Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
beer gas canister
Oct 30, 2007

shmups are da best come play some shmups they're cheap and good and you like them
Plaster Town Cop

THREAD SOUNDTRACK
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZzteZNLZmI
THREAD TESTIMONIALS

Captain Foo posted:

okay i bought DU3 because of this thread, let's see if i click with it

Char posted:

I just spent 5 hours on The Void Rains Upon Her Heart

how
how did this happen

this game is fantastic

FishMcCool posted:

Ok, despite what the screenshots make it look like, Crimzon Clover does indeed feel like an amazing entry point. It's not long (5 stages), there's a novice mode, infinite continues, and a practice mode to just work on a single section. In novice mode, I can reach the 4th stage boss on 1 credit after 3 runs, so it doesn't feel that far off from a first 1cc, although stage 5 is a lot wilder. And there's there's the non-noob mode, obviously, and plenty more modes for varying things.

I'm absolutely impressed at how crazy it looks while remaining quite manageable in the end. It definitely feels a lot more approachable than the 1941/42/43 of yore.

Jester Mcgee posted:

This thread motivated me to try out some shmups. And the Full Extent of the Jam guide gave me a new perspective on how people enjoy these games.

And now I’m incredibly hooked. I started with Touhou 7 and Mushihimesama on the Switch.

madmatt112 posted:

I broke down, bought Ikaruga. Holy poo poo this is amazing. Never played shmups before

WHAT IS A SHMUP?
A shmup, or STG, or just shooter, is a game genre where the player flies around in a tiny ship shooting at tanks, planes, bugs, aliens, schoolgirls, and so on. Usually the maps scroll automatically. It's one of the oldest genres, and one of the most commercially successful in the early years of gaming. You probably know (or think you know) the deal already. Bullet hell refers to a particular type of shmup that fires an assload of bullets at you. IMO bullet hells are FAR easier than old school stuff like Gradius or Raiden because the bullets and enemies are easier to see and dodge. They will also usually respawn you instantly instead of resetting the entire level.

This thread is for new players like me that want to learn the ropes, talk strategy, and access this extraordinary body of work for the first time.

WHO CARES?
I do, and you should too. I'm too young to have spent time in the arcades, so the mystique of Gradius, Raiden and other famous cabinets eludes me. For many years I wrote off SHMUPs as an antiquated form, games created exclusively for the most diehard hikikomori, so dedicated that they'd actually leave their house not only to play, but master. In the 2000s, many of the biggest games, Touhou chief among them, featured an assortment of anime girlfriends. Wtf is that about?

I've never been interested in high scores or competition, at all. But recently these games have completely dominated my free time and left me wondering how I'd never given them even a moment of serious consideration. Shmups contain some of the most elegant design in the medium and probably 99% of gamers have never given them a fair shake. This thread here to convince you to try. If you've ever been awed by the difficult but fair nature of the Dark Souls/Bloodborne/Elden Ring set, or raised a controller in joy at the defeat of a tough boss, or drooled over gorgeous sprites, you will find something to love in what you're about to play. There is a lot more to do in shmups than score.

The Electric Underground addresses longstanding misunderstandings about shmups as a genre:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CziyNG8ls3A

SHMUPS ARE CHEAP!
Here's the first issue out of the way. Most shmups found on modern systems are inexpensive. With some exceptions for major arcade titles and Japan-only releases, most of them clock in around $20, and a few stone cold gems can be had for as little as $2 with no sale in place. And being one of the oldest genres, there is a ton of variety in terms of visuals, systems, and mechanics to choose from.

SHMUPS ARE BEAUTIFUL
pictured: me securing a personal best score in Crimzon Clover on Switch, played in TATE (vertical) mode
https://imgur.com/cNIB6bu.mp4
I mean come on. These games are gorgeous beyond compare, especially if you like chunky 2D sprites. Shmups originated in the arcades, as a public spectacle. Most of the titles regarded as the peak of genre were for many years available only on printed circuited boards torn directly from an arcade machine, and now you can play these rare wonders in the comfort of your living room, possibly laying on your back if you own a Switch or a Steam Deck. The effect of this visual hype is quite powerful.

SHMUPS ARE FAST
If you're reading this, you are probably an adult with a job. Since shmups are hard, you could conceivably spend 20 minutes on playing something like the fabulous Progear and complete 10 run-throughs - as in dying on the first or second level - though we all know dying is fun by now, right? If you have the experience to beat the whole game (or infinite credits), a full run will take between 20-40 minutes tops. There are virtually zero cutscenes or dialogue, no forced tutorials, no lovely unlock mechanics, no pay to win (because you aren't actually in the arcade), no chaff at all. The gameplay is everything.

SHMUPS ARE NOT THAT HARD
OK OK so they're cool as gently caress. But aren't they only for prodigies and freaks? The answer is no. Certain titles will absolutely mug the player for all of their quarters with no remorse, but thanks to the wonders of modern game design this is usually not an issue. A good, modern port of classic a shmup, and almost always new titles, will include a wealth of accessibility features. You can choose individual levels and bosses, and many games have save state support built-in, along with speed controls and rewind for practice. Even old games have difficulty settings built in - they were on the PCBs in arcades too, selectable via DIP switch - and there is no shame in playing on easy mode. Devs are sensitive to that as well, and for years have been adapting "default" difficulty modes into novice versions into something that anyone can enjoy without feeling patronized.

WHERE DO I PLAY SHMUPS?
Every platform has access to quality shmups at this point. I can only speak personally to the Switch and PC, both of which have awesome libraries. The Switch in particular supports TATE (vertical) mode in handheld. For PC, there is of course Steam, but also MAME emulation if you want the arcade experience. MAME is not recommended because it's a pain in the rear end. For a more streamlined experience, Fightcade supports many of the major shmups, with automated download and online matchmaking(!). Whatever you choose, pick something with level selects and/or save states.

