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Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


It's not about the results, it's about sending a message

cracks knuckles but in a hippie way

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Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


TitanG posted:

Cold war propaganda around nuclear wars took it too far, and Chernobyl didn't really help. In my opinion it's monumentally stupid throwing untold money at low-possibility stuff like hydrogen and not investing in already developed breeder nuclear but what the gently caress do I know.

Dredging sand from rivers is pretty much a fully renewable resource and done across the world, the problem is actually getting silica (quartz) sand and not literally anything else like limestone.

I did a brief bit of work at a fusion research lab, and it was incredibly bleak. The main conclusion I got from it was that the same obstacles that prevented the US from going heavy on fission reactors will prevent them from going heavy on fusion reactors, assuming they ever become practical: they're not fossil fuel based. Fission was stopped by politics, and those politics have not changed and fusion isn't different enough from fission to be immune to the same political forces.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


What I'm getting out of this is that the Anno series has weird politics. Is this what German Greens actually believe or is Anno mocking them from the other side?

Alkydere posted:

I'm talking about fusion power avoiding the "horrible toxic waste", apologies if I wasn't clear.

It's just carbon combustion based power is more or less grandfathered into our culture's threat analysis so it doesn't have the "OH GOD WHY!?" that radioactive waste does...despite being oh so very horrible. As you said, the surroundings of coal plants are often more radioactive than the surroundings of nuclear plants.

Coal plants produce more radioactive waste than fission plants. The lesson the fusion guys have taken from this is that the underlying facts of how much radioactive waste is produced is irrelevant in the face of the kind of propaganda campaigns that they'd be throwing themselves into. It may factually produce less, but facts are just a single argument in the political realm.

Plus there is the weird but difficult fact that we're almost certainly never going to see a practical civilian use for fusion on earth.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


SIGSEGV posted:

I notice that the meat factories don't have hog manure pools, err, forgive me, the industry term is "lagoon", and don't suffer a risk of hog manure foam explosion, cause by excessive antibiotic force feeding changing the decay process of manure in the enclosed areas under the farms.

Voted 1.


(Yes, those are real. Very Real. Factory herding is loving horrible, to the animals, workers and environment, probably not as much to the spreadsheets though.)

City builders in general have a problem with realistic portrayals of land use (cough parking lots in sim city cough) and even worse for stuff like waste disposal (tbh this just feels like a missed opportunity, wast management is a critical part of city infrastructure and the challenge of "how do we get bad stuff out of here" is bound to be as interesting as "how do we get good stuff into here"), but even considering those, having pig factories without their lagoons seems really off-message for this game's intentions.

Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


Cythereal posted:

I can kind of let Blue Byte get away with a lot of mechanics like this being half-baked in 2070, it was their first non-historical Anno game. The series before this point was exclusively old historical titles, and it's obvious in some places where Blue Byte was kind of kludging things together into the near-future setting. Pollution has returned in Anno 1800, as I understand it, but Alkydere or someone else would have to explain how well that game does or does not handle it.

I really wish that 2205 had gotten the support it needed. I still plan to LP 2205 at some point after 2070 if no one beats me to it, but 2205 is an extremely incomplete game and dataminers found a lot of stuff indicating that that game was planned to be far more ambitious than it wound up being. Ubisoft also cut support for the game immediately and 2205 never got the kind of expansion that made 2070 the well regarded game that it is.

I prefer 2205 in many respects, but felt that 2070 was the better starting point for showing the series off to people who have never played an Anno game before.

Here's hoping the next game in the series returns to a sci-fi direction and does a better job with it.

I mean, I am coming from a pretty critical place because some of the stuff they're doing seems pretty obviously political in ways that touch on my (and your!) actual life. That said, it is kind of a miracle that any game ever gets completed and its very rare that a piece of art ever really gets to fulfill its vision. Compromises on your vision often have to happen.

I do still hope that we can get a city builder that takes waste management seriously. Possibly this is informed by living in NYC, a city that depending on your perspective is either extremely good at waste management (trash gets picked up every day, I've never had a problem with sewage which is the only American city I've lived in that I can say that about), or more likely extremely bad at waste management (even with daily pickup there's still usually mountains of garbage everywhere, even just from the same day, litter is frequent especially of dog poo poo). Presumably one day we'll get some itch scale games that focus on it first and then some more simple mechanics get integrated into something like Skylines before somebody makes "factorio but for garbage." It just feels particularly missing in a game that has such explicit story themes about ecology and pollution to not get into the main way we interact with those problems in real life.

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Tulip
Jun 3, 2008

yeah thats pretty good


An awful but highly prestigious salad.

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