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Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



I did Sealed Temple once, when I got Thief/Beastmaster/Chemist/Canoneer. It's probably the best bonus dungeon team there is (maybe Summoner is better than Canoneer), and it still turned out to be a giant slog. Don't do Sealed Temple, kids.

Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:

You can, the probability is just incomprehensibly low. A Rune Axe has a 1/200 chance of hitting, quarter's Omega's defense, and might roll above that!

I think even perfect RNG wouldn't make the fight doable. You just can't do enough damage before Wave Cannon kills you.

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Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Crystal Guardians is just a matter of farming enough money for Flame Rings in World 1. World 2 Exdeath would be awful though. Probably have to do a fair bit of level grinding and get some Reflect Rings.

I don't think Neo-Exdeath would be all that bad though. Four Dancers should put out enough damage to kill the Almagest part before it can act. Might take a couple of tries if you get unfavourable RNG.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Jose Valasquez posted:

I had some free time tonight so I started looking at this since I can't start a real run yet. So far it looks like it will take more than lucky hits, wave cannon will hit for 4999 each time at 99 and atomic ray only heals for ~3k, with those numbers even the optimal scenario goes

Does equipping a Bone Mail in combination with a Flame Shield double the amount of healing you receive from Atomic Ray? If so, that would make it a lot easier.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Jose Valasquez posted:

It will play out exactly the same way each time given the same initial state, so if it is accurate that those two 8 bit numbers determine all of the RNG then there are only 255*255=65,025 possible versions of a quadzerker battle and given the amount of things that need to go your way I don't think that will be nearly enough versions for everything to go exactly right.

I want to believe it's possible, but as you say, 65,025 outcomes sounds way too low considering how much has to go in your favour.

You're doing God's Gilgamesh's work in any case.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.




I assume all of Omega's counter attacks are manipulated into being either Rocket Punch or Encircle and then missing. Or how did you deal with those?

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Jose Valasquez posted:

Theoretically if I try every RNG setup for 3,725 different setups there's a good chance of everything lining up, and each attempt takes only about 5 seconds so it could finish sometime in the next 40-50 years

FFV Four Job Fiesta 2077: Quadzerker finally beats Omega

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



I think White Mage / Black Mage / Summoner / Ninja would be the most beginner-friendly team. All of your tools can be bought in stores except for summons (and hunting those down is a fun sidequest in its own right), you've got lots of synergies, the setup can easily handle every part of the game, and there's no complex mechanics involved. Just heal and buff your own guys while hurting the enemy, and you're good to go.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Fine, make it Black Mage / White Mage / Ninja / Summoner.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Pollyanna posted:

Oh man, please tell me thereís a comedy patch for the GBA version in this vein.

A patch that makes NPCs randomly tell you about hidden treasures would be pretty great.

"There are Cottages in Castle Tycoon."
"There's a Great Sword in the moat."
"There's a Hi-Potion and Dark Matter in the walls of the Island Shrine. (But why would you care?)"

Gotta get that 100% treasure rating somehow.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



dis astranagant posted:

The fastest thief with all the lightest or most agility boosting gear gets about 20% more turns than the slowest berserker with the heaviest gear possible.

Berserkers are also bugged and always go last in the first round, regardless of their Agility stat, which imo is one of their most annoying traits. That's one of the things the Matrix version fixed though, I believe.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



nrook posted:

I played the Fiesta for the first time last year, and I was stunned at just how unfair Blue Mage felt. I expected unusual spells that were more effective than their conventional alternatives. I did not expect to just instantly beat every W2 boss.

FFV comes from that magical time when selling strategy guides was still a viable business venture, which meant developers had a big incentive to make incredibly powerful classes with very obscure mechanics. Gau from FFVI is another fun example.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



What was the longest time the Run ever took? I feel like the last couple haven't been too bad.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



There are some niche situations where knowing your classes in advance can impact your gameplay (e.g. if you know you'll get a Dancer and already have a Thief, it makes sense to try and steal a Lamia's Tiara in Ronka Ruins), but those are very rare. Unlocking everything at the beginning is less about gaining an advantage and more about satisfying your curiosity or going faster since you don't have to stop playing to visit Twitter.

I think it's kind of nice to experience that tingle of anticipation at every crystal ("Will I get Berserker or Summoner?"), but that's neither here nor there.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Beating every single boss with Goblin Punch actually sounds like a fun challenge. You'd probably need a Chemist to make it feasible though.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Ace Transmuter posted:

It is quite good. There's never any reason to use more than one or two Legendary Weapon. I can only think of a few that are happiest with theirs? (Berserker, Bard, Samurai, White & maybe Black Mage).

e: Flame Lash is also pretty great if you can boost their Magic stat.

Excalibur is the best Knight option until the very end unless you have the Brave Blade. Yoichi's Bow is nice if another class desperately needs the Chicken Knife. Same goes for Sasuke's Katana.

