Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
Which should I play as for the Generals Challenge? [Pick 3]
This poll is closed.
Laser 60 14.74%
Air Power 34 8.35%
Super Weapons 49 12.04%
Tanks 26 6.39%
Infantry 39 9.58%
Nuclear Power 68 16.71%
Toxin 48 11.79%
Stealth 42 10.32%
Explosives 41 10.07%
Total: 189 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
  • Post
  • Reply
Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry
China 01: The Dragon Awakes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9gHg-LfYoE
China 01: The Dragon Awakes




Participate in the Military Parade in Beijing, then enjoy some sweet R&R!






I have no clue where EA thinks Beijing is in the loading/briefing screen.



Location: Beijing, China
Objective: Eliminate any threat in the Beijing Area

Author's note: A nice introduction for the Chinese faction, with reveals for almost all of the available units as the carrot on the stick to progress further in the campaign.




N/A

[The Characters section will be removed until further notice]




[Buildings will be covered next update]


Construction Dozer
RANGE: Short
ARMOR: Dozer
WEAPON: None
COST: 1000

This multipurpose vehicle is the backbone of the Chinese fighting forces. In addition to constructing all of the Chinese military structures, you can use the Construction Dozer to repair structures. It is also effective at clearing minefields.

Author's Note: Vital to the survival of any base, you need these like you need air to breathe. [As of Aug 12, 2021, I officially dislike this unit]



Supply Truck
RANGE: Short
ARMOR: Truck
WEAPON: None
COST: 600

The main link in the Chinese supply chain, the Supply Truck ferries freight from depots to its Supply Center. While its capacity is less than [REDACTED], the Supply Truck is cheap to produce and can be quickly built in quantity.

Author's Note: Required for most income gathering you'll do on the map. These trucks serve as the average gatherer compared to the other factions.



Red Guard
RANGE: Short
ARMOR: Human
WEAPON: Assault Rifle
COST: 150

The front-line trooper of the Red Army, the Red Guard operates best in large groups. Red Guard units can capture enemy facilities. When fighting in close quarters, the Red Guard can switch from his bolt-action rifle to his bayonet, which can do considerable damage

Author's Note: One of three units that benefits from the Horde bonus, its design was changed after its manual entry, as there is no bayonet upgrade/ability.



Tank Hunter
RANGE: Medium
ARMOR: Human
WEAPON: Rocket Launcher
COST: 300

A squad of Tank Hunters can ruin a tank division. Armed with an RPG rocket launcher, the Tank Hunter can hit-and-run against slow tanks or fire down from occupied structures. However, he may be even more dangerous when cornered. A zealous Tank Hunter can place a TNT charge on a vehicle, which can stop it [dead] in its tracks. Works very well in groups.

Author's Note: The second of three units to receive the Horde bonus, the Tank Hunter is particularly great against tanks not designed to fight infantry. Generals beware....



Dragon Tank
RANGE: Short-Medium
ARMOR: Dragon
WEAPON: Flamethrower
COST: 800

A mobile hose of fiery napalm, the Dragon Tank is extremely effective against infantry, especially when garrisoned in buildings. When enemy forces are closing, Dragon Tanks can create a 180-degree wall of fire.

Author's Note: The Chinese anti-building and anti-infantry vehicle, it can be devastating against infantry-held chokepoints, although its Wall of Fire ability is rather hit-or-miss.



Battlemaster Tank
RANGE: Medium
ARMOR: Tank
WEAPON: 125mm Smoothbore Cannon
COST: 800

The basic tank platform for the Chinese side, the Battlemaster is cheap to produce and very flexible. When deployed in invasion-sized attacks, the Battlemaster can wear down enemy defenses and overrun installations. It can be upgraded with [REDACTED] and [REDACTED] ability at the [REDACTED] structure.

Author's Note: The third of three units that should always travel in groups of 5 or more, the Battlemaster can easily swamp defenders with their cheap cost, and thus high numbers. Less versatile than enemy faction counterparts.


Aftermath:

After the elimination of the GLA terrorist cell in the region, and the destruction of the nuclear weapon storage facility, the General is readied for their next assignment.

Jobbo_Fett fucked around with this message at 03:41 on Aug 13, 2021

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Space Kablooey
May 6, 2009


it will look real nice when it's done. :)

HannibalBarca
Sep 11, 2016

History shows, again and again, how nature points out the folly of man.

Space Kablooey posted:

it will look real nice when it's done. :)

the chinese dozer has some, uh, remarkable lines if ordered to use its crush ability on enemy infantry

Slaan
Mar 16, 2009



ASHERAH DEMANDS I FEAST, I VOTE FOR A FEAST OF FLESH
We will build it for China

mr_stibbons
Aug 18, 2019
While the politics and graphics have not aged well, generals is an interesting game in retrospect. It really is willing to do some experimentation (and ripoffs of other franchises), and even if they all didn't work out, future games would refine the ideas it had. I had lots of fun with it as a kid who didn't care about the sanctity of the command and conquer legacy.

Very little of that fun involved the base game's story campaign. This campaign was just dire. It's going to be a long wait until we get to the good stuff.

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry
I don't know why I didn't check this before but I'm glad my old program I used to rip stuff from earlier C&C titles still works on Generals and whatever wrapper it uses.


Which means I can show off singleplayer maps!

And rip audio files!

And since I've been doing these LPs for a while and we've crossed quite a few different series' and eras, if you have a request for a unit's voice line(s), let me know and I'll see what I can do.

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry

HannibalBarca posted:

the chinese dozer has some, uh, remarkable lines if ordered to use its crush ability on enemy infantry

https://voca.ro/11qXVRSkAFzC

DUDE WHY DID YOU TELL ME ABOUT THIS?!

BiggestOrangeTree
May 19, 2008
I think I've previously said a couple of things about wtf things they did to make the German releases of the other games palatable for the authorities there, but Generals blows them all out of the water. We'll get there when we get there.

Slaan
Mar 16, 2009



ASHERAH DEMANDS I FEAST, I VOTE FOR A FEAST OF FLESH

Jobbo_Fett posted:

https://voca.ro/11qXVRSkAFzC

DUDE WHY DID YOU TELL ME ABOUT THIS?!

:yikes:

Space Kablooey
May 6, 2009


Jobbo_Fett posted:

https://voca.ro/11qXVRSkAFzC

DUDE WHY DID YOU TELL ME ABOUT THIS?!

holy poo poo

Sylphid
Aug 3, 2012
The Dragon Tank is one of the units that's okay in the single-player at anti-infantry stuff, but really shines through as one of China's best units in multiplayer, namely because the Flame Wall absolutely decimates most every structure in the game if it can get close enough. A Dragon Tank that slips through an undefended part of the map and gets into the enemy's base can completely change the game. It's just it can't demonstrate this ability as well in single-player because of the nature of pre-deployed enemy arrangements there's not as many places to slip through to enemy infrastructure to do damage.

Also, toxins are primarily anti-infantry but they also can do tons of damage to lightly-armored vehicles, like the Troop Crawler or artillery in general. Like with previous C&Cs, every unit has an armor type and those kinds of vehicles take lots of damage from virtually any source of damage that actually can harm them. But yeah, toxins are basically entirely useless against buildings.

Sylphid fucked around with this message at 05:02 on Aug 13, 2021

UED Special Ops
Oct 21, 2008
Grimey Drawer
And into the campaign proper. This is a actually decent intro to how the China faction works, and you are even rewarded for exploring the map with some extra units, with the Overlords being the choice find. The hoard mechanic is pretty potent, as shown, and definitely shows off the brute force aspect of the faction's units. Overall, not the most exciting level though, as the GLA has just those scripted attacks and then just sits there waiting for you more or less. Still, it is gonna be a bit o a slog till Zero Hour though, as I am looking forward to that intently for... many reasons.

raverrn
Apr 5, 2005

Unidentified spacecraft inbound from delta line.

All Silpheed squadrons scramble now!


Jobbo_Fett posted:

https://voca.ro/11qXVRSkAFzC

DUDE WHY DID YOU TELL ME ABOUT THIS?!

HOLY gently caress WHAT

Loxbourne
Apr 6, 2011

Tomorrow, doom!
But now, tea.
Ah, I see we're all discovering that Generals goes a bit beyond mere Team America satire.

This game is so bad EA stepped in to tone it down. Think about that for a moment.

By popular demand
Jul 17, 2007
Probation
Can't post for 14 hours!
EA moderation? :psypop:

You better be getting there fast, it's hard to avoid the temptation of looking into this.

fuck off Batman
Oct 14, 2013

Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah!


I've only ever played multiplayer and never cared about the campaigns, so it will be interesting to see what all the hubbub is about.

HannibalBarca
Sep 11, 2016

History shows, again and again, how nature points out the folly of man.

speaking of EA moderation, the multiplayer for this game had an innovative auto-censorship system built into its in-game chat. the expected profanity was automatically rendered as a bunch of asterisks, but so was stuff like "god", "jesus", and "allah". they also censored the names of certain members of the nazi leadership, which meant that friends and I spent most of the build-up portion of the multiplayer games trying to remember which war criminals made the cut and which didn't.

Cythereal
Nov 8, 2009

I love the potoo,
and the potoo loves you.
Well... that's one way to start a campaign.

China was my favorite of the factions to play in Generals because they seemed to rely on fancy tricks and micro the least. Pure brute force is very much my style in RTS games.

Grammarchist
Jan 28, 2013

I loved the Chinese propaganda towers keeping maimed infantry alive and fighting by reminding them, "YOU FIGHT FOR CHINA!"

Like that scene in Wolf Warrior where the evil American Mercenary is about to kill the hero, who then sees the reflection of the Chinese Flag in the mercenary's eyes, giving him the strength to win.

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry
I never watched Wolf Warrior. I should send a message to the "With Chinese Characteristics" podcast about this game...

Grammarchist
Jan 28, 2013

Jobbo_Fett posted:

I never watched Wolf Warrior. I should send a message to the "With Chinese Characteristics" podcast about this game...

A friend of mine had copies of Wolf Warrior 1 and 2 and we watched it all without subtitles. That was fine because it's just Chinese Rambo. The sequel even has the hero being rejected by politicians for "being too badass and patriotic" and going off on a spirit quest to Africa as a seaman, only to find himself embroiled in a fight against American Imperialism that involves kung fu, tanks and PRC military porn.

Mokinokaro
Sep 11, 2001

At the end of everything, hold onto anything



Fun Shoe
Yeah as has been said Generals has some incredibly unfortunate theming.

It's a shame because it has tons of interesting ideas gameplay wise.

White Coke
May 29, 2015

Loxbourne posted:

Ah, I see we're all discovering that Generals goes a bit beyond mere Team America satire.

This game is so bad EA stepped in to tone it down. Think about that for a moment.

This is toned down? Dare I ask what it was like before?

UED Special Ops
Oct 21, 2008
Grimey Drawer

Mokinokaro posted:

Yeah as has been said Generals has some incredibly unfortunate theming.

It's a shame because it has tons of interesting ideas gameplay wise.

Yeah, while I have said that the C&C name was just pretty much stamped onto this game, it did do some pretty interesting things gameplay-wise to try to mix up the bog-standard now slightly stale rts formula. Some of those gameplay ideas working better then others but it at least tried something new and different in that regard.

Manic_Misanthrope
Jul 1, 2010


White Coke posted:

This is toned down? Dare I ask what it was like before?

There was a cut building for the Americans... or at least I think it was cut in the base game. Definitely cut in the expansion.

It'll come up when we get to them.

Manic_Misanthrope fucked around with this message at 22:07 on Aug 13, 2021

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry
Yo, stop spoiling stuff please. We'll get to it when we get to it.

Radio Free Kobold
Aug 11, 2012

"Federal regulations mandate that at least 30% of our content must promote Reptilian or Draconic culture. This is DJ Scratch N' Sniff with the latest mermaid screeching on KBLD..."




we haven't even played as the GLA yet

mr_stibbons
Aug 18, 2019
In terms of stuff we've already seen, it's hard to understate just how much being able to garrison anything changes the game. Rocket infantry in an urban area make a mockery of the venerable battle tank deathblob, especially with good micro. The dragon tank is really a very good unit, because the ability to clear garrisons covers a big counter to the battlemaster horde. You need to bring a couple of them along, and they are better than their equivalents in other factions

In my opinion Generals leaves the medium tank it about the worst place it's ever been in the franchise, which kinda fits with the irregular warfare setting.

evilmiera
Dec 14, 2009

Status: Ravenously Rambunctious

Jobbo_Fett posted:

https://voca.ro/11qXVRSkAFzC

DUDE WHY DID YOU TELL ME ABOUT THIS?!

Don't make me laugh out loud while I'm working in a nursing home for the terminally ill, it gives the wrong kind of impression.

Akratic Method
Mar 9, 2013

It's going to pay off eventually--I'm sure of it.

Any day now.

mr_stibbons posted:

In terms of stuff we've already seen, it's hard to understate just how much being able to garrison anything changes the game. Rocket infantry in an urban area make a mockery of the venerable battle tank deathblob, especially with good micro.

It really does; I remember deliberately leveling any building I wasn't personally occupying in the area of operations (hey look at that, we're back to war crimes chat) just to avoid the inevitability that the enemy would fill it with rockets (or other infantry inconveniences we haven't seen yet) at the exact wrong time. Can't be overstated how hard a building full of rockets tears through a tank. Jobbo, if you get a defensive mission please point it out when it finally gets demonstrated!

Jobbo_Fett posted:

https://voca.ro/11qXVRSkAFzC

DUDE WHY DID YOU TELL ME ABOUT THIS?!

Wow. This has to have only made it past the EA toning-down because it's a rarity to use construction units for crushing. I played a ton of this game and never heard that.

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry

Akratic Method posted:

It really does; I remember deliberately leveling any building I wasn't personally occupying in the area of operations (hey look at that, we're back to war crimes chat) just to avoid the inevitability that the enemy would fill it with rockets (or other infantry inconveniences we haven't seen yet) at the exact wrong time. Can't be overstated how hard a building full of rockets tears through a tank. Jobbo, if you get a defensive mission please point it out when it finally gets demonstrated!

Oh, trust me, defensive buildings is a thing we will see.

Mordja
Apr 26, 2014

Hell Gem
Hell yeah, best game in the series, and most quotable too. Also I disagree about the graphics: I think they're both colourful and simple enough that they hold up, unlike, say, C&C3's.

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini

Clapping Larry
China 02: Hong Kong Crisis

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JvyNuKLCOc
China 02: Hong Kong Crisis




With the attack on the military parade in Beijing having been a success in the eyes of the GLA, they have decided to up the ante and have taken over the convention center in Hong Kong, using it as a base of operation in the area. A strike force has been deployed to destroy the Convention Center and those who would seek to use it as a Command Center.






I couldn't find a spot that had the convention center and an appropriate bridge :shrug:



Location: Hong Kong, China
Objective: Destroy the Convention center and the GLA Terrorist Cell that occupies it.

Author's note: Well this level sure is awkward in 2021! We get some interesting map functions, new powers, and tougher enemies to fight.





Command Center
ARMOR: Structure [Tough]
COST: 2000
POWER USAGE: 0
PURPOSE: Trains Construction Dozers, unlocks Base Building

The first structure in a Chinese base, the Command Center generates Construction Dozers to build the rest. Upgrades include a Radar Map and Mines.

Author's Note: The essential building for any base, the Chinese version of this building is required to unlock the minimap.



Nuclear Reactor
ARMOR: Structure
COST: 1000
POWER PROVIDED: 10
PURPOSE: Provides Power to your base

A strong yet volatile source of power, the Nuclear Reactor should be built a safe distance from other structures. When switched into Overcharge mode, the Nuclear Reactor generates additional power yet takes damage. If left in Overcharge mode, the reactor eventually explodes.

Author's Note: Required if you want a working minimap and automated defenses, the Nuclear Reactor comes with a useful, if dangerous, ability to provide an additional +5 power while being Overcharged.



Supply Center
ARMOR: Structure
COST: 1500
POWER USAGE: 1
PURPOSE: Resource drop-off point, builds Supply Trucks

The Chinese Supply Center receives and holds resources that are found and delivered by the Supply Trucks it creates. Building extra Supply Trucks speeds your gathering of supplies.

Author's Note: As mentioned, each faction requires differing amounts of resource getters. I tend to find 3 supply trucks works well when the SC is close to a resource point.



Barracks
ARMOR: Structure
COST: 500
POWER USAGE: 0
PURPOSE: Trains infantry

All Chinese infantry, including the Red Guard, Tank Hunter, [REDACTED] and [REDACTED], are trained and released from the Barracks. The Capture Building upgrade is developed here.

Author's Note: One of the most vital buildings in the Chinese arsenal, for reasons that won't be 100% clear until we get further into the campaign.



Bunker
ARMOR: Structure
COST: 500
POWER USAGE: 0
PURPOSE: Defensive Structure

A Chinese Bunker can garrison up to five soldiers guarding an area. Units can be evacuated individually or simultaneously from the Bunker. It's best to garrison with a variety of Chinese infantry.

Author's Note: Ignore the manual, toss all your Tank Hunters in here!



War Factory
ARMOR: Structure
COST: 2000
POWER USAGE: 1
PURPOSE: Trains Chinese vehicles

The Chinese War Factory builds and repairs Chinese vehicles.

Author's Note: While the Barracks is more vital to long-term survival, the War Factory cannot be ignored, as it produces the more fun units.



Gatling Cannon
ARMOR: Base Defence
COST: 1200
POWER USAGE: 3
PURPOSE: Defensive Structure

A vicious machine gun, the Gatling Cannon can be targeted against air and ground attackers. A steady stream of bullets from the Gatling Guns can make short work of most enemy units - especially infantry.

Author's Note: While I don't do it, a healthy mix of Gattling Cannons and Bunkers is heartily advised.



Gatling Tank
RANGE: Medium
ARMOR: Anti-Air Vehicle
WEAPON: Gatling Gun
COST: 800

The Gatling Tank spews lead and more lead. This weapon is particularly lethal against infantry and other soft targets.

Author's Note: Great when used in conjunction with heavier tanks as a means to provide anti-infantry and anti-air support. There's no reason to avoid using these except for one specific unit later.




Aftermath:

Despite the victories in Beijing and Hong Kong, they have felt a little hollow, as the job of clearing out the GLA from China's native lands is not yet complete. No rest for the wicked, General!

PurpleXVI
Oct 30, 2011

Spewing insults, pissing off all your neighbors, betraying your allies, backing out of treaties and accords, and generally screwing over the global environment?
ALL PART OF MY BRILLIANT STRATEGY!
Is every Chinese mission going to start with a cutscene of them eating poo poo at the hands of the GLA? :v:

UED Special Ops
Oct 21, 2008
Grimey Drawer

PurpleXVI posted:

Is every Chinese mission going to start with a cutscene of them eating poo poo at the hands of the GLA? :v:

So far EVERY mission, even the training one, has started with one faction getting clowned on.

Anyway, this mission at least has the GLA attack you, which is a big step up, and really shows off the strengths and weaknesses of garrisoning buildings. Those weird blind-spots always are nasty and I swear purposeful on this map. While it wasn't mentioned in the video, the Convention Center and its two car parks actually do play a purpose beyond being something you need to destroy. The Center itself spawns in small GLA infantry teams while the car parks spawn those nasty explosive cars. Also neat thing about the buildable Bunker, the infantry inside can't be cleared out using fire or toxins or whatever, making the Gatling Cannon/Bunker combo even more potent. Overall, its a lot more exciting of a map then the last one, not that is a hard feat however.

Redeye Flight
Mar 26, 2010

God, I'm so tired. What the hell did I post last night?

PurpleXVI posted:

Is every Chinese mission going to start with a cutscene of them eating poo poo at the hands of the GLA? :v:

The poo poo-eating here is actually one of the better story design choices in this game; the Chinese campaign has a very believable ramp where your starting position gets better and better as you get a grip on the situation and turn the might of China on the opposition. I'm loathe to say more because of the possibility of spoilers.

I played so god drat much of this campaign when I was young, mostly on the C&C Decade collection they put out. I could probably do some of the missions entirely in my head. I also cannot goddamn wait for Zero Hour, but people aren't going to get WHY I can't wait for Zero Hour until we're done with the main campaign here.

The thing that was REALLY my jam, however, was the Generals' Challenge mode.

THE BAR
Oct 20, 2011

You know what might look better on your nose?

I only just realised, that the Red Guards don't wear glasses on their picture. That's a shame, I liked my nerdy murder boys.

Sylphid
Aug 3, 2012
You were right about the functioning of the Refinery; it lowers the prices of all mechanized units by 10%, I think? This applies to all vehicles.

It should be noted that the Gatling Cannon can detect stealthed units, but the Bunker can't. That's another reason why it's always a good idea to have a mix of defensive structures if you're playing as China. Also, due to a weird way the game engine works or something, Red Guard and Tank Hunters that don't have the Horde Bonus, if they go into a garrisonable building, will not get that bonus while they're inside. But if they do have that bonus when they go into the building, they'll receive it while still inside the building.

Manic_Misanthrope
Jul 1, 2010


Sylphid posted:

You were right about the functioning of the Refinery; it lowers the prices of all mechanized units by 10%, I think? This applies to all vehicles.

It should be noted that the Gatling Cannon can detect stealthed units, but the Bunker can't. That's another reason why it's always a good idea to have a mix of defensive structures if you're playing as China. Also, due to a weird way the game engine works or something, Red Guard and Tank Hunters that don't have the Horde Bonus, if they go into a garrisonable building, will not get that bonus while they're inside. But if they do have that bonus when they go into the building, they'll receive it while still inside the building.

Yeah, that's a thing in this game: All automated defensive structures automatically reveal stealth in their vicinity which makes it easier to defend against but garrisons don't.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Grammarchist posted:

But I'll be damned if I still don't get a kick out of "In the modern world, great leaders resolve their conflicts with words. Words like... SCUD LAUNCHER *sick guitar riffs*"

The intro is trying way too hard to be cool and is so lame that it wraps around to being awesome.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply