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I used to play Belgium, Netherlands and Mexico a lot in Vicky 2, plus Germany and Italy occasionally to unite, and the UK occasionally to get on Mr Laissez-Faire’s Wild Ride. Everything that’s been written about V3 so far looks great.
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May 23, 2021 08:32
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Vicky 2 did a very good job of modelling that, but the absolute leader in the field of “expand your insatiable industrial economy till your next war is WW1” remains Imperialism.
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May 23, 2021 13:22
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Randarkman posted:In 1836 there's still the EIC. Though in alot of ways it already functions in ways similar to the later British Raj. IIRC the EIC was so staggeringly corrupt that it needed government bailouts on more than one occasion, despite having a GDP larger than that of the Home Islands.
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May 28, 2021 06:30
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DrSunshine posted:Lol Ha ha yes, it worked out really well to send those idiots off with a flea in their ear  The Emperor and his officials quite correctly read the power dynamic as of 1795 but even if you don’t blame them for not predicting the way the next 40 years would change that, they should possibly have put more weight on the implications of Macartney’s team, who were not morons, challenging the idea that the Emperor was on a level of his own above their King. I think this thread is the first time I’ve seen the response presented as a diplomatic masterstroke. Then again, China had had lovely ships compared to Europeans for 300 years at that point and it had never been a problem so it’s understandable that he didn’t immediately see the implications of the Macartney ships (and when they eventually did build a proper fleet, the Japanese promptly sank it).
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Jun 3, 2021 05:45
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Raenir Salazar posted:A thing to keep in mind was 300 years ago, they had a massive fleet that sailed all the way to africa no problem, so from a certain perspective this is just Europeans barely catching up to where they were 300 years ago. China for whatever its worth, decided they didn't need to be a maritime power and so had no reason to be impressed with however advanced the ships were. Yeah fair enough. It’s still depressing how it all ended up. Although the Qing were also an ethnically distinct military elite repressing a giant population of “inferiors” so eh. I’m actually pretty excited to see if and how Taiping and the end of the Qing are modelled, there’s a ton of cool and interesting alt history you could do around that.
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Jun 3, 2021 09:58
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Tuna-Fish posted:Not just badly run, but fundamentally evil. The Qing empire was a racist apartheid state where the ruling Manchu minority had a policy of trying to trigger revolts early, So they were EU4 players is what I’m hearing?
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Jun 3, 2021 11:03
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Crazycryodude posted:Modeling rebellions as dudes with guns on the map having pitched battles with the professional army is just a terrible way to model all but the biggest of them. Having the army stomp a 2-regiment stack of irregulars should never even come up, the small-scale stuff should happen off the map and in the pop screen instead. Maybe apply a constant low-level attrition to both the military units in the state and militant rebel pops or something to represent the low-level simmer of the local rebels knocking over the occasional checkpoint but I don't think the little 3D dudes should start shooting at each other in full battles on the map until it's a full civil war level conflict. There needs to be some kind of growing penalty for ignoring unrest, and a disincentive to just grant concessions. Otherwise we’ll all just grant whatever concessions are needed to make it less of a headache. For the Vicky2 era my impression is that uprisings were overwhelmingly failures that were successfully repressed with violence, usually by quite small numbers of people relative to the numbers of uprisers. I’m not sure why this was the case - presumably connected with modern communications allowing better force concentration as well as using accurate artillery as a force multiplier?
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Jul 13, 2021 17:43
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I’m curious about the pie charts. When I started doing serious data visualisation in corporate strategy teams I found that nobody used them, supposedly because they aren’t actually very intuitive to process. To the degree that it sort of felt like pie charts were obsolete. Have they had a renaissance or is it just that they’re good for the use case somehow? E: or just Vicky 2 nostalgia? Beefeater1980 fucked around with this message at 11:21 on Jul 17, 2021 |
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Jul 17, 2021 09:40
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Poil posted:Isn't realpolitik basically just following your ideology while claiming you're being completely pragmatic and that it's the best way? I thought it was following your interests without regard to commonsense understandings of morality, pace Palmerston “Britain has no permanent allies and no permanent enemies, only permanent interests.” Ideology is one of the things that goes into defining your interests, but not the only one. I get the feeling that what they are going for here is that you might want to take expedient decisions but doing so will piss off your population who want to see their government Standing Up To Johnny Foreigner.
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Aug 4, 2021 00:14
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HOI4 had some clever stuff going on with brush wars etc in the Chinese civil war. I feel like in this era you need to model a few things though: wars by great powers against pre-industrial countries should usually be a cakewalk but you also need to accommodate Ethiopia kicking the poo poo out of Italy and Japan wiping the floor with Russia.
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Aug 23, 2021 14:06
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DaysBefore posted:I think part of the trouble with colonial wars is that the AI - in like every strategy game ever to be fair - has never really understood the idea of a 'limited' war. I think HoI 4 has a system for that but I have no idea how well it works. I just don't want a repeat of Victoria 2, where the AI mobilises for full-scale war everytime some tiny backwater goes to war To be fair if it had been a simple thing in the Crimean war to just take Moscow by siege (or in the 7YW to have occupied Paris / London) presumably the belligerents would have done it. What PDX games don’t model are the factors that made those outcomes impossible, which are mostly diplomatic or logistical. I don’t know if it’s even possible to make a grand strategy game with plausible logistical constraints that would allow for Cortez to conquer Mexico and the EIC to take Bengal, but annihilate Napoleon’s army in Russia and prevent Ming from marching across Siberia.
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Aug 23, 2021 16:11
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Orange Devil posted:You realize the mightiest 19th century imperial power did in fact attempt to do the whole imperialism thing in Afghanistan during the 19th century and it didn't work out very well, yes? Outside of the mythology, the reality is that it didn’t go that badly after the initial defeat; the British went back to Afghanistan and razed parts of Kabul, got Akbar Khan murdered and then kept it as a quasi-neutral buffer stage for a while. Then came back again to make sure that their totally not in charge The UK basically did the usual indirect imperial control thing without formally taking over because nobody needs a landlocked central Asian highlands when goods are all moving over sea.
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Aug 31, 2021 15:27
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Eiba posted:The casual mention that quality of life is still going to be real bad for former slave pops until you reform your discrimination laws is so depressing. There's a button you can press to just "reform your discrimination laws" and the US didn't press it until the 19 loving 60s. I always thought reconstruction was trying to do that (and failing).
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Sep 17, 2021 04:16
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I’m really excited about this. There’s a little beer-n-pretzels game called Stellar Monarch that did the fronts thing (you have navies and you assign one or more navies to each border) and to me it felt like a very elegant approach. Game looking good.
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Nov 12, 2021 00:53
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Jabor posted:War is likely, in many cases, to be less profitable than just bullying countries with the threat of war without actually fighting. Yeah I think if anything this will be exacerbated as the game progresses, because there will be less available territory and more valuable stakes each time.
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Nov 26, 2021 09:43
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Koramei posted:It would be nice if China could be balanced more by things that actually caused China problems historically I’m not sure how you model the staggering incompetence of the late Qing court or the crippling corruption at all levels of society in a way that’s fun for the player.
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Dec 7, 2021 06:59
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Seeing Like a State game: you have to persuade the rest of your polity, family by family, to make their lives more painful, unfair and inconvenient so as to make it more legible. If you fail then you get wiped out by a neighbouring polity. If you succeed too much you stagnate and 1000 years later your descendants get colonised by foreigners selling opium.
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Jan 15, 2022 10:50
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TwoQuestions posted:For some reason a lot of programmers really hate UX stuff, I think it might be the "RTFM, idiot!" mentality still around. It’s a loving nightmare to code from scratch, too.
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Jan 22, 2022 05:59
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In the European worldview China starts off being seen as a civilised country in the 18th.C, and then gets kind of retrospectively recategorised as backwards once industrialisation and scientific racism really start getting their groove on, travellers bring back stories of what a basket case late Qing-era China is and the opium trade shifts into high gear. It’s wild to me that this massive change in perspective happens over just 20 years, even though about the same has happened in reverse over the last 20 or so as China’s gone from undeveloped backwater to Top Nation.
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Feb 2, 2022 07:04
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A Buttery Pastry posted:Paradox should just bite the bullet and go with period appropriate terms like enlightened, civilized, half civilized, barbarous, and savage. And then have those terms be country dependent, so a Qing player sees the Brits as barbarous. This way the Qing and Korea can do whatever diplomacy they like, and get real offended when the Brits come in and gently caress everything up, while no European really gives a poo poo. I like this, it could do a good job of representing that at game start a lot of the world has a very narrow view of what matters (horizon ends 50km out from the capital), and then as the century goes on it changes, as countries potentially win and get to enforce their world view on everyone else, or lose, get absorbed into the global consensus and develop a robust anti-colonial literature.
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Feb 3, 2022 07:52
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Zkoto posted:They should formalise it then! I’m dying to play the drat thing, but don’t want to play the leak, it just doesn’t feel right to play something they had no intention of making public. Yeah same here. I’ve playtested a ton of really terrible EA releases already, no skin off my nose to grab it in EA and I strongly suspect it would be better than the average. But listed company, it would probably gently caress up their financial reporting, so unless someone gets comfortable taking a risk on what should be a flagship title, that won’t happen.
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Apr 20, 2022 07:17
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I feel awful for Wiz and the team and have no interest in playing the leaked version. Also from a crisis management perspective I thought that Wiz’s formal reply on behalf of paradox was really good.
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Apr 21, 2022 05:23
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oscarthewilde posted:That's definitely not the case. Sure, there's a lot of historical discussion about the efficacy of denazification in East and West Germany, and the Soviet's also chose to ignore the nazi past of certain important officers and magistrates, but in general the Soviets were much more committed Denazification in East Germany than the Western Allies in the West. West stood by and ignored the nazi pasts of important ministers and national politicians, including one of the authors of the Nuremberg Race Laws in order to construct a strong Germany as shield against the Soviets. It might be a bit reductive to call NATO a Nazi institution because an early Chairman was a former Wehrmacht officer (who probably committed war crimes on the Eastern Front), but the West wasn't particularly interested in a fully denazifyied Germany. You really shouldn't underestimate the continuation in terms of government and military officials from the Third Reich to the BRD. W Germany eliminated the Gestapo and did a risk-base denazification of the educators, civil service and army. E Germany kept the Gestapo and its Nazis and lower ranks of the army but were more thorough in denazifying educators and the civil service.
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May 28, 2022 15:57
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Beefeater1980 posted:W Germany eliminated the Gestapo and did a risk-base denazification of the educators, civil service and army. E: why is this in the Vicky3 thread?
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May 28, 2022 15:58
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Orange Devil posted:Does the tutorial have Hitler in it? Shouldn’t it be Palmerston, explaining why opium wars are cool and good?
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Jun 23, 2022 17:46
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trapped mouse posted:Victoria 3: Factories don't care about your feelings New title
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Jul 13, 2022 23:39
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Vichan posted:Someone should make a sequel to Star Control: Origins (2018) already! There’s Starcom Nexus if you’re keen on getting more of that sort of thing. I just beat it, it’s short but a pretty good starflight/ star control clone.
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Jul 30, 2022 05:24
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Cease to Hope posted:bigger marx theory The largest Marx will inevitably consume each smaller Marx in turn, starting with the smallest…
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Aug 5, 2022 11:49
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Their HOI4 alt hist setups are quite good though
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Aug 8, 2022 07:03
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I wonder if I can go all Castle Falkenstein and have Mad King Ludwig hold off Bismarck?
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Sep 5, 2022 17:44
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I’m behind on watching the vids, but: there are no little soldiers and battalions? In the period with the most ~fabulous~ and diverse military uniforms (not just on generals), and the most striking change in the way that military hardware shaped the battlefield? That’s admirable as a way of downgrading war as a tool in a period that started the great peacening, but it’s a bit of a shame in terms of having a fun game. Players should be able to see little Qing cavalry sweeping through Alabama, redcoats marching through Hyderabad or an honour guard with assegais marching down a defeated Mall IMO. E: this is in no way a denigration of the “fronts”-based replacement to moving individual units, which I really like. 100% aesthetic
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Oct 12, 2022 09:52
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First run will probably be Belgium because that’s how I learned Vicky 2. After that I have UK to shoot for world conquest (or optionally try to go communist), revanchist France, crush-the-conferderacy US, Germany, Italy and Qing runs lined up. It’s such a fascinating period. Paradox seems to have backed off from the fantasy mods since Aztec Invasion, which is a shame because a War of the Worlds DLC where you’re on the receiving end of colonisation could be really interesting.
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Oct 16, 2022 09:24
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Ofaloaf posted:
This owns.
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Oct 19, 2022 16:47
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It’s bizarre that as a grown adult I’m this excited about the release of a video game but, well, time is passing really slowly right now for some reason.
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Oct 25, 2022 13:59
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Where do I go to see pop needs? Also amazing job Johan, Wiz et al. Very smooth so far, gorgeous map, nice UI. I like the pop portraits, they add a lot of character.
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Oct 25, 2022 17:33
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MonsieurChoc posted:Good news everygoblin! Holy poo poo Sam Gamgee got buff. In awe at the size of that “small country”.
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Oct 26, 2022 03:18
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So I had a chance to play around with Belgium overnight. First thoughts: industrialisation is a race against time. I feel like the pressure on Belgium specifically at game start is to expand your iron and coal mines as fast as possible because (a) that feeds your pops and (b) you need cheap iron and coal for the rest of your industry. At game start you have a good chance of being the most profitable and largest scale producer of coal and iron for a while, until the big boys really get their engine humming. You can then use the wealth this generates to move up the value chain to the cool stuff like tooling etc. So you want to pump construction at game start so you can throw up more coal and iron mines because the entire world will want to come set up trade routes with you for it in those initial years.
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Oct 26, 2022 05:51
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A bunch of confused looking Han Chinese just showed up in my newly multicultural Flanders. I assume they were refugees fleeing the opium wars that saw Britain snatch Wenzhou. Entirely unrelatedly, Belgium suddenly developed a significant demand for opium. I would *really* like to see exactly how much demand though, for that and for other things. For my industrial consumption I can do some mental arithmetic to figure our whether a trade deal that imports 100 units of wood, say, will meet current and future needs. For my consumers, though, I have no idea.
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Oct 26, 2022 09:12
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I’m having fun starting and restarting as Belgium. Into the mid 1840s now and just getting my first couple of colonies. What are you supposed to do with them? All my money is going on the ports - do they not need to be at max level?
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Oct 27, 2022 06:56
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Played around a bit with Thailand earlier, it’s quite fun. You have a bunch of neighbours around you to bully while you try to keep the nobles down and abolish serfdom. Also there’s so much space for flavour events. Have Harry Flashman pop up and duel Bismarck, let a player being one of the Indian princes have an event where they storm Calcutta and behead the Governor-General, tell me about the pirate queen who’s raiding my plantations in Malaya. Release Jules Verne or HG Wells DLC where Martians pop a colony next to Bristol. I think the system for generating these interesting events is really solid, but things like wars, or your country’s first colony, or emancipation of women, or deposing Queen Vic and taking the UK communist, are all just a bit bloodless. But like people have said, much easier to fix the flavour than to fix the system, so the priorities were definitely right.
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Oct 27, 2022 15:53
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