Unless you enjoy farming, Holy Lance is also as good as it gets for Dragoon.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



The saddest thing about Dragoons is meeting the occasional enemy in World 3 who resists Holy and having to slowly whittle them to death with the Partizan.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



DalaranJ posted:

Okay, here's a more radical that I'm going to add on top of my last one.
Number Go Up
Recommended: Thief, but not Samurai
Complete the game without spending any money (which includes using !cointoss).

Oh, now that's an interesting challenge. I'll definitely give it a shot if I get a decent team for it.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Blue Mage's easier than Thief I'd say. Hell, get Blue Mage / Summoner / Bard and the challenge doesn't differ all that much from a normal run.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



TooMuchAbstraction posted:

Is this "beat the game while holding a full-power Brave Blade" or "make it to the Brave Blade while it still is at full power"? i.e. are you allowing players to flee once they get the thing?

Assuming you have a Knight to use it, random encounters in World 3 won't be much of a problem when you're hitting for 4k+ damage every turn. The most dangerous part of a Brave Blade run is usually Exdeath's castle, particularly the lava-ridden dragon-dwelling floors.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Part of the problem with Natural is that it barely affects the strong classes (You mean my Summoner can't do anything but summon? The horror!), while screwing over the weaker ones who rely on secondary abilities to remain competitive (Monks, Geomancers, Red Mages etc.). It accentuates the system's imbalances instead of mitigating them.

The one thing I do like about the mode is that it encourages you to play around with obscure class abilities you'd normally never consider. It taught me that !Flirt is actually a pretty useful command in certain situations.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Kyrosiris posted:

Yeah RK has a very strong "christ I loving wish y'all wouldn't but goons generate a lot of donations so I guess" attitude towards Neo Cactuar and Friends.

RK doesn't even like people playing on emulators, but he also realises that the FJF community is far too small to splinter it further by arbitrarily policing playstyles. Which is good because I'm pretty sure the event would have died out a long time ago otherwise.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



If you're talking about actual hardware, the Matrix version (available for PC, Android & iOS) is pretty much your only option. The GBA cartridges are very expensive (if you can even find one that's not a pirated copy) and the SNES version never even had an official release in the West.

If you're okay with emulation, both SNES and GBA work fine. The latter is generally preferred due to extra content, a good translation, more mods, and a few quality of life options (notably the ability to sprint without having a Thief).

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



30.5 Days posted:

Is the matrix version.... good?

Depends. It brings quite a few changes, some welcome (Power Drinks actually work now) some contentious (lots of exploits got fixed, a few other powerful strategies were also changed for some reason) and the redone artwork has both admirers and detractors. Since it's not emulated you can't change the game speed, which mostly matters if you're planning to do a lot of runs or get stuck with something unholy like four Berserkers.

Overall I think people overstate the differences. The Matrix version is absolutely fine for a casual playthrough and most Fiesta teams. It's really only a few edge cases where GBA ends up being much more beneficial.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



For those of you struggling with a Thief start, I wrote down my usual route to the Water Crystal with the class in a previous thread. You might find it useful.

Samuel Clemens posted:

My usual route for Thief starts is as follows:

1. Get to level 5 with your Freelancers in the Wind Shrine. That gives everyone an extra attack multiplier once they switch over to Thief. Faris will actually get two multipliers due to the Agility glitch, so she should definitely keep the sole Dagger.

2. Buy two Leather Hats and all the Potions you can afford in Tule.

3. Karlabos is never difficult if you have four characters. Keep your unarmed members in the back row and heal up with Potions as needed.

4. Run away from everything in the Ship Graveyard, the encounters are not worth the trouble. You might consider fighting single Skeletons for the chance at a Dagger drop, but it's not vital.

5. For Siren, sit in the back row and throw Potions at her undead form/yourself if needed. Faris can also do decent damage against the normal form with her Dagger.

6. In Carwen, buy Daggers for everyone and stock up on Potions again.

7. Run away from everything on North Mountain. The enemies are even less worthwhile to fight than in the graveyard. You could steal Silver Specs from the headstones, but you'll get four accessories in the next location anyway.

8. For Magisa you'll want to do close to 350 damage so she's right on the verge of calling in Forza. Then have everyone wait with a full ATB until she attacks. Immediately attack her with all four characters afterwards. If you were fast enough, you should be able to get in another round of attacks before she acts since Thieves are faster than her. That'll kill her before she gets the chance to yell for help.

9. In Walse, buy four Kenpo Gis, get the Silver Specs and use the !Flee skill to get the castle's Elven Cape. Stock up on Potions if you need to.

10. Head to Walse Tower and steal Mythril Knives from the Wyverns. You technically only need one, but might as well get four while you're at it.

11. Now you'll want to do a bit of grinding. At level 9, Bartz gets another attack multiplier. That plus the additional HP helps a ton when fighting Garula. I prefer gaining those levels in the Ship Graveyard since the enemies there are no longer dangerous, give good ABP, and have a chance of dropping Elixirs, but you can also do it in the tower itself.

12. Once everyone (or at least Bartz) is level 9, you're ready to take on Garula. Have Bartz in the Front Row with the Mythril Knife, Leather Hat, Kenpo Gi, and Elven Mantle. everyone else in the back. Bartz attacks, everyone else defends and heals as needed. It's a slow fight, but not a dangerous one unless you attack while your characters are weakened. Just keep in mind that most of the danger comes from Garula's counters, and you'll be fine.

13. Mash through the cutscene and enjoy having a useful job again (unless you drew Berserker ).

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



The only truly objective way to determine the best team is by looking at it from the fashion angle. In which case four Dancers obviously win.*

*Maybe three Dancers and White Mage Krile

Nasgate posted:

Is it normal for !summon to ignore Sandworms holes? Or is this another matrixism?

No, that's true for all versions. I don't know why they made an exception for summons after explicitly warning you not to use MT attacks, but that's how it is.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Meow Tse-tung posted:

I got blue mage . Should I build this towards attack or magic stats? I know they use both and monster skill calculations are usually weird, as well as getting stuff like the wind knife later. I just don't know if I'm supposed to be gearing them as mages or fighters.

Blue Mages have a terrible Strength score, so their ability to equip swords only matters in a few niche cases. They're casters through and through.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Grizzled Patriarch posted:

Man this Soul Cannon fight is goddamn miserable with Thief / Berserker / Geomancer. Literally 2 out of 4 characters are completely useless except to toss potions and his HP is just absurd.

Ouch, yeah. That composition is horrible for Soul Cannon. Little you can do except grind levels and farm Hi-Potions I'm afraid.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



redreader posted:

My first job is Red Mage. Any tips before I get started? I went with 'regchaos' and 'berserkerrisk'. Any idea how many berserkers are getting handed out this year?

Red Mage is smooth sailing through World 1 since you get the full utility of both White and Black Magic (barring one very situational spell). How smooth the sailing will be from World 2 onwards depends on your other classes, but for now just enjoy the ride.

If this is your first FFV playthrough ever, make sure to talk to all the NPCs and explore thoroughly. There's a fair bit of hidden content in this game, but most of it's not hard to find if you pay attention.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Where did everyone else grind in W1?

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



That is a lovely Neo-Exdeath, but a hideous menu colour.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.




It's a very cool idea for a toxx, but you can't actually get that message at Necrophobe. I tested it a few years ago, and the last save point to give you the "consecrated circle" message is the one right before Omega. (Presumably because the remaining two save points are spawned upon defeating a boss.)

Edit: For reference:

Samuel Clemens fucked around with this message at 23:14 on Jun 18, 2021

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



oldskool posted:

well poo poo


You're good people.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



girl dick energy posted:

Oh, gently caress, they do, donít they? poo poo.

Nah, they don't. It would actually be kind of nice if they had innate Reflect, since that'd make it much easier to learn Level 3 Flare.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



I wonder what the lowest level average is with which someone beat the game under the FJF ruleset. I know derra (RIP) had a toxx for beating the bonus bosses with a combined party level of less than 100, but I'm sure people have gone a lot lower than that.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



derra posted:

Alive but have a kid and a FFXIV addiction now. Also nothing to play FFV on.

Good to hear you're doing well even if FFXIV claims another victim.

Jose Valasquez posted:

I poked at Neo Shinryu for a bit, his weird targeting that causes misses a lot of the time might be too much of a slog even for me

Yeah, Neo Shinryu is hell if you don't have a class combo that can kill him in two rounds or a Chemist. His attacks are too relentless to survive long-term without !Mix.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



Jose Valasquez posted:

full writeup and shin/omega coming soon, but I did my own toxx









All the more impressive for pulling it off without Chemist (though arguably with the four next-best classes).

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



#2 sword comes five minutes before the end of the game though. Part of the fun of a Brave Blade run is arriving in World 3 and instantly going from ~1500 to ~4500 damage.

Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



If you want to solo the Minotaur with a Monk, use the Counter strategy. Never attack; instead heal up with Hi-Potions and if necessary Elixirs, and wait for your counter-attacks to finish him. This will also prevent Minotaur from counter-attacking you, which is were most of his damage comes from.

Edit: Since you have Chemist and are presumably not running Natural, you can give your Monk !Drink and have him use a Protect and Goliath Tonic at the start to make this even easier.

Samuel Clemens fucked around with this message at 16:16 on Jul 2, 2021

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Samuel Clemens
Oct 4, 2013

I think we should call the Avengers.



MisterZimbu posted:

- Where do I get the mats to use for !Combine? The merchant says he hangs out in equipment shops but I've been to every town I can think of and haven't seen him. Google tells me nothing, either.

He only hangs out in a small number of locations. Karnak is usually where I go to buy from him, but you can also find him in Crescent and Bal Castle.

Edit: Also, make sure you're in the right building. He stays at the Inn, not the equipment store.

Samuel Clemens fucked around with this message at 10:18 on Jul 7, 2021

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