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nielsm
Jun 1, 2009



cruft posted:

I've spent the last few weeks trying to get AI to write code for me, and I have bad news for the people who think nobody will ever use AI to write code.

There are plenty of situations where horrible code is churned out, and as soon as it checks all the functionality boxes, it's shipped. This is just making that process faster.

With guidance, the code actually came out pretty good. But I had to have arguments with it about things to convince it that what it was asserting was a good practice was actually a horrible idea. For my demonstration online game, we were able to do about 40 hours of work in 90 minutes.

I don't really like the implications for where early career programmers fit into all this.

How easy to exploit is that software then? How would it have been if you hadn't been a competent person and been able to identify and correct horrible design mistakes?

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Koskun
Apr 20, 2004
I worship the ground NinjaPablo walks on

wash bucket posted:

My criticisms of AI aren't about what it can do, but what it will be used to do. It will be used to cut corners and do things as cheap as possible to goose next quarter's profits. We'll be up to our ears in poo poo for the sake of shareholder value.

I wonder if how it is perceived that AI is cheap to use, will that bubble pop once the actual bills start coming due? At least in the State's it won't be from regulations.

xedFour40
Jul 21, 2024

cruft posted:

I've spent the last few weeks trying to get AI to write code for me, and I have bad news for the people who think nobody will ever use AI to write code.

There are plenty of situations where horrible code is churned out, and as soon as it checks all the functionality boxes, it's shipped. This is just making that process faster.

With guidance, the code actually came out pretty good. But I had to have arguments with it about things to convince it that what it was asserting was a good practice was actually a horrible idea. For my demonstration online game, we were able to do about 40 hours of work in 90 minutes.

I don't really like the implications for where early career programmers fit into all this.

You can’t grow a pig on its own poo poo. Once AI starts ingesting code written by a previous AI, it’ll fall off the cliff.

cruft
Oct 25, 2007

nielsm posted:

How easy to exploit is that software then? How would it have been if you hadn't been a competent person and been able to identify and correct horrible design mistakes?

I think my answers to these questions will not surprise you, so I'm not going to bother typing them in :)

Mozi
Apr 4, 2004

Forms change so fast
Time is moving past
Memory is smoke
Gonna get wider when I die
Nap Ghost

cruft posted:

With guidance, the code actually came out pretty good. But I had to have arguments with it about things to convince it that what it was asserting was a good practice was actually a horrible idea. For my demonstration online game, we were able to do about 40 hours of work in 90 minutes.

Every time somebody talks about how good AI can code, it's for whipping up some sample demo project.

Let me know how well it goes when you use AI to build a large, complex, and novel application over many months.

Cool Dad
Jun 15, 2007

Look out, here come my posts
I mean that's happening all over the place right now and it's going pretty bad!

Harminoff
Oct 24, 2005

👽
Programming is way more than writing code though. I probably spend 1/5th my time actually doing that.

You also need to know a lot about architecture and how everything is structured in the company.

I can't imagine having AI do it, it breaking, and having no idea why, having to try and argue with the AI to try and fix it, while stakeholders and customers are waiting for a resolution.

If my stuff breaks, it's pretty easy to figure out the issue and fix it. I don't think that is really the case with AI written code.

Fallom
Sep 6, 2008

I mainly use it to save me a ton of hours doing stupid data processing and visualization tricks

God bless LLMs for letting me do literally anything else with my life than iterate on Plotly

WattsvilleBlues
Jan 25, 2005

Every demon wants his pound of flesh

Jesus loving Christ, what a tone-deaf bag of cum. That dude is clearly an android and I, for one, do not welcome our artificial lifeform overlords.

~Coxy
Dec 9, 2003

R.I.P. Inter-OS Sass - b.2000AD d.2003AD

Harminoff posted:

Hey at least they updated Xbox 360! to inject it with ads!

This was particularly bad. Obviously MS loves to put ads in updates, but they specifically updated an old console that they had already sunset all the online services for, just for ad.

mikey
Sep 22, 2002

Latest Windows 11 update trip report:
• Installed, rebooted, no apparent problems. Go to play a YT video, get deafeningly-loud and odd-sounding audio. Cool, OK?
• Check volume levels, normal. Check channel setup, normal. Check driver versions, no change. Firefox updated too, maybe it's just the browser somehow.
• Run music player. Loud as gently caress. Hmmm.
• Play a game. Not only loud, but zero audio coming from behind me, like it thinks my default playback device set to two channel stereo is actually a surround system.
• Change and reset every setting in the Realtek control panel. This somehow fixes the channel issue, but it's still twice as loud and sounding weird.
• Remember Equalizer APO exists, that I'm using it, and that my EQ has a -9dBA preamp that matches the volume change. Run the EQAPO control panel, it says no devices have installed hooks - cool, the update must have removed all of the APO hooks, so I re-installed them.
• All device handles in my EQ config are invalid even after re-installing hooks, because apparently the update re-created all audio device IDs in the system, and I have to re-define all of the device selections in my EQ config.
Thanks Microsoft.

Blue Footed Booby
Oct 4, 2006

got those happy feet

Lol, realtek

I use speakers with a built-in USB DAC in large part to never have to deal with their poo poo again.

Not saying this is in any way related to your issues; the name makes me hiss like a startled possum.

Alkanos
Jul 20, 2009

Ia! Ia! Cthulhu Fht-YAWN

mikey posted:

Latest Windows 11 update trip report:
• Installed, rebooted, no apparent problems. Go to play a YT video, get deafeningly-loud and odd-sounding audio. Cool, OK?
• Check volume levels, normal. Check channel setup, normal. Check driver versions, no change. Firefox updated too, maybe it's just the browser somehow.
• Run music player. Loud as gently caress. Hmmm.
• Play a game. Not only loud, but zero audio coming from behind me, like it thinks my default playback device set to two channel stereo is actually a surround system.
• Change and reset every setting in the Realtek control panel. This somehow fixes the channel issue, but it's still twice as loud and sounding weird.
• Remember Equalizer APO exists, that I'm using it, and that my EQ has a -9dBA preamp that matches the volume change. Run the EQAPO control panel, it says no devices have installed hooks - cool, the update must have removed all of the APO hooks, so I re-installed them.
• All device handles in my EQ config are invalid even after re-installing hooks, because apparently the update re-created all audio device IDs in the system, and I have to re-define all of the device selections in my EQ config.
Thanks Microsoft.

Oh, so it's an Equalizer APO & Windows 11 issue, and not just me. I've been having issues with that ultra-loud distorted sound popping up randomly. It's a pretty easy fix, go into EQAPO and deactivate/reactivate the hook. I figured it was something with my setup specifically, and I was too lazy to actually dig in to work it out. But sounds like it might be more widespread (and maybe have a fix someone else found).

Fruits of the sea
Dec 1, 2010

Blue Footed Booby posted:

Lol, realtek

I use speakers with a built-in USB DAC in large part to never have to deal with their poo poo again.

Not saying this is in any way related to your issues; the name makes me hiss like a startled possum.

I haven’t had issues with Realtek drivers for quite a while but yeah, an external DAC just works 99% of the time.

mikey
Sep 22, 2002

I did a ton of reading about external DACs, and 99% is generous. Maybe 95%? Lots of people have popping or latency problems with them, and for gaming I didn't want to deal with any unnecessary latency, as I'm rather sensitive to it. Realtek's recent drivers are actually fine and I've had zero issues with them until this Windows update hiccup, and the ALC1220 is very respectable DAC so long as it's implemented with proper isolation and none of your internal components produce audible EMI.

Volguus
Mar 3, 2009

mikey posted:

I did a ton of reading about external DACs, and 99% is generous. Maybe 95%? Lots of people have popping or latency problems with them,

Oh .. that's news to me. Been using external DACs for a while now (20-ish years) and while i've gone through quite a few in that time, don't remember ever hitting that problem. Then again, it's only one data point. True, I always bought the best DAC my budget allowed for at the time. USB or optical.

mikey
Sep 22, 2002

Optical is a bit more reliable, but then you're once again dependent on the onboard audio drivers, and it still adds some latency. There are drawbacks to all forms of PC audio, and you have to pick your poison.

Fallom
Sep 6, 2008

mikey posted:

I did a ton of reading about external DACs, and 99% is generous. Maybe 95%? Lots of people have popping or latency problems with them, and for gaming I didn't want to deal with any unnecessary latency, as I'm rather sensitive to it. Realtek's recent drivers are actually fine and I've had zero issues with them until this Windows update hiccup, and the ALC1220 is very respectable DAC so long as it's implemented with proper isolation and none of your internal components produce audible EMI.

Yeah my Fiio has some stupid power saving mode that causes pops and the only way to disable it is to install the driver software and edit an ini file to unlock a hidden option in the software

Looking the issue up again it looks like it’s pretty common for their products

Here’s the instructions if you run into it: https://www.reddit.com/r/FiiO/s/2dzN3Dh09x

Fallom fucked around with this message at 01:19 on Jul 12, 2025

cruft
Oct 25, 2007

mikey posted:

There are drawbacks to all forms of PC audio, and you have to pick your poison.

Back in the early 90s I made a DAC using a parallel port and eight resistors.

Unbelievably, the damned thing worked.

Volguus
Mar 3, 2009

Fallom posted:

Yeah my Fiio has some stupid power saving mode that causes pops and the only way to disable it is to install the driver software and edit an ini file to unlock a hidden option in the software

Oooh, I had a Fiio at one time (it's now sleeping with the fish in the basement) and I remember seeing latency on input with Rocksmith. The solution was just to plug in the rocksmith usb cable directly into the MB USB ports. But other than that was fine.

Fruits of the sea
Dec 1, 2010

There’s always ASIO passthrough

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Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Fruits of the sea posted:

There’s always ASIO passthrough

ASIO just avoids any latency in the Windows audio stack between your source application and the output (mixing, effects software, some driver crap). A Fiio and most other cheap USB DACs are using UAC1/2, so they don't have any driver crap. If it has bad latency and another device on the same machine does not, it's probably because the Fiio itself is adding latency.


With many of these consumer USB DACs, they support high bit depth & sample rates but latency goes up if you do that. I have a Schiit USB DAC / headphone amp combo with that problem. If you stick with normal 16bit/48kHz, or really anything 24/96 or below, the latency is fine. In line with any other decent consumer audio. (IE fine for rhythm games, not good for studio recording.) But it supports a completely stupid 32b/384kHz rate. If you set it to 192 it's bad, and gets worse from there.

The other issue with anything USB is you can add a small chunk of latency by choosing the wrong usb port, if some of your ports are actually controlled by some secondary internal hub / controller.

Klyith fucked around with this message at 02:58 on Jul 13, 2025

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