing anything? Is there anything you'd like to see removed? Keep in mind that SH/SC, and many other subforums, also incorporate the GBS rules.
  • What do you think about a general monthly/quarterly "chat" thread, that gets closed and reset on an interval? How about the various ongoing "IT chat" threads that exist today? We're not advocating for it, but do folks think those should be combined?
Anyways, we're excited to give this a shot. Please do not use this as an opportunity to helldump people or be jerks to one another. It's been an incredibly difficult year for everyone, so please approach this and each other with kindness. SH/SC is the best place to talk tech on the internet and we just want to make sure we are working to keep it that way. Please let us know your thoughts!

Internet Explorer fucked around with this message at 17:39 on Mar 9, 2021

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Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

Nobody Cares




I want to open with the opinion that this subforum is amazingly high quality, and I feel like my skillet would be suffering a little if I had to go to sites like Reddit or Stackoverflow that often lack the deeper context you can get here.

I don't have any specific ideas, only a wish that feedback be focused on maintaining that level of quality.

i am a moron
Nov 12, 2020

Gettin' woke about vaccines

Someone recently spammed every thread I have bookmarked with a link and I haven’t seen mods take any action thanks for taking time to hear my concerns

codo27
Apr 21, 2008



Definitely one of the better subforums on the site and in need of little alteration. Certain threads could use refreshing, sure. But much better off than what I'll call its sister subforum, IYG.

Crosby B. Alfred
May 20, 2006
Cosby B. Alright

I think SH/SC has been doing great. Not sure how we'd even make it better and this place does even beat StackOverflow.

Internet Explorer
Jun 1, 2005


Oven Wrangler

i am a moron posted:

Someone recently spammed every thread I have bookmarked with a link and I haven’t seen mods take any action thanks for taking time to hear my concerns



I knew this was coming. I just wanted to make sure no one got left out!

Defenestrategy
Oct 24, 2010

Worst decision I ever made.


Crosby B. Alfred posted:

I think SH/SC has been doing great. Not sure how we'd even make it better and this place does even beat StackOverflow.

It's very refreshing not to see

"WE ALREADY ANSWERED THIS QUESTION DID YOU NOT SEARCH FIRST!-links to a question which is entirely different-"

in response to questions, even those that have been asked in the same thread consistently.

Stay the course admins.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014

Nobody Cares




I'm going to ask that question that one learns at overwrought leadership seminars:

admins, is there anything that we can be doing for you?

CLAM DOWN
Feb 13, 2007


RICKARUS

It's Moot baby!




I think SH/SC is great outside of jaegerx being the literal florida man of the IT thread and screaming at me about bath salts and bbq

movax
Aug 30, 2008



i am a moron posted:

Someone recently spammed every thread I have bookmarked with a link and I haven’t seen mods take any action thanks for taking time to hear my concerns

I will be doing the needful and replacing IE with Edge immediately.

kensei
Dec 27, 2007

He has come home, where he belongs. The Ancient Mariner returns to lead his first team to glory, forever and ever. Amen!



The SH/SC threads are usually pretty chill, and I appreciate that very much. The mods are responsive and make the funny title changes as needed. There are a few times where derails happen but overall I think things are on topic as much as they can realistically be.

Thanks for giving us a great place to post about IT.

Fauxtool
Oct 21, 2008

Bitcoin Rich


The GPU thread is heavily overmoderated. It goes from having a healthy discussion to half of the active members being suspended and no new posts happening for 24hours. Actual gpu news like AMD potentially making mining gpus is not being discussed because people fear the mods

Mining on GPUs is absolutely on topic in the GPU thread. The amount of new posters unaware of the unilaterally decided "no crypto" rule coming in to talk about it is proof of that.

sb hermit
Dec 13, 2016




people here are generally chill and things are on topic so I have no suggestions, op

EDIT: I mainly post in the hardware short questions thread

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


The drama last summer and the uncertainty of whether the forums were going to stay up / people were going to stick around made me fearful of having to use Reddit. I'm aware that's hardly the best praise you could hope for but it does mean you're doing something right.

denereal visease
Nov 27, 2002

"Research your own experience. Absorb what is useful, reject what is useless, add what is essentially your own."

My suggestion for improvement is to post your build pics you loving cowards

e: The GPU thread only became tolerable again in the last couple weeks with changes to its purview.

denereal visease fucked around with this message at 18:16 on Mar 9, 2021

Crosby B. Alfred
May 20, 2006
Cosby B. Alright

Fauxtool posted:

The GPU thread is heavily overmoderated. It goes from having a healthy discussion to half of the active members being suspended and no new posts happening for 24hours. Actual gpu news like AMD potentially making mining gpus is not being discussed because people fear the mods

Mining on GPUs is absolutely on topic in the GPU thread. The amount of new posters unaware of the unilaterally decided "no crypto" rule coming in to talk about it is proof of that.

The GPU Thread is largely geared towards gaming not cryptographic mining. If we want to discuss that then I'd suggest that be it's own thread.

Mustache Ride
Sep 11, 2001






As a frequent visitor of AI, I think SH/SC could use a monthly chat thread. There's plenty of things that end up in various threads that could be covered by in a chat thread so it could stay out of the megathreads. It works really well and has brought AI peeps together.

Khorne
May 1, 2002

Goonstone Champ x2

The laptop thread op is pretty out of date. Intel & AMD threads seemed to stop getting updates in 2017/2018. Having up to date ops encourages new users to post and/or like the forum so there's probably value in updating them. Having real out of date ops makes the place seem abandoned even if thread regulars never check the op.

My suggestion around it would be to try to create a group of users who can discuss updating ops. I don't know where this group should assemble, but there would be immense value in building up a volunteer/group structure around maintaining any number of things on SA. That way there's not one op who vanishes and the burden doesn't necessarily fall on one person or mod to update either.

Mackieman
Jan 11, 2003

Get off my lawn.

I am a casual SH/SC user but enjoy the threads I read and participate in. Steady as she goes, etc.

Fauxtool
Oct 21, 2008

Bitcoin Rich


Crosby B. Alfred posted:

The GPU Thread is largely geared towards gaming not cryptographic mining. If we want to discuss that then I'd suggest that be it's own thread.

Its not geared towards gaming, you are looking at a many years old OP.

Its geared towards GPUs and whats being done with them. When mining was booming it was all mining chat related to how it affects gpus. Until recently there wasnt much mining going on and it was game chat all the time. Let the GPU thread be about GPUs

imagine trying to complain about how hard it is to get a gpu but not being allowed to talk about why its hard. Probably wouldnt make for a very good discussion. That is the gpu thread currently.

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


Fauxtool posted:

The GPU thread is heavily overmoderated. It goes from having a healthy discussion to half of the active members being suspended and no new posts happening for 24hours. Actual gpu news like AMD potentially making mining gpus is not being discussed because people fear the mods

Mining on GPUs is absolutely on topic in the GPU thread. The amount of new posters unaware of the unilaterally decided "no crypto" rule coming in to talk about it is proof of that.

yeah, it's really hard to discuss the GPU shortage without touching on the prices/profit of crypto mining. Like, we don't have to get into "oh the best way to mine is to install miner XYZ, did you try overclocking your memory?" but stuff like crypto prices and how much a card mines per day and how many days payback that is, have pretty substantial bearings on how bad the shortage is going to be and how high GPU prices are going to get, and that's a topic of frequent discussion. It's hard to dance around the topic in a way that feels like it will be satisfactory to the mods.

I don't think we need to discuss the specifics of mining and how to do it better, but in the context of how crypto prices/profits are moving and how it's affecting GPU shortages, I think that's of obvious interest to a lot of people.

spunkshui
Oct 5, 2011





Fauxtool posted:

The GPU thread is heavily overmoderated. It goes from having a healthy discussion to half of the active members being suspended and no new posts happening for 24hours. Actual gpu news like AMD potentially making mining gpus is not being discussed because people fear the mods

Mining on GPUs is absolutely on topic in the GPU thread. The amount of new posters unaware of the unilaterally decided "no crypto" rule coming in to talk about it is proof of that.

Sure but it leads to pages of people discussing which coins they want to make a go up or down or whatever and no one wants to loving read that.

Cant there just be a cryptocurrency thread and then you guys can post about how you want to scalp cards or sell coins or find cheaper sources of electricity all day there?

spunkshui fucked around with this message at 18:30 on Mar 9, 2021

K8.0
Feb 26, 2004

Her Majesty's 56th Regiment of Foot

Fauxtool posted:

The GPU thread is heavily overmoderated. It goes from having a healthy discussion to half of the active members being suspended and no new posts happening for 24hours. Actual gpu news like AMD potentially making mining gpus is not being discussed because people fear the mods

Mining on GPUs is absolutely on topic in the GPU thread. The amount of new posters unaware of the unilaterally decided "no crypto" rule coming in to talk about it is proof of that.

I agree. It'd be one thing if there were actual GPU news beyond "LOL idiot you can't get a GPU" but right now crypto is literally half of the GPU conversation. There should probably be also be a crypto thread for people to talk about the practical and technical details, but general crypto talk is absolutely part of the GPU discussion. It's a similar topic to ML, there's no moderation crackdown when mining is dead, gaming is going fine, and people start talking about ML or using GPUs for pro rendering or whatever.

Aside from that, SH/SC feels unmoderated, which to me means the moderation is probably just about perfect. Conversations just flow naturally and rarely does it seem like meaningful conversation is being overshadowed by chatter.

Fauxtool
Oct 21, 2008

Bitcoin Rich


spunkshui posted:

Sure but it leads to pages of people discussing which coins they want to make a go up or down or whatever and no one wants to loving read that.

Cant there just be a cryptocurrency thread and then you guys can post about how you want to scalp cards or sell coins or find cheaper sources of electricity all day there?

seems like a strong reaction, what is this actually about and why are you so mad about fancy sand?

spunkshui
Oct 5, 2011





Fauxtool posted:

seems like a strong reaction, what is this actually about and why are you so mad about fancy sand?

I am not mad about fancy sand and this post confuses me.

bus hustler
Mar 14, 2019



The moderation might be slightly too heavy handed now & catching some dolphins in its net, but before the policy was in place the Crypto people were essentially being bullied out of the thread and demanded safe harbor as well.

It's not anyone's fault if your political/economic views about crypto are in the deep minority on SA. Yes, we should probably be able to cover a few bigger moves around crypto as they relate to the industry, but I literally never ever want to see someone asking how to make $7 a day in the GPU thread again either.

And personally, I'd pay $10 never to have to read another poster's 3rd grade economic justifications for why they NEED to mine or it's not that bad. It is a political issue, you definitely will not "forums lawyer" yourself into anyone else changing their view on it.

Wiggly Wayne DDS
Sep 11, 2010





there's been a year long high demand in the gpu market spiking from in september/october, yet the *coin discussion in earnest only appeared a couple of months ago at most. the claims of it being the driver of gpu demand and thus meriting a takeover of the gpu thread is farcical. just admit you want to talk about *coin and prefer dragging uninterested posters into the discussion rather than having your own thread devoted to the topic where 3-4 people talk about how best to scalp and avoid taxes this year

Fauxtool
Oct 21, 2008

Bitcoin Rich


spunkshui posted:

I am not mad about fancy sand and this post confuses me.

Your words indicate hostility to individual posters. No one is arguing for "discussing which coins they want to make a go up or down or whatever"

Show me the post where this happened

I want GPU talk in the GPU thread with less restrictions. Bitcoin reaching 50k 100% has implications on the availability of gaming GPUS and you are delusional to think otherwise. 1/3 gpus I sell goes to a miner and i cant be the only one

Fauxtool fucked around with this message at 18:43 on Mar 9, 2021

CLAM DOWN
Feb 13, 2007


RICKARUS

It's Moot baby!




denereal visease posted:

My suggestion for improvement is to post your build pics you loving cowards

My new pc I built a few weeks ago!!!! I somehow got a 3070 for elite gaming like the pro I am

CyberPingu
Sep 15, 2013


CLAM DOWN posted:

My new pc I built a few weeks ago!!!! I somehow got a 3070 for elite gaming like the pro I am



You should step down as mod because of that cable management.


Jk. But seriously, if people want to talk about mining beyond "holy poo poo this is a massive waste of silicon" then surely they could start a thread.

GnarlyCharlie4u
Sep 23, 2007

I have an unhealthy obsession with motorcycles.

Proof


hi.
e: bookmarked.

Woof Blitzer
Dec 29, 2012


If you want to change something, you need to make a Change Task and involve the Change Management team. Thanks.

movax
Aug 30, 2008



Khorne posted:

The laptop thread op is pretty out of date. Intel & AMD threads seemed to stop getting updates in 2017/2018. Having up to date ops encourages new users to post and/or like the forum so there's probably value in updating them. Having real out of date ops makes the place seem abandoned even if thread regulars never check the op.

My suggestion around it would be to try to create a group of users who can discuss updating ops. I don't know where this group should assemble, but there would be immense value in building up a volunteer/group structure around maintaining any number of things on SA. That way there's not one op who vanishes and the burden doesn't necessarily fall on one person or mod to update either.

This is a good point and definitely something I've been thinking about for awhile (and as the guilty party who has not updated OPs in a long time!). Refreshes definitely help but also have the effect of killing old posts off to goldmine or archives. The forums don't have a good setup currently for 'shared' edit permissions, unless you're a mod, but that would help with making more people able to help keep it up to date.

I would be interested to hear what people's expectations for a "megathread" OP are as well, and I imagine it varies per topic. For example, I've wanted to make a generic comp-arch thread for awhile so we can ingest ARM/RISC-V/archaic CPU here chat into one thread instead of split across a few different ones. I feel like the only thing stopping me from doing that is an effort-post with quick blurbs on various archs and an intro to the topic. Or -- is "hey this is the place to talk about low-level computer arch stuff, have fun!" actually sufficient? Comparing that to the threads for displays, laptops or things where a lot of goons come to get purchasing requirements / an introduction to the topic, both the up-to-date'ness of the OP becomes important and its content becomes important.

Stanley Pain
Jun 16, 2001

Bit. Trip. RIP.


Fauxtool posted:

I want GPU talk in the GPU thread with less restrictions. Bitcoin reaching 50k 100% has implications on the availability of gaming GPUS and you are delusional to think otherwise.

I'd like this as well.

There's some irrational hatred spewed towards people who use their GPUs to mine.

movax
Aug 30, 2008



Re: mining, IE has been definitely picking up my slack in the GPU thread. As he said, we are interested in getting the feedback here to help tune moderation levels. If separate threads are the answer, great, but of course crypto/GPUs intersect and personally I'd rather discussion theory-craft around how that driver blockage of mining algos work vs. get into the economics of mining... but that's just my opinion because I am a giant nerd.

There's people understandably upset they can't get the cards they want and want to vent, there are people that want to use their cards to mine, great -- capitalism / supply and demand are real things. We'll listen here and see if some kind of hopefully simple solution can be hit.

Please try to keep commentary / thoughts here somewhat civil.

spunkshui
Oct 5, 2011





Fauxtool posted:

Your words indicate hostility to individual posters. No one is arguing for "discussing which coins they want to make a go up or down or whatever"

Show me the post where this happened

I want GPU talk in the GPU thread with less restrictions. Bitcoin reaching 50k 100% has implications on the availability of gaming GPUS and you are delusional to think otherwise. 1/3 gpus I sell goes to a miner and i cant be the only one

Fauxtool posted:

going off the definitely inaccurate nicehash profitability calc, 1080ti's can still make $5 a day. Buy them for $500 on ebay and you have the same breakeven as a $1000 3080. No I didnt include electric costs because miners are cool like that.
We thought 20xx was bad, but it was actually the last commonly available GPU generation of our time

Elon just needs to announce that he sold his BTC and we can go back to terrible stock levels instead of impossible levels.

Ok but im not sure how this helps.

Sickening
Jul 15, 2007

Black summer was the best summer.

I am still of the thought that the working in IT, poo poo that pisses me off, and the ticket thread have no distinction between them and should be merged.

Apoplexy
Mar 9, 2003

~Neck Angels~



Stanley Pain posted:

I'd like this as well.

There's some irrational hatred spewed towards people who use their GPUs to mine.

There's some real irrational levels of hatred spewed towards people who coal-roll with 500 F350 pickups piped directly into orphanages, too.

nielsm
Jun 1, 2009




Fallen Rib

movax posted:

This is a good point and definitely something I've been thinking about for awhile (and as the guilty party who has not updated OPs in a long time!). Refreshes definitely help but also have the effect of killing old posts off to goldmine or archives. The forums don't have a good setup currently for 'shared' edit permissions, unless you're a mod, but that would help with making more people able to help keep it up to date.

I've kind of wanted to get the general Windows 10 thread "off my hands" for a long time now. The OP hasn't been maintained for years and is still large written with "upgrading from Windows 7/8" in mind, rather than just daily usage.
A way to "wikify" thread OPs would be nice, but even just a way to transfer ownership could help a lot of unmaintained threads like that.

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The Gunslinger
Jul 24, 2004

Do not forget the face of your father.

Fun Shoe

I can only speak to my preference but I'm only interested in GPU related news and discussion, I'm not really interested in crypto/mining chat. I feel like IE has done a great job of separating it. I don't really see a reason they have to be mixed, SH/SC doesn't get a ton of unique thread traffic so having 2 threads seems fine.

quote:

A way to "wikify" thread OPs would be nice

Yeah it would be cool if we had a way to collaborate and sustain threads to avoid outdated OPs. Although more new threads in general seems like a better goal, we have so many megathreads but that seems to be a forums wide thing.

The Gunslinger fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Mar 9, 2021

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