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... never mind, josef just forgot.
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Jul 4, 2024 05:49
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| # ? May 12, 2025 12:29 |
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Okay, so I've been thinking. I see the following scenarios here: Punk doesn't work as an SK here. He was held up by Egalz orders. Punk could be a Lutheran GF, but the fact that Lutherans didn't bother going for Egalz to "free" their doctor when their entire team was dying makes this unlikely. Fool, I think, doesn't make sense to be a Lutheran, when he was literally claiming Calvinist. I think Fool only makes sense as an SK. That leaves HCT. I said it before and I will say it again. HCT's claim is really bad. I do not believe they're town. I think what's most likely the case here is that HCT is Lutheran and Fool is the Serial Killer. It would explain why the Apple is a free action - it might have been designed as a cover for killing, or a requirement for doing so, or something. Note the lack of N1 window kill.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:03
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Yami Fenrir posted:Okay, so I've been thinking. Why can't you be a Lutheran looter, again? GF doesn't make sense given Lutherans have TWO scramble actions for the team.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:23
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CubicalSucrose posted:Why can't you be a Lutheran looter, again? That's a good point re: GF. Both teams have been very different from each other after all. Like I said I don't believe that Punk is a GF anyway. Either way, I know I'm town. Why would I come up with a scenario that makes me scum?
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Jul 4, 2024 06:26
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Either way, I can't have done the extra N2 or N3 kill, and neither could Punk. I think our best shot at winning lies getting the 3rd killer out, and then Punk needs to doc correctly. It's almost certainly 1v1v2 right now.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:30
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I targeted Punk. Sorry for not going along with the plan, but I'd like to think it was for a good reason. I saw something that makes me think Punkreas slipped. Hold on, let me find it...
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Jul 4, 2024 06:43
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HCT I am so tempted to vote you right now.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:44
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Yami: *explains why Punk is cleared as catholic and can't have done the extra kill* HCT: "So anyway, Punk slipped and I conveniently failed to prove my role yet again"
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Jul 4, 2024 06:45
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Punkreas posted:Night Actions: Here. I didn't react to this before, but it just struck me late yesterday. This can't be right. Turn your modbrain on for a second. Doctors always have one of two restrictions, don't they? Either they can't target themselves, or they can't target the same person two nights in a row. But Punkreas claims to have done both. You might think, what about EGalz's order ability? We've seen her flip. There is nothing in there that indicates her target is allowed to ignore limitations on their abilities. I don't think that's it.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:45
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Bro, does HCT need to wear a neon sign saying that he isn't town for people to realize he's not town
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Jul 4, 2024 06:45
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:Here. I didn't react to this before, but it just struck me late yesterday. This can't be right. Turn your modbrain on for a second. Doctors always have one of two restrictions, don't they? Either they can't target themselves, or they can't target the same person two nights in a row. But Punkreas claims to have done both. You might think, what about EGalz's order ability? We've seen her flip. There is nothing in there that indicates her target is allowed to ignore limitations on their abilities. I don't think that's it. It's a Fire and Ice game. I can see that restriction being waived. I don't disagree with the general idea but I think there's too much pointing at Punk just being town.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:47
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I can't. I think this is just... wrong. Either way. I'll be honest, I am pretty tired of this game by now. It's been exhausting and I don't want to have another day of shouting matches with you. So do whatever the hell you want with your votes. I think it's Punk and FoS, because of this and process of elimination. The apple remains weird. We haven't seen it do anything, and FoS hasn't explained anything in much detail, even this close to the end of the game. Other than that I don't really know what to say. I'm tired.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:51
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fool of sound posted:The lack of kill presumably means that the last scum tried to hit the person who currently has the apple, which means it’s stuck to them lmao. Not a great situation for them. Like I don't see a reason to be this mysterious now.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:52
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Okay, say I believe you. Punk still couldn't have been the third killer due to Egalz.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:53
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Yami Fenrir posted:Punk still couldn't have been the third killer due to Egalz. Which leaves FoS.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:55
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Or secret shared team abilities, or some other aspect we haven't thought of. But more likely just FoS.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:55
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And you. And I know the apple exists, because I had it. And yet you repeatedly failed to produce evidence your role exists, despite having multiple opportunities to.
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Jul 4, 2024 06:56
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I also have another thing that I'm fairly sure is fairly damning re: HCT, but I need to know Punk's target first.
