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the best ui addition would be making it obvious to people who pick a support ability that their teammates need ammo/health without them having to ask they should make uniforms faction specific so it's easy to tell w/o IFF but they wont do that b/c of cosmetic purchases lmao 
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Oct 13, 2021 05:23
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it's amazing to me the psychological gulf between battlefield's historically lovely class system and just saying I'm Medic Mans by picking the Medic Mans perk or character it's cooler medic mans can carry LMG and have a grapple or w/e
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Oct 13, 2021 05:24
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Paul MaudDib posted:isn't "IFF light" just a cute euphemism for dorito? I thought battlefield players hated that. No, that is 3D spotting and I hope they don't go back to that either. Spamming your spot button all game was dumb. IFF lights are these little lights on the soldiers that glow either red or blue. There's a couple examples on Mckay and Falk in the trailer. Black Ops 4 had it so you can watch some gameplay of that to get an idea. I have some screenshots but not sure how to post pictures here. Edit: https://ibb.co/SQQppGT Sedisp posted:Again. We have an example of this. BFV. Again the most common complaint in it is the same one worsened by the operator system. People are able to identify silhouettes quicker than whatever UI system you try to make. I guess I'm not fulling understanding what the complaint is. If it's just identifying if they're an enemy, the IFF lights and clearer dots on the UI will fix that. The reason I kept missing them in the 2042 beta is the UI blue blended in with the sky. If the issue is identifying what gadgets the enemy is running then I guess I'm ambivalent. There was no battlefield game where the class of the enemy really changed my behavior. If they were close enough to tell what class they were, I shot them. If they were further away and I could not tell what class, I still shot them. DrBox fucked around with this message at 05:41 on Oct 13, 2021 |
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Oct 13, 2021 05:26
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comedyblissoption posted:the best ui addition would be making it obvious to people who pick a support ability that their teammates need ammo/health without them having to ask Specialists are stupid and water down what's left of the class system for the purpose of selling cosmetics but if you absolutely insisted in having it camo color being locked and adding model elements depending on what you equipped would probably be the best. Definitely not happening though.
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Oct 13, 2021 05:28
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after playing the shitheap known as the BF2042 beta, i decided to at least try BF:V which i had neglected for years based on feedback. this of course turned out to be a huge mistake. 3 hours of troubleshooting later i finally managed to fix connection issues by loving around with my router DNS settings, a completely normal part of playing video games. all said and done, it was time to play a MP game! too bad every single game loaded into a black screen with 64 players whining into the general chat that they are having the same issues. think i'm done with dice from now on
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Oct 13, 2021 05:29
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note that IFF systems always have a problem when someone suddenly appears out of any type of cover whatsoever where you can see the player before the IFF indicator, because generally you don't want the IFF indicator to show when you only see a sliver of a player in a 64v64 game mode where this is an avoidable problem, it'll be really annoying to shoot teammates randomly all the time
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Oct 13, 2021 05:30
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comedyblissoption posted:in a 64v64 game mode where this is an avoidable problem, it'll be really annoying to shoot teammates randomly all the time well that's easy, just enable friendly fire and players will learn not to do that. ezpz, NEXT QUESTION
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Oct 13, 2021 05:31
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Atheist Sunglasses posted:after playing the shitheap known as the BF2042 beta, i decided to at least try BF:V which i had neglected for years based on feedback. this of course turned out to be a huge mistake. 3 hours of troubleshooting later i finally managed to fix connection issues by loving around with my router DNS settings, a completely normal part of playing video games. all said and done, it was time to play a MP game! too bad every single game loaded into a black screen with 64 players whining into the general chat that they are having the same issues. think i'm done with dice from now on If this was tonight, the servers were down for BF4 and BF5 (and maybe BF1, but I didn't try)
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Oct 13, 2021 05:32
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Sedisp posted:Specialists are stupid and water down what's left of the class system for the purpose of selling cosmetics but if you absolutely insisted in having it camo color being locked and adding model elements depending on what you equipped would probably be the best. if the classes were radically different like in team fortress or whatever I think class based gameplay would make more sense
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Oct 13, 2021 05:37
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DrBox posted:I guess I'm not fulling understanding what the complaint is. If it's just identifying if they're an enemy, the IFF lights and clearer dots on the UI will fix that. The reason I kept missing them in the 2042 beta is the UI blue blended in with the sky. Alright so the benefit of camo and models being locked is simple in any split second scenario it is the quickest way to identify a friend or foe. If you're too close you might not see their name tags or UI element or IFF lights or whatever you WILL see that they are a green blob and you are not the green team. At a distance it really depends on how the IFF lights will work. Given that it's dice the answer is probably not very well. For class models even if it doesn't change how you engage them (and that is probably not true) it does change split second decisions on whether to run to a medic friendly to survive or if that's just a wookie going for is third kill at the end of the match.
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Oct 13, 2021 05:41
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DrBox posted:If this was tonight, the servers were down for BF4 and BF5 (and maybe BF1, but I didn't try) 1 was also.
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Oct 13, 2021 05:46
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Sedisp posted:Alright so the benefit of camo and models being locked is simple in any split second scenario it is the quickest way to identify a friend or foe. If you're too close you might not see their name tags or UI element or IFF lights or whatever you WILL see that they are a green blob and you are not the green team. At a distance it really depends on how the IFF lights will work. Given that it's dice the answer is probably not very well. I'm going to play a round of BF4 and take some screenshots and we can play a game called "What class is he and how should this change how fast I pull the trigger". Like I guess when running in a tank it's nice to know if they have a rocket on them but it's pretty hard to tell at a glance no matter what. They could also just have the equipment literally on the back of the player and then class uniform is irrelevant. Oh, he's got a rocket launcher on his back. Noted.
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Oct 13, 2021 05:50
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D-Pad posted:I'm just gonna assume based on this all your BF experience is actually as short as your BF V experience turned out to be. I literally am constantly being revived, healed, and given ammo by pubbies in bfv. Literally constantly. And you can say it's because it's only high level players left but load into any game right now and it's mostly low level poo poo heads who just got the game cause it's so cheap. In fact it's so constant I was frustrated last night when for the FIRST time in my couple days of playing I watched a nearby medic simply walk past me. The nerve! If you think people in bfv don't do team supporting actions you literally haven't played the game.
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Oct 13, 2021 06:01
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DrBox posted:I'm going to play a round of BF4 and take some screenshots and we can play a game called "What class is he and how should this change how fast I pull the trigger". Deciding on a quicker path that has longer sight lines or a longer path that will get you closer does indeed change depending on what weapon they have. Or whether this cover you're using is going to be hit by a rocket or if you can stay behind it. Or if the medic you're shooting at will win an attrition shoot out. Yes you're correct if you have an in your cross hairs at your ideal engagement range it doesn't matter what class they are (until it does) but you might have noticed that there are lots of scenarios and situations that are not man in cross hairs me shoot now. And even when it is that situation there was a whole host of little decisions and events that lead you to be in this spot. Sedisp fucked around with this message at 06:11 on Oct 13, 2021 |
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Oct 13, 2021 06:07
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Skyarb posted:I literally am constantly being revived, healed, and given ammo by pubbies in bfv. Literally constantly. And you can say it's because it's only high level players left but load into any game right now and it's mostly low level poo poo heads who just got the game cause it's so cheap. Yep, of all the complaints to make for BFV, "No teamplay" isn't one I generally experience. I think right now is a bit of a renaissance though for the game with a lot of people coming in with fresh eyes and teamplay on the brain.
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Oct 13, 2021 06:10
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I definitely aimed at some dude that was pointing a big cylindrical thing on his shoulders at me first when I was in a tank/apc.
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Oct 13, 2021 06:10
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Like it's totally fine to like the specialist system I think you're dumb and that's fine but whether the system is good or not there isn't a good argument for them looking identical and hoping UI will solve it when we have a perfect example of it doing not that in the previous game. It's even solvable while keeping the specialists through camo guidelines and adding poo poo to the model depending on your gadgets. poo poo like this McKay has a launcher so he has a tube on his back and a little side pouch of rockets and other explosive devices and this McKay has a health box so he has a little backpack instead with a green plus sign and a little pouch of bandaids on his hips. We just a know they won't because the specialist system exists to sell skins.
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Oct 13, 2021 06:18
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Sedisp posted:Like it's totally fine to like the specialist system I think you're dumb and that's fine Thanks for keeping things chill. In the end I think it'll work out but I understand the apprehension people have. They could easily sell skins without totally changing the way the game works, and also if nobody likes it they don't sell skins so I'm sure they'll be open to ideas. I just don't want to see them scrap the whole thing as a knee jerk reaction.
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Oct 13, 2021 06:26
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specialists looking identical is stupid as gently caress I really like the idea of mixing and matching stuff like grapple/heal dart/turret/recon drone with other utility and it's a funner idea than battlefield's historically anemic class system where if you pick the support/anti-vehicle you get gimped ShootMan weapons which is stupid and dumb
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Oct 13, 2021 06:28
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some people just look at titanfall and be like "hmm yes I do want to play the faceless robots that get slaughtered by the dozens by superhero pilots". Erm I meant specialists. plus, you know, grappling hook
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Oct 13, 2021 06:31
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comedyblissoption posted:specialists looking identical is stupid as gently caress The last two games have the support classes have had extremely good guns. I think a better idea than throwing away the class system is to simply make each class be able to use guns that you just want to use maybe introduce some overlap between them. I absolutely agree that how 2/3/4 handle it is very bad but I/V both have fine class systems with good weapons in every class.
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Oct 13, 2021 06:34
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FWIW the Halo Infinite beta has the same issue of customisation of the player models taking precedent over logical visual representation of teams. in Halo Infinite you can make your Spartan any colour you like, with different secondary and accent colours (one of the in game colour options I unlocked was cream armour with grey/orange accents) in game, you are then on either red or blue team. to differentiate the players, enemies get a red a overlay and friendlies get blue. so you can be playing on the red team, see a guy with blue armour, and hes a friendly with a blue overlay. The team you play on changes from game to game, so you can be a a blue team member and see a blue team member, that is red, with a blue overlay the next round. Halo also has friendly fire enabled. previously in 3/4/5/reach you could customise your armour and colours and the base colour would be replaced by the teams base colour for team based games. The problem isn't necessarily specialists, or customisation (in either 2042 or Halo) but the way they have failed rto manage simple, long solved problems of 'should I shoot that guy or not?' while also being able to charge money for skins.
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Oct 13, 2021 06:36
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Laserface posted:FWIW the Halo Infinite beta has the same issue of customisation of the player models taking precedent over logical visual representation of teams.
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Oct 13, 2021 06:56
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Propaganda Hour posted:Isn't this the same Gaming Intel dude? Are there any OTHER sources of this? Tom Henderson posts on that site yeah. He throws poo poo at the wall and celebrates what sticks but ignores what slides off. He has had access to some leaks for sure, but he is in a position now where he makes out he has access to a lot more info than he does for clicks, presenting speculation as fact.
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Oct 13, 2021 08:23
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Mr Beens posted:Tom Henderson posts on that site yeah. Look at his latest "leak", the length of the upcoming Hazard Zone trailer. He stacks up these small facts and uses it as proof that his more wild bullshit speculation is credible even when some of it ends up contradicting. He sucks.
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Oct 13, 2021 08:51
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comedyblissoption posted:I checked a video to see how long it takes to regen to full and this is how long from ~12 health: I don't hate it and I accept that passive regen is much slower, but being caught in a gunfight without your gun out means you're dead, trying to heal teammates in most gunfights rather than just shooting people yourself is going to be the wrong choice most of the time, and the TTK is definitely low enough that the heal speed is going to make very little difference if you're getting hit. If it was an instant fullheal or something then yeah, that would change things. At the moment it's best used for yourself when you've been caught but can get to cover, and for healing up your friends post-firefight. It's the latter where the difference in speed between passive and medic gun doesn't matter a lot of the time.
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Oct 13, 2021 09:17
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Thirsty Dog posted:I don't hate it and I accept that passive regen is much slower, but being caught in a gunfight without your gun out means you're dead, trying to heal teammates in most gunfights rather than just shooting people yourself is going to be the wrong choice most of the time, and the TTK is definitely low enough that the heal speed is going to make very little difference if you're getting hit. If it was an instant fullheal or something then yeah, that would change things. this is a common situation because usually you should play around cover. the TTK is so high you can usually react to taking damage to take cover and heal if you are already near cover. you can peek, heal, reset ad infinitum until you run out of healing. if you can't heal behind cover in a firefight, you have two options to continue the fight: 1) take a terrible or even fight depending on how much health your opponent will have if you want to be aggressive 2) passively give up angles and aggression for 15-25s for the regen if you can heal behind cover in a firefight and the enemy is distant enough, you can full heal and then guarantee either an even fight or an advantaged fight (in terms of health) for you into a wounded or full health enemy. you can start being aggressive more safely in a few seconds. being able to heal behind cover puts the enemy in a situation where they often must traverse terrain without cover to prevent your heal. it is much easier to kill enemies when they don't have cover.
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Oct 13, 2021 09:37
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I guess I just don't agree that the TTK is that high. I've been killing people faster than they can react most of the time in closer range combat, and at long range it's a couple of hits with the sniper-pistol to kill someone anyway.
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Oct 13, 2021 10:22
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TTK is basically as low as you can reasonably get in valorant and counter-strike and people regularly retreat to cover to try to reset a situation you need to be only just a few steps away from cover ideally when engaged in a firefight
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Oct 13, 2021 10:26
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comedyblissoption posted:TTK is basically as low as you can reasonably get in valorant and counter-strike and people regularly retreat to cover to try to reset a situation Sure, but Battlefield is a far more open game and on that map in particular there's an incredible amount of places with no realistic nearby cover. One of the joys of playing Battlefield is that you get these emergent situations where you make do with what you have to hand at any point. Obviously if you're defending certain points then yes, cover is always available nearby. I enjoyed playing medic but for me the impact of healing someone during a fight was much lower than just adding my own bullets to the fight. In Valorant and CS, having two people shooting someone >>> having one person shooting someone. If the medic gun was an offhand thing or the heal was quicker, I could see more value in using it on teammates during a firefight.
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Oct 13, 2021 10:33
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I am surprised that there are so few people talking about the TTK considering what an important topic it was for BFV From the Beta sample, 2042 seems it will have a lot of <300ms TTK guns (at close range) and this is pretty drat quick Or the aim jankyness and hit registration made it feel like it was much higher than
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Oct 13, 2021 10:40
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Thirsty Dog posted:Sure, but Battlefield is a far more open game and on that map in particular there's an incredible amount of places with no realistic nearby cover. One of the joys of playing Battlefield is that you get these emergent situations where you make do with what you have to hand at any point. Obviously if you're defending certain points then yes, cover is always available nearby. this game is not overwatch where you heal someone while they are actively taking damage. battlefield games have never been that. this game is where the support heals you behind cover to take an advantage or reset which the game gives an extreme amount of opportunities for.
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Oct 13, 2021 10:48
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comedyblissoption posted:we agree 100% on all these points. you should usually shoot instead of heal if someone is committed to an engagement OK good, but this whole discussion started when I said "but the healing from the healing gun also seems to be pretty useless in an active firefight, especially compared to the opportunity cost of shooting an actual gun instead" :-) I think I missed you were talking explicitly about the self-heal though, which is (as I think I said) pretty good/useful and one of the main reasons I enjoyed playing as medic. I suppose there's two other points to be made when talking about the relative utility of the medic: 1) You can miss with the healing gun (lol) 2) You don't need to be a medic to have a method of healing yourself and others (i.e. the medical crates) The heal gun is fairly clearly suffering from the removal of the revive ability, so I wouldn't be surprised if it got further tweaks. Definitely think making it an offhand would be a good change, it feels awful to slowly switch to it, fire (and hope your teammate doesn't dodge), and then swap back...
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Oct 13, 2021 11:01
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active firefight to me means like you both take 50 damage, you retreat behind cover and heal to full, then pop out while the other guy is trying to aggro you in an extremely unfair 100 v 55 health situation
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Oct 13, 2021 11:05
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Just "you and at least one enemy are aware of each other, are shooting each other, and are both capable of killing each other" for me. So not very long range potshot duels. There's just very few situations where healing a teammate isn't best left til after the bullets have stopped flying, unless you're literally going to die if you pop your head out (there's a tank outside or you're being strafed, for example). Again, self-heals are a different deal as you can essentially queue this up as soon as you think you can get back into cover and you weren't going to be using a gun for a few seconds anyway.
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Oct 13, 2021 11:08
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Thirsty Dog posted:Just "you and at least one enemy are aware of each other, are shooting each other, and are both capable of killing each other" for me. So not very long range potshot duels. There's just very few situations where healing a teammate isn't best left til after the bullets have stopped flying, unless you're literally going to die if you pop your head out (there's a tank outside or you're being strafed, for example). Again, self-heals are a different deal as you can essentially queue this up as soon as you think you can get back into cover and you weren't going to be using a gun for a few seconds anyway. This mentality is all wrong. If you just sniped them with your Carl Gustav like you were supposed to, you wouldn’t need to write an internet essay about it. Further more “dying” just becomes getting more Carl Gustavs once you learn to play the game correctly.
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Oct 13, 2021 11:12
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the main problem with healing teammates is they have to realize they can be healed and understand they can reset or turn situations with support healing. this is a problem even in overwatch where one of its main selling features is a big fat Healer role UI and voice comms help a lot with this but it really is a skill someone has to learn. tons of people don't even understand they should use cover so it can be rough to help them out.
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Oct 13, 2021 11:12
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VulgarandStupid posted:This mentality is all wrong. but I don't have a Carl Gustav yet  The recoilless can do a job but it's not the same. comedyblissoption posted:the main problem with healing teammates is they have to realize they can be healed and understand they can reset or turn situations with support healing. this is a problem even in overwatch where one of its main selling features is a big fat Healer role The other problem is that aside from the ticket loss, half the time just dying and respawning with full ammo feels like a better bet in the mad world of 2042 where there's little extra ammo and you want more rockets/grenades
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Oct 13, 2021 11:45
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comedyblissoption posted:specialists looking identical is stupid as gently caress Paul MaudDib posted:isn't "IFF light" just a cute euphemism for dorito? I thought battlefield players hated that.  comedyblissoption posted:I checked a video to see how long it takes to regen to full and this is how long from ~12 health: Thirsty Dog posted:I guess I just don't agree that the TTK is that high. I've been killing people faster than they can react most of the time in closer range combat, and at long range it's a couple of hits with the sniper-pistol to kill someone anyway.
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Oct 13, 2021 11:48
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Krogort posted:I am surprised that there are so few people talking about the TTK considering what an important topic it was for BFV Forever unreal to me that people think being able to survive several clips of high caliber ammunition from close range is an essential feature in a shootmans game. If anything it was still a little bit too slow in the beta
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Oct 13, 2021 12:02
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