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Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


Alright thread. It's time to talk about overpowered abilities. You know the ones. They can make or break a run. You get three Thieves and despair and then roll a Samurai and go "lol guess I'm throwing money at everything".

But what if you didn't? There's jobs that have so much to offer that have stuff that never gets appreciated. Maybe it's time to take a new look at some of them, and cast your mind back to when you were young and didn't know about the internet letting you know what was really good or not.

Thus, here's my :toxx:: $1, up to $20, for any instance of the following, with a comment (your choice as to the length) on how you thought it changed the game:

-Samurai without using !Zeninage.
-Chemist without using !Mix.
-Ranger without using !Rapid Fire (the menu command. Hayate Bow is fine).
-Red Mage without using !Dualcast.
-A write-in of your choice where a defining or powerful ability for the job is left unused. I just mention those four above because you're not defaulting to a bad Freelancer if you hold back. I'll accept any good faith effort on this, in case you want to do a Bard without !Sing or something for whatever reason.

These do add up, if you wanted to do multiple in one run, but if you don't want to give up !Dualcast on your one Red Mage in a sea of money-hoarding Samurai I won't judge (but those three Samurai would each count).

Anyway, the intent here is to just appreciate other abilities on offer, with a slight incentive to do so. Having done all of those myself, I think you'll be surprised as what you find when you take the power off the table (hint: Chemist? Still busted).

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Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


Empress Brosephine posted:

What about outside of fiesta rules also

The strongest jobs relative to the amount of effort and knowledge needed to make them so would be, in my opinion, Mystic Knight, Samurai, Ninja, White Mage, Black Mage, and Time Mage. Just buy stuff from stores and press buttons.

If you want the true best at everything stuff? That's more complicated and depends on where in the game you're at.

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


W.T. Fits posted:


Thief: Artful Dodger is really your only option here, mostly due to the fact that all the other passives are redundant by virtue of already having a thief in your party. Artful Dodger doesn't really do anything except give your Berserker the same Agility score as a Thief, which is arguably more useful in the versions where the ATB for Berserkers isn't buggy, but there are still plenty of better options out there.

Artful Dodger is actually a much bigger boost than it seems like. I forget the numbers offhand but it works out to be somewhere around a 20-30% boost to turns taken. Go stick it on a Berserker with a Cursed Ring and count the Death Sentence ticks and see for yourself.

Otherwise, I will second: A Brave Blade Berserker is wonderful.

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


Everyone would adore the Anthology version of it weren't for the load times.

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


FeyerbrandX posted:

And the dummy targets on NED. I'd love for someone to patch the PSX enemy names into GBA.

That's a thing on all non-Matrix versions, isn't it?

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


subujun posted:

So, I hit probably the biggest wall, besides NED, with Twintania. Coral ring deals with the tidal counters but not the Mind Blast. Reflect ring will work on that but then I just get waved to death. After the paralyze wears off I get blasted away from his charged form. Currently hitting level 40 and just barely reaching 3000 hp. I feel like I need to exceed 4000 hp to death sickle/assassin blade him after he blasts me. Does anyone know what level I would need to reach with the 'zerks?

Hermes Sandals and Death Sickles are the route. Hermes Sandals make you immune to Paralysis, while Death Sickles can cause instant death.

"But wait, what about the Assassin's Dagger?"

That's what's killing you. Twintania is countering physical attacks with Tidal Wave, and the Assassin's Dagger is hitting every single time. In fact, it might even be better to kill off a couple of your Berserkers so you face fewer Tidal Waves (especially with Hermes Sandals). The Death Sickle missing prior to the Giga Flare phase is a feature, not a bug, and so you should lean into that, as every missed Death Sickle is one less Tidal Wave.

In fact, thinking on it, I'd say stick with Reflect Rings, because then you have fewer attacks going out. Sure, you're getting fewer shots per fight at Death hitting, but if you're still facing too many Tidal Waves this is the ticket.

Rosalie_A fucked around with this message at 01:04 on Jun 15, 2021

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


Gray Stormy posted:

Just got my water crystal jobs.

Rolling Blue Mage and Mystic Knight so far.

I feel like not having 'real' magic is going to hurt a lot down the road.

!Blue and !Spellblade are arguably better than "real" magic.

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


redreader posted:

I suppose I feel like there's no reason for me to actually play this. I'm sponsoring a couple of friends and slogging through this with the red mages and a berserker. But no extra money gets donated due to me playing.

So maybe I should donate to get better jobs. Can anyone suggest jobs that are more fun? I'd like to keep the berserker. I had dancer once before and I don't feel like charging up the chicken knife. Can someone recommend a fun combination of jobs that include berserker please?

Knight, Samurai, Time Mage. No Chicken Knife needed but a bunch of Berserker synergy.

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


Drunk Nerds posted:

Thanks for the solid answers. Where can I get dark matter? I only have one and the wiki seems to indicate I can't farm them on World 2.

Without stealing you can get one from Soul Cannon and one from Atomos 100%, so if you haven't beaten Atomos that's where you can get the second. Failing that, Aeroga and Aqua Breath cost MP. 10000 MP each isn't the greatest amount to Lilith's Kiss through (Ether + Maiden's Kiss) but it's certainly doable.

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


girl dick energy posted:

Do you have Meteor and Quick? Quick into double-Meteor eats through MP like nobody's business, but it also does loving absurd damage, especially with a fully-buffed Hero's Ballad.

Meteor has a (randomly) fixed Attack and M value: the only thing that affects it is random variance and the target's Magic Defense.

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


Shoehead posted:

Oh poo poo that must have been Mellusion! Sorry!

I mean, Lenna was poisoned at the end of your Exdeath fight, so...

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


Hackan Slash posted:

Okay theorycrafters, I need some help. Running a team of Berserk/Mime/Samurai/Freelancer is there any feasible way to beat Omega(gba), or should I just resign myself to the fact that this will be a double crown run.

All I can think of is the standard reflect search approach, but I have no good way to get past evasion/defense. I was hoping to break thunder rods, but those can't self target for a bounce and no counter and trying coral swords seems like madness. I wasn't sure if there was a random piece of equipment I was missing or some other strategy.

High levels and katanas. Katanas have a crit chance, which ignores defense. Let's say you're using the Murakumo (stealable from Yojimbo), with 117 Attack and 20% crit. Omega has 95% Evade, so 5% of the time you'll hit and 1% of the time you'll crit. That 1% of the time, you'll negate Omega's Defense and double your Attack, so you'll be doing 234 * (Strength * Level/128 + 2) damage (plus some random variance). At reasonable levels this is only a few thousand or so, but we can do better.

First of all, we give our Berserker Bartz Equip Katanas and the Murakumo, and then we bring them to level 71; at level 71 we're assured to pull straight nines from a crit. Then, we buff up: assuming we're using a Reflect Ring, we use the Masamune to bounce Haste off of Omega onto Bartz (you are using Reflect Rings, right?). If we want to get fancy, we can also bounce Shell from the Wonder Rod onto Bartz to increase his chances of survival. Alternatively, you can prime the Rod for Thundaga, and use that and the successive Flare for the finishing blow.

All that being said, this is a pretty painful way to do things. At level 71 you're still basically assured to be eliminated by Encircle: you need to 95 just to have a 10% shot at dodging it.

The real equalizer is levels: without Shell, there's no other way to have a chance of dodging Omega's counters. Once you've got the levels to have a shot at surviving making a few attacks, the rest is academic. Berserk katana crits are just one way to go about things, and probably one of the better ones. The above strategy could probably be improved, too. A level 99 Freelancer with a Ribbon, Aegis Shield, Flame Ring, and Murakumo would actually have solid odds of living for a while, and you could throw in Shell from the Wonder Rod and suddenly you've got a pretty drat good chance. Getting to that point, however, involves getting a level 99 Freelancer, so...have fun with that!

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


Gray Stormy posted:

Whats bizarre is that I read this reply, loaded my save before the fight, and he dealt the damage you said he should.

So I loaded it back up, dumped Lv.2 Old on him, he Shakered, and it hit me for way bigger damage.



No idea what would cause the bump in damage.

I *did* wind up getting the kill though.

Opened with Lv.2 Old, then used Drain sword/white wind for healing with Aero 3 for damage. He never used Shaker and I was able to power through his first phase without issue.

Are you using any other patches besides the translation? If so, do you happen to have a save file/save state from before this fight? I'm curious to figure out how this happened.

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


Gray Stormy posted:

I should be able to get you a save state in the morning. Im running totally vanilla, minus the translation.

so, guess what?

L2 Old makes Exdeath's Magic overflow. More specifically, I suspect that it's the Aging status combined with having zero Magic Power (yes, Exdeath has zero magic!), with the status checking if the stat is equal to one (which, as it happens, zero is not).

You might wonder how this hadn't been seen before, but it's a combination of a lot of factors to notice. For one, you need to be vulnerable to Aging status or have an even level to be hit by L2 Old (or Dark Shock nonsense). For two, you need to have a high enough level: you're not scoring a high magic multiplier off of 255 Magic when your level is only 3. For three, you need to have a high Attack magic spell: Thunder isn't pulling damage no matter the multiplier if you've got enough Magic Defense. Finally, you the enemy to actually use said Magic Attack.

Aging will drop Level and Magic to basically nothing in a pretty quick amount of time, at one point per battle tick. Put another way, if Exdeath opens with Condemn and you open with Level 2 Old, by the time his target dies he'll be down to level 36. If he were to do another Condemn, then by the time that target dies he'll be at level 6, and thus pulling an M of 8 (despite having 195 Magic): only twice what he started with, and in five more ticks he'll be back at an M of 4.

Exdeath only uses Earth Shaker on his fifth turn in a ten turn cycle, and only at a 2/3 chance. If you were to wait until after his fifth turn to L2 Old, by the time he next got a chance to Earth Shaker he'd likely be near level 1. The only other things in his first phase script that use Magic are Bio (single target) and L3 Flare (multitarget but level-based), and those are reflectable.

So...congrats. You've stumbled onto a bug that, as far as I can tell, has never been documented by anyone ever.

EDIT: I checked this on both the RPGe translation and an unpatched Japanese rom, by the way. No idea if this happens on the GBA version, but if someone wants to test have at it.

Rosalie_A fucked around with this message at 22:27 on Jul 14, 2021

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


Jose Valasquez posted:

I think they said they were getting 2k earthshakers even before Old though? I think that's still unexplained

Not quite. They were getting 2k Earth Shakers before they were told Level 2 Old would shut Exdeath down. This is easily explainable: they were using Level 2 Old anyway. Both the save state and the save file have all four characters with !Blue equipped, meaning it's likely they were throwing everything at Exdeath seeing what sticks.

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


DalaranJ posted:

It's not as easy as it looks because these are 'common' drops, but not 100% drops.

Not quite. There are 1/16 drops ("rare" drops) and Always drops ("common" drops). If an enemy has a rare drop you have a 1/16 chance of getting it. If they don't have one or they do and you roll the 15/16, you get the common drop.

Black Flames have a Speed Shake as a rare drop, and so each one you kill has a 1/16 chance to drop a Shake. If they had it at common instead, all you'd have to do is kill twenty of them for twenty Shakes. Sadly, you aren't so lucky.

Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


You can get two Hero Cocktails in W1. One is a steal from Iron Claw, the other a drop from Archaeoavis. At level 2 or 3, two Hero Cocktails will take you to level 22 or 23, both of which Dark Spark to 11, which Dark Sparks to 5. Boom, you've got Level 5 Death in W1 at 2/2/2/3 levels.

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Rosalie_A
Oct 30, 2011


Pharmacology is a good passive that you'd be happy to slap onto many jobs that do well standing alone, except !Revive exists.

!Revive is a great secondary that you'd be happy to slap onto many jobs that do well standing alone, except !Drink exists.

!Drink is a fantastic secondary that you'd be happy to slap onto many jobs that do well standing alone, except !Mix exists.

!Mix is better than most of the jobs in the game. And these are all available on one job. Chemist is whack.

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