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Powered Descent
Jul 13, 2008

We haven't had that spirit here since 1969.

Lemniscate Blue posted:

The original theme song gets used in the miniseries as the Colonial national anthem. Made me giggle.

Also in Final Cut, and also in the series finale when the whole fleet flies into the sun.

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Milkfred E. Moore
Aug 27, 2006

'It's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism.'
Fragged is... interesting. It's the first episode where my buddy has said it didn't quite land for him, concerning Crashdown's whole thing. Which I kind of get. The Kobol stuff has suffered from something similar to Helo on Caprica where, because it's basically distracting us from the more interesting stuff in the Fleet, it's a little... barebones. It's still a solid episode, with Tigh spiraling, Roslin needing her meds, and Baltar taking a life. I think Crashdown's sudden turn is fine, but it doesn't feel as explored as it could be. I wonder how it goes if you're not as familiar with military best practice (eg. as the senior NCO, Crashdown should probably have given Tyrol command, or at least listened to him more than he did, but is a sign of how poorly Crash was suited for that incident.) That said, the whole frakked-up attack on the missile battery is a great bit of drama.

One thing I found myself wondering was about Kobol itself. One might think, based on the end of Season 1, that Kobol is a holy place. Baltar has an outright vision of the future in the opera house, for example, and one could maybe argue that Kobol is closer to the light of God than anywhere else. But then Head Six is telling him that God abandoned it and it's an awful place of murder, which feels like it could've been explored more than it was. It feels like it, plus the Crashdown death, are the first signs of the strength and weakness of Battlestar's writing: it always shoots for cool drama but doesn't really think ahead too much. A pretty minor quibble, but one that stuck out to me.

Powered Descent
Jul 13, 2008

We haven't had that spirit here since 1969.

Milkfred E. Moore posted:

(eg. as the senior NCO, Crashdown should probably have given Tyrol command, or at least listened to him more than he did, but is a sign of how poorly Crash was suited for that incident.)

A recurring theme of Season 2 is "the person in charge really shouldn't be in charge" -- consider Tigh, Crashdown, Cain, Baltar.

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Look deep within your shell
Tigh did alright, all things considered, but using Marines to break up riots when he declared martial law was a screw up for sure.

feedmegin
Jul 30, 2008

Mister Speaker posted:

They're also in Razor, and if I'm not mistaken there are some Centurions in S4 as well, fighting inside either the Colony or the Resurrection Hub.

I didn't see Blood and Chrome, was it any good?

I thought it was decent but I'm easily pleased:)

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Look deep within your shell
The thing I remember most about Blood and Chrome is that there's a Deep Space Nine reference in there because it was written by Michael Taylor. It's funny how so much of BSG is written as an angry response to how hamstrung the writers room was working on Star Trek shows. It's like the anti Voyager.

bobthenameless
Jun 20, 2005

Mister Speaker posted:

They're also in Razor, and if I'm not mistaken there are some Centurions in S4 as well, fighting inside either the Colony or the Resurrection Hub.

I didn't see Blood and Chrome, was it any good?

if you want some husker lore its worth watching, but ymmv for good. it was interesting to me at the time but i remember it being a slow burn and cheesy production wise. this was a lot of years ago, and i still remember liking it but i did forget all about it for a long time compared to the show and razor

Neorxenawang
Jun 9, 2003

Arc Hammer posted:

The thing I remember most about Blood and Chrome is that there's a Deep Space Nine reference in there because it was written by Michael Taylor. It's funny how so much of BSG is written as an angry response to how hamstrung the writers room was working on Star Trek shows. It's like the anti Voyager.

What was the reference? I haven't seen it since it was released, and I don't think I noticed it at the time.

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Look deep within your shell

Neorxenawang posted:

What was the reference? I haven't seen it since it was released, and I don't think I noticed it at the time.

Michael Taylor wrote the DS9 episode "The Visitor" in which we see an alternate future where Jake Sisko has grown old and become a famous author who wrote a bestselling novel called Anslem. In Blood and Chrome there's a point when Adama links up with the Ghost Fleet and one of the pilots aboard Galactica loudly celebrates the birth of his son, who he calls Anslem.

