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Under the law of armed conflict what happened at the hospital is pretty important, either way. If it was a hospital being bombed that's a hugely damaging case for Israel, if it's a demonstrable case of a rocket being fired out of a hospital it can clearly make it a legitimate target under the LOAC, and both of those will then be used as justification for future action. In this forum people are knowledgeable about the LOAC, right?
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Oct 26, 2023 10:08
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That is definitely not true now when global public opinion is more important than ever, and content is disseminated in real time.
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Oct 26, 2023 19:34
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Which rules of war are you expecting Israel to be judged by?
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Oct 26, 2023 19:56
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:....any? I don't mean people being big mad and chiding them, I mean facing no-poo poo juries and trials. I would be willing to bet very large amounts of money that no one responsible ever faces justice for the wholesale slaughter currently going on. Obviously nobody is able to stop anything right now, and unless countries are dissolved somehow they're unlikely to give up servicemen for prosecution unless it's against internal law. That being said Israel has a right under international law to respond to being attacked. The way they are supposed to be judged on that response is the LOAC. Randomly bombing a hospital would be a breach of that, so the detail on what happened is important.
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Oct 26, 2023 21:22
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Borscht posted:Right on. Isn’t food water and medicine interference prohibited by the Geneva convention? The justification is that, while they're not allowed to interfere with supplies coming in to civilians, they're not obliged to provide them and not prevented from interfering with supplies going to aggressive forces. The trick being of course that Hamas can’t be distinguished from civilians and Israel's excuse is they've told all the civilians to leave.
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Oct 28, 2023 11:23
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Pretty clearly that's not what the quote says? It says the US won't draw the red lines for Israel, not that there aren't any.
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Oct 28, 2023 11:25
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What do you mean?
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Oct 28, 2023 11:56
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That Works posted:That its a bullshit semantics cover for an irrelevant distinction. The UN member that has already vetoed security council sanctions stating there are no red lines means that anyone else drawing them will be ignored. The guy literally did not say "there are no red lines for Israel".
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Oct 28, 2023 12:08
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kill me now posted:Yeah, my take on his statement is "We will talk to them about toning down the genocide, but if they keep doing it and don't take our advice we are going to continue to give them everything they need to kill all the people of Gaza." You're revising what he said so you can react to it. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Oct 28, 2023 13:53
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Iran is definitely not involved in the Houthis firing Iranian ballistic missiles at Israel. https://www.armyrecognition.com/ham...nst_israel.html
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Nov 6, 2023 10:23
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bulletsponge13 posted:Thermobaric weapons in enclosed places are horrific things. The US and The Soviets both used variations in AFG, and the accounts of the teams that did the Battle Damage Assessment both said similar things- they'd find people dead with their some of their insides ripped through their mouth; a Spetznaz team wrote that they found fighters with their lungs tore out and laying on their chest, though that is probably some exaggeration. Overpressure and enclosed places = bad stuff to soft goo I did BDA where we used Hellfire-N. Obviously not nice but I didn't see that kind of thing.
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Nov 7, 2023 08:50
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Jarmak posted:Absolute garbage probe.  very low effort moderation
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Nov 16, 2023 14:59
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Al-Saqr posted:if you want i can stop updating the thread with what i find. Considering you have 50 pages of C-SPAM posts praising Hamas, that would be great.
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Nov 20, 2023 06:38
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Godholio posted:If he tossed it, it's either a dumb bomb or artillery. Dude is a fusilier e: well that's embarrassing, clearly a grenadier. What was I thinking. knox_harrington fucked around with this message at 16:05 on Nov 23, 2023 |
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Nov 23, 2023 16:02
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Come on that is clearly going to be driven by the US.
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Nov 26, 2023 19:24
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No shrapnel damage Damage to the cars looks like they've been bent rather than ripped Looks like a single line away from the viewpoint where the cars have been squashed by something heavy Diagnosis: tank Secondary diagnosis: tankies
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Nov 27, 2023 11:04
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bulletsponge13 posted:The risk is a variable, depending on distance (Danger Close for most support fires is 600 meters; weapon systems, firing platforms, guidance [forward observers, GPS, etc], and geography). The general rule they gave us in OSUT was Danger Close fires have a 50% likelihood of hitting friendlies. It's >0.1% PI not 50% https://ndiastorage.blob.core.usgovcloudapi.net/ndia/2011/gunmissile/TuesdayBalding.pdf Not US but the way we conduct fire missions is if the point of impact is within a trigger distance x a multiplying factor depending on the gun target line, danger close procedures "may be used". The reality of terrain in Helmand is all engagements were within that distance but we never used DC procedures as it would increase collateral damage.
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Nov 28, 2023 22:38
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OK but I am a qualified forward observer (I was a reconnaissance patrols soldier in a job that also has strike capability), and I have called in combat fire missions within the trigger distance. Maybe don't understand your point, I'm not sure of a way to tell what risk assessment would have been made, much less that it would have been >50% probability of civilian casualties.
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Nov 29, 2023 03:26
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PurpleXVI posted:Strongly depends on what you define as "stolen Palestinian land." If you look at the 1967 borders and say "this is a fair and equitable distribution of land, Israel deserves this." then sure, the Kibbutzes are not on stolen Palestinian land, and we would proceed to greatly disagree on the matter. Also several of them are in the occupied West Bank, which makes it even more clear cut. You've repeatedly almost said you don't think Israel should exist as a country, which I think is the fundamental disagreement here.
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Dec 1, 2023 04:48
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Sure but starting from whichever version of that premise means you can say that any action Israel takes is illegitimate, because the country shouldn't exist. And any action Hamas takes is legitimate, because Israel shouldn't exist. It gets in the way of having the important discussions about whether Israel is committing war crimes, and conversely what the effects on protections under international law for Hamas by eg not being uniformed military.
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Dec 1, 2023 05:14
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Well that's my point, Israel the country does exist, and whether you agree that's a good thing or not, it's the starting point from which their actions in Gaza need to be viewed.
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Dec 1, 2023 07:55
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BUUNNI posted:Do apartheid genocidal states have a right to exist? Yes the United States has a right to exist.
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Dec 1, 2023 20:42
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PurpleXVI posted:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/feb/28/ethiopian-women-given-contraceptives-israel That is obviously very uncool but I think you need to look up what "sterilisation" means. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 2, 2023 19:54
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PurpleXVI posted:I would argue that the difference between "a number of procedures which would have continued indefinitely if no one had raised the alarm" and "a single procedure of permanent duration" is vanishingly small. You could, but you would be wrong.
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Dec 2, 2023 20:58
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My Spirit Otter posted:so is chemical castration not sterilization because it's not permanent? they're giving their population drugs against their will in order to prevent births, it's sterilization. It has to be permanent. Come on you can't be this dumb.
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Dec 2, 2023 21:42
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It's essential to be incredibly accurate about whether Hamas was beheading children or just adults, but for Israel's offences "close enough" is just fine.
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Dec 2, 2023 22:23
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The guy appears to be one of the most prominent academics on Ethiopian Jews. If anything I'd think he would be more sensitive to detect wrongdoing.
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Dec 2, 2023 22:53
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Anyway this is really tangential to the current conflict. At least we established that y'all agree that Israel is a country that a) does exist and b) has a right to exist. It follows from there that they have an obligation to protect their population and makes a basis for looking at the operations in Gaza. There was a good Lawfare episode this week on the IDF's tolérance for civilian casualties compared to the US and UK. It is much higher! I don't agree fully with the guy's assessment, the threat Israel faces is in a totally different ballpark from anything the US faced from ISIS. But, it's a very well structured analysis of the calculus of whether and how many civilian casualties might be a consequence of a particular action.
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Dec 2, 2023 23:07
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Luceid posted:I disagree. Israel is an occupying force and a genocidal ethnostate, and should be forcibly dismantled! Your response? Setting aside that this view is exactly why Israel behaves in such a belligerent way; regardless of whether you think it should be a country, Israel does exist and has rights for protecting its population under international law. Given the attack Hamas recently made and their stated aims, it is easy to see why Israelis see calls for forcibly dismantling their country as calls for their genocide. knox_harrington fucked around with this message at 10:16 on Dec 3, 2023 |
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Dec 3, 2023 09:55
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If you think the Hamas actions were justified in full then you can't object to the Israelis killing civilians either. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 3, 2023 10:30
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Given this is a military subforum and military legitimacy depends on the concept of a nation, I think arguing that nations don't exist is going to be an uphill battle.
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Dec 3, 2023 10:32
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Radical 90s Wizard posted:Shut the gently caress up Knox Great rebuttal
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Dec 3, 2023 11:53
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Absolutely. And to be clear, I think what the IDF is doing is excessive and abhorrent.
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Dec 3, 2023 12:06
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