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Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

~this is me posting irl~


My recollection is that the 1978 BSG producers got screwed by the network, because they went into the project thinking they were going to do a series of made-for-TV movies at a rate of one a month or so - which would have been far more feasible with late-70s technology - and then ABC turned around and said "that was great, we're ordering a full season of weekly episodes!" and left them scrambling for both scripts and opticals.

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Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

~this is me posting irl~


Arcsquad12 posted:

Blood and Chrome had more staying power than Caprica and it didn't even get a full series.

I remember hearing a big part of that was SyFy expecting mostly/all-CGI sets to save them a bunch of money, and then being rudely surprised to find out that it didn't actually save them much money at all.

Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

~this is me posting irl~


The bigger gripe I have with how BSG2003 turned in the third season was in how it abandoned the promise that it wasn't going to hit the reset button, that they weren't going to handwave away consequences for the sake of getting back to the format. My favorite example is the fuckin' "resurrection virus" plot line.

For those who don't remember: basically, there's a Cylon Basestar that's drifting in space because it found an artifact floating in space (that is allegedly tied to the 13th colony) and it made them sick with a virus... and the virus could be transmitted via the resurrection technology they use!

There's a bit where the Cylons that have Baltar find it and then run off, but the juicy part is where the Colonials find it, figure out what's going on, and then decide to use the resurrection virus to strike a blow against the Cylons. They're going to go bait the Cylons into a battle, where presumably they'll be in range of a Resurrection Ship, then kill the infected Cylons (thus transmitting the virus into the resurrection ship, and hopefully the entire Cylon network) and then jump away.

Big hero chisel-jawed Helo has a problem with this, he thinks it ain't right, so after the Galactica jumps into what they hope will soon be the combat area, he sabotages the life support for the holding cell the infected Cylons are in, killing them before the Cylon fleet jumps in and spoiling the plan. This works because for some reason, instead of having people with guns in the cell waiting to execute the prisoners the instant the Cylon fleet arrives, the marines (led be Apollo) have to walk across half the drat ship to get there after CIC calls to say "hey, we just spotted the fleet, go kill 'em," so nobody notices the Cylons asphyxiating until it's too late.

Meanwhile a big glitzy space battle is erupting outside - including the use of missile racks on the Raptors, which I don't think had ever been seen previously - and somehow none of the Vipers or Raptors are getting splashed. Apollo realizes the plan is hosed, they abort the battle and jump away. Adama and Helo and... Roslin and Apollo, I think? have a meeting where nobody's happy but no consequences are handed out for directly sabotaging a military operation explicitly ordered and authorized by the President.

Like, they could have tried softening it a little, maybe have it so that the operation wasn't strictly authorized after all or something like that, but no, there was a whole song and dance where President Roslin formally ordered Admiral Adama to use the infected Cylon prisoners to conduct biological warfare against the Cylons.



The whole thing just reeks of the producers getting cold feet and deciding they don't want to carry through the infected Cylon plot line after all. But also, oh no, we can't have anything bad happen to Helo, because he's their favorite i dunno they had plans for him or something? It was just ludicrously contrived to make his betrayal as consequence-free as possible, from the marines having to walk across the ship (so that no humans got asphyxiated as well), to seemingly not taking any casualties at all during a pitched fire fight with the Cylon fleet. I used to wonder if one of the producers went on vacation before the plot line went into production, then came back and saw the episodes coming down the pipeline and pitched a huge fit over it.



And then there was the loving magical half-breed Cylon baby blood that cures cancer... or at least puts it into remission for just long enough for Mary McDonnell to finish out the show.

Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

~this is me posting irl~


Someone else also once pointed out how, during the two (three?) parter where there's a map room on an algae planet and a star that winds up going nova, Cavil ends one episode going "gently caress it, we're immortal machines, we don't need a map, we can just spend the next ten thousand years visiting literally every star system in this loving galaxy if we have to" and then starts the next episode going "ooh, gee, that map's pretty important, we'd better not risk them nuking the planet..."

Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

~this is me posting irl~


Arcsquad12 posted:

Maybe the piano episode? I honestly barely remember season 4 it's such a blur of stupid. Maybe the episode where they killed Cally so Nicki Clyne could leave the show to go join the NXIVM sex cult.

Is that really why? I just assumed the producers killed her off because they were bored with her.


That show sure loved depicting violence against women. How many times did they show some dude choking a woman out? And there was that weird pregnancy center the Cylons setup on occupied Caprica. And there was the "we need to ban abortion because we gotta start pumping out kids" (in a closed environment that already struggles to provide for the existing population) episode, which was one of those things Ron Moore brought over from his Voyager critique.

Farmer Crack-Ass fucked around with this message at 06:35 on May 10, 2021

Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

~this is me posting irl~


I've said it elsewhere but between BSG, and the way some of the female Trek characters got written out (K'ehlar being brutally murdered because Ron Moore thought it would be a nice gut punch, Moore being all pissy over Jadzia Dax's death in an interview because he thought that her reaching for her phaser before Dukat kills her was too cliche), I'm kinda suspicious of Ron Moore.

Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

~this is me posting irl~


Gene Roddenberry and Majel Barrett stayed together too.

Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

~this is me posting irl~


sean10mm posted:

I haven't watched this in forever, which seasons are actually good and is there a good cut off in the narrative before the final, dogshit ending?

There's different opinions on this, some people think it's great right up until just before the end, some people think shortly after New Caprica is about where to drop it. Sanguinia made a great post about the thematic/arc quality plunging after the Resurrection Ship arc, which is a really interesting take I haven't seen before.

With this show I think it's probably a safe bet to just watch until you don't want to any more.

Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

~this is me posting irl~


Arcsquad12 posted:

The rest of the show basically drops any concerns about supplies or stress or any of the compelling issues about a fleet of refugees stretched to its limits and dives headlong into character drama and shocking reveals for the rest of the runtime. It peaks with the mutiny arc and then it's all downhill.

I think the article's probably been lost to the sands of time, but I remember reading back in the late 2000s on some website an interview with one (some?) of the show writers, and they said that at some point when they were struggling to make sense of the knots they had tied over the years, Ron Moore had a minor tantrum in the writers' room and basically said "gently caress it, we can just write whatever anyway, it's all about the characters!"

I think that happened during the fourth season production run but I'm not certain. It's been a long time.

Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

~this is me posting irl~


Sanguinia posted:

Roslin is absolutely an uncaring monster in this episode, which is par for the course for her in the second half of the show sadly. What the heck happened with her writing?

I think it was supposed to be some subversive "oooh, you thought she was some weak liberal teacher, but in fact she's got the biggest balls in the fleet!" kind of thing.


That said it was still funny when Apollo got really mad about the plot to kill Cain and basically said "well I'm gonna go see what mommy has to say about this!" and Adama says "that's cool, it was her idea anyway" and Apollo's face just slid to the floor.

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Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

~this is me posting irl~


Zesty posted:

BSG2003 is clumsy and tiresome on it's own, but SO MUCH MORE SO that seemingly every Sci-Fi show since is desperate to replicate it.

Maybe there were past shows that did it but I feel like another legacy of BSG2003 is the willingness to say "this person who looks totally normal? yeah they're actually robots that can outperform mere mortal flesh humans in every way. oh and they're also totally undetectable even under intense examination"


like, when BSG did it, there was that whole "oh NO are there secret terrorists hiding among us? any one of us could be secret traitors! they might not even know it!!" angle being played

but when following series do it, like Star Trek Picard, it just comes across as incredibly lazy and/or cheap "oh look we don't have to pay extra for special makeup"

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