WHICH SHUMPS SHOULD I PLAY?
Here are a few awesome shmups to get you started. Pick your favorite based on the visual style, because you will be pasting your loving eyelids open for many hours as you dodge, attack, bomb and meditate your way to the true last boss.

InfectedZero posted:

Hi everyone! Just wanted to drop this beginners list that a bunch of folks over in the Shmup Junkie discord have been working on as a good starting point to get into the genre. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1MZz8Q_8HdGyh2QU9BX4lNgyVAP9JZxxuy_YYbOLf1CM/edit?usp=drivesdk

BULLET HELL

Gunvein
This is maybe the perfect 1st bullet hell. Forgiving difficulty, excellent training modes, flashy graphics, indie pricing, tons of fun. Look for a port to Switch in 2023.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UC6KGwlACNc

DEATHSMILES I+II
Deathsmiles was Cave's late 00's attempt to bring new players to their arcade machines by incorporating gothy anime art and reduced overall challenge. Features a forgiving, stage-by-stage selectable difficulty, with varying routes. Stages are brief and punchy, with a ton of visual flair. Scoring is based on pairing particular shot types to each enemy. Deathsmiles II incorporated full 3D modelling, and it looks rough, but the gameplay holds up. DS is one of Cave's most polished and cohesive releases. Includes the awesome Black Label arrange mode, originally limited to a 300 PCB run.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJbkevnvYF0

Crimzon Clover: World Explosion
A glorious game, designed by a world record setting superplayer. Made to appeal to new players as well as the most hardcore via variable difficulty. Easier to understand and more forgiving than it seems in video!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsKx1eomF3w
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpN0eKjwtRE

Danmaku Unlimited 3
A super friendly game intended to onboard noobs. Developed first as a mobile title and later ported to PC and Switch. This is the game that set me down this mad path.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzFvnsNQgSI

ZeroRanger
A gorgeous indie game. PC only for now. More continues unlock as you progress further through the game. Maybe not truly a bullet hell.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCJSj-WOqdc

Mushihimesama
A classic from the master studio CAVE (the FromSoft of shooters). This is often cited as their most accessible game. It has super simple controls and ship selection, and highly legible graphics. The Novice mode is a ton of fun and does a nice job easing the player into the mess.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihS8ILnvMzc

DRAINUS
Old school level design meets bullet hell, with a full blown leveling and equipment selection system. Brought to you by Team Ladybug, better known for their Metroidvania Record of Lodoss War: Deedlit in Wonder Labyrinth. A gorgeous game and definitely worth a try. Difficulty level is relatively low, and the equipment system allows for all sorts of cheesy strats and optimization.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jv8xwNCuoE

Progear no Arashi
Another from CAVE and my personal favorite. I'm currently working clearing this game in 1 credit. It's included this on the list because it costs a mere $2, as part of the Capcom Arcade Collection (individual titles are available a la carte). It is slightly less intense than other CAVE games, and features a unique mechanic where catching bullets in exploding enemies deletes them. Be sure to turn the difficulty down to 2 in the US version because it has been set too high by default! You can also play it on the JP rom, which defaults to the normal arcade level. Giga Wing is another great shmup available in this collection, with more of a souped up Sega Genesis look and feel.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOUxSbUg0Mo

Jamestown
An indie darling with many fans in this thread. Remembered for bringing in a lot of casual players at release.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xp4qpKBzq1o

ROGUELIKES

Monolith
Hugely popular in both the roguelike and shmup circles, Monolith is a 4 directional shooter, where the player moves through proc gen mazes full of bullets, collecting various upgrades along the way. Features distinctive movement including a dash button. A very special game.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kSwRkqvd6_E

The Void Rains Upon Her Heart
A newer entry to the scene and possible classic in the making.

Ciaphas posted:

my drug of choice is The Void Rains Upon Her Heart, a criminally-underrated boss-rush shmup with roguelite-ish elements- no wait come back it's good i promise



the game's initial story mode has you going through 8-10 fights against one of dozens (like 80+? not sure) monsters and their various alternates. each monster has a level from 1 to at least 12, and more levels means more & faster bullets in each pattern, sometimes with entirely new patterns or different versions of the same pattern. each monster drops a set of "gifts" when defeated - passive boosts, helpers, Panics (bombs), consumables, all that sort of thing. not far in, you unlock Quickplay, which lets you pick a monster, their level & set of gifts and throw down for top score without the story bits

(...)

tl;dr: TVRUHH is great, it's thirteen bucks on steam, please play it!

Operation STEEL
Traditional hori shmup married to a roguelike. Lots of flexibility in the systems here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XexinO9UgOE

CHUNKY 3D with 2D gameplay

Cotton Fantasy aka Cotton Rock n Roll
A new entry in an old school favorite series. Notable for its high production value and breezy, non-bullet hell style. Features 7 characters with completely different mechanics and a relatively low difficulty.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xY_hErptXFo

RADIANT SILVERGUN
Treasure's first shoot em up, and an all time classic. Level up your weapon systems by chaining kills of like-colored enemies. There's really nothing else like RSG. One of my favorite games period and a remarkable piece of work. The visuals and music are in a class of their own.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxFZ3T_Azzg

Ikaruga
Treasure's follow up to Radiant Silvergun and in many ways its polar opposite. Devourer of many an unsuspecting player, Ikaruga is different from every other game in this post. Designed to check the player's aggression at every point and force them to reckon with the demanding mechanics. Stages are built around a polarity mechanic where the player can absorb roughly half of the bullets on screen, while vulnerable to the rest. Not recommended for noobs at all but here it is if you're curious.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8MoniJKCjY

Rolling Gunner
Another relatively new game much lauded by shmup fans. Directed by former Cave developer Daisuke Koizumi.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrSVN7K6Zy4

Psyvariar Delta
A clear inspiration for Danmaku Unlimited 3: bullets can be grazed to influence score, encouraging a risky playstyle. The publisher of the most modern port is in rough shape, so it may be wise to snatch this quick before it's deslited.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Syu4G2VHy2s

G-DARIUS
One of the most beloved series in STGs, with a storied history. The 1st Darius utilized an ultrawide cabinet with 3 horizontal monitors to display the action. This installment was a major turning point for the series and is well remembered by fans. The modern port was developed by M2, known for their fidelity to the arcade and generous emulation features.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuXp5XtI2so

OLD SCHOOL AND APPROACHABLE

Aleste series
A friendly and still modern-feeling series from Compile. These games have a tight scope, with fewer enemies than bullet hell games. Friendly to the player and quite well designed, this series was designed from the start for console players instead of the arcade. The definition of "comfy" shmups. A few of them have been ported by M2 (JP only but region free), who went so far as to create an entirely new game exclusive to the port collection. Some of these have selectable movement speed, which makes them especially suited to retro handheld devices. If you only play one of them, go with MUSHA.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMbzgsdRDxA

The Voice of Labor posted:

musha 1cc'ed on normal. it's not easy, not too hard. pretty much the goldilocks of shmup. had to recover from some absolute hard fails too, so it's good enough that if you loose all your powerups you're not dead in the water

a few tips

set the speed to 6 and leave it there. leave the satellites at forward. try and stick with the laser mostly. figure out the powerup system, consecutive elemental weapons power up, ie.. two lightnings in a row or two missiles in a row will pump your weapon to level 1 (it starts at zero), but picking up a lighting followed by a missile will leave it at zero. the little glowy pod things that come four per canister power up your main shot and your satellites. remember that there's no timer, on a few of the bosses the best strategy is really to shoot them a few times, move away from their shot, rinse and repeat, play it safe and don't rush. if an enemy has a trick to it, it will only have one, you'll get surprised by it the first time but a couple of practice sessions and you should be good. there's a level select code, so you can practice specific levels and there's an easy setting. musha isn't exactly one of those games where you need to 100% anticipate where every enemy is coming in and be at the top of the screen waiting for them, rote memorization isn't necessary. you do, however, need to play aggressively and get close to the enemy you're firing at. there are enough back attacks that cruising at the bottom of the screen isn't a great idea, but it's generally safe to retreat to.

Soldier series
Still gorgeous 30 years later! These are old favorites by Hudson Soft. Similar in style to Aleste. Inspiration for the fantastic modern title Raging Blasters.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcWbjLW4mV4
Raging Blasters:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTL6zgtC5mQ

EUROSHMUPS
Euroshmups are a broad category with no solid definition. Typical characteristics include health bars, inertial movement, slower pace, and selectable upgrades. They tend to be a little controversial.

Tyrian
A classic and possibly the archetypal euroshmup. Free on GOG!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TiazAACfxPk

Jet's n Guns 1&2

Ineptitude posted:

Jets’n’guns 2 is the gold standard.

They decided to take seriousness out of the equation and just go off the rails with wacky items and gear combos.

JnG 1 is great as well, but 2 is a lot better.

Sky Force and Sky Force Reloaded is also great, not as good as JnG but easily in 2nd place. Reloaded is their corny way of naming the sequel, they are 2 different games.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQjbCS5-vEc

OTHER

Cambria Sword
A sprawling indie epic that's unlike anything else. Released in 2016 and updated significantly since. Featuring a de-emphasized scoring system in favor of rich gameplay. Not available on Steam, click here for the official store link. Here's a System11 post with more info: https://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=62806&start=0

quote:

The most epic tale starring a flying Sarotrocercus - The first thing anyone will tell you about this game is that it's long. Like, really long. A full playthrough of all 11 stages takes over three hours, but for those of you who balk at that length (i.e. sane people), the game allows you to skip stages, allowing you to reach the ending in as little as four stages (1 to 1.5 hours). Clearly a game this long isn't going to have the tight design and conciseness of a CAVE or Psikyo game, and I'm not going to pretend that it does. There are definitely parts that could have been cut down or compressed if the goal were to make a shorter game that would realistically fit in an arcade setting, but what makes the game great is that that's not the point and it knows it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWTFdsGlfxs


GUIDES AND ADVICE
Shmups are distinctive in that they are fully about learning. Even if you don't play for score, you'll want to treat each run as an opportunity to learn something new. How does that mini boss actually work? Is there a trick to downing that mass of tiny planes? What does my lock on shot actually do? It's helpful to have a goal in mind for every session. Fire up the 2nd level only and get to problem solving, or try the full game and see how you've progressed!

These two guides will tell you everything you need to know to get started. They apply to any given shmup, especially bullet hells.

The Full Extent of the Jam
The best gaming strategy guide I've ever seen. Details the actual journey of a scrub to world-record contender. The techniques here are easy to understand.

quote:

==========> Music Analogy <==========
DoDonPachi is a song that's pretty easy to play in the beginning, and gets harder and harder. It's a song that lasts 45 bloody minutes. And the last few minutes are horribly hard to play.
When approaching this kind of work with mastery in mind, you may naturally try playing the song until you reach parts that seem way too hard for you. Then you will start over from the beginning until you reach them again. And again. And again. After a while, you will realize it's pretty stupid to play through the easy parts every time you want to try the first part that is hard for you, so you will start focusing on the hard parts. Bar by bar, you will decompose and study the song. The hardest bars will be the bars you study and practice the most.
=======> End of Music Analogy <=======

This video cribs heavily from the guide above, with some extra tidbits here and there. Great watch.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mje1q66Zazo

Another very brief guide to common shmup mechanics:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_vUM1V_s1A

For further reading and discussion, see the shmup megathread here: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3520923

ZackHoagie posted:

Play DodonPachi yall, it will change your life.

Racketboy's Shmups 101. Lots of good foundational information here: https://www.racketboy.com/retro/shmups-101-a-beginners-guide-to-2d-shooters

Bamd's Quick Start guide: https://shmups.wiki/library/User:Bamd

A collection of informational shmup reading: https://1cclog.blogspot.com/p/precious-shmup-links.html?m=1

Restart Syndrome: A public leaderboard for casual and hardcore players alike to post their scores: https://www.restartsyndrome.com/

System11 is the main English language shmup forum: https://shmups.system11.org/

A well-maintained list of Switch shmups and their current sale status: https://www.dekudeals.com/lists/h9wbjf?sort=release_date

A quick overview of essential shmup mechanics from a design perspective:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1iM9Fc2DsPppedlJVDYQ3g1VB5sFfilomGIYFIwJka9w/edit
https://twitter.com/boghogooo/status/1520874464078090246

Solid Twitter accounts to follow:
https://twitter.com/STGshmups
https://twitter.com/ShmupJunkie
https://twitter.com/NShmups
https://twitter.com/shmups

This is a link of the entire above post as of 8/25/22 as pastable text. Please feel free to share and modify for use in any way elsewhere, since it is unlikely that offsite users will ever see it.

beer gas canister fucked around with this message at 18:34 on Sep 22, 2023

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

victrix
Oct 30, 2007


This is easily one of the weirdest genres in gaming for me - I've 1ccd and beaten tons of the ancient ultra ball busting games and I probably have hundreds or thousands of hours put into them over the years

... but I almost never talk about it

because any conversation starter feels like I first have to do the door to door evangelist bit just to get someone to try one

And the genre is so broad that while there probably is a game for almost anyone who likes action games even a little, finding the right match between theme and gameplay is time consuming - and therefore very poorly suited to twitter length modern gaming conversations

what I'm saying is shmups are really good and you should play a bunch until you find the ones that click for you, but I ain't guiding you :v:

Potsticker
Jan 14, 2006


It's one of those genres that replaying over and over, the practice, feels really good to me on the games I enjoy, but I don't find often there's a lot to talk about outside of like-- reading news when there's something new out or an older game becomes available again.

beer gas canister
Oct 30, 2007

shmups are da best come play some shmups they're cheap and good and you like them
Plaster Town Cop

victrix posted:

This is easily one of the weirdest genres in gaming for me - I've 1ccd and beaten tons of the ancient ultra ball busting games and I probably have hundreds or thousands of hours put into them over the years

... but I almost never talk about it

because any conversation starter feels like I first have to do the door to door evangelist bit just to get someone to try one

And the genre is so broad that while there probably is a game for almost anyone who likes action games even a little, finding the right match between theme and gameplay is time consuming - and therefore very poorly suited to twitter length modern gaming conversations

what I'm saying is shmups are really good and you should play a bunch until you find the ones that click for you, but I ain't guiding you :v:

This is precisely why now is such a great time to try them. I never cared at all about these games until about a couple of months ago, and now I can hardly play anything else. The genre has been so heavily refined over the years that the best games from the past are still stunningly good, even for someone with zero nostalgia. Newer entries have features so brilliant that it's kind of dazzling - take Monolith for example. Since they are so cheap and plentiful on current hardware it's easy to try out a slew of them.

I've bought several in pairs, trying out hori and tate games, old stuff, new stuff. I even credit fed fully through DoDonPachi on an rg531p rotated 90 degrees to see the early bullet hell designs. There's a whole thread of conventions and language that runs through these games that really tickle the game-design-liker center of my brain. The best have all of the elements game critics rave about : diegetic world building, a pedagogical difficulty curve, precise friction-heavy control, all that stuff.

MMF Freeway
Sep 15, 2010

Later!
Haven't played them in years but yeah very fun genre if you get in the right headspace. also an excuse to post this. mars matrix is really very good...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbts2qTrbAg

The Voice of Labor
Apr 8, 2020

MMF Freeway posted:

mars matrix is really very good...

nrook
Jun 25, 2009

Just let yourself become a worthless person!
I don’t think there’s any rush in video games quite like reaching an achievement you’ve been aiming for in a shmup. It’s the sort of thing that makes you giddy for the rest of the day. Maybe winning a significant tournament in a multiplayer game is similar.

beer gas canister
Oct 30, 2007

shmups are da best come play some shmups they're cheap and good and you like them
Plaster Town Cop
The first time I landed on the Progear leaderboards was amazing. It took a couple of weeks to clear the minimum score, and I spent every day thinking about how to score better, and it was helpful, because the levels are always exactly the same.

There is a special rhythm to the learning process for shmups. First run or two is stupefied confusion and surprise, often to the point of comedy. Then once you figure out the controls, you start to recognize enemies patterns and shots in between the deaths, then that turns into memorization over segments of then an entire level. That becomes a 1 credit level clear, then you clear the level without dying at all, and the comical confusion has turned into a wrestling match with the level designer before you know it.