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Jul 4, 2024 07:00
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:I targeted Punk. Sorry for not going along with the plan, but I'd like to think it was for a good reason. I saw something that makes me think Punkreas slipped. Hold on, let me find it... Please fullclaim.
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Jul 4, 2024 07:04
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Yami Fenrir posted:And I know the apple exists, because I had it. Because I gave it to you, let's not forget. Yami Fenrir posted:And yet you repeatedly failed to produce evidence your role exists, despite having multiple opportunities to. Because despite how great that would be, at this stage of the game, I would really rather just use it to, you know, prevent kills. Ugh, look, again, I can feel myself getting angry already, so I'm going to stop here.
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Jul 4, 2024 07:05
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CubicalSucrose posted:Please fullclaim. Er, is there anything missing from my claim? I've claimed everything I have already.
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Jul 4, 2024 07:06
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:Er, is there anything missing from my claim? I've claimed everything I have already. Can you link the post?
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Jul 4, 2024 07:10
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:Because I gave it to you, let's not forget. I've had it before, Fool gave it to me n3. I was the one to give it to you N4. The point was more that we know that the apple part of Fool's role is real. I still maintain that yours isn't. The reason you never targeted a looter before voodoo (Not counting never here who was almost certain to get modkilled, and is a sus loving target), who most likely just bounced off your BP, was because it doesn't exist.
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Jul 4, 2024 07:10
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Yami Fenrir posted:Punk could be a Lutheran GF, but the fact that Lutherans didn't bother going for Egalz to "free" their doctor when their entire team was dying makes this unlikely. Also, why do you say this? Didn't you realize the same thing I did late yesterday, that Punk could have killed EGalz specifically because she was becoming a problem for him?
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Jul 4, 2024 07:10
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CubicalSucrose posted:Can you link the post? Easier to just restate it. Maximilian von und zu Trauttmansdorff, the emperor's chief diplomat and second in command. I can negotiate peace with people at night, stopping their kill/loot actions from having any effect (it's worded weirdly, it says it renders them ineffective, not "blocked" or anything like that). And secondly I started the game with a bulletproof stack and gained another when the emperor (Monathin) died. The flavor of all this is that I'm the guy who eventually sets up the Peace of Westphalia that ends the war.
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Jul 4, 2024 07:12
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Yami Fenrir posted:The point was more that we know that the apple part of Fool's role is real. Yeah, but this doesn't mean anything. All it means is there's an apple that you have to pass around. But surely that's not the end of the story, and it also leaves FoS conveniently without any night actions whatsoever? Nothing to do during the game than to sit and watch the apple go around? Not even that, since he doesn't seem to know where it is. Doesn't it feel like there's a huge chunk of role missing here, especially given all the others we've seen?
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Jul 4, 2024 07:16
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:Easier to just restate it. Maximilian von und zu Trauttmansdorff, the emperor's chief diplomat and second in command. I can negotiate peace with people at night, stopping their kill/loot actions from having any effect (it's worded weirdly, it says it renders them ineffective, not "blocked" or anything like that). And secondly I started the game with a bulletproof stack and gained another when the emperor (Monathin) died. The flavor of all this is that I'm the guy who eventually sets up the Peace of Westphalia that ends the war. Got it, and targets again?
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Jul 4, 2024 07:16
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CubicalSucrose posted:Got it, and targets again? Cpig, binus, NeverHelm, Voodoo, Voodoo, Punk.
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Jul 4, 2024 07:18
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JosefStalinator posted:A new day dawns... and during the night, sheer bloodshed: HCT literally admits to visiting b- on the night he died. CubicalSucrose posted:NOTE: Discord-hosted image links (like this one) expire approximately 24hrs after they were copied from Discord. We know Punk visited Zoya. I visited Never (this is confirmed via tsie using a hated stack after I got looted, he wouldn't have enough coins to do so if he didn't loot every night including the night I got looted afaik, since he didn't hit another looter)
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Jul 4, 2024 07:49
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:Also, why do you say this? Didn't you realize the same thing I did late yesterday, that Punk could have killed EGalz specifically because she was becoming a problem for him? There were 2 or 3 nights before that iirc, where lutherans died one by one. If punk was a problem for their doctor, they would have freed him sooner imo.
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Jul 4, 2024 07:52
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Yami Fenrir posted:There were 2 or 3 nights before that iirc, where lutherans died one by one. If punk was a problem for their doctor, they would have freed him sooner imo. If egalz*
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Jul 4, 2024 07:53
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Wait hold on. Didn't B- claim to be ordered around? That'd mean that there's TWO lutherans that could be ordered around if punk is lutheran... so that seems unlikely too.
