Toalpaz posted:

who are we turboin

b-minus1 posted:

What

Retro Futurist posted:

Yeah agreeeddd

b-minus1 posted:

I don’t know how you arrived on maerlyn after making that first post and also whether your maerlyn vote is real or a joke vote.

Grandicap posted:

Do not like this post. Read either straight or dripping with sarcasm, I do not like it.

ObamaAkbar. posted:

If you hate flavour arguments here comes the meta argument.

Grandi acts like he’s caught scum in mae because they backed off of the turbo, an argument I’m not buying UNLESS binus is also scum. Since then he’s picked apart every post they’ve made and doubled down on this read. This is something I’ve 100% seen him do as scum.

Outside of meta grandi somehow declared a town read on binus super early based on what exactly? Also if binus is town I honestly can’t fathom why scum would care about being involved in a turbo mislunch enough to draw attention to themselves. It feels more like awkward newbie to me. Grandi cares enough to check votefinder to dispel the newbie myth however their last game outside of steaks ongoing one was 8 years ago…

This is scum clinging to the first easy case they see and burrowing in.

Lotus Aura posted:

Leaves ##vote OA as the other real pick for me right now.

Voodoofly posted:

So are we playing in the real world or in your fantasy one where you have seen the future and are coming back to enlighten everyone?

1. I want to vote Grand. I am voting Grand. I think everyone else should vote Grand. Grand's posts are scummy and I don't believe his reasoning re: asking minus to explain more. You seem to agree on that.
2. I am fine voting Maer. I have no idea if she is town. I didn't think she was scummy but it's day 1 I am wrong all the time. But she provides a lot of info. Most of the people in this game have taken a stance on her, and it gives us a lot to analyze other players on. It also would have avoided dealing with a replacement and would also have avoided having to make any sort of game reliance on her exit post or whether a town or scum would make that post, which I'm happy to avoid dealing with.
3. Saying amni and grand have a point was sarcastic, considering I am voting grand right now.

So, where is my position where I'm voting her, knowing she is town, and jumping off grand and going home?

Grandicap posted:

I don't think it's you Voodoo, but it's definitely not me.

Maerlyn posted:

The whole build up feels weird in retrospect, I'm questioning Amni's intentions and the Amni/Grandicap/Retro Futurist triumvirate is worth watching.

Bifauxnen posted:

Leaving a turbo after two other people have already bailed seems more like a "moving on now that it's not happening" than a "got cold feet" though?

Bifauxnen posted:

What is absolutely a correct read? My read, that totally disagrees with yours?

Bifauxnen posted:

Ok fair enough. But anyway, are you trying to say that Jen leaving the turbo (after Maerlyn and RF already did) was scummy of her, and people really should have been making a bigger deal out of how scummy this was?

Bifauxnen posted:

Not only is staying on the turbo kinda silly when literally everyone else has left it (it's no longer happening), I'm also not sure why continuing to try for the turbo is supposed to be more towny to begin with.

There was a whole serious case by then revolving around Maerlyn, actual gameplay to get to as opposed to a turbo which is more of a jokephase kickstart icebreaker activity.

So yeah, this feels like an extremely fake case on Jen, and I hope I've said enough now for peeps to see what I'm on about voting Lamp, so I don't have to go on full murder squad round-up duty

Bifauxnen posted:

btw I am very very glad actually that you brought up your read, so I have more stuff to point to haha

Trying to paint this as me "disagreeing with somebody even bringing up their read" is one more thing to point at actually. Nice bit of misdirection there.

Bifauxnen posted:

Ok did you also notice that Amni and Grand had also pretty blatantly left the turbo as well (to case Maerlyn for it) so by the time Jen left the turbo she was literally the only vote left on binus

Grandicap posted:

Lamp is doubling down in the face of nothing here, keeping up their bad Jen read.

##vote Lampsacus

Amnistar posted:

Does scum lampsacus back down on a bad case...

b-minus1 posted:

Agreed. Grandi is pretty much confirmed town imo

Retro Futurist posted:

Town are wrong pretty often. If anything scum can be less wrong because they can be totally sure in their convictions in a way town can't. Plus you're assuming observers are inherently on the towns side

Lampsacus posted:

there seems to be a wide circle for what is called a case.

Lampsacus posted:

[...] its place as a minor note for the thread.[...]

Lotus Aura posted:

I'm pretty okay with my vote staying on Lamp for the rest of today, too. His argument before was real bad and after rereading it to check if I wasn't just misreading it while half-awake, he comes off as incredibly insincere. I'm sure he'd probably handwave that away like when Grandi thought he was being sarcastic on D1, but in this instance it's more about what was being said than how. His case on Jen being manufactured was pretty well covered by Bif already, and I don't wanna just repeat what she already said but worse. But also, he voted for Grandi for.. being wrong about OA, and Somber to a lesser degree? And not because of anything actually scummy? I suppose that is consistent with his D1 when he voted for Grandi but still thought Grandi was almost definitely town, so it's basically the worst kinda consistent.

Lampsacus posted:

Maybe I was wrong.

Lampsacus posted:

Maybe I was wrong.

Lotus Aura posted:

Oh, I suppose the thing about Lamp that makes his case feel fake to me that hasn't been mentioned is that if it was dumb but sincere, once pretty basic fundamental issues with it had been pointed out, the obvious thing to do is admit as such and move on. Instead, he doubled and even tripled down on it like he was grasping for literally anything to use to declare someone scummy with seemingly minimal care about the who or the why.

Lampsacus posted:

Maybe I was wrong.

Lampsacus posted:

no intentional misdirection. i could be wrong here but

Bifauxnen posted:

Ok fair enough. But anyway, are you trying to say that Jen leaving the turbo (after Maerlyn and RF already did) was scummy of her, and people really should have been making a bigger deal out of how scummy this was?

when you say 'people really should have be making a bigger deal'.. this seems to imply to me that you were questioning that i'm not only sharing my own organic read of a situation but saying, by virtue of bringing it up, that others should have done it earlier and that they didn't is either scummy or a mistake. i don't think bringing up a read that others haven't had nessitates that and asking me/implying that that is also what i'm saying strikes me as saying my post has more weight then i've written it as having - and thus should have only brought up my read if i was going to stand by that secondary claim that

Bifauxnen posted:

people really should have been making a bigger deal out of how scummy this was?

it just feels to me like you are saying 'oh, you are saying gen x is scummy and we all missed that/didn't make a big deal of it?

so what are you implying?' which is to say 'your read is valid if and only if it includes the opinion that 'people really should have been making a bigger deal of how scummy this was?' otherwise, it isn't enough to post. like, so what you're saying is x because without x then your post is below the bar of substance. especially when followed up by:

which is basically saying, did you notice this thing that happened - happened - and part of that thing is that jen was the only vote left on binus. which a) i did and b) my post literally said jen was the last/left on turbo so its like saying 'hey your read, did you even notice the basic facts of what your read is about? just checking??'

which implies you seem to disagree with me even posting an organic read if it doesn't fit your meta/idea of what is good play or not based on the current sa meta whatever that is i have no idea.

so yeah. definitely not intentional misdirection on my part.wawaaaaa

Bifauxnen posted:

I agree that Lamp has made more of a minor observation than a case on Jen. But I don't think the distinction is important at all.

My own perception of the initial post was that it was either an attempt to build up into a full fake case later, or to make Jen look scummy without sticking his neck out to "make a case", so someone else could do the real pushing later. Or so he could just look like he was posting something when he didn't actually have much to contribute.

I believe this because the observation was so tilted, to suggest Jen was scummy for doing something completely unremarkable. I do have to say it almost does seem too scummy to be scum, to overlook how much the vote had moved on, with Amni and Grandi openly calling out Maerlyn as scummy, and ending the turbo they began to point the finger at her.

But when I poked at it to get more reactions from Lamp, instead of being like "oh whoops I didn't realise the turbo was already that completely over", or something to suggest he'd made an odd observation by mere accident, or saw Jen's particular vote change as unusual for some special reason... he seemed more concerned with how I perceived him, for making the observation.

He fixated on technicalities to try and prove that what he was saying was technically true and so it shouldn't be scummy for him to say it, rather than worry about whether the point was fair or not. "oh but I did mention that others had left the turbo before Jen!" (he'd only mentioned one or two other names instead of the fact that literally everyone but Jen had already moved on) or that angle where he was all, "well if you just don't want me to point out things I noticed, I can't agree with that..." (I was saying nothing of the sort)

The main thing that would help convince me Lamp is town is if he actually continued giving more observations than this one little teensy one (that we all need to know is definitely not a case or nothing), and if that new content and new opinions felt more genuine. But he has not done this yet.

Grandicap posted:

I'll give you a hint as to why.
It's because Lamp is scum.

Bifauxnen posted:

Bifauxnen posted:

Eh that kinda post is just typical maf posturing, means nothing

Bifauxnen posted:

Not really lol

Bifauxnen posted:

Like to be fair, ever since I noticed a bit ago that Lamp wasn't some returning ancient vet like I first assumed, and only has a few actual games on their VF profile, I have started worrying that this is a case of flustered newb false positive.

But I still think that Lamp post I pointed out on D1 was also strange, and it looks like evidence of Lamp maybe having a hard time trying to come up with content as scum. So I'm not ready to drop it just yet.