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HellOnEarth
Nov 6, 2005




Finished at just under 80 hours! I really liked it!

Ending stuff:
I appreciate a good old fashioned :gbsmith: ending, but I kind of hope the upcoming DLC in December has a follow up story. Iím rootiní for those crazy kids.

Maybe I missed something but I wasnít sure why the worlds drifted apart when time restarted? I thought that Origin was supposed to successfully reboot the post-merge planet.


Edit: oh my god thereís a post credit scene.

HellOnEarth fucked around with this message at 16:35 on Aug 11, 2022

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Mr. Fortitude
Jul 9, 2010

The biggest dumbass


HellOnEarth posted:

Finished at just under 80 hours! I really liked it!

Ending stuff:
I appreciate a good old fashioned :gbsmith: ending, but I kind of hope the upcoming DLC in December has a follow up story. I’m rootin’ for those crazy kids.

Maybe I missed something but I wasn’t sure why the worlds drifted apart when time restarted? I thought that Origin was supposed to successfully reboot the post-merge planet.


Ending talk: The way I understood it is Origin specifically recreates both worlds into forms of light after the merge since the merge would destroy both worlds. It's implied that the worlds are still connected though, due to Noah hearing Mio's tune and disappearing in the post-credits afterwards, probably to reunite with Mio. So presumably people are able to travel between both worlds once their memories reawaken.

Valleyant
Jul 23, 2007

Eat the rich




Everyone in the city is super dead/never born yeah?

Mr. Fortitude
Jul 9, 2010

The biggest dumbass


Valleyant posted:

Everyone in the city is super dead/never born yeah?

Yes, but it's also implied that they'll be reborn in time too

donotpost
Jul 28, 2022


They really should've had Noah disappear when the camera was behind him instead of zoomed out a mile away.

Ardryn
Oct 27, 2007

Rolling around at the speed of sound.


nerdz posted:

I agree with your points aside from reveals there were no real spins. I think it's implied that riku is a descendant of riki, and the game is set after all the regular lifespan characters in both games are long dead. Melia is probably the one he refers to as his masterpon and was probably holding onto the sword for her. I dont know how long nopon live but it could be a Planescape Torment: Morte scenario where he and his lineage kept giving the sword to the current noah. Considering noah and mio founded the city alongside their partners, it's implied noah's child was just another person who moved it along as the first generation of non origin people (who got a raw loving deal on the end, bye from existence!). He could also be part of a possible (lets hope not) prequel dlc

I also agree that the main theme is heavily overused, as good as it is. Making it a gameplay element sorta made that even worse.



Yeah I just assumed that Melia kept track of everyone's descendants and Riku is Riki's and she told him as much while gaining his trust as Riku's "Masterpon."

I also think they overused the flute waaay too much, doesn't help that you can't skip single send-offs, but you can skip group send-offs for some reason. It's even more bizarre considering the game lets you skip normal conversations, so someone at Monolith was thinking about repeat scenes.

donotpost
Jul 28, 2022


For people who have beaten Sena's sidestory, What did you think of Shania's character, did she work for you as a sympathetic villain?

Valleyant
Jul 23, 2007

Eat the rich




donotpost posted:

For people who have beaten Sena's sidestory, What did you think of Shania's character, did she work for you as a sympathetic villain?

Not even in the slightest. I think it might be because she picked the worst role model to try and live up to. Her saying the colony kids had it easy was nuts. Was fun to clown on though.

Prowler
May 24, 2004



So we're using spoiler tags in the spoiler thread?

I have some questions that may be straight-up answered in the post-game content:

1. Is Mio Nia's daughter? ...did Rex bone all three ladies? REX?!
2. Do we know if Riku a descendant of Riki?
3. Do we ever see N/M's son in the world?
4. What sort of agonizing death will Vandham have in Xenoblade Legends?


Valleyant posted:

Not even in the slightest. I think it might be because she picked the worst role model to try and live up to. Her saying the colony kids had it easy was nuts. Was fun to clown on though.

It's weird to refer to Ghondor as a role model when they're the same age, same social status, were in the same team/cohort, and etc. Plus, she actively rejects the role to Shania's face multiple times. Because she isn't a role model, and Shania isn't looking for one. She's physically weak, looking for a shortcut to becoming stronger so others recognize her. She's Michael Jordan's teammate, but when she sees his success, her conclusion is "ah, I guess it's the shoes."

Her actual role model was likely her sister. We don't know much about their relationship, but I seem to recall a hint of jealousy. After she dies, despite her father and Ghondor praising her artwork (which was good!) and telling her to be true to herself (i.e. don't fight, become an artist), she goes, "Well, I guess I'm sister now" and begins using her dead sister's gun. So, sure, fine, let's say she wants to follow in her sister's footsteps (instead of it being a desperate cry for praise and recognition). When her sister's gun doesn't work--and she meets someone else stronger than her--she just uses their weapon. She continually takes shortcuts to become strong like other people rather than just be herself; she is too weak to be herself.

Having a lovely mother doesn't drum up enough sympathy in me to excuse betraying the City to their worst enemy and attempted genocide by a privileged faildaugther.

turn off the TV
Aug 4, 2010


Prowler posted:

1. Is Mio Nia's daughter? ...did Rex bone all three ladies? REX?!

It's implied that she's Nia's descendant but we don't know that Mio is her actual daughter. It's hard to say how long it's been since the events of 1 and 2, but I think that the current batch of High Entia children indicates that it's been generations given how they age and appear. Eunie is the only one we see with wings about the same size and color of Melia's, who was already generations down the line of mixed parentage. All of the other ones have really stumpy little wings that match their hair color, and even Eunie's a brunette. If Mio is part of their age cohort then I don't think that she'd be Nia's daughter, or at least not Rex's.

I've also seen some people trying to date the game by Riki and Tora still being alive, but IIRC normal Nopon can live for a couple hundred years.

turn off the TV fucked around with this message at 16:00 on Aug 19, 2022

Valleyant
Jul 23, 2007

Eat the rich




Prowler posted:

So we're using spoiler tags in the spoiler thread?

I have some questions that may be straight-up answered in the post-game content:

1. Is Mio Nia's daughter? ...did Rex bone all three ladies? REX?!
2. Do we know if Riku a descendant of Riki?
3. Do we ever see N/M's son in the world?
4. What sort of agonizing death will Vandham have in Xenoblade Legends?

It's weird to refer to Ghondor as a role model when they're the same age, same social status, were in the same team/cohort, and etc. Plus, she actively rejects the role to Shania's face multiple times. Because she isn't a role model, and Shania isn't looking for one. She's physically weak, looking for a shortcut to becoming stronger so others recognize her. She's Michael Jordan's teammate, but when she sees his success, her conclusion is "ah, I guess it's the shoes."

Her actual role model was likely her sister. We don't know much about their relationship, but I seem to recall a hint of jealousy. After she dies, despite her father and Ghondor praising her artwork (which was good!) and telling her to be true to herself (i.e. don't fight, become an artist), she goes, "Well, I guess I'm sister now" and begins using her dead sister's gun. So, sure, fine, let's say she wants to follow in her sister's footsteps (instead of it being a desperate cry for praise and recognition). When her sister's gun doesn't work--and she meets someone else stronger than her--she just uses their weapon. She continually takes shortcuts to become strong like other people rather than just be herself; she is too weak to be herself.

Having a lovely mother doesn't drum up enough sympathy in me to excuse betraying the City to their worst enemy and attempted genocide by a privileged faildaugther.

Also she had a dad who was supportive who she apparently completely forgot about until ghondor said, "hey remember your dad, he sure existed"

rex boned all 3 ladies. I'm pretty sure Mio is Nia's kid, they have the exact same core crystal and the origin stuff they use to reincarnate people has to come from somewhere. I'd say it'd be hard to guess who is what age in the original worlds since everyone gets set to 10 by Z.

Noah almost literally goes, "Alright then, keep your secrets" to Riku and then its' basically dropped as to why he's the coolest guy in the world.

How long the game takes place after xenoblades 1 and 2 is kind of iffy to figure out because there's the world state at origin and then the world state at the start of the game. Nia says, "I'm going to see you all soon" to the photograph so as far as we know they're alive at origin and got super dead during moebius world

turn off the TV
Aug 4, 2010


Valleyant posted:

rex boned all 3 ladies. I'm pretty sure Mio is Nia's kid, they have the exact same core crystal and the origin stuff they use to reincarnate people has to come from somewhere. I'd say it'd be hard to guess who is what age in the original worlds since everyone gets set to 10 by Z.

The excerpt from the art book used in the collector's edition preview has this on Mio's character art page alongside her final design:



Noah's page has what appears to be an early version of his intro/post credits design in the exact same spot, so I'm guessing that we're seeing Mio's version here. I don't think that there's really any other explanation for why she'd be this young and be wearing normal little girl clothes. I think that Mio is probably intended to be about the same age as him.

Mea Tulpa
Sep 4, 2006



When you meet Nia, doesn't she express some surprise when seeing Mio? I'd have to rewatch the scene to be sure but it seemed that way. Not to mention in postgame that Mio is the class inheritor. Seems like there's more going on.

I expected some sort of reveal with Riku. That little guy knows too much, like XB1's Alvis. And what was that knowing glance he exchanged with Melia?

Like a previous poster mentioned, the worlds drifting apart bit didn't make a whole lot of sense. It feels a little contrived to add more drama. I like the dramatic cutscenes in this, but the game can be a bit manipulative.

turn off the TV
Aug 4, 2010


Mea Tulpa posted:

When you meet Nia, doesn't she express some surprise when seeing Mio? I'd have to rewatch the scene to be sure but it seemed that way. Not to mention in postgame that Mio is the class inheritor. Seems like there's more going on.

I expected some sort of reveal with Riku. That little guy knows too much, like XB1's Alvis. And what was that knowing glance he exchanged with Melia?

Like a previous poster mentioned, the worlds drifting apart bit didn't make a whole lot of sense. It feels a little contrived to add more drama. I like the dramatic cutscenes in this, but the game can be a bit manipulative.

From what I understand of the setting, they build one half of Origin in each universe and wait for the moment when they collide, which is when both halves of Origin will combine into a single, functioning machine. It is basically an ark that will carry the souls of both worlds through the annihilation event caused by the universes combining and then reconstructs things afterwords. Origin was used to effectively stop time the moment it was completed. Aionios was made by combining parts of Alrest and Bionis/Mechonis in the instant they begin being annihilated. The separation in the end is Aionios being dissolved back into Alrest and Bionis/Mechonis, at which point time resumes at its normal rate and everything besides Origin is vaporized.

also I think that Mio is probably her grandaughter or something.

turn off the TV fucked around with this message at 19:55 on Aug 20, 2022

Blackbelt Bobman
Jul 17, 2004

I don't need friends! I've been
manipulatin' you since the start!
All so I can something,
something X-Blade!




Iím actively trying to avoid reading this thread rn but the idea of a spoiler thread is that you can post without spoiler tags so please, go hog wild.

For example, the queens are robots and Keves and Agnes fight to generate life energy that Mobius can use to live forever or whatever. Idk Iím only at chapter 5. Seems a lot like The Matrix.

That part doesnít make sense, where do they get the energy to grow the combatants? Doesnít that require energy? Maybe theyíll explain it.

PantsBandit
Oct 26, 2007

it is both a monkey and a boombox




Don't talk to me or my son ever again

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015

Kinda get used to weird things in my line of work, but coming back from the dead is definitely a first. I didn't even know that was possible.


The final boss being the collective embodiment of anxiety about the future is the most JPRG thing I've ever seen in a while.

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007



Junpei posted:

The final boss being the collective embodiment of anxiety about the future is the most JPRG thing I've ever seen in a while.

I mean the plot is literally "We shouldn't let powerful people continue to exploit us and use our limited lives for their own profit because we're so scared of what the alternative is that we accept a horrifying status quo over an unsure future." It's not a very subtle game.

Blackbelt Bobman
Jul 17, 2004

I don't need friends! I've been
manipulatin' you since the start!
All so I can something,
something X-Blade!




I found the ending kind of unsatisfying. Iíve seen other people talking about how it treats the worldsí splitting as something we should already know, even though the entire game has been about them fighting to defeat Moebius in spite of the fact that they donít know what will happen, and I agree that it comes out of nowhere. The post-credits scene makes sense, the planets collided as young Noah was looking at that clock and froze time in that moment, destroying Origin and resetting the planets returned them to that exact moment. But that means that the planets just arenít going to collide any more? Why? Do they now exist in different universes?

I wish they had explained why Riku had the magical sword that could cut anything. Also he clearly knew Melia, but if he is possibly hundreds of years old wouldnít he have run into the same people over and over as they were reborn? I canít recall, were the Nopon surprised by procreation like everyone else? Because if so, do Nopon not reproduce? Have they just existed since Aionos was formed? And if so, same question about them running into the same people over and over. Seems like a plot hole?

Iím posting in this thread because gently caress spoiler tags.

Mea Tulpa
Sep 4, 2006



Had the worlds separating business been introduced sooner, like the end of chapter 6, it would have added some uncertainty to the story for characters to focus on while setting up the ending. The question of whether restarting origin would work or just blow everything up could have been added too. The final two story chapters felt flat and abridged compared to everything that came before. To be clear I enjoyed the hell out of the game, but I think it climaxed too early.

It seems like Riku knew Melia from before the start. Maybe she was the source of lucky seven, as the counterpart to the ouroboros stone. It's not inconsistent with anything we're shown.

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turn off the TV
Aug 4, 2010


Blackbelt Bobman posted:

I found the ending kind of unsatisfying. Iíve seen other people talking about how it treats the worldsí splitting as something we should already know, even though the entire game has been about them fighting to defeat Moebius in spite of the fact that they donít know what will happen, and I agree that it comes out of nowhere. The post-credits scene makes sense, the planets collided as young Noah was looking at that clock and froze time in that moment, destroying Origin and resetting the planets returned them to that exact moment. But that means that the planets just arenít going to collide any more? Why? Do they now exist in different universes?

You see in the intro that Alrest appears in the sky over the Bionis and time stops at 6 PM. The Endless Now begins before anything is destroyed or anyone dies. Z tells the party that the two universes will collide and everything will blow up when time resumes. The first scene of chapter 7 says that the plan for Origin is to let the universes intersect and blow up, and then Origin will recreate the worlds and everyone will be reborn. In the post credits scene time has resumed, the world has been recreated as it was at 5:59 PM, and everyone has been reborn as children again. I'm pretty sure that the idea is that the universe really does just blow up when time resumes and Origin works exactly as intended.

There's not really any explanation for if the planets are in different universes or not, unless you can somehow figure out what the gently caress the flute duet in the end actually means.

Mea Tulpa posted:

The question of whether restarting origin would work or just blow everything up could have been added too.

I assume that this was the intent of Melia and Nia's skype call where they're talking about how Origin will give them a new beginning or be their end and that they'll only find out with the passage of time.

turn off the TV fucked around with this message at 03:59 on Sep 6, 2022

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