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WE'RE STILL HERE, WE'RE STILL QUEER, AND NOW WE'RE A N G R Y post your big queer rage here. keep it BYOB though. anyone being unbyob, well, they'll get a talkin'-to. |
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Jul 1, 2021 00:39
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| # ? May 2, 2024 23:39 |
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I'm mad that everywhere is out of cool rainbow capitalist bullshit so I can't cover mean bumper stickers with gay af bumper stickers so instead I have been helpfully filling in everyone's color your own pride flag stickers. It's very nice. |
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Jul 1, 2021 00:41
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 everything along these lines
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Jul 1, 2021 01:08
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biosterous posted:
lmao |
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Jul 1, 2021 01:45
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biosterous posted:
hm this kind of thing is very near and dear to my professional specialties and its actually something I'm really cautious about. I think it's really difficult to call most people in the Eurocentric world prior to the mid-19th century definitively "gay" or definitively "straight" because people tended to have very little sense of "who you gently caress" as a stable predicate for identity. It was more like... ok, you're born, probably you will want to have sex with someone of the opposite gender to help continue your "family," but maybe you'll also want to have sex with someone of the same gender, or more often maybe you'll just wind up having sex with people of the same gender because it was convenient or the only option or you were just bored-- but there was not really a ubiquitous sense of homo- or heterosexuality in the sense of a constitutive building block of the self. which is complicated and you know, itself an elision of specificities at different places at different times but it's like-- I get the impulse. To take an easy example, Abraham Lincoln. There's more than enough textual evidence to suggest that he was far from what we'd call, in 2021, straight. But to say he was gay would be imposing an anachronism on him-- even to call him bi would be to imply that he wasn't the product of an age that instrumentalized sex and desire in a much different way than we do. so when I teach queer lit or queer history or queer theory or whatever I try hard to emphasize queer acts and queer valences of identity rather than gestures of queer self-determination which truly would not have been an option for most people in the West. It's like pointing at a horse and saying "well, if it's not a Miata, then what is it?? The options are Miata or Subaru, what the gently caress is it?? What car is this???" It's not a car. It's a horse that fucks other boy horses and that's just fine no matter what language it had for itself. Which is to say-- I love queer inquiries into medievalism, I love trans histories of pre-modern subjects. I'm just very very finnicky about trying not to infringe upon the often very nuanced language people had for themselves and for their queer relationships and subjectivities.
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Jul 1, 2021 01:48
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How Wonderful! posted:hm this kind of thing is very near and dear to my professional specialties and its actually something I'm really cautious about. I think it's really difficult to call most people in the Eurocentric world prior to the mid-19th century definitively "gay" or definitively "straight" because people tended to have very little sense of "who you gently caress" as a stable predicate for identity. It was more like... ok, you're born, probably you will want to have sex with someone of the opposite gender to help continue your "family," but maybe you'll also want to have sex with someone of the same gender, or more often maybe you'll just wind up having sex with people of the same gender because it was convenient or the only option or you were just bored-- but there was not really a ubiquitous sense of homo- or heterosexuality in the sense of a constitutive building block of the self. i need to reread this post-fever so i can actually think about it, thank you for a good post
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Jul 1, 2021 01:54
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But I mean of course the kind of stodgy "well we don't need to worry about this" handwaving is still sadly prevalent. I guess I just trained at a fairly hip institution and didn't have to deal with it much. I still see it a lot with trans or proto-trans or earlier gender-variant or noncomforming people though I think just because that's still such a discursive battlefield. I really feel convinced by the scholar Grace Lavery's reading, for example, of George Eliot who really wanted to be seen and read as a man and who quite likely wanted to live as a man. It all fits for me. But there were so many people who weren't even like engaging with her evidence, they just were like, no, George Eliot's a woman and spouting a lot of ahistorical nonsense based on long debunked myths about the demesne of women writers in the 19th century. I feel a lot of recognition and longing when I read about you know, Daniel Paul Schreber, or Rachilde, Marc de Montifaud, Jean Dieulafoy, other writers of the past who we might recognize as trans or having some common tether of conviction or hope that trans people in 2021 have. But at the same time I remember when Troubling the Line came out and listed John Wieners as a trans writer based on some letters that imo just deeply misapprehend gay NYC lingo of the mid-century and every trans poet I know was also like girl, John Wieners, what the gently caress, no.
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Jul 1, 2021 01:54
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Grace is a national god damned treasure for her research, and so are you, How Wonderful! |
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Jul 1, 2021 01:58
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biosterous posted:i need to reread this post-fever so i can actually think about it, thank you for a good post It's something I grapple with a lot because it feels sometimes like the options are "don't acknowledge that queer people existed at all" or "just go hog wild" and my instinct is also to just do everything very delicately and scrupulously, which I think is often a too conservative or even too cowardly instinct. So I try to temper my own gut on this a lot because I certainly think saying "yeah Shakespeare was gay as hell" is better than saying "mmm my word no, Shakespeare never even thought about a huge cut dick" and certainly just teaching a gay Shakespeare in the classrooms is more productive and more interesting than teaching a totally sexless Shakespeare. It's also like.. hm... I never know how to put this without sounding like I'm mad at centuries. But the early history of people saying "well no, this is part of my identity, I'm a gay man/lesbian/"invert" through and through" is long and filled with lots of struggles and I don't want to diminish what a watershed that was in Western culture. So like-- yeah I'll go to bat night and day for gay Henry James. But prior to that watershed moment I think reading queer literature and queer epistolary is really rich in part because how little of a sense of a shared language there is. Everybody's making it up from scratch, trying to invent their own words for this powerful thing they're feeling. Which is part of why I think the introduction of queer identity onto the scene is so important, because it opened the door for a sense of political and social solidarity and community that existed only fleetingly and transiently before that in many places. I think Lincoln's letters to Joshua Speed are a good example of this-- his paralyzing fear that if Speed himself goes out of his life, this capacity for love and desire will go with it. Lincoln doesn't see himself as gay. He sees himself as someone who passionately loves Joshua Speed. Which I think is a somewhat marginal distinction if we're trying to look at the long long sweep of queer desire in history, but a pretty important one if we're looking more granularly at how queer self-fashioning plays out in specific times and places.
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Jul 1, 2021 02:02
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Mormon Nailer posted:Grace is a national god damned treasure for her research, and so are you, How Wonderful! ty. Part of what makes this so personal to me is that I spent a long time with my own research trying to figure out how gender played into female Spiritualist poets, and the ways that they would go on stage and "become" male ghosts, publish as them, etc. And as much as it would have comforted me to be able to say look, these are my comrades, these are people actively resisting and subverting gender from a position of personal gender nonconformity, it just didn't really fit the evidence (for most of them, I'm biting my tongue on Andrew Jackson Davis). And I became much more cautious about distinguishing between "what I want the archives to tell me" and "what the archives are telling me."
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Jul 1, 2021 02:04
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I will say my own personal gay wrath now. All over time this month restaurants would be having "LGBTQ+ Community Nights" and it turns out that that meant they'd donate 10% of each sale or whatever to the local pride center. But what it should have meant is that I could go in and eat whatever I wanted for free. What the gently caress gives????
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Jul 1, 2021 02:05
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How Wonderful! posted:I will say my own personal gay wrath now. All over time this month restaurants would be having "LGBTQ+ Community Nights" and it turns out that that meant they'd donate 10% of each sale or whatever to the local pride center. But what it should have meant is that I could go in and eat whatever I wanted for free. What the gently caress gives???? If they really wanted to have an LGBTQ+Community Night they could start by paying their staff a living wage. 
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Jul 1, 2021 02:08
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Another personal wrath: I just really, really want people to stop asking me if I'm doing "the gay thing, you know." I DO NOT KNOW, TELL ME WHAT YOU THINK THE GAY THING IS. I'LL loving WAIT. Missourah. |
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Jul 1, 2021 02:10
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Mormon Nailer posted:Another personal wrath: I just really, really want people to stop asking me if I'm doing "the gay thing, you know." I DO NOT KNOW, TELL ME WHAT YOU THINK THE GAY THING IS. I'LL loving WAIT. Wait. There's a gay thing? Is it like a dream catcher you hang over your bed to get more gay energy? Maybe a cool hat? |
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Jul 1, 2021 02:30
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GODSPEED JOHN GLENN posted:Wait. There's a gay thing? Is it like a dream catcher you hang over your bed to get more gay energy? Maybe a cool hat? I dunno! Pretty much everything I own is a gay thing, as an extremely queer person, and everything I do is a gay thing, for the same reason, so ????? |
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Jul 1, 2021 02:34
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okay so i want to be an ally but this month i'm fully terrified don't hit me please i'm on your side
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Jul 1, 2021 02:44
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did somebody say gay Thing??
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Jul 1, 2021 02:56
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Mormon Nailer posted:I dunno! Pretty much everything I own is a gay thing, as an extremely queer person, and everything I do is a gay thing, for the same reason, so ????? Well then, keep on doing that gay thing! |
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Jul 1, 2021 02:57
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GODSPEED JOHN GLENN posted:Well then, keep on doing that gay thing! I mean I literally cannot stop doing that gay thing But by god if I figure out which gay thing they mean I'm gonna do it even harder just to piss em off |
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Jul 1, 2021 02:59
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I just caught up on the Nina Paley stuff from the movie club thread and I'm full of both pathos and Wrathos.
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Jul 1, 2021 03:36
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How Wonderful! posted:I just caught up on the Nina Paley stuff from the movie club thread and I'm full of both pathos and Wrathos. hello yes i said let's watch one of her movies, recently, and didn't know her deal. when i found out i wanted to flippo some tableso, having been technically tied to that trash by promoting it AHG I hahah lol i'm not gonna do that thing where a well meaning ally flips out and lets drat anyways this is the main thing i should have thought of, sorry. i should have done better.
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Jul 1, 2021 03:44
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Nina Paley, more like Nina Fail-y because she fails to see that everyone is valid and her opinion is uninformed bullshit at best, and at worst (which seems to be the reality), hateful and discriminatory for her own gain. And that's loving sad. |
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Jul 1, 2021 03:44
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Heather Papps posted:hello yes i said let's watch one of her movies, recently, and didn't know her deal. when i found out i wanted to flippo some tableso, having been technically tied to that trash by promoting it AHG I Nah it's not on you, you didn't write her raunchy posts. I'm mad because Sita Sings the Blues meant a hell of a lot to me and gave me a lot of clarity and happiness at a time in my life when both of those things were in short supply. It was one of the first movies Bingo Bango watched together and it was a wonderful night early on in our relationship-- one of those is it l...love? can it be? could it be? couldn't be... moments in a romance that sort of just permanently live in your memory. And Nina Paley was a huge part of that memory, so on a personal level I feel weirdly, vicariously betrayed.
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Jul 1, 2021 03:55
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i can't imagine, and i guess that's all. i'm disappointed, but the betrayal isn't so acute. anyways let's GET WRATHFUL
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Jul 1, 2021 04:03
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*kicking, punching and hurling insults at my Computational Physics textbooks because I left them on the floor of my bedroom* |
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Jul 1, 2021 04:14
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giving a vinegar eyeball to all and sundry
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Jul 1, 2021 04:17
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Feeling mighty salty tonight, pals, just realllll piquant too |
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Jul 1, 2021 04:20
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the search for ancestors/predecessors is such an important part of so many people's journeys of identification but the process of history is a process of progressive disidentification so working with the archive becomes an inevitable act of refusal of powerful and necessary desires; a kind of mythologizing might be inevitable and/or healing. because what you're doing is, people are saying: i want my nana, i want my mama, i want my brother, i want my family, i want my people, and you have to say, i can't give them to you, they're gone forever, they never were, i wish it was different because you deserve them, but it's not. and so the anger always makes sense. america was already given an abraham lincoln who never existed, we're already playing pretend with his bones, so why can't he be gay, why can't you just say it, who does it hurt. i want my country to have a father too. every essay should be allowed to have a section where the author engages in critical fabulation without shame or fear. history doesn't reconstruct what's lost, it recovers what's left, in the process of which it discovers how much can never be known. it widens the void and reopens the wound and i think there's a growing recognition that that's necessary but incomplete. |
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Jul 1, 2021 06:16
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Mormon Nailer posted:Feeling mighty salty tonight, pals, just realllll piquant too https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qo6qhaZ119E you're the mask on my face at the masquerade, painted black. you can take a place at our table, if they even let you in. i drive too fast at night because accidents happen to other men and not me. walk into the sea.
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Jul 1, 2021 06:18
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bad guy posted:the search for ancestors/predecessors is such an important part of so many people's journeys of identification but the process of history is a process of progressive disidentification so working with the archive becomes an inevitable act of refusal of powerful and necessary desires; a kind of mythologizing might be inevitable and/or healing. because what you're doing is, people are saying: i want my nana, i want my mama, i want my brother, i want my family, i want my people, and you have to say, i can't give them to you, they're gone forever, they never were, i wish it was different because you deserve them, but it's not. and so the anger always makes sense. america was already given an abraham lincoln who never existed, we're already playing pretend with his bones, so why can't he be gay, why can't you just say it, who does it hurt. i want my country to have a father too. every essay should be allowed to have a section where the author engages in critical fabulation without shame or fear. history doesn't reconstruct what's lost, it recovers what's left, in the process of which it discovers how much can never be known. it widens the void and reopens the wound and i think there's a growing recognition that that's necessary but incomplete. currently engaging with abe lincolns bones, playing pretend with my nations father - a figure more comfy with gays than my actual dad. anyways to every queer trying to be xena, i agree, it rules you're right, bad guy is smarter than i am, koopa shells make you go fast, the end.
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Jul 1, 2021 06:21
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I'm gay as hell and I'm not going to take it any more
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Jul 1, 2021 06:48
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Starting a petition for August to be LUST month
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Jul 1, 2021 06:48
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Rarity posted:Starting a petition for August to be LUST month Well hello there 
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Jul 1, 2021 06:50
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Mormon Nailer posted:Well hello there Oh Oh my
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Jul 1, 2021 06:55
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Rarity posted:Starting a petition for August to be LUST month It already is.
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Jul 1, 2021 14:06
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sig by Prof. Crocodile
BYOB spells: Mutually Assured Kindness
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i'm still mad at this dingd*ng virus for taking away two years and four instances of kinky queer sex camp
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Jul 1, 2021 15:10
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bad guy posted:the search for ancestors/predecessors is such an important part of so many people's journeys of identification but the process of history is a process of progressive disidentification so working with the archive becomes an inevitable act of refusal of powerful and necessary desires; a kind of mythologizing might be inevitable and/or healing. because what you're doing is, people are saying: i want my nana, i want my mama, i want my brother, i want my family, i want my people, and you have to say, i can't give them to you, they're gone forever, they never were, i wish it was different because you deserve them, but it's not. and so the anger always makes sense. america was already given an abraham lincoln who never existed, we're already playing pretend with his bones, so why can't he be gay, why can't you just say it, who does it hurt. i want my country to have a father too. every essay should be allowed to have a section where the author engages in critical fabulation without shame or fear. history doesn't reconstruct what's lost, it recovers what's left, in the process of which it discovers how much can never be known. it widens the void and reopens the wound and i think there's a growing recognition that that's necessary but incomplete. yeah I think this puts it really perfectly and the impulse towards fabulation is very very strong and very very primals. in my diss I finally couldn't hold it in any more and the conclusion has all the stuff about gender and mourning I couldn't really responsibly put in elsewhere and it's a section people really respond to. I think "I want to hear something beautiful about existing in a universe of love" is really the most reasonable request in the world to have when you're looking backwards and it sucks that the nature of the archive is not such that it can usually provide that. Or rather I think I always imagine the Benjaminean angel of history and what we think it's really looking at. I think a natural desire is to turn backwards from the fractures and rubble of the present and see history as unspooling backwards towards a moment where the fragments come together and make sense (I think we inherited this from Ficino and Bruno and all them) when really the further back you look the more fracture and rubble there is. And I think there's profound beauty in the rubble but it's not always the rubble one needs as a matter of feeling like part of something.
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Jul 1, 2021 15:59
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I think Carolyn Dinshaw talks about this in one of her books but it's been a couple years
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Jul 1, 2021 16:02
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Mormon Nailer posted:Nina Paley, more like Nina Fail-y because she fails to see that everyone is valid and her opinion is uninformed bullshit at best, and at worst (which seems to be the reality), hateful and discriminatory for her own gain. And that's loving sad.
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Jul 1, 2021 17:04
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| # ? May 2, 2024 23:39 |
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hell yes all these good posts making me think good thoughts and i now have functionbrain instead of feverbrain, this is something i am not mad about a little mad about: due to culture and upbringing and also being kinda thick about it, i didn't realize i liked dudes until around a year ago, and looking back if i had known earlier there were some cute dudes i definitely could've kissed and i missed out
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Jul 1, 2021 17:09
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