Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


Conventional wisdom seems to be that you should either beeline to Intuition 20 or dump Intuition to 1 at the start and ignore it completely. Detecting lies is helpful, but it's not as important as being able to get people to listen when you talk (Charisma), or being able to actually play through a game without getting killed/frozen (Stealth and Charm).

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


batteries! posted:

Will the game keep nudging you towards events, or are you supposed to figure it out with the event search option alone? I'm at around loop 30 and it feels like there's way too many dead loops where nothing happens whether I win or lose.

It's a good idea to use Event Search whenever possible; it tweaks things behind the scenes to make it more likely that people will be in role combinations that make it possible to see new events. There are a few events that are easier to see if you adjust the settings manually, though, if you already have an idea of the conditions needed for them.

Ryanbomber posted:

I'm still trying to figure out the rules behind Definite Human/Enemy, it seems to rarely come up (mostly uncontested claims day 1 and their results after that) but there was one game where Raqio just sort of popped off out of nowhere and assigned everyone an alignment and the game just sort of ended right there, and I didn't catch what caused them to do it

The ingame docs give some examples of situations where someone can be confirmed Human or Enemy. For example, if there are two engineer claims on day 1 and one of them gets killed in a game without any non-Gnosia enemy roles, then the other was obviously a fake. Or if the Doctor has reported 3 people as Gnosia and there are only 3 Gnosia in the game, you know the Doctor is fake because the game's not over yet. (Some characters are dumb enough to do this.)

To get into more complex situations, if there are 3 Gnosia, two Doctor claims, two Engineer claims, no non-Gnosia enemy roles, and the two Engineers each pick a different person as Gnosia, then everyone other than the Doctors, Engineers, and the two people the Engineers picked out is definitely human (because one of the doctors is Gnosia, one of the engineers is Gnosia, and the person the real engineer picked out is Gnosia).

GiantRockFromSpace posted:

The one thing I'm annoyed about it's the drat Shut Up mechanic, seems kinda random how much is too much (do skills even count?) and if the AI uses it welp everyone hates you have fun going to cold sleep. Not to mention it runs contrary to actual social deduction games where the most active people are the least likely to be scum. Is it related to a stat or do you need to use the wait option a bit more?

Increasing your Stealth makes people pay less attention to your actions, which increases the threshold before people start telling you to shut up. Stealth does a surprisingly large number of things.

Thuryl fucked around with this message at 22:33 on Mar 21, 2021

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


Yeah, looking at how characters interact with each other is especially helpful for specific people. Shigemichi has exactly one brain cell and it is permanently set to "defend my friends", so if he's confirmed Gnosia it tends to become super obvious who the others were. On the other hand, Raqio is smart and an rear end in a top hat so they'll happily throw their own allies under the bus as Gnosia.

Thuryl fucked around with this message at 22:38 on Mar 21, 2021

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


I find the game is a better experience if you don't get too invested in winning every round, and instead prioritize surviving as long as possible to see character events.

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


If you know Regret and use it when someone shuts you up, that's usually enough to save you, although you'd better actually shut up for a while afterwards. A few characters are talkative enough that you can sometimes use Shut Up on them as well.

Thuryl fucked around with this message at 01:07 on Mar 22, 2021

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


To be honest, I think the actual mafia game part is just okay even once you're good at it; the actions and dialogue get pretty repetitive. The main draw is the characters and story scenes.

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


Mr. Trampoline posted:

Feels really good when you get opportunities to use Don't Be Fooled and Don't Vote and they work. Feels even better when you dodge a freeze by Gnosia Yuriko gunning for you with a Grovel, and then coming back and voting her out the next day.

I had to use Don't Vote every day for like 3 days in a row on Raqio after they were outed as a confirmed enemy and I had to keep them alive for an event and it worked shockingly well. I'd kinda given up on that run but somehow people kept listening to me.

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


I can only assume that by "fairy girl" they mean Raqio, who is neither a fairy nor a girl but I can at least see how you could get there

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


Waltzing Along posted:

What is no evil roles?

No AC follower, no Bug.

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


The Shame Boy posted:

I was missing one of SQ's last infos and it's the one near the bottom that was labels a Gnosia. I had been spoiled about Gnosia SQ putting you in a collar if you both survive until the end but hadn't seen it myself yet so i figured that was it. But my Gnosia round justnow i accepted one of her requests to team up (she was doing it an awful lot) and...wow i didn't expect to have to try and keep only the 2 of us alive and it was surprisingly hard as i had Comet and Remnan as teammates, but it worked out and now i'm a bit sad :(


At least that explains why she was trying to partner up with me so much, i wonder how much sooner i could have gotten that one.

You can still get the data file if you survive with SQ after making a deal with her even if there are other survivors, but you get a slightly shorter version of the scene.

It's one of the harder scenes to get since you have to be Gnosia, SQ has to be crew, and she has to catch you in a lie, and she kinda sucks at catching lies.

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


Waltzing Along posted:

I must be near the end. I am not "full" yet. I only have 2 crew reports to fill. A Remnan and a Gina. They just aren't popping. My stats are high enough that I win every round but it's just more and more XP with no progress. I think it's like 15 games in a row with nothing. Sigh.

There's a guide here if you need it: https://www.halfstaratelier.com/gnos

Minimal story spoilers, but obviously there are spoilers for event triggers.

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


GiantRockFromSpace posted:

I doubt that. Yuriko is a fugitive from the group that cyberizes people, she probably wants nothing with the Gnosia unless infected, even if she dislikes being human. Her weird intuitions and powers are probably due to her knowing the process to cyberize people, so she's got real knowledge about conciousness (which is why she can respec your stats and delete your anti-sus defense).

I'm not sure about Manan being the origin of the Gnosia, the point is Gnosia!SQ is actually Manan's consciousness taking over her body. That said "true ending is how Kukrushka is created" is totally true, the Remanan/Kukrushka ending is her getting back Remnan as a slave and killing every witness. I think the trick is that the Silver Key does not take you to "another world" but to another timelineof the sorts, it's very implied norma New Game Setsu you meet at the start is the Normal Ending one so she never went into another world, she looped back to the start and brought your body so everything would be consistent. Meaning Kukrushka is very likely trapped in the Gnosia loop, except she's clearly a psycho unable to connect to others so she'll never fill the Key and be forever trapped in a Werewolf game for the rest of existance.


Fortunately, as Setsu points out, eternal youth is the only thing Manan seems to care about, so she may not mind that too much.

I never quite put the pieces together on why Kukrushka killed everyone and why it specifically had to be Remnan alive for that ending before this post. Thanks for that.

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


Haifisch posted:

Events where you have to keep a specific character unfrozen to the end with them as Gnosia are the loving worst. :negative:

The Don't Vote skill is really powerful for that situation (or for when playing on the side of the Gnosia in general). If people start to get suspicious of the person you need to protect, just use Don't Vote on them once at the start of every day and people will usually target someone else as long as there's any other reasonable target at all. I was able to protect Raqio for like three consecutive days after they were revealed as a Definite Enemy by doing that.

Thuryl fucked around with this message at 08:01 on Apr 1, 2021

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


There's another scene that kinda touches on that stuff with Setsu a little, too; I think it's the one where you learn Retaliate.

SQ thinks it's suspicious that you and Setsu have been spending so much time together, and Setsu quickly says that the two of you are lovers. SQ is like "wait, I thought you weren't even into sex" and Setsu replies "We have a spiritual connection". Afterwards, you and Setsu talk about it, they apologize for making up that story, and if you tell them you were glad to hear them say it, they get all smiley and blushy. Looking at Setsu's interactions with the MC as a whole, I felt it was pretty clear that Setsu feels a special emotional bond with you, even if what they're looking for isn't necessarily a conventional romantic relationship from the perspective of us here in 2021.

Thuryl fucked around with this message at 02:53 on Apr 2, 2021

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


Fedule posted:

Hah, I remembered there was a non-binary player but for some reason I thought it was Setsu. Guess it doesn't help that most of the dialogue by volume is written to meticulously avoid having to use pronouns.

You weren't wrong about that; Setsu and Raqio are both non-binary.

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


Jonas and SQ are two of the more annoying Gnosia to deal with just because they both do incredibly suspicious poo poo even when they're human.

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


cheetah7071 posted:

Where I'm at it feels like Yuriko is Gnosia and I'm not I basically just accept defeat. Maybe a lucky engineer push can get people hating her but most of the time whoever doubts her just gets frozen instantly

I'm level 70 but it still feels like I basically can't do anything so I don't know if the game is intended to scale to like level 300 or if I'm just crap at it

Character stats scale up as you unlock more information about them, so if you're advancing the story fast you'll start to have trouble keeping up. I finished the game with my level and loop count both somewhere in the 130s, I think, and that was with using a guide for the last few events.

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


Ryanbomber posted:

What to do with fakeclaimers depend on your and their stats - high Logic players might want to wait until they make a mistake to Definite Enemy them, high Charisma players can just bully them into getting iced, low Performance fakeclaimers you can wait for other characters to catch onto lies, etc. Unless they're super charismatic, you can usually let them live for a few days without worrying about people following their false reports.

Also, if Shigemichi fake-claims Engineer, he will immediately go around reporting all his Gnosia buddies as human, so if you keep him around for a couple of days you can sniff out who the other Gnosia are.

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


cheetah7071 posted:

You can't permanently miss anything

There are a couple of alternate versions of scenes that are missable (the biggest unavoidable one being whether you watch a movie or go fishing with Setsu), but nothing that will lock you out of finishing

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


Zyxyz posted:

Reviving this thread to share a project I've been working on lately: a spreadsheet of all the "generic" dialogue lines used for standard debates. The categories still need some fine-tuning (especially re. Doubt/Affirm Doubt, winning comments, and nighttime visits) and the format is a bit janky, but hopefully this still makes for an interesting enough resource?

Thanks for confirming that Yuriko does in fact have lines for all three kinds of small talk, even if you might never see them.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Thuryl
Mar 14, 2007

My postillion has been struck by lightning.


Dirk the Average posted:

If you do get intuition, the Say You're Human skill is really nice. It's less useful for actually catching people who are lying, and much more useful for following how people react to it. It does piss people off a fair bit though, so definitely keep your head down for a while afterwards.

Although it's worth keeping in mind that it's more useful on some characters than others; Yuriko in particular is a misanthropic jerk and will often refuse to participate even when she's human.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply