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Sure, why not, if this is happening. She/her, GMT.
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Jun 25, 2022 14:29
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| # ¿ Sep 10, 2024 05:03 |
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How do you do, fellow gamers? It's time to game. Do not asks for whom the game games... It games for you.
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Jun 28, 2022 17:35
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alright joining this game finally got me to buy an avatar, truly I am a pawn in Jeffrey's machinations.
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Jun 28, 2022 17:54
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Yet to post: Buncasti; Cloacamazing; My Second Re-Reg. I mean it's day 1 and there's nothing to go on, and I feel nervous when I'm not doing something which is arguably useful. Previously in in-person Werewolf or whatever, I'd suggest skipping the execution on day 1, but since we don't know how many scum there are (right?) and we get the information when we execute, I guess there's little reason not to execute on day 1?
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Jun 28, 2022 23:55
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Somebody is going to get flipped in night 1 regardless, hooowever: The more I think about it, the more I think not executing Day 1 is a gift to the scum, and agree with PlasticAutomaton. Having the information about who voted for who, what they said, even if appearing to be in jest - too good to pass up. Otherwise we're just dealing with the same stuff tomorrow. Probably going to vote Jadecore on the basis that I think that's how I post if I was scum and wanted to secure no execution (by positioning it as that, or execute wologar) This is literally just a vibes argument though, but, day 1 innit. I'm going to work off of vibes and go for ##vote Jadecore. Might change it tomorrow, who knows! Day 1, what a concept!
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Jun 29, 2022 03:01
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Bucnasti posted:I'm here, I don't know how we can flip somebody other than maybe lower paddle without any more information to go off of. Lower paddle isn't a player, that's just flavour. Flipping somebody doesn't just gain the information from the flip - it also gains the information based on who voted for who, who dragged their feet, and how that compares to the result of the flip. None of this information is gained from a flip that happens in the night - so on thinking of it again, I'm pretty sure we'd be in a much worse position if we didn't do it.
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Jun 29, 2022 03:36
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Green Wing posted:Lower paddle isn't a player, that's just flavour. I now realise you almost certainly knew this and was joking but I'm posting at 0340 for some reason so I'm not thinking well.
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Jun 29, 2022 03:38
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NeverHelm posted:Yeah, in the absence of any better choices I might vote Plastic merely to make this a "pure" newbie game as was originally intended. That's sort of a last resort for me, though. I'd much rather vote for someone actually giving scum vibes. So far there hasn't been much of that, the closest thing being Jade for maintaining a reluctance to vote but that doesn't mean much coming from a newbie. I think a vote for a veteran, because they are a veteran, would be a mislay. Much better to vote for vibes, however weak, than for a, like, game design reason - the latter becomes a defence for the vote so removes information from this day. Too easy to dismiss later questioning and vote count analysis with "well, I thought we agreed to just make this a newbie game". cuntman.net posted:we could vote for either green wing or jadecore because both have vaguely indicated being reluctant to vote at some point. but thats a lousy reason especially because both of those posts were before it was established that voting someone out only benefits the town Nah I said that in *in person* werewolf that's often my move but that I didn't see an advantage here. Just mulling, but indicated the opposite. Jadecore posted:…I guess this is the mafia newbie experience, huh? I think it's always going to feel like that, I figured it's better to rip the plaster off early 
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Jun 29, 2022 13:48
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Bucnasti posted:Ok, this is where I'm lost, how does somebody give scum vibes right at the beginning? Like what should I be looking for right now? How does anybody give up scum vibes any time? Through the things they're suggesting and where they're trying to pull the conversation. It's going to be weak in day 1, but the resulting flip gives that information and puts the votes into context that can be used in future days. Countering at night implies role use. Unless protective roles get very lucky (or even exist) somebody will flip at night - if none of us have put forward arguments on this day, that flip won't be information. So it's up to townies to make those arguments and add to content. Simply spinning the wheel at the last moment...not good. No information, not useful. MSRR?
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Jun 29, 2022 14:07
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Oh while I remember, since now discussions are happening more freely and I'm pretty confident the no-vote argument has been nipped in the bud I'm going to ##unvote and build up a more proper case later today/early tomorrow morning once there's more to go on, now the content and positions are slowly trickling in. Sorry if I'm posting too much and too early, I just haven't played mafia in over a decade - and only once online - and realised how much I missed it.  I'm also super unemployed so spent a lot of time reading the wiki and other games last night.
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Jun 29, 2022 15:24
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I think one thing to keep in mind - I may have said this before but it's worth emphasising - is that people are going to get unceremoniously removed from the game anyway (through night actions) and that it's something that could happen to any of us so, like. While it can feel bad to be voted out early on shaky premises, there's actually a page I found on the wiki (that I'm not sure is updated any more) but "games that voted out scum D1" so I think it's a very rare thing - so it's just the way of the game that you gotta be brutalBucnasti posted:
We all decide here - including the bad guys (scum) hiding among us. And yeah, during the night they will kill somebody anyway (unless there are protective roles and they get lucky). So yeah, you've got it right. One thing I'm totally undecided on is whether it's good or not to kill a lurker in day 1. Like...it seems like that's a good scum tactic, but I love information and data and loathe to do something that gains so little (also I'm not sure anybody is specifically lurking at this point, idk I haven't done a post count)
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Jun 29, 2022 15:43
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Green Wing posted:
(to be clear, I mean - lurking seems like a good scum tactic. But then I guess there are rules against that, so...ok I'm going to keep my thoughts to myself for a little bit and come back later like I said I would. Sorry, unemployed, excited by the game, posting too much)
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Jun 29, 2022 15:45
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My Second Re-Reg posted:So is anybody else in this thread ACTUALLY a newcomer to this whole thing? Or is it just me over here by myself with no clue what's going on while a bunch of Mafia Veterans stand around and act like it's just another day at the Guessing Game Inc office? Could you elaborate on why you think this is a tell?
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Jun 29, 2022 16:16
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cuntman.net posted:what makes it different in person? sounds like youve killed before and youll kill again tbh I'm not sure, possibly because I was in my first year at university at the time, and an idiot. Also they were sort of wacky 40-person randomised setup games where it was possible there were no scum at all, or lots of factions. They were a mess.
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Jun 29, 2022 16:30
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My Second Re-Reg posted:I think you two misunderstand me - I'm not attempting to apply game logic to my actions. Yeah I'm voting for this. I have some suspicions on others, but I think this is the clearest statement of anti-town action on the first day, as well as saying that they'll make an action that is difficult to analyse after the fact (because it's just non-logical chaos, right?) So, primary suspicion now goes to MSRR. ##vote My Second Re-Reg. Others I'm currently looking at are: Bucnasti Maybe playing up the confusion for obfuscation, but this could just be my paranoia. Follows MSRR with “Spin the wheel at the last minute” (and thus carries the same suspicion, for me) but, I might just be being paranoid and the confusion might be genuine, we're largely new, and so on. Cuntman.net Initially supported a no-vote, then switched to supporting a vote and voting for those who supported a no-vote (Green Wing and Jadecore). (minor inconsistency, but can also be explained because it's D1 and, like, people are allowed to change their minds) Proposed alternative to vote out Plastic Automaton on the basis of veterancy (‘innocent’ reasoning possibly shields scum move). But also, like. There are plenty of people for whom my notes are just "idk, not much to go on", because it's more than 24 hours out from deadline, so this might just be me doing the tall poppy thing to people sticking their necks out. That said, I feel pretty strongly that MSRR's proposed actions are, at best, town-detrimental. Also I like voting for people because it means people are forced to comment and make more content to look at, so. I like votes.
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Jun 29, 2022 17:07
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:I don't think we can read much if anything from people waffling on whether to lunch or not day one. I don't think it's obvious, and I had to think about it for a while before the game started, too. I think the question of who people are proposing we vote for is more interesting. Me giving people weird vibes isn't news to me, honestly Eh, I was really just thinking aloud about no-kill rather than suggesting it first of all, but like yeah I see why that gave vibes. As I said at the time of the vote, it was "Might change it tomorrow, who knows! Day 1, what a concept!" so it was very much just an indicative "let's see where this leads" because, yeah. Gotta start somewhere. For avoidance of doubt, my current MSRR vote is more of a 'real' one.
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Jun 29, 2022 19:08
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My Second Re-Reg posted:It's Day #1 - there is no information yet, outside of those trying to pipe up and lead the thread, thus making the act of trying to influence the decisions of others suspicious in and of itself. Nah, a quick look at other mafia threads does show that, after an initial shitposting phase, people still make accusations on others based on the content of their posts in Day 1, often on tone. You just have to make a read - I'm sticking with my read and vote on you, I think this is an anti-town position at best but also just likely a scum position. (Side note, like crab said I would really like to hear from Caffeinated Jerkoff and I hope that more people make votes before it comes down to the wire tomorrow, so there's time to think about them  )
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Jun 29, 2022 20:08
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I'm not sure wologar ever 'targeted' NeverHelm in any case. The closest I can find is this post:wologar posted:I've only played IRL Werewolf and Avalon like thrice. I've been reading through some threads in the Game Room (https://forums.somethingawful.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=103), though, where I found out that NeverHelm has actually played before!! Which was quickly - like, *immediately*, followed up with wologar posted:Oh, just once according to Votefinder, so nevermind. Further, wologar was actually saying that they might vote plastic so...I don't think any of what you've said re: wologar holds up, HyperCrab. Possibly obfuscation? I don't know. Might be worth remembering this if any of these people flip. I'm not changing my vote at this time, but the more I look at this post the more I think...hmm, I'm not sure the addition of wologar here adds up. Wologar *did* bring up plastic as their voting preference. Hyper Crab Tank posted:I'm way more suspicious of wologar and My Second Re-Reg now both going for the "vote out the secret veterans" angle. wologar is the first one to bring up NeverHelm and then Re-Reg follows up and announces their intent to vote NeverHelm out. I'm also suspicious as to why both of them homed in on alleged crypto-veteran NeverHelm instead of confirmed veteran Plastic Automaton. The heat also seemed to turn on NeverHelm the second they said they might vote Plastic. This whole schtick is giving me some vibes. I have more out-there theories like for example "MSRR is a townie but an easy target, and both HCT and wologar are scum who are running interference" or "Plastic isn't posting as much as I'd expect a veteran to do, even on Day 1, and that's a tell", but, like, at some point I'm just overthinking and running in circles. Keeping my vote where it is, but, like. This post is to make sure my suspicions about what might be an honest mistake from HCT are written down. One other thought I have is that scum may be attempting to "be present without being present". I think this is more likely than straight-up not posting, which is also bad but for different reasons. By this I mean, posting but not commenting on things/talking about how they can't decide/how difficult this is, etc. Avoids being seen as lurkers, prevents getting a read. Also avoids voting - let's assume there are 3 scum (2 seems like too little, 4 seems like too much). If all of them just don't vote, that's quite a lot out of an inexperience crowd that just need to not vote in order to have no D1 flip. There are several people who are potentially in this category now.
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Jun 29, 2022 23:06
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Green Wing posted:
To be clear because this was a super rambling post - that first one is something I think might be true *instead* of MSRR being scum, but ultimately I still come down on 'MSRR is scum'. It's an alternative I'm mulling over.
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Jun 29, 2022 23:08
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Cloacamazing! posted:I don't really trust the sudden ganging up on MSSR here. The thread had been going that way for a while, but Green Wing has been pushing for it a bit too hard in my opinion. ##vote Green Wing Eh, in my post where I voted I listed two other people in suspicious of, and then set out how I'm not sure about HCT. Like, I've been posting a lot, but that's just...sort of what I'm like. (my instinct is to point at this post and say 'hm this is possibly scum trying to distance themselves, maybe MSRR is a townie' but I think this is a post it's impossible to analyse before the flip. That's probably just an "oi, how dare you vote for me" instinct) I try to go all out in everything I do, and tend to put dien every thought I have. This might not be for strategy, the more I think think about it. I just can't stop posting.
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Jun 30, 2022 09:46
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I mean, bandwagoning is always going to be a concern, that's what scum are going to do if they see a vote going one way. Either the person is town (and it's slipping in to push it towards there) or they're scum and they can see the way the wind is blowing, and want to cover themselves. All the more reason for people to, like. Set out fully what they think as much as they can.
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Jun 30, 2022 12:07
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Next vote to MSRR would end the day immediately, keep in mind, so. Any last thoughts before nightfall, get them in now.
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Jun 30, 2022 12:42
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LupusAter posted:Yeah, advocating for people not to try to play the game isn't a good look. Only thing that gives me pause is the doubling down, feels a little too attention-grabbing, but it could be an attempt at posting through it. specifically flagging this vote and lurking while also saying in a previous post that we ought to be suspicious of lurkers.
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Jun 30, 2022 12:43
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Green Wing posted:specifically flagging this vote and lurking while also saying in a previous post that we ought to be suspicious of lurkers. To clarify: I think regardless of the flip, this post gives me pause (like I feel like at the 5-6 votes mark, even scum would start throwing their teammates under the bus), and I'm saying it's one to look at tomorrow (because I might be dead by then, so I'm making note of my flag now)
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Jun 30, 2022 12:45
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:Yeah I'm not nearly sold enough on my own read that I want to hammer Re-Reg now. I want to hear some thoughts from the people who suddenly decided to pile on the votes. Maybe it's just because the day is ending in a couple hours, but I still think the justifications have been kinda slim. Also, nobody is stepping up to defend Re-Reg either, so either the scum have already decided to bus him or he's not scum. Also what happened to Plastic, who said he was going to write a post and then didn't? wologar posted:I know I agreed that Re-Reg's posting was anti-town (although they got better), but I think the pile-up on votes is bandwagony. There's bound to be scum in the last few votes, either jumping at the chance to execute town or just leaving a teammate to the wolves. The scum could also be simply not voting, and staying mostly quiet or just performing hesitancy - letting us twist ourselves in knots about things, both shielding them both from accusations of bussing (in the event of MSRR being scum) and piling on (if they aren't). There are enough quiet people for that to be feasible. I think, as I've said before, at this point. One specific thing I want to put out there in case the day ends suddenly is that there are a couple people who have posted *precisely* as much as they need to, to avoid the lurker warning, while not getting involved in the discussion all that much. That's Jadecore (OK WELL I HIT PREVIEW AND SHE POSTED with a lot of reasoning and input too so uhhhh never mind I guess!), cuntman (who has posted precisely 10 times, posing questions to MSRR but not voting, or even stating a personal position, just asking questions. Very strong belief that both should be kept an eye on. Specifically, I expressed some suspicion about cuntman in an earlier post. See this post: Green Wing posted:
Noting the precise post count, and the nature of those posts, that suspicion is getting stronger. I think bucnasti is the last 'true' lurker (and Plastic but looking at plastic's post history, he doesn't seem to usually get down to the posting grind until later in the day anyway. I think the only person who hasn't given any position or votes (however slight) at this point is Bucnasti. Which is a pity, but, like. I doubt it's scum behaviour because it's so far below the lurking threshold, and at this point shifting votes on to a lurker wouldn't gain a huge amount of information.
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Jun 30, 2022 15:23
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Jadecore posted:So my focus has to land on, y'know, the people actually talking a good amount. As I've said, Green Wing and NeverHelm are the loudest, and it could be argued they're trying to become The Leader Folks early so as to guide town around by the nose, but... I genuinely believe Green Wing's reasoning of just being unemployed and very excited. Don't have as much specific stuff to believe about NeverHelm, but I don't see either's behavior as particularly suspicious yet. Just involved. I'm taking the opportunity of not having a job to catch up on my posting 
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Jun 30, 2022 15:25
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NeverHelm posted:I think you might be going a little too far with some of these points. Especially that part about precise postcounts. Remember that people are still finding their footing here. I believe you might be twisting yourself in a knot. Eh, maybe. I'm keen to get my thoughts out before nightfall in case I die at night.
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Jun 30, 2022 16:55
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Shellception posted:Night phase: Thread will be closed. During night phase, mafia players will be allowed to attempt to kill a player, removing them from the game. Night actions that are part of roles will also take place during that time.[/list] Cloacamazing! posted:We can still talk at night, right? First night is usually when people start yelling at each other over how the first vote turned out. No, can't talk at night unless scum.
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Jun 30, 2022 17:25
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The OP says night is up to 24 hours. Like wologar said - unlikely to have crazy roles. I'd expect there to be a cop (can investigate a player's alignment during the night) and a doctor (can protect somebody from a nightkill) because those seem like the most basic roles.
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Jun 30, 2022 17:41
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PlasticAutomaton posted:Okay 3 1/2 hours left, I think I'm pretty set at this point. I don't think votefinder has recognised that as an alias? (how do you set votefinder aliases anyway? I see this happening in mafia games down below)
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Jun 30, 2022 18:32
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cuntman.net posted:it looks like everyone has either voted or is planning to vote for msrr. i think hyper crab tank might not be committed but im not sure. is there any reason not to end the day here? do we want to give people a chance to meet the 10 post requirement first? I was vaguely wondering if MSRR was going to make a defence by claiming to have a power role, to be honest. I think that's the only thing that could change things at this point, and even then might not.
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Jun 30, 2022 18:38
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Bucnasti posted:That's actually super useful thank you. Judging from other games, it's immediate (as soon as a mod notices the hammer and makes the flip post) but like I could be wrong or this game could be different. My Second Re-Reg posted:Haul me off in chains, foaming at the mouth and gesticulating wildly at NeverHelm and Green Wing like that one screenshot from It's Always Sunny with the corkboard For what it's worth, whether you're town or scum I'm pretty sure that scene is what everybody else is going to be doing in the next day phaser.
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Jun 30, 2022 18:58
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Eh, that's not good logic. If I was scum, I wouldn't have made the first vote on somebody, with no guarantee that it'd lead to anything. Seems like that'd be a bad move. To be honest, I'm a little suspicious of Bucnasti not so much on the basis of hammering (somebody has to), but on getting in slightly earlier on, on Day 1, how they thought they were going to vote for MSRR but also that they didn't think that they were scum. In fact, Bucnasti was seemed pretty sure that MSRR wasn't scum - to the point, really, where I would have expected them to refuse to make a vote. Bucnasti posted:I'm going to wait a few hours to vote, and since I'm convinced that offing someone is better than not I will vote for MSRR unless someone else is leading the vote by then, even though I don't think MSRR is scum, the information from they're reveal will be useful. I think this deflection - a kind of pre-emptive excusal by saying "I'll vote even thought I don't think MSRR is scum" is not a good look, at all. I think this is one of the most suspicious acts from Day 1. Like, I don't think the case against me is strong at all, because, like. As I said, I was the first to put down a vote, which for scum seems much more risky than jumping on somebody else's case, and also I think this is mostly on the basis of me being one of the people to actually put forward a case. It was wrong, but that doesn't make me scum.
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Jul 1, 2022 20:55
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Advance warning that it's Pride in my city this weekend and I have  a date so I'm liable to be slightly more quiet this weekend, so will be trying to get as much of my post-night thoughts out tonight as I can.As in my previous post, I'm suspicious of Bucnasti, for reasons explained - appeared to pre-load knowledge of MSRR's town flip and make their excuses early, in preparation for a case today. I ask - if you really didn't think MSRR was scum, why vote at all? You seemed pretty sure. I'm also a bit suspicious of Hyper Crab Tank. I know that they're claiming that they just made a mistake with their wologar questioning (in [url="https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=4004626&userid=208356#post524519438"this post [/url]), but I also felt that the positioning on MSRR was a little off. Both expressing suspicion but also declining to vote, and downplaying their read. Similar suspicion for similar reasons goes to...ech, too many people for this to really be useful. I started making a list, before realising that this was honestly too common to be only scum doing this. I guess this is what apathy votes are, like Plastic was saying? Not the only person to do this, but this kind of behaviour - supporting a bandwagon in text but also downplaying how much they believe the case - is bad vibes. This is worse in Bucnasti's case, though, which was a vote accompanied by downplaying how much they really believed in it. Either you support the vote or you don't, really. Bucnasti posted:
Yeah, but I had a better case (modulo day 1 weirdness) Cloacamazing is the only person that I'm particularly convinced is in the clear, right now.
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Jul 1, 2022 21:18
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Bucnasti posted:Somebody will have to tell me if this is a faux pas or giving away valuable information, but since MSRR is gone I don't think it matters, I'm the other Mason. MSRR and I agreed before the vote that if it turned out he wasn't SCUM that Green Wing was the most likely culprit and that I'd do whatever I could to bring him down. You are claiming to have hammered your mason buddy?!
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Jul 1, 2022 21:19
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Bucnasti posted:Somebody will have to tell me if this is a faux pas or giving away valuable information, but since MSRR is gone I don't think it matters, I'm the other Mason. MSRR and I agreed before the vote that if it turned out he wasn't SCUM that Green Wing was the most likely culprit and that I'd do whatever I could to bring him down. This is a scum slip. Masons know that each other aren't scum. That's what that role is. There is no way what is said here can be true - there is no "if it turned out he wasn't scum". Like, I thought you were just wrong about me - but this is an outright, "got 'em", scum slip. There's no way you're the other mason, because the masons knew they both were town. ##vote Bucnasti.
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Jul 1, 2022 21:21
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Well shoot I guess I'm just wrong. I got overexcited and thought that was a straight-up "throw the book at 'em, boys" scumslip.  I will ##unvote.
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Jul 1, 2022 21:27
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Wait, hang on. if it's unconfirmed masons then how does you being the other Mason back up your case at all? Like, it becomes irrelevant.
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Jul 1, 2022 21:30
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Oh, and since we're talking about masons now, the only reason I had my "probably a townie" read in my earlier post on Cloacamazing was that I thought she was the other mason (based on how little she trusted the votes against MSRR, but also was willing to put her vote against me. Suggested foreknowledge - again, under the misconception that Masons = automatic town). Based on this new information, I guess I retract that townie read.
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Jul 1, 2022 21:34
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| # ¿ Sep 10, 2024 05:03 |
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The more I think about it, the more I feel like the mason thing is just a bit odd to bring up, because - it doesn't help Bucnasti's case against me (because they didn't know MSRR was town either, like any of the town voting for them - nor had any reason to have an especial belief that they were), nor help to convince us that their arguments are in good faith (because it seems that the mason status doesn't confer any kind of mod-confirmed towniness).Bucnasti posted:I'm probably putting a big old target on myself for both sides, but right now I'm confident Green Wing is scum, and nobody has yet to give a compelling reason why he isn't, just lots of attempts to redirect to other people. Like...why would this be the case? If it's unconfirmed, it doesn't make you a confirmed townie or anything (also, she) I don't know, it's weird. I think I've said enough in my defence now, so, moving on. Jadecore posted:
Agreed and I think this underlines how important it is for town to post as much as possible about their thoughts - otherwise they're a cheap and safe night kill for the scum. cuntman.net posted:
So I think you made the same mistake as me by assuming that masons were confirmed town, unless I'm missing something here? Just trying to get my head around your point.
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Jul 1, 2022 22:10
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