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Nov 10, 2009

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New Battlefield game already off to a good start I see

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Nov 10, 2009

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Captain Beans posted:

ah hmm well I guess it's all to be seen. I saw the OP bullet point of AI in FULL matches to mean that there will always be some bots, but that could mean bots just fill empty player slots.
Someone linked an article earlier that implied they'd be OG style bots which replace players rather than Titanfall-esque style AI grunts:
https://wccftech.com/battlefield-2042-deep-dive-with-dice-128-players-ai-bots-huge-maps-dynamic-events-specialists-and-more/

quote:

You can basically play all alone as a human player in a match otherwise filled with AI on both sides. Or, if needed, it can be a mix of humans and AI. DICE said they've had this on their whiteboard for many years, and they are finally at a place where they can offer it.

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Nov 10, 2009

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LGD posted:

my hangover from BF V is probably large enough that they was simply no way they were going to win me over with a single video, but either way its just not quite giving me the fizz
This is kinda me right now though the trailer really did hit the right spots for me, as well as the announcement that bot matches are a thing again.

V for Vegans posted:

They made it seem like you could call them on the fly, which would be nice when the match spawns and everyone drives off in the jeeps with 3 empty seats leaving their team behind. It will be funny to see a sea of ATVs right off the start though
After 1 and 5 having basically no transport vehicles I'm 100% okay with every player getting an ATV

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Nov 10, 2009

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Orv posted:

A remake of 1942 would see a return of the worst BF map, Wake Island and thus I must decline.
I hope Wake returns and that no one has bothered to move the Beach Landing flagpole for 100 years

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Nov 10, 2009

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Orv posted:

I feel like both the best and worst experiences from Battlefield come from one point turning into a meatgrinder of people just piling in from every direction and while it usually turns out fun more often than frustrating I don't know why people enjoy subjecting themselves to like thirty minutes straight of "Walk around corner, shoot one man, eat grenade."
Locker was fun as a palate cleanser every couple of maps but it sucked when every server ran the map vote plugin and it decided that every second vote had to include Locker as an option because I found playing it every second map was tiring.

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Nov 10, 2009

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Fart Car '97 posted:

Tarkov is absolutely in the same vein of games as your standard battle royale titles. Solo or Small squad, open world pvp survival, High stakes, loot based. It's a evolution of the formula but it's much more akin to PUBG than it is a looter shooter or a standard BF or COD MP. Hazard Zone sounds like an obvious grab at the Apex/Warzone/PUBG playerbase but I guess we'll find out on the 22nd.
I'd call it BR-adjacent but not actually a BR itself and that games like Tarkov/Hunt are more offshoots or continuations of the orginal DayZ concept. Like if BRs are a codified, proper version of the end-state of DayZ (hunting other players once you are geared because there isn't anything else to do), then games like Tarkov, Hunt, and The Division 1's Survival Mode are the mirror of that, taking the original concept of an open world that you scavenge gear in and is populated by enemy NPCs and players that may or may not be hostile and adding objectives other than directly shooting other players.

Maybe I'm totally off-base because I'm missing some crucial facts or something but that has always made the most sense to me.

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Nov 10, 2009

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DrBox posted:

I'm so hype I've been watching every trailer breakdown video I can find looking for more gameplay details. I know people were wondering about vehicle entry/exit animations. Not sure about exit animations but it was pointed out that you can see an entry animation for someone jumping in one of the side gunner seats on the Osprey being pulled into the tornado. You have to slow it right down to see it. I liked the animations so as long as they are kept to a couple seconds I think it'll be ok. I just hope they aren't as long as the BF5 troop carrier one where you open the doors and walk all the way through from the back.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WomAGoEh-Ss#t=135s
On the other hand despite their seemingly deliberate attempt to cover it up with a conveniently placed piece of cover, if you look at the scene with the C4 quad it looks like the guy riding the quad gets out instantly if you watch the markers for friendly players and minimap, so I wonder if it's going to be CoD Warzone style where there's an animation that plays for getting into a vehicle but gameplay wise you "enter" it instantly, and exiting just causes you to pop out.

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Nov 10, 2009

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Kibayasu posted:

Vehicle animations are fine. It was always dumb that a player can instantly escape danger and also become much more dangerous just because they happen to be beside a vehicle. Players being able to leave vehicles instantly and appear in seemingly random spots around it is also dumb.
Jeep Stuff is cool actually

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Nov 10, 2009

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Krogort posted:

And reliably getting kills on tank drivers rather than having them flee and disappear like rats if there is cover around.
Actually tank drivers bailing because being able to instantly get out of their vehicle making them feel safe owns because it meant a chance to steal a tank, a classic Battlefield tradition

I think I could count the number times I've seen a stolen tank in both BF1 and V combined on one hand

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Nov 10, 2009

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Orv posted:

I am not a fan of vehicles in general
Sir this is the Battlefield thread

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Nov 10, 2009

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Yami Fenrir posted:


When a single tank rolls up to a checkpoint in BF4 it's entirely fine, for example, but I've had games where I was capturing a random point and 2 tanks and an LAV rolled up to it at the same point. And of course they all have infrared, probably also have motion sensors, AND can just straight up ignore a rocket every 25 seconds. ALL of them.
I mean 2 tanks and 1 IFV is the majority of a team's armour for a lot of the maps so I'd be more surprised if they didn't take the point.

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Nov 10, 2009

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Blue Raider posted:

M249, Win1894, Famas, M14, P90, some kind of semi auto shotty doesnt matter what kind, Bizon, Remington 700, Tavor

Iíd also like some eccentric nonsense like bleeding edge guns and milsurp as long as they donít go overboard.
Bring back the battle-pickup Railgun from Final Stand

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Nov 10, 2009

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Yami Fenrir posted:

Speaking of new physics poo poo, tank treads actually deform to properly roll over stuff when you drive over a car or something.
They've actually done this since BC2, though the effect got notably less pronounced in BF3/4.

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Nov 10, 2009

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Kazinsal posted:

People in helos suck a lot less than they used to. I think I probably fired off two dozen stingers in a match on Paracel Storm last night and didn't hit a fuckin thing.
As someone who primarily played as a Stinger engineer since BF4's launch let me assure you that that's just standard Stinger behavior, especially if you're launching from max range.

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Nov 10, 2009

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priznat posted:

In battlefield the vehicle unlocks were the worst imo, especially when you can never get in one or get blown up as soon as you snag something
At least in 4 you start with an unlock in every slot by default. I still remember in 3 planes not having flares for the first 1100 or so points until they finally patched it so everyone has them by default.

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Nov 10, 2009

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jisforjosh posted:

I think I'm just incapable of playing BF4 again
Me: Reading this thread and getting an ego boost because I'm still scoreboard topping or close to it
Also Me:
https://i.imgur.com/S6G6ahx.gifv

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Nov 10, 2009

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Yami Fenrir posted:

Fair. Still a vehicle, though.

Actually weren't LAVs just straight up better than Tanks at one point? To the point LAVs usually went to hunt Tanks?

But honestly what I want the most from BF2042 is having actual counter measures against Jets. You can mostly do something against other vehicles, but against a good jet player the counterplay pretty much boils down to a) be an even better jet player or b) cry in a hidden corner.
LAVs were better back in ye old days of BF3, where LAVs didn't take directional damage but tanks did, and could take both HE and AP autocannon ammo and just spam switch weapon to double their ROF (since each ammo type was considered a separate weapon this had separate reloads).

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Nov 10, 2009

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Oh yeah I forgot another thing that made IFVs better in BF3: the best-in-slot upgrade Reactive Armour, which absorbed 1 RPG shot from the side it was mounted on, covered all 4 sides in the IFV (so you were guaranteed to block at least one shot) whereas the tank only had it on 3 sides (sides and back).

Yami Fenrir posted:

Ohhhh, that makes sense.

It's honestly hard for me to keep the two games apart since they're so similar in a lot of ways.

The thing I remember the most is that I liked the BF3 maps a lot more than the BF4 maps, honestly. I just feel like the BF3 maps had a lot more character. Like Seine Crossing or the Dama something Peaks maps. I remember those, while BF4 maps seem to mostly be variations of "largely wide open map with little to no cover from air vehicles."

I used to play a LOT of Flood Zone simply because it was an exception to that.
I much prefer the gameplay of 4 but I think I also preferred the maps in 3, especially the DLC maps from Armored Kill onwards. Though while I can't recall the maps off-hand I distinctly recall disliking several base BF3 maps, meanwhile in BF4 there isn't a map I generally dislike enough to groan when it comes up.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that for me, BF3 had lower lows and higher highs, while BF4 had a more consistent throughput, which led to 3's maps being much more memorable to me.

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Nov 10, 2009

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I kinda miss the launch BF4 movement where you didn't go from a dead stop to full sprint immediately but instead when you started sprinting you'd actually accelerate up to max speed over a second or two. It was eventually patched out because it didn't play very well with the netcode (servers were like 10 tic or something ridiculous at launch) but I thought it gave the game a unique feel.

jisforjosh posted:

Hopping back into a Littlebird was like riding a bike and went on a decently long streak once I got my loadout situated (thanks Battlelog for not updating my ingame poo poo) but the BF4 gunplay/handling has definitely aged poorly
I just use the test range if I need to adjust my loadout before entering a server.

Kibayasu posted:

I can’t kill things worth a poo poo in the scout chopper but I can at least fly the thing competently and be an annoying bastard with LGMs and the 25mm cannon. Occasionally I even steal a kill from a tank that was shooting an enemy tank already.
I can't hit poo poo with aircraft guns* in general, and I can't imagine how much practice it would take to consistently be able to strafe people, especially in the jets. I can generally hold my own in a dogfight though so it's always super funny when someone is sky-goding and I finally manage to snag a Stealth Fighter and we sort of just take each other out of the game for the entire rest of the map, forever padlocked in a perpetual dogfight.

*Rockets and JDAMs are fine though

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Nov 10, 2009

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Remember: Tanks have the weakest armour on the bottom
https://i.imgur.com/VHEFdUH.gifv

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Nov 10, 2009

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Paracel Storm owns

Why yes I'm in the boat or jet how'd you know

Kibayasu posted:

I know Iím weird in this opinion but I actually very much prefer BF4ís more cumbersome (though thatís only compared to BF1/5) movement and more ambiguous approach to recoil and reticule bloom even when ADS. I donít hate BF1 and 5 at all but I feel that when every weapon isnít a pinpoint sniper and not every bullet goes to exactly where youíre aiming (when youíre firing in full auto from longer ranges) it adds excitement somehow? Like I might actually be able to cross an opening without immediately getting mown down or maybe Iím on the shooting side of that and donít quite kill someone and now I have to deal with that.
Nah I get this. There's a super notable lack of lethality past a certain range due to bullet travel time, damage drop-off, and fairly large accuracy spreads that pretty much makes it so only Sniper Rifles and bipod MGs can really effectively kill you if you're not just standing in the open like an idiot. In a way I think it's a very overlooked part of the "Battlefield" feel of sprinting across a stretch of ground as rounds zip by you and you know there's a very real possibility that you'll actually make it to the cover at the other end, as opposed to games where the high accuracy on the guns means that you're guaranteed dead unless the other guy really potatoes it.

Laserface posted:

MW2019/warzone is straight up a poker machine win sound. its hilarious.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbTwAbyjpv8

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Nov 10, 2009

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Kibayasu posted:

Sniper rifles in particular become incredibly broken since they go from needing 2 body hits to kill any at range (I believe even up to 3 hits if you hit limbs with all 3 shots at long range) to kill to needing 1 hit literally anywhere on a player at any range to kill.
You can totally body someone with a sniper rifle in core because they all have 100 damage up to about 15m, so they'll die unless you hit a limb or they're running the defense spec (gives your chest the limb multiplier).

(The rest of the post is correct I'm just being needless nitpicky because I've gotten a significant about of sniper kills with iron-sight bolt-action bodyshots )

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Nov 10, 2009

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Orv posted:

My hottest possible Battlefield take; being able to repair choppers as passengers is stupid.
They did nerf it post-launch (can't remember how, I think the chopper have to be below a certain speed in order for the repairs to work?) but yeah it's very powerful. At launch they were legit more powerful than the attack choppers lol.

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Nov 10, 2009

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Between Sinai and Suez I want to know who hit their head on the DICE level design team. Like Sinai has this giant cluster of caps in the north but in the south (which is like 2/3rds of the size of the map) has a single solitary point all the way at the bottom?

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Nov 10, 2009

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Kibayasu posted:

I donít remember liking DMRs before in BF4 but I do now!
You know, you're not the only one. A couple of my friends said the same thing which is funny because I remember them making GBS threads on DMRs back in the day and being confused why my top gun was the M39 EMR.

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Nov 10, 2009

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Perestroika posted:

Yeah, I keep bouncing around between that one and the RPG. The SMAW is easier to land hits with, but I keep telling myself that one of these days those extra ~5 damage from the RPG will make the difference when shooting a tank
IIRC the damage between the SMAW and RPG actually is set up in a way that the SMAW almost always takes 1 extra shot to kill. Like a perfect rear shot on a tank with an RPG does 55 damage but a SMAW only does 48, and I don't recall the front numbers offhand but IIRC the RPG takes 4 frontal shots to kill a tank but the SMAW takes 5. Granted if you're using the SMAW at that point the tank's probably at like single digit HP but if he has an engineer buddy that can mean the difference between a dead tank and one that makes it away.

Also remember that your damage is actually modified by the angle that you hit at (further away from 90 degree perpendicular = less damage) so the RPG is slightly more generous on the angles too.

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Nov 10, 2009

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Chronojam posted:

That's the trick, you really only need a couple people willing to return fire. It's just that they're conditioned into learned helplessness versus air threats that most people don't try.
The irony of personal AA between BF4 and BF1 is that despite BF1 AA being generally a lot more effective overall the mechanics of BF4 AA meant that if your teammates weren't doing anything it was easier to at least shoo the enemy air away by yourself, even if you never kill them. In BF1 if you're the only person shooting at planes I generally find the only thing you end up accomplishing is marking your own position with tracers so it becomes this almost prisoners dilemma-eqsue situation where if there aren't enough people shooting at the plane you're better off not shooting either and hoping the plane bombs someone else.

Kibayasu posted:

There was the carrier mode in BF4 but since that was only on the DLC maps and also not as good it didn't stay populated long.
I unironically love carrier assault but don't understand why made it a 32 player mode. I don't think it'd be drastically more popular due to it being a DLC mode but I'd suspect that if it was a 64 player mode it might show up occasionally in the rotation on those all DLC maps (I think BF4 has the ability to mix multiple gamemodes in the rotation? I'm pretty sure that was possible in BF3).

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Nov 10, 2009

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jisforjosh posted:

Psst, Carrier Assault Large is a thing
Large is 32 players, small is 24 IIRC. Small only has like, 3 missile points per map.

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Nov 10, 2009

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Kibayasu posted:

As much as it seems besides the point, you just donít use the burst. Burst modes barely have a use in actual guns much less video games. Does that turn the gun into just another slow firing AR? Yep.

It did have a point in Bad Company 2 where you were allowed to shoot the 2 rounds (almost) as fast as you could click but youíre as likely to just not shoot when you expected to in BF4.
Note: Don't listen to this guy because the AN-94 has literally twice the RoF in burst as it does in full auto (1200RPM versus 600).

Also in BF4 the burst fire does have a niche in that the first shot recoil multiplier on guns is applied on the final round of the burst, instead of the first one, which makes it noticeably easier to control at range. I personally don't bother most of the time because I hate cycling through the fire modes constantly but if you're firing short bursts at someone it's actually technically optimal to switch to burst mode first.

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Nov 10, 2009

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Kibayasu posted:

If you werenít artificially limited by the game in how fast you were allowed to fire the burst the RPM would matter but you are so it doesnít.
It literally doesn't do this

source: me using way too much M4 and M16A4

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Nov 10, 2009

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I fail to see how everyone carrying rockets and never having ammo is somehow different from your average BF4 match

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Nov 10, 2009

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codo27 posted:

Exclusively play HC and mostly exclusively use snipers dont @ me
Don't listen to all the gatekeepers bro your playstyle is valid so long as you're having fun, even if I'll probably curse you silently behind the scenes if you end up on my team

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Nov 10, 2009

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Kibayasu posted:

1942 had a small scale remake in Frostbite with BF1943 (which wasn’t released on PC) so I suspect that’s why 1942 as it were is in this at all.
1943 was Pacific only IIRC so there was obviously at least some work done given they showed Germans in the trailer

They'll probably swipe a bunch of BFV assets honestly

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Nov 10, 2009

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Kibayasu posted:

For the scout choppers specifically thereís a couple of related things that combine into a bigger thing. I think the speed of repairs is the biggest factor rather than being able to repair at all. The related factor is that wIth ECM or flares a scout helicopter is guaranteed to have time. ECM and flares arenít a chance to evade a missile but a guaranteed miss.

For BF4 Iíve usually thought that a countermeasure should have been for a specific attack rather than all of them. Flares could stop a lock or hit from heatseekers but do nothing against radar missiles, same for ECM against heatseekers. You could throw in another countermeasure type for lasers like tanks have.
I think the biggest problem (or at least, a big problem) is that seems to have balanced aircraft HP and missile damage based on having no countermeasures at all and not taking their sheer mobility into account, and because like you said CMs are a guaranteed miss for the missile the knock-on effect is that it takes drastically more missiles than it looks like on paper to take down an aircraft. Just to give an example, a Stinger* does 35% damage per hit, so it requires 3 hits to knock something out of the sky, but because of reload and lock times, even if a helo or jet is literally just orbiting you forever, the first and fourth missile will always be decoyed and so it takes a minimum of 5 missiles (the pattern being decoy/hit/hit/decoy/hit) to take something down. I'm assuming this is all by yourself mind you, because unlike against ground vehicles the nature of CMs means that it's a lot more awkward to try and "stack" multiple missiles against air targets and it doesn't work nearly as effectively.

If even simply made it so planes/helos took 2 hits to kill instead of 3, you'd probably see way more get shot down because despite the on-paper hits to kill going down by one, you'd reduce the practical amount of missiles needed by 2 (so you'd only need to shoot 3 of them). I've frequently gotten 2 hits on aircraft by being smart and not immediately launching missiles at max range but it never matters because they still have so much time to fly away and repair (or just straight up murder me). Honestly I'd argue that planes should die to 1 missile, because CMs give you literal missile immunity for several seconds and you can literally just fly away and go bother people on the other side of the map instead. I'd personally be okay with planes being death machines if that lethality went both ways, but that's just me.

*I'm leaving the Igla out of this because I have way less experience with it and also it's kinda hard to quantify the tricks you can do with it like double missile stacking or shooting at a different aircraft and switching targets at the last second

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The United States posted:

The funniest part of the BF2042 reveal trailer was the countermeasures failing when we all know that will never happen in game
Maybe it's them trying to tell us that they've reworked the countermeasures so they're less of a binary state! Right guys? Guys?

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Nov 10, 2009

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Alkydere posted:

I just love all the truly wonky guns in BF1. It was an age of experimentation and confusion in gun manufacturing so you get so many truly goofy weapons.

In what other game would an SMG that holds only 8+1 rounds be considered a reasonable (if not exactly good) weapon?
I love that one Austro-Hungarian machine pistol that holds 16 rounds and is loaded via 2 8-round stripper clips and fires at like 1200RPM. You'll demolish precisely 1 person per reload but that one dude will get shredded to hell.

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ScootsMcSkirt posted:

My personal fav is the Perino, just for the reload:
One of the German MGs had a reload mechanic where if you reloaded above like, 10 rounds (below that your character would just pull the belt out the ejection side), he'd crank the handle on the drum belt and the amount of cranks depended on how much ammo you had expended. So if you used the 200-round version of the gun you could have a ~10s reload:
https://i.imgur.com/TuHqK1a.gifv

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Nov 10, 2009

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BigglesSWE posted:

While obviously not very obscure, the reload of the Lebel will always be my favorite. Itís soooooo satisfying.

https://youtu.be/daY72vbGf1Y
My favourite part of the Lebel was if you used K Bullets you'd have like, half the fire rate of other rifles due to the way the magazine cutoff works, forcing your character to have to essentially rack the bolt twice before it'd load the round. Thanks France!

jisforjosh posted:

BF1 was definitely peak attention to detail as far as reloads and sounds were concerned imo. The little things sound wise like rain dropping on the spent artillery shells, the sound of your feet causing those same casings to make a slight rolling/shifting sound, and poo poo like casings from your gun sounding completely different depending on the surface they landed on (even little ploop sounds if they landed in water)
Yeah it's insane how much detail went into those animations. Someone else mentioned it, but the Mosin had a separate reload depending on how much rounds you had left in the gun which was awesome because it wasn't just a single cycled animation of loading one round at a time like most guns. Also how all the DLC bolt-actions if you only had one round left your character would just dump the last round out and load in a stripper clip instead of slowly topping off the gun.

Has anyone mentioned the Colt SAA yet? Someone had a ton of fun animation all those Revolver Ocelot-esque animations.

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Nov 10, 2009

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Bots will probably actually give you medkits and ammo if asked, making them superior to the average player

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Nov 10, 2009

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jisforjosh posted:

BF4 is the best sandbox Battlefield game but BF1 is just the best in every other category.
This is more of a personal preference thing but I much prefer BF4's weapon type distribution with having three different all-class weapon types compared to BF1's strict "each class gets a range" setup, even if BF4 technically did start the trend by replacing the Engineer's main weapon type with PDWs. It means I actually get to enjoy my time playing as Recon instead of being stuck with a bolt-action (though ironically I really enjoyed bolt-actions in BF1).

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