RoboChrist 9000
Dec 14, 2006

Mater Dolorosa

Arc Hammer posted:

It's like the anti Voyager.

I mean, basically. Much like how SquareSoft's classic video game Parasite Eve really is only tangentially related to the novel or film of the same name and its plot is actually an adaptation of an early unused draft for what became Final Fantasy 7, I would argue that Battlestar Galactica is at least as much of a reimagining of Voyager as it is of the original eponym, at least and especially for the first three seasons. Like Adama more or less explicitly says as much in that original miniseries where he pitches the bit about how it's not enough for humanity to be able to be saved, humanity must be worth saving.

"A (more or less) lone ship is lost in the wilderness and surrounded by enemies. What must they do to survive? What will they do to survive? What profit a man if he survives at the cost of his soul?"

Like the population count at the start of each episode is something I'm pretty sure is just a direct response to this nonsense.

Milkfred E. Moore
Aug 27, 2006

'It's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism.'
Resistance is a fun setup kind of episode. Not just for the plot for Roslin taking a chunk of the fleet to Kobol, but Lee and Dualla have some nice chemistry that had to be the seed for their later romance. That said, Billy's refusal t continue on with Roslin is very abrupt, and I figure that's related to him shooting for other shows or something. Tigh's immediate apology and admission to Adama upon his return is a great choice to help restore some sympathy, and the way Adama practically collapses once it's just him and Tigh around is some great acting from Olmos. It is very interesting that after being unable to engage the metal Cylons, Cally had no problem shooting Boomer dead. I also caught that Tyrol says he served on the Pegasus which adds a fun irony to the events of that same episode, although I don't think anyone ever mentions it directly.

The Farm, meanwhile, is weird. My pal and I basically finished it, turned to each other and went, "Okay, what was going on with this one? That was weird, right?" Every aspect of the episode feels underdeveloped or just, well, weird. The solid parts are everything with Olmos, who portrays a man caught between rage, despair, and the simple struggle of remaining on his feet with remarkable flair. The scene with him breaking down over Boomer's corpse is extremely memorable. But the rest of it?

First, the time-frame feels off. It feels like we're picking up the morning after Anders and Starbuck have that pyramid game... except it's been a week. The scene of Starbuck getting shot is oddly mirrored. It is also odd how she knows the intricacies of a Heavy Raider when Lee, Hot Dog, and seemingly the Galactica crew themselves, had no idea ("What is that thing?!" "I don't know! But whatever it is..." Lee's tactics seemingly imply he is unaware of its capabilities, too.) Speaking of Raiders, what happened to the one Sharon flew off in? It feels odd that the resolution to that is just... she walks up and joins Anders' group. Where did it end up?

(It also doesn't feel like Adama has been on his feet for a week, as indicated by Gaeta. They spent seven days not hunting down the President? It's taken the Quorum a week to deliberate on supporting her? A week for Adama to talk to Tyrol about Cally shooting Boomer? I really don't see why they mentioned that week. It was like a line they put in to justify 'she could be anywhere, quarantine the ships one by one' but... surely a day or two would be enough?)

Starbuck in the hospital is likewise a bit off. Simon is a great presence, but it feels a bit too convenient that he slips up and calls her Starbuck, and a little odd that you could almost think Starbuck doesn't catch it immediately. Sue-Shaun being also there is a bit... well, yeah, okay. We've barely seen her. Then Starbuck smashes a machine and kills all the women, and I'm guessing whatever plan they had with the props wasn't something they were quite able to realize. I also feel like the "procreation is one of God's commandments" part of it is a little... simplistic, and almost betrays the idea of the Cylons as posthuman which the series had been playing with. It's also hard to imagine sympathy for them, now that their atrocities are more mundane. I suspect the 'farms' are one of the missteps in Battlestar's treatment of the Cylons. And the plot also reveals that Anders is alive a little early, I think.

And what's with Baltar's attitude when he's there in the CIC, applauding Adama? He seems like he's about to start cussing him out, like he's at a party for someone he hates. Sure, Baltar is a bit weird and he's a bit messed up since shooting Crashdown, but it's just, well, obviously weird.

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Look deep within your shell

Milkfred E. Moore posted:

Speaking of Raiders, what happened to the one Sharon flew off in? It feels odd that the resolution to that is just... she walks up and joins Anders' group. Where did it end up?

It's heavily implied that the Raider Starbuck commandeers becomes that one nicknamed Scar in the later episode.

Mister Speaker
May 8, 2007

Arc Hammer posted:

It's heavily implied that the Raider Starbuck commandeers becomes that one nicknamed Scar in the later episode.

Is it? I never caught this.

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Look deep within your shell

Mister Speaker posted:

Is it? I never caught this.

The Previously On segment for Scar features a lot of flashback scenes to when Starbuck crash landed on the dust moon in Season 1 during You Can't Go Home Again, where she encountered the downed raider, and then in the episode itself Sharon explains to her that Raiders also resurrect (but now that their resurrection ship is gone they've switched to hit and run tactics). The Raider airframe the Colonials hollowed out for Starbuck ti fly back to Caprica was little more than a corpse and it's likely Scar had already been downloaded into a new frame, complete with some pretty angry memories and a vendetta against the Fleet.

Arc Hammer fucked around with this message at 18:29 on Nov 2, 2025

Mister Speaker
May 8, 2007

Arc Hammer posted:

The Previously On segment for Scar features a lot of flashback scenes to when Starbuck crash landed on the dust moon in Season 1 during You Can't Go Home Again, where she encountered the downed raider, and then in the episode itself Sharon explains to her that Raiders also resurrect (but now that their resurrection ship is gone they've switched to hit and run tactics). The Raider airframe the Colonials hollowed out for Starbuck ti fly back to Caprica was little more than a corpse and it's likely Scar had already been downloaded into a new frame, complete with some pretty angry memories and a vendetta against the Fleet.

I mean, sure, but I never read it that way; IMO the Previously On segment just reminds the audience that the raiders are basically living, thinking creatures, and any raider killed and downloaded enough times would probably hold a grudge. I think it'd be cool if they made that connection explicit but to me it's a bit tenuous a connection.

wizardofloneliness
Dec 30, 2008

Milkfred E. Moore posted:

(Maybe not quite in the way they originally planned, where Baltar walked into the Opera House and met Dirk Benedict as God and heard Jimi Hendrix playing -- but, like, maybe closer to that than the Final Five.)

This has always been one of those crazy ideas where the more I think about it the more I kind of wish they had done it. Had it been canceled, which I’m assuming it would have if they actually did this, it would’ve been one of the greatest “what the gently caress?” endings of all time. And if by some miracle it wasn’t canceled, who knows where the gently caress it would have led. I always liked the weirdo religious stuff they had going on and while the finale left a lot to be desired in that regard and a bunch of other things, I always sort of wished RDM had just laid all his insane cards on the table at this point instead of waiting until the finale.

Honestly, the only part that really gives me pause about this is involving Dirk Benedict in the show.

Milkfred E. Moore
Aug 27, 2006

'It's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism.'

Arc Hammer posted:

It's heavily implied that the Raider Starbuck commandeers becomes that one nicknamed Scar in the later episode.

Sure, and that's a fun little callback, but it's just odd that "Sharon steals the Raider, stranding Kara and Helo on Caprica" gets tied off with "Sharon shows up one week later, joins back up with Helo, knows about the farms" with no indication of what happened to her and the Raider. It was a very dramatic moment (did Sharon steal it to escape Kara, or did she steal it to betray Helo? Or both? Neither?) and the Raider was a prominent part of the first season.

wizardofloneliness posted:

This has always been one of those crazy ideas where the more I think about it the more I kind of wish they had done it. Had it been canceled, which I’m assuming it would have if they actually did this, it would’ve been one of the greatest “what the gently caress?” endings of all time. And if by some miracle it wasn’t canceled, who knows where the gently caress it would have led. I always liked the weirdo religious stuff they had going on and while the finale left a lot to be desired in that regard and a bunch of other things, I always sort of wished RDM had just laid all his insane cards on the table at this point instead of waiting until the finale.

Honestly, the only part that really gives me pause about this is involving Dirk Benedict in the show.

There's a part of me that feels like that really was the way Season 1 was leading, but the pivot to what we got is part of the reason Season 2 feels not as neat and tidy as Season 1 did (so far, at least.) There's something different about it which I can't quite put my finger on.

McSpanky
Jan 16, 2005






There's no plan, which often leads to wild and urgent rising actions because anything goes, but then falters when it comes time to follow through because now you have to make a meal out of your table full of ice cream and crab cakes. That's the vibe you're sensing.

Milkfred E. Moore
Aug 27, 2006

'It's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism.'

McSpanky posted:

There's no plan, which often leads to wild and urgent rising actions because anything goes, but then falters when it comes time to follow through because now you have to make a meal out of your table full of ice cream and crab cakes. That's the vibe you're sensing.

Probably, yeah. Season 1 also had very self-contained episodes where a few continuity hooks, whereas Season 2 is shifting to a more standard/modern style of serialized storytelling.

That said! Home, Part 1 and Home, Part 2 are very good. The general plot is strong, but the character interactions are the highlight -- Lee pulling a gun on Sharon, Roslin going to space her, Lee telling Kara he loves her and her teasing him, Zarak in general, Dee getting through to Adama... And that's just the stuff in the first part!

But the real shining element of the two-parter is Baltar and Head Six. The way that Baltar makes some joke about Starbuck having their child, only for Six to take on her appearance -- except it's not Katee Sackhoff but Tricia Helfer who feels like she's playing 'Six pretending to be Starbuck' is inspired. The teasing contempt that Helfer gives Six, as if she's been pranking him the whole time... And Callis playing Baltar with the sudden existential horror of not actually being chosen by God but just being psychotic is wonderful. As is the whole ending, the sudden fear Baltar displays when he realizes that, yes, Six might just be a literal representative of a higher power.

I don't think I've said much about Mary McDonnell yet, but she's fantastic, too. Her ability to switch between kindly schoolteacher and the coldest politician you'll ever meet is really something. She's great throughout the whole show.

The Tomb of Athena bit is very memorable, and it's a really interesting thing to have the map be glimpsed from the perspective of Earth. The Kobol stuff is good, and Zarek gets some more time to show he's not a simple character. Adama's intense attempt to murder Sharon being averted by his heart (symbolism!) is quite fun, too.

That said, and this may not be surprising, I don't like the direction the show took with Kobol. I think it's easy to see why people had an issue with the ending of the show because it feels like it really is deciding to step back from the mysticism and shoot for some 'there's always a mundane explanation' form of intrigue (even if this is the same episode that reaffirms that Six is an angel.) A return to Kobol must be paid with blood, Elosha says. And it turns out this is because there just-so-happen to be Centurions over looking the path and they had mined the place and, so, Elosha dies. And it's like... fine? It's an okay action sequence. But I think we saw it better and more interesting with Baltar shooting Crashdown, and it would have been just as interesting had it been more like...

Well, just spitballing another idea. Instead of Elosha getting blown up in Part 1 and Zarek's thugs getting shot in Part 2, combine it into one event. They reach the tomb. Everyone starts shooting. Zarek shoots his buddy, but not before he gets a shot off at Roslin or Lee -- which strikes Elosha instead. It centers the human drama a little more and plays up that aspect of there being a divine element who is a bit of monster, in much the same way that Six died to protect Baltar. The faithful may be chosen but they may also be a scapegoat.

But that said, Elosha dying early and Roslin carrying around her burnt holy book is great, so, hey. It's just convenient that there's four Cylon Centurions overlooking the path and, I guess, figured the colonials would come down the path at some point. Maybe if they'd been older, rusted Centurions or something. Set up that idea that this story has been a long time in the telling. Sharon knowing a bit more about the history of Kobol is fine, but I feel like it's conflating Leoben's transcendental connection with, again, that sort of mundanity. But I think it's generally intriguing enough to make you wonder what Kobol was, especially with what Six said about it being a place of death.

Basically, I think BSG is interesting in the first season because it feels like a gritty military sci-fi that also has this weird, mystical element running through it. Blue Planet: War in Heaven is very similar in tone. But I think BSG Season 2 is leaning harder into the gritty military aspect, hence that vibe of the scriptures' price in blood is actually a Cylon ambush.

Milkfred E. Moore
Aug 27, 2006

'It's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism.'
Oh, and the little bit where Gaeta says they shouldn't jump Galactica into Kobol's atmosphere. Great pay off coming in the third season to that.

Milkfred E. Moore
Aug 27, 2006

'It's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism.'
Final Cut -- Final Cut is a neat little episode; I always enjoy those 'news crew' episodes that feel like a sci-fi genre trope. I especially enjoyed how it gives some of the secondary cast members (Juliani and McClure in particular) an opportunity to shine during the interview segments. D'Anna being a Cylon is a good reveal. Not too much to say about it, overall.

Flight of the Phoenix -- A nice 'breather' episode (pun not intended) with some good character beats, much like Final Cut. That said, the bit with Sharon plugging a cable into her arm and managing a connection is something that you'd assume would be really helpful to detecting Cylons in some way (likewise the visceral reaction Sharon has to the printed-out code.) There's also something interesting in how Tyrol, who is all enraged because of the reveal about Boomer, suddenly creates another machine (the Blackbird) out of a need to deal with that angst. All of this has happened before, and all of this has happened again...

Pegasus -- What is there to say about this episode? From beginning to end, it's a horrifically tense dream that you know is going to twist into a nightmare -- but when? Made all the worse that every so often, it seems like it's going to turn out well. Michelle Forbes is fantastic as Cain. She is a sharp, dangerous woman who wastes no time in establishing her idea of order. Her double-take when being told there's a President aboard Galactica tells you so much. The contrast between Adama's soft 'sitcom crew' and the disciplined Pegasus hardasses is really effective. Fisk's story about her shooting her XO which he then covers by laughing, and how Tigh immediately goes to Adama with it, who is now this cowed, pathetic figure, chained to Admiral Cain... It's so good. And then Baltar and the prisoner, the rape of Sharon by Thorne, and the imminent confrontation between the two battlestars -- goddamn.

I've only ever seen the extended/DVD version of Pegasus. Which, I should point out, is not the version offered by Amazon. It's clear that the extended version is the one the audience is intended to see. The biggest change is that Thorne is killed before being able to rape Sharon, and the shot they insert to clarify that he still has his pants on as Tyrol and Helo reach the cell is so blunt as to be almost comical. Whether fiction should use rape as drama at all is a big topic, but I think BSG handles it about as well as one could expect a fictional TV show to: it's a horrific violation that is in no way titillating (hello, Game of Thrones.) It helps, too, that members of the cast like Park and McDonnell argued for that version to stress the awfulness of it which, alongside the 'frat party'-esque behavior from the Pegasus crew just before it, makes it quite a powerful scene.

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Look deep within your shell
The episode arc between Pegasus and Resurrection Ship is imo the absolute peak of the show. You've got the underlying tension of humanity vs itself flaring into open conflict while the ever-present threat of the Cylons is patiently waiting on the sidelines. You've got fantastic music, extreme tension, and one of the best action scenes in the show where Pegasus and Galactica get into a standoff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RM04c8EI0wc

The scene where they immediately break off their dogfight to form up on an incoming bogey is incredibly.

Milkfred E. Moore
Aug 27, 2006

'It's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism.'

Arc Hammer posted:

The episode arc between Pegasus and Resurrection Ship is imo the absolute peak of the show. You've got the underlying tension of humanity vs itself flaring into open conflict while the ever-present threat of the Cylons is patiently waiting on the sidelines. You've got fantastic music, extreme tension, and one of the best action scenes in the show where Pegasus and Galactica get into a standoff.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RM04c8EI0wc

The scene where they immediately break off their dogfight to form up on an incoming bogey is incredibly.

Yeah, totally. One of the most memorable shots of the show.

You can also appreciate how Pegasus is facing her broadside to Galactica throughout the standoff, when her firepower is much more forward-oriented. A sign that perhaps Cain wasn't quite willing to go straight for the throat. But yes, I agree, I think this three episode-arc is the absolute peak.

One thing I've also been impressed by is the improvisation allowed by the cast. Before starting this rewatch, I saw a clip from Sackhoff's podcast where she's talking with Bamber and they're both griping (playfully) about how Olmos told them that Battlestar was the best thing they'd ever work on and how dare that old man tell them that when they're just starting their careers -- well, they say, Eddie was right. They talk about how they got a ton of freedom to define their characters and such on BSG, which they've not had in recent productions. So, I've been interested to see what gets improvised.

We all know that Adama kissing Roslin was improvised. But it appears that a lot of Lee and Starbuck's interactions were, too. Lee kissing her when she returns from Caprica was improvised, and their 'I love you' conversation was ad-libbed. The bit where Lee and Starbuck team up to hold the gun together in Flight of the Blackbird was their idea. And it wasn't just them -- Sharon pulling the blanket over herself was all Grace Park, too. The interview segments for Gaeta, Dee, and Racetrack were likewise given to the actors (which might be why Gaeta's one is so memorably funny.) It feels like a big reason BSG was such a strong production is because the writers were willing to let the cast take the reins a little, and the cast were sure enough in their characters to know how to pull things off.

Milkfred E. Moore
Aug 27, 2006

'It's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of capitalism.'
Resurrection Ship 1 and 2 -- Again, like Pegasus, what is there to say? The opening is great. The discussion that Roslin mediates is great, as is Roslin's push to kill Cain. From beginning to end the two-parter is fantastic, and it includes what I think is the most memorable scene transition in the whole series, when it goes from Sharon's, "Maybe you don't," and into the battle sequence. Which is still not only the best looking battle in the show, but definitely one of the best in sci-fi.

It's interesting to me how much the two-parter deals with mortality. The main plot is about reducing the Cylons to mortals -- more on that in a second -- but the rest of the episode deals with it, too. You've got Adama staring at his surgical scar, Lee letting go of everything, Gina electing to die, and the mutual assassination plot where one plausible ending is that everyone dies. And, of course, the soft goodbye kiss from Adama to Roslin.

Other random thoughts...

In some ways, I think Resurrection Ship is another of those episodes that depicts a story that Battlestar won't quite commit to telling. The usage of Bloodshed as the Vipers take out the titular ship means it is framed as a point of comparison to the other usages of that track, such as the moment Boomer shoots Adama. Is it a good thing to reduce the Cylons to mortals? Even after everything? Some part of Battlestar goes, "Maybe not." Even if God sends his angels to punish you, there's some terrible beauty that is lost if you cut off their wings and reduce them to the level of humankind.

(The Resurrection Hub is a really bad idea, ultimately, too. The Resurrection Ship is very obviously a one-of-a-kind vessel built to support the attack on the Colonies. Just look at it! It's a sort of skeletal cathedral: yeah, this is important, but we don't expect it to do much.)

Alongside that metaphysical aspect, the shot of Lee in the river obviously ties back to Leoben's comments. That Lee collides with the Raptor because he's looking back and not forwards is a pretty on-the-nose character beat, too. On one hand, I can see why Lee gets so emotionally wounded by the Roslin-Adama assassination play, but on the other, I feel like he'd be down with the elimination of Cain especially if they were both in favor. He's not a blind adherent to the chain of command, and other times in the series he displays some real pragmatic thought. Like, he drew a gun on Tigh because his father was about to depose Roslin -- does he really think Cain would be good for the fleet?

It's also interesting that we see a divide between Gina, a devout Cylon, and Head Six, an Angel who is seemingly on the side of the Cylons. God won't forgive the loss of the resurrection ship versus that he forgives everything. Head Six is incensed that the side God picked is about to get kicked in the teeth, and despairs as Baltar forsakes her for the prisoner who she happens to resemble. You probably wouldn't want Battlestar to go down the path of, like, 'they team up and defy/kill God' or something, but it's a very intriguing aspect of the episode's more mystical aspects here.

Cain is a great character. She dominates every scene she's in. It's her way or the highway. It's easy to see how she inspires that dread loyalty, but the small moments where you see the woman behind the Admiral are really impressive, too. The little smile when they take out the ship, the sudden fear before Gina pulls the trigger. And I think, despite Roslin's belief that Cain is irredeemable, there might've been a way for Cain to integrate with the fleet. After all, she doesn't go through with her plan. In some ways, killing her is too neat and tidy, but on the other hand, it's a bit like shooting every future episode with a lioness in the room and you kind of need Cain out of the way.

It's interesting that they chose to depict Cain as a lesbian in Razor, because I can't say -- even knowing what I know from Razor -- that she gives off any kind of idea that she once was in a relationship with Gina in the two-parter. But it does add an interesting wrinkle to her admiration and meeting with Starbuck near the start of Part 1.

Fisk is a likewise strong character, and it's a shame what the series does with him. Graham Beckel plays him so well. He's this guy who clearly agrees with Cain on about nine-tenths of things, but that last tenth is eating him up inside.

It's... something that Adama only has started calling Sharon she and her after she was attacked by Thorne. I think there's a few feminist philosophers who'd have something to say about that!

It's interesting to wonder about why Cain didn't go through with her plan. I figure there's two really obvious possibilities. The first is that she saw what they could achieve if they worked together and, so, perhaps softened. The other is that she guessed what Adama had Starbuck there to do and understood that he had the opportunity to shoot first, and didn't. It could also be both, or neither.

Just fantastic stuff. But I think from where on in we start hitting some rough patches. Epiphanies, Black Market, etc. It'll be interesting to see what my blind watcher thinks, because he's basically been enthralled so far.

Speaking of Black Market, though. I asked my wife what she recalls of Battlestar after not having seen it in about ten years, and she said: "There's a ship called Galactica and they're looking for a planet like Earth. Commander Adama commands the ship, has a thing with the President, and he has a son named... Young Adama. And Gaius Baltar... is on the ship as well. Some people maybe know the Cylons look human, or maybe not. The engineering crew keep having romance drama and it's boring. At some point, Captain Pegasus shows up but she's mean and then she goes away. Also, Young Adama had a girlfriend who he left behind during the attack, and that's messed him up really badly, and he shoots some guy over it." And about then I started laughing like, wait, of everything you recall, the clearest thing is a passable synopsis of the worst episode of the series?

Cain: "I must go now, the Colonies need me." Note: Admiral Cain died on the way back to Caprica.

Carbolic
Apr 19, 2007

This song is about how America chews the working man up and spits him in the dirt to die
The scene where Adama and Cain are each giving orders to have the other killed is a masterpiece imo. The Pegasus-Resurrection Ship arc feels like the high point of the entire show.

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Look deep within your shell
Pegasus is one hell of a ship but it has the dinkiest little CIC that's the size of a conference room and any time the ship goes into combat the glass pane windows break. I get that there probably wasn't a budget to make a full sized CIC akin to Galactica's but it's rather hilarious just how few sets were actually made for Pegasus herself.

"How do we make it look more frantic?"

"I don't know, have some background extras go jogging along the hallway set behind the CIC."

Powered Descent
Jul 13, 2008

We haven't had that spirit here since 1969.

Arc Hammer posted:

Pegasus is one hell of a ship but it has the dinkiest little CIC that's the size of a conference room and any time the ship goes into combat the glass pane windows break. I get that there probably wasn't a budget to make a full sized CIC akin to Galactica's but it's rather hilarious just how few sets were actually made for Pegasus herself.

"How do we make it look more frantic?"

"I don't know, have some background extras go jogging along the hallway set behind the CIC."

If I remember right, all the Pegasus sets were originally built for a pilot episode for some other sci-fi show. When that pilot didn't get picked up, the BSG production bought their sets for super cheap. Then they put up some big Battlestar Pegasus emblems on the walls of the most interesting-looking room and called it the CIC. Boom, whole other spaceship to shoot scenes in.

Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

this is me posting irl
It was a Lost in Space pilot. My recollection is that if that set hadn't become available, BSG probably wouldn't have been able to afford doing Pegasus at all.

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Look deep within your shell
Is the show actually streaming anywhere or just for purchase? I don't even know if Canada gets Peacock but the only Galactica shows streaming on Prime are the original 1978 series and Caprica.

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Open Source Idiom
Jan 4, 2013
Does anyone know where I can track down a copy of Admiral Cain Eats Kittens? IIRC it was a shitpost silent movie that was included in some of the US versions of the DVDs. I watched it once on YouTube but it doesn't seem to be there anymore.

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