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Jul 4, 2024 07:54
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Yami Fenrir posted:HCT literally admits to visiting b- on the night he died. Yes, I did. But I didn't kill him, obviously. I think I'm going to case everyone who is still alive once I get a chance to. I think there's a lutheran left and that's it, but if there really is a third-party killer around, like, there just aren't that many choices left.
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Jul 4, 2024 08:10
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Reasons why Yami could be scum: * Symmetry. Tsietisin was a Calvinist looter, but we haven't seen a Lutheran looter and there is nobody left in the pool who even can be a looter other than Yami. We thought about this way earlier but then just dropped it sometime along the way, and I don't think we should have. * Devastation weirdness. Yami has now devastated every single time he has looted someone, except the time when he couldn't. If this is the 33% chance to devastate that the town looters flipped with, this is extraordinarily unlikely. But both Keats and Tsi flipped with abilities that gave them a 100% chance to devastate, which is looking mighty suspicious. * Hasn't seriously cased any Lutherans that I can remember, but I need to go back and check votes and I'm too tired for that right now. Looting wologar could be a distancing tactic, especially since wologar wouldn't even be meaningfully stopped from doing his ninja kill stuff by being devastated. * Lazy case on me, likely because he knew Voodoo was suspicious of me, thinking he could ride that to a miselim and win. The plan he formulated sounded more like a trap for me and/or Punkreas since it doesn't actually clear anyone. Also, I want to point out that it's really loving dangerous to allow Yami to go into tomorrow with a doublevote. He can single-handedly decide the day if the vote threshold is 2, and if he's scum, game over. No matter what else happens he needs to use up his doublevote today. (Sorry, work meeting, casing the rest later...)
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Jul 4, 2024 08:20
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Addendum to the Yami case: * Blew up at me when I seriously cased binus, who later flipped Lutheran. Much too vigorous a defense, in retrospect. * Weirdly uninterested in probing question marks about Punkreas and fool of sound's claims, indicating he doesn't really care to find scum, just wants the easiest yeet he can find Reasons why fool of sound could be scum: * Role still unclaimed. All we know is there is an apple. Even in this eleventh hour, FoS has not explained what it actually does. * Part of the group of suspicious millers. I don't buy the argument that him calling himself a Calvinist D1 was a claim, I think it was a joke that turned into a real claim. * Weirdly defensive around ANarc calling him Calvinist. That really wasn't a result and I don't see why he would ever have interpreted it that way, especially not after ANarc flipped. Instead suggests the idea ANarc had a one-shot cop of some kind?? What is this? Called himself a "confirmed Calvinist", without that confirmation actually existing. * Has been gliding by under the surface most of the game. Very little interaction with the ongoing arguments or casing. So far, a depressingly fruitful strategy as we have mostly been yeeting town. * Only ever voted TPC, ANarc and Voodoo. Never any Lutherans. Reasons why Punkreas could be scum: * Doctor claim looks wrong. Claiming to have both targeted the same person consecutively and himself utterly contradicts how doctors work in every other game, including other games Josef has run. * Claims to have protected Zoya the night she died, but after EGalz's flip we know EGalz never got confirmation on what action Punkreas used. Punk could have simply killed her. * EGalz being the NK is weird. The Calvinist team didn't really have any reason to go after her (but on the other hand, I'm not sure why molly would withhold, either). * Voted TPC, but never any Lutherans. Never cased any Lutherans, either. I'd like to hear Cube's opinion on all this, being the only one not actually in contention.
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Jul 4, 2024 08:41
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I'll respond to that "case" later, but first I want to know who you'd be most interested in voting right now, HCT.
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Jul 4, 2024 08:53
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Without Cube telling you. I want to hear your own, unbiased opinion.
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Jul 4, 2024 08:54
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Cube can give his thoughts after that.
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Jul 4, 2024 08:55
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I want Punk and FoS fullclaims. Will be sleeping soon I hope.
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Jul 4, 2024 08:57
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| # ? May 12, 2025 12:29 |
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CubicalSucrose posted:I want Punk and FoS fullclaims. Will be sleeping soon I hope. That too. Either way, I want HCT to actually give his own read rather than latching onto yours. So please hold off until he does.
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Jul 4, 2024 08:58
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