Once it gets too easy, every screen or so of a good 1st level will begin to scream the scoring mechanics at you, bunching up enemies, spacing out encounters enough to allow for a broad interpretation of the core elements (charge meter, score multipliers, etc). Some games, like Progear, are actually made easier with good scoring practices, because cancelled bullets grant score and can chain delete more bullets. Crimzon Clover has a risky point-blanking mechanic to coax out more points. Competitive scoring aside, guides beyond basics aren't needed for most shmups because they're so good at training the player to handle them.

Social Animal
Nov 1, 2005

I got into the genre a little over a year ago from stumbling onto Shmup Junkie’s youtube channel. I had to see for myself why he was so enthusiastic about a genre I hadn’t played since the NES days. So I bought Danmaku Unlimited 3 and I was hooked!

So many of us were sold on Ikaruga back in the Xbox Live Arcade days by game journalists and phonies saying it’s the best shmup ever. We played it, got our rear end handed to us on the second level and decided these games weren't for us. It’s such a specific and unique game that’s not at all representative of the majority of titles out there. If any of you share the trauma of playing “the best shmup” and thought this genre wasn’t for you, give it another shot. The stuff in the OP is good but if you are hesitant on spending money and you have access to emulation I highly recommend two games that can give you a taste of two different styles:

Soldier Blade for the PC Engine/Turbografx for a more oldschool console game with kickass music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCTwr0PCORk

The original Dodonpachi on MAME for what basically started the bullet hell genre.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nh_11rOb8E

Getting a 1CC (one credit clear, basically beating the game without using a continue) in these games is extremely satisfying.

beer gas canister
Oct 30, 2007

shmups are da best come play some shmups they're cheap and good and you like them
Plaster Town Cop
DoDonPachi is wonderful and the PS1 port is good if you'd rather not hassle with MAME. Make sure to turn ON slowdown emulation in the pause menu.

japtor
Oct 28, 2005
(tl;dr I got into them in college and that eventually turned into getting some arcade cabs)

While I've always had them in my rotation growing up and definitely got in a few looking back, I'd say it was college when I really got into them. I had an hour to kill between classes and there was an arcade on campus so gravitated there of course. Got my rear end handed to me whenever I played a fighting game and eventually made my way over to the back corner with Strikers 1945 III (aka 1999) and Gunbird 2, where no one could cut my play time short :v:.

Put a few quarters in every day and started to get pretty decent at Strikers in particular. I think I started with a dollar but got decent enough to only need a quarter or two to last me a while, with the rest of the time watching others play, with particular interest around the Tech Bonus boss kills. And iirc it had a persistent top score along with the daily leaderboard, so I had some goals to go after as I got better. Eventually by the end of the quarter I got the top score, with the previous owner watching at the time no less :smugbert: (never did 1CC it though :argh:).

At some point during all this I discovered Cave's games in MAME among others, got a Saturn for the games there, etc. All kind of culminated with buying myself an Astro City for my graduation present and getting into PCBs, luckily while that stuff was in fairly low demand before prices skyrocketed a few years later...my big regret is never getting DoDonPachi back then :cry:. I did get Ketsui though, and that remains one of my favorites.

These days I've recently got a modded Vewlix and stuck my Switch in there. I've been able to play Progear in emulation for years (poo poo, decades!) but only just recently played enough to get a handle on the scoring system and absolutely love it. Horizontal shmups have always been a bit of a blind spot for me so open to suggestions there on Switch. I have a decent number but I feel like Black Bird and Progear are the only ones that have really stuck for me.

quote:

==========> Music Analogy <==========
DoDonPachi is a song that's pretty easy to play in the beginning, and gets harder and harder. It's a song that lasts 45 bloody minutes. And the last few minutes are horribly hard to play.
When approaching this kind of work with mastery in mind, you may naturally try playing the song until you reach parts that seem way too hard for you. Then you will start over from the beginning until you reach them again. And again. And again. After a while, you will realize it's pretty stupid to play through the easy parts every time you want to try the first part that is hard for you, so you will start focusing on the hard parts. Bar by bar, you will decompose and study the song. The hardest bars will be the bars you study and practice the most.
=======> End of Music Analogy <=======
Practicing the hardest parts the most is a somewhat foreign concept to me cause it's not an option in the arcades :v:. Never got into it myself, although the occasional credit feed accomplishes some of the same effect. What keeps the "easy" parts fun is the scoring recognition/mastery element. It's like discovering a whole other composition for those parts that makes the music sound even more amazing.

Jimlit
Jun 30, 2005



Probably going to get laughed out of here but Bullet Hell Monday is what kicked off my love for bullet hell shooters. Personally I think its one of the best intros to the genre's more obscure mechanics you can get. The downside is I believe its mobile only.

Link: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.msykit.Stg1x2g&hl=en_US&gl=US

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kb4881WJTaA

Jimlit fucked around with this message at 16:02 on Aug 3, 2022

Silius
Apr 24, 2010
Hi everyone! Just wanted to drop this beginners list that a bunch of folks over in the Shmup Junkie discord have been working on as a good starting point to get into the genre. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1MZz8Q_8HdGyh2QU9BX4lNgyVAP9JZxxuy_YYbOLf1CM/edit?usp=drivesdk

beer gas canister
Oct 30, 2007

shmups are da best come play some shmups they're cheap and good and you like them
Plaster Town Cop

japtor posted:

Practicing the hardest parts the most is a somewhat foreign concept to me cause it's not an option in the arcades :v:. Never got into it myself, although the occasional credit feed accomplishes some of the same effect. What keeps the "easy" parts fun is the scoring recognition/mastery element. It's like discovering a whole other composition for those parts that makes the music sound even more amazing.
Credit feeding definitely does work. I find that periodically running further into the game allows me to discover new mechanical concepts that might be less obvious on early levels, often because the scoring rate ramps up. I've been using practice primarily for mini-bosses, like the big plane mini boss in Progear level 2, and main bosses.

japtor
Oct 28, 2005

Jimlit posted:

Probably going to get laughed out of here but Bullet Hell Monday is what kicked off my love for bullet hell shooters. Personally I think its one of the best intros to the genre's more obscure mechanics you can get. The downside is I believe its mobile only.

Link: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.msykit.Stg1x2g&hl=en_US&gl=US

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kb4881WJTaA
Looks like it's planned to be coming out on Windows this year:
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2003660/Bullet_Hell_Monday/

Hell I think the Danmaku Unlimited series started on mobile, and I've put a lot of time into the mobile Cave ports myself. And still the only way to play Aka to Blue outside of arcades :argh:

beer gas canister posted:

Credit feeding definitely does work. I find that periodically running further into the game allows me to discover new mechanical concepts that might be less obvious on early levels, often because the scoring rate ramps up. I've been using practice primarily for mini-bosses, like the big plane mini boss in Progear level 2, and main bosses.
Just realized my sentence was kinda mixed up there, I do occasionally credit feed, but could never get into the singular/situational practice that's available in console releases for whatever reason. Maybe starts feeling like work at a certain point vs just playing for me. I should try the rewind stuff where available though now that I think about it, it'd be akin to the checkpoints in the Trials series, where I have no problem resetting constantly to get segments down.

Bogart
Apr 12, 2010

by VideoGames
I don't like going much harder than very simple style Deltarune stuff. Is there a game for a baby like me?

Vadun
Mar 9, 2011

I'm hungrier than a green snake in a sugar cane field.

Bogart posted:

I don't like going much harder than very simple style Deltarune stuff. Is there a game for a baby like me?

The Void Rains Upon Her Heart maybe?

SniperWoreConverse
Mar 20, 2010



Gun Saliva
Barging in to say I remember NO REFUGE

Fun factoid i heard is that the characters that show up when you get to a boss, between the warning and boss description, are all mantras or tantric chants, maybe supposed to be in Sanskrit, but i don't know which. I'm p sure all the bosses and levels are based around this concept.

Every time you get to a boss you're pretty much spinning a prayer wheel i guess, so if you play Ikaruga enough times you'll attain radiant crystalline perfection form and surpass all bullet hells

SniperWoreConverse
Mar 20, 2010



Gun Saliva


Mara's assault on the Buddha
Aniconic representation of mastery, here the ultimate gamer is represented only by his gaming chair, needing no consoles or arcade systems to obtain S tier in all bullet hells simultaneously. Amaravati, India.

Hwurmp
May 20, 2005

Bogart posted:

I don't like going much harder than very simple style Deltarune stuff. Is there a game for a baby like me?

Get some old-school shmups like Tyrian 2000 or Raptor: Call of the Shadows.

Tyrian is legit one of the best games of all time :corsair:

THE AWESOME GHOST
Oct 21, 2005

This is a great thread. I’ve been playing loads of shmups again because so much are coming to the switch, but I got into the genre because in 2005 that’s what you played for free on your laptop

Ciaphas
Nov 20, 2005

> BEWARE, COWARD :ovr:


my drug of choice is The Void Rains Upon Her Heart, a criminally-underrated boss-rush shmup with roguelite-ish elements- no wait come back it's good i promise



the game's initial story mode has you going through 8-10 fights against one of dozens (like 80+? not sure) monsters and their various alternates. each monster has a level from 1 to at least 12, and more levels means more & faster bullets in each pattern, sometimes with entirely new patterns or different versions of the same pattern. each monster drops a set of "gifts" when defeated - passive boosts, helpers, Panics (bombs), consumables, all that sort of thing. not far in, you unlock Quickplay, which lets you pick a monster, their level & set of gifts and throw down for top score without the story bits

this video starts at 10:07 to show an example low-tier boss at its max level (and one of my favorite examples of the great soundtrack). a whole lot of other monsters on display in the rest of the video too
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7lpYOg_v0o&t=607s

the game is very good at explicitly telling you what your items are doing in detail. it also has a stats screen that gives you All The Numbers in the pause menu - right down to things like stating that Crit Rate is actually a Rate and not just a % chance to crit individual bullets, or how long a bullet takes to cross the screen


here's the roguelite-ish parts. i've mixed opinions on these, mileage may vary:
  • as you play the game & complete Dreams (achievements), new monsters & items become available for the game to offer. many dreams are dead simple ("break 20 of this boss's wing-parts across multiple runs"), others harder ("full-combo this monster without using panics (bombs)"). there are currently 583 Dreams implemented, all with associated steam achievements if you like that sort of thing
  • each monster you defeat drops pieces of metacurrency (called Tetrids) that are used primarily to Radiate monsters and items, and to unlock things in Quickplay. Other uses come in once the game introduces Events
  • on Radiating: in the story mode, before each fight you select one of 1-4 offered monsters to fight next. on a new file, you know the monster's levels and the types/power levels of items it will drop on defeat; but you don't know anything about the monster except their name & picture (and not even that if it's your first meeting!), nor can you see what the drops actually are, until the item/monster has been Radiated by spending tetrids between runs. once you have the item in a run you can see what it does, but unradiated items are forgotten again at the end of the run. Finally, unradiated items & monsters can't be used for Quickplay


tl;dr: TVRUHH is great, it's thirteen bucks on steam, please play it!

Ciaphas fucked around with this message at 01:26 on Aug 4, 2022

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.
Saint Dragon.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0doYiySTflc&t=316s&ab_channel=AL82RetrogamingLongplays

Social Animal
Nov 1, 2005

japtor posted:

Practicing the hardest parts the most is a somewhat foreign concept to me cause it's not an option in the arcades :v:. Never got into it myself, although the occasional credit feed accomplishes some of the same effect. What keeps the "easy" parts fun is the scoring recognition/mastery element. It's like discovering a whole other composition for those parts that makes the music sound even more amazing.

I recently got a 2 all in Dodonpachi and I have no idea how long it would have taken me to get that playing in an arcade. I think I read that it took like six months for the first player to clear the game and I can't imagine how many hours playing and watching the other players went into that. Save states/training modes are a godsend but I can get why it would be a bore to people. I tend to just do full runs these days but man some of these tough ones have me running into training mode lol.

InfectedZero posted:

Hi everyone! Just wanted to drop this beginners list that a bunch of folks over in the Shmup Junkie discord have been working on as a good starting point to get into the genre. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1MZz8Q_8HdGyh2QU9BX4lNgyVAP9JZxxuy_YYbOLf1CM/edit?usp=drivesdk

There's a few good games on this list but I highly recommend skipping the "Brand new to shmups" at the very top.

nrook
Jun 25, 2009

Just let yourself become a worthless person!
It’s very funny to me that there’s another tab specifically for Touhou games because Touhou players have no idea which game is best to start with, and because there’s a bit of a strange separation between Touhou players and players of other shmups.

I started with Touhou and I think it’s a reasonable place to start; its normal difficulties are generally pretty accessible, and the characters and attack names make it easier to think about and remember the game (it’s easier to remember “I died to Spooky Sign: Anime Ghosts” than it is “I died to the third attack of the boss”). But its stage design is not up to the standards of the decent arcade games. It’s insanely anime, obviously, but never creepy which is more than I can say for some other anime girl shmups.

Or The Void Rains Upon Her Heart, for that matter, which is a fun attempt to make a roguelike shmup but which also gives me the suspicion the dev wants to gently caress Cthulhu.

The Voice of Labor
Apr 8, 2020

I think my only 1ccs are on sine mora, crimson clover and deathsmiles

beer gas canister
Oct 30, 2007

shmups are da best come play some shmups they're cheap and good and you like them
Plaster Town Cop

Hwurmp posted:

Get some old-school shmups like Tyrian 2000 or Raptor: Call of the Shadows.

Tyrian is legit one of the best games of all time :corsair:

Now that you mention I did play most of Tyrian 2000 about a decade ago and had a great time. The fine-grained ship customization thing combined with an actual HP bar soften the rough bits a lot.

ate shit on live tv
Feb 15, 2004

by Azathoth
Not sure if this counts, but I've been playing Nova Drift for my Shoot'em Up fix.
It's on Steam:
https://store.steampowered.com/app/858210/Nova_Drift/

It's early access but that is just because they are adding new mods, and have different modes they haven't enabled yet. It's a full game. Endless mode (high score challenge) and also a Time Attack mode is enabled, to see how fast you can get to and beat the final boss.

It's appealing because of the variety of builds you can make. There are 14 or so different base hulls you can choose, and like 10 different shields and 12 base weapons. You can mix and match them however you wish, and as you progress through the game you'll get a choice of mods that will drastically change how you play through the game. There are also options to go shield-less, weapon-less (ramming speed), or have drones/mines do your damage instead.

I also like the art-direction. It's fairly minimalist, like Geometry Wars, but very vibrant. Some say it's too vibrant when there are too many explosions happening.

For old school Mame world Shoot'em ups, my favorite is Darius Gaiden. "dariusg" in Mame. It has amazing music and a huge variety of paths you can take that each have different bosses/levels you'll go through. It's also aquatically themed with robotic bosses being fish of different types and they are awesome.
https://shmups.wiki/library/Darius_Gaiden

DrankSinatra
Aug 25, 2011
I'm really new to bullet hell shmups (I got started in the past year or so), but I've been enjoying my time with them. I'm gonna put out a little love for the M2 Shottriggers rereleases of classic shmups. I've spent a decent bit of time with their Ketsui and Esp. Ra. De. ports. M2s ports are like the Criterion Collection of classic shmups.

For those of you who may not know, M2 is a Japanese developer that specializes in meticulous, high-fidelity ports of classic games. They're handled with a reverence and attention to detail that is astounding. They handled the emulation on the recent, very good, Sega Genesis Mini (the one that exists as a mea culpa for the atGames crap). They also did the very wonderful Sega Ages releases for the Switch and 3DS.

What really stands out with the Shottriggers collection is the ridiculous care put into the packages; they generally have the bare minimum of input lag, and are faithful to the originals, in terms of slowdown. They also have some absolutely astounding features that really make learning the games fun. Their practice mode basically splits the game into bite-sized sections that you can practice repeatedly, and there are various constraints you can place on yourself, such as doing it without bombs. The game gives you a medal for each section as you progress in skill, so you can concretely see your improvement.

In addition, the game saves the 20 or so most recent points at which you died, and actually stores a snapshot of the game state a few seconds before (I think ten, but I don't remember exactly)! After a session, you can go and replay the points where you died, and see what you can do to repair or avoid the situation in the future.

They also include new modes, on-screen gadgets that clarify mechanics that were opaque in the arcade version, and a whole host of tweakable options. They're pricey, but the love and craftsmanship is just astounding. Their affection for the genre shines through, and they are the absolute best pieces of game preservation you will ever see.

[They also made the really rad Darius Cozmic Collection, which are amazing ports of games in the notably idiosyncratic Darius series. They're really Shottrigers collection ports in all but name. They don't have the sophisticated replay and practice features of M2's Cave ports, but they're still well-done. I'd recommend the Cave ports first, just because the early Darius games are quite weird and hard in a different sort of way. Even if you're a shmup fan, you may or may not click with them, though the aforementioned Darius Gaiden is a bit of an exception to that.]

[If I have time this weekend, I may come back and do an effort post about the practice modes with screenshots and stuff]

DrankSinatra fucked around with this message at 06:39 on Aug 4, 2022

nrook
Jun 25, 2009

Just let yourself become a worthless person!
I’ve been putting off getting a Japanese eshop account for ages, but the reason I want one is so I can try ESP Ra De, which I’ve always been interested in.

They’ve released ports of older, non-bullet hell games as well, like Flying Shark, one of the first good shmups.

cheetah7071
Oct 20, 2010

honk honk
College Slice
I like touhou but the popular characters and memorable music are a significant enough part of the appeal that I don't think I'll ever become a shmuphead

Also I'm very bad and can't barely 1cc normal after hours and hours of trying

DrankSinatra
Aug 25, 2011

nrook posted:

I’ve been putting off getting a Japanese eshop account for ages, but the reason I want one is so I can try ESP Ra De, which I’ve always been interested in.

They’ve released ports of older, non-bullet hell games as well, like Flying Shark, one of the first good shmups.

If you have a PS4/5, you can get Ketsui on a US account, too! (Also Battle Garegga and Dangun Feveron)

SniperWoreConverse posted:

Mara's assault on the Buddha
Aniconic representation of mastery, here the ultimate gamer is represented only by his gaming chair, needing no consoles or arcade systems to obtain S tier in all bullet hells simultaneously. Amaravati, India.
I love that ZeroRanger is loaded with overtly Buddhist iconography. The game basically goes "hey, here's what you're in for" by starting you at a Bodhi Tree.

DrankSinatra fucked around with this message at 06:00 on Aug 4, 2022

victrix
Oct 30, 2007


This thread and playing Monolith made me go check and apparently Cho Ren Sha 68k got an update to Win10 compatibility at some point... but it looks like the dev's original page is toast. I got it off an archive site and yep, works fine

https://shmups.wiki/library/Cho_Ren_Sha_68K#Download

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaIjLUsH2yI

Gotta be one of the oldest fan shooters out there, and what an absurdly good game for a solo effort in the mid 90s.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HO5aMd1Osk

DrankSinatra posted:

I love that ZeroRanger is loaded with overtly Buddhist iconography. The game basically goes "hey, here's what you're in for" by starting you at a Bodhi Tree.

I love this because I've always considered shmups to be some of the most Zen games you can play once you get into the zone

beer gas canister
Oct 30, 2007

shmups are da best come play some shmups they're cheap and good and you like them
Plaster Town Cop

DrankSinatra posted:

In addition, the game saves the 20 or so most recent points at which you died, and actually stores a snapshot of the game state a few seconds before (I think ten, but I don't remember exactly)! After a session, you can go and replay the points where you died, and see what you can do to repair or avoid the situation in the future.
That is so helpful. Hopefully they release a few in English on Switch. I'd gladly pay $40 for EspRaDe but probably won't bother with a JP account.

japtor
Oct 28, 2005
For the beginners, the novice modes in the Cave console ports (of the ones I've played at least) are pretty dang good. They're significantly more manageable than the default arcade modes, while not being a cakewalk. Easy enough to get into while still having enough of a challenge to grow and work your way up through.

Social Animal posted:

I recently got a 2 all in Dodonpachi and I have no idea how long it would have taken me to get that playing in an arcade. I think I read that it took like six months for the first player to clear the game and I can't imagine how many hours playing and watching the other players went into that. Save states/training modes are a godsend but I can get why it would be a bore to people. I tend to just do full runs these days but man some of these tough ones have me running into training mode lol.
Yeah I totally get it, but at my level I'm fairly satisfied with just going for the (basic 1-all) 1CC or whatever best I can do at this point. I've only gotten a few 1CCs but the pattern is the same in the sense of just playing regularly and slowly improving in various ways. I don't mind the slow grind I guess, cause ultimately I'm just playing the game rather than consciously working on getting better. I think the hard part these days for me is just playing a game consistently enough cause the whole backlog and short attention span affects my little shmup world too.

Fiye
Nov 23, 2021

No one can hide anything from me.
Your heart is in plain sight to me.
My best 1cc was w/ Touhou 12 UFO that ended with capturing the last spell card when I had no bombs/lives left and tbh I've been chasing that high ever since.

Pladdicus
Aug 13, 2010
play zeroranger. it's extremely good! what a great game. don't wanna say much about zero ranger, play zero ranger.

void rains upon her heart is very good, but very not done. also a new update is gonna change basic game mechanics I suspect soon, so worth keeping an eye on. I had a fun tryout of the game and very excited to 100% it when it's done. it has the kind of 'roguelite' abstraction which is great if you like that kinda stuff, but I also think there's a lot of very great and interesting bosses, and the way that scoring works makes each boss less a struggle to win (though that is available at higher difficulties) and more an attempt to maximize victory with sustained combo chains and flawless play.

ate shit on live tv
Feb 15, 2004

by Azathoth
Like 20 years ago I 1ccd Gigawing. That was my greatest achievement.

bare bottom pancakes
Sep 3, 2015

Production: Complete
There's a lot of merit in looking for easier games, but my recommendation is just to play a game you like a little too much.

I have no idea how many hours I put into the game anymore, but I made it to stage 2-3 of DoDonPachi DaiOuJou White Label a few years ago and I'd love to get back to that point sometime!

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Vadun
Mar 9, 2011

I'm hungrier than a green snake in a sugar cane field.

How do I get good at R-Type Final 2?

I have no idea what i'm supposed to be looking for in a ship or what to do with the Bit

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply