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Pharohman777
Jan 14, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
There totally needs to be a newspaper event if Bakunin is alive and a 'socialist' state degenerates into stalinist oppression.

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Pharohman777
Jan 14, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
Regarding silver, from what I've picked up from history podcasts, mercenary companies in europe were paid in silver, so a trade deficit in silver would be seen as a critical national security issue, especially after the war of the spanish succession, the revolutionary war, etc depleted Britians stores.
https://militaryhistorynow.com/2013/06/15/hired-guns-ten-amazing-facts-about-the-hessians/

quote:

IN 1715, England’s King George I hired 12,000 Hessians when war broke out with the Scots and French. It would be the start of a long and profitable relationship for Hesse-Kassel. By the 1720s, Britain was doling out the princely sum of £125,000 yearly to Hesse-Kassel, simply to keep 12,000 Hessian troops on standby. By the end of the decade, that figure had doubled to £250,000 a year.
Having a vault of silver to pay mercenaries was literally a manner of national security, and it was being spent to feed Britain's tea craze.

Pharohman777
Jan 14, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
Tea is gonna be an obsession for every strata of British society

Pharohman777
Jan 14, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
I kinda wanna know more about how the slave trade is gonna be depicted in centralized African kingdoms that actively exported slaves.
Is there going to be a slave raider job done by soldier pops that actively captures pops in neighboring regions you dont control and converts them into slaves to be shipped?

Pharohman777
Jan 14, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Panzeh posted:

I read on the forums that socities with debt slavery export some of their slaves to those who have the slave trade running, it's not really that complex a system.

I was talking about a different sort of slavery, the sort that fueled the triangle trade.

Basically in west africa before Europeans started colonizing america; african tribes, kindgoms, etc could make some cash by selling their prisoners of war, criminals, and anyone able-bodied they kidnapped while raiding their enemies. This was normal and had been going on for thousands of years, but it wasn't a major economic pillar.

Slave raiding like this happened all across Europe too in the dark/middle ages, but the catholic church really didn't like Christians enslaving Christians, and other forms of forced labor emerged over time due to the sheer power the church held.
See stuff like the dublin slave markets or the viking slave trade for more info.

The sheer demand for slaves that occurred when the colonies started running out of native Indians to enslave ended up warping the economy of west africa and fueled several large kingdoms/empires in west Africa that went to war specifically to get slaves from their enemies to trade for European goods.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_Africa

quote:

The Atlantic slave trade peaked in the late 18th century, when the largest number of people were bought or captured from West Africa and taken to the Americas.[239] The increase of demand for slaves due to the expansion of European colonial powers to the New World made the slave trade much more lucrative to the West African powers, leading to the establishment of a number of actual West African empires thriving on slave trade.[240] These included the Bono State, Oyo empire (Yoruba), Kong Empire, Imamate of Futa Jallon, Imamate of Futa Toro, Kingdom of Koya, Kingdom of Khasso, Kingdom of Kaabu, Fante Confederacy, Ashanti Confederacy, and the kingdom of Dahomey.[241] These kingdoms relied on a militaristic culture of constant warfare to generate the great numbers of human captives required for trade with the Europeans.

This is why I was asking about how gaining slaves would be handled on the African end. There were kingdoms so distorted by the profits from enlaving their enemies that they went to war specifically because of it.

Pharohman777 fucked around with this message at 21:17 on Sep 19, 2021

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Pharohman777
Jan 14, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

golden bubble posted:

And by European goods, it often means European weapons, which leads to a cruel cycle where a kingdom needs profits from the slave trade to avoid being on the wrong end of a war over slaves.

Well that, plus lots of cloth, metal and booze.

And apparently once abolishing the slave trade became a thing for the imperial powers, the major slaveholders in africa switched to running plantations with slaves instead of shipping them overseas.

Theres a ton of demographic effects as well, with male and female slaves desired in different places causing demographic imbalances in regions.

I just have so many questions that were completely unanswered by that dev diary. Although you probably need to do a dedicated west africa dlc to really nail all the economic contortions and unique circumstances west African kingdoms found itself in during the Victorian period.

quote:

When European powers began to stop the Atlantic slave trade, this caused a further change in that large holders of slaves in Africa began to exploit enslaved people on plantations and other agricultural products.[245]

Abolition
Main articles: Abolitionism and Blockade of Africa
The final major transformation of slave relationships came with the inconsistent emancipation efforts starting in the mid-19th century.[246] As European authorities began to take over large parts of inland Africa starting in the 1870s, the colonial policies were often confusing on the issue.[247] For example, even when slavery was deemed illegal, colonial authorities would return escaped slaves to their masters.[248][4] Slavery persisted in some countries under colonial rule, and in some instances it was not until independence that slavery practices were significantly transformed.[249][250] Anti-colonial struggles in Africa often brought slaves and former slaves together with masters and former masters to fight for independence;[251] however, this cooperation was short-lived and following independence political parties would often form based upon the stratifications of slaves and masters.[252][152]

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