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BigwigML posted:I need to know more about this well what naem is doing is subtly weaving in fictional with historic material, you probably didn't notice bc it's hard to spot but he actually included a couple stills from 80s cult hit Willow as well
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Oct 8, 2015 01:01
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nomadologique posted:well what naem is doing is subtly weaving in fictional with historic material, you probably didn't notice bc it's hard to spot but he actually included a couple stills from 80s cult hit Willow as well reality is subjective maybe to him it really happened??
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Oct 8, 2015 01:22
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Frosted Flake posted:I've always wondered how the very earliest metallurgy came about. copper, silver, gold and iron are all found natively in different environments (gold as nuggets in streams and placer deposits, copper as nuggets + as sometimes-extensive shallow deposits, silver rarely in related mineral deposits, iron in nickel-iron meteorites), with the first three being meaningfully cold-workable. while smelted/processed metal is relatively young- "relatively" meaning ~8000 BCE is the approx current acknowledged upper limit (i remember reading about some very ancient lead beads being found at catalhoyuk pushing that date, lead being a metal that does not exist natively in useful quantities, but now i cant find a reference for it)- crude cold-worked nuggets are far older, with nuggets that show signs of probably being roughly worked (blob-form refined, grooves worked in for hafting to a handle, etc) going back some tens of thousands of years the origins of smelting and meaningful metal production are unknown but catalhoyuk's lead beads are a significant tip-off. the following is largely speculative, mind, b/c the proof for all of this is extremely dead and gone. while most ores require very high temperatures and specific conditions very rarely obtained in a normal wood-burning self-aspirated fire, galena and other lesser lead ores will readily yield metallic lead at normal fire temperatures if a moderately reducing atmosphere is created, which really only requires a sheltered fire area (a partial pit, say) to help exclude oxygen near the ore in favour of carbon monoxide from combustion. in colonial america bullets were sometimes cast this way in old tree-stumps and the like in a pinch- it's not very efficient, but it's piss easy. its likely people smelted lead by accident by building firepits on or with lead ores and finding the metal solidified at the bottom of the pit once it had cooled, and then eventually started doing it deliberately the thing, tho, is that lead is pretty goddamn useless- it's always been the lowliest of base metals cause it's too soft to be of any use for toolmaking, oxidizes quickly and to an ugly state making it a very unattractive choice for decorative applications, and its very low melting point excludes it from anything involving fire. sling pellets and the like, sure, but thats a very niche application. the important thing is that lead is smelted just like most other historically-important metals, except at a much lower temperature and with more tolerance for iffy production conditions. if you understand the principle of lead smelting, copper smelting (a metal youre already familiar with as a neolithic metalworker) isn't far behind, you just need more heat. and altho outright producing copper from ores is a big leap, remelting native copper to produce larger single billets (and therefore, being able to cast copper to its final form all at once, saving enormous amounts of labour) was an obvious and attractive goal once the working properties of metals were fully understood, as facilitated by the accessible but fundamentally frumpy and lame lead
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Oct 8, 2015 02:39
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so you're saying that once the metalworker had gained confidence, he ditched his ugly duckling for a swan? history is hosed up
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Oct 8, 2015 02:42
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Oct 8, 2015 05:28
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dang who is this
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Oct 8, 2015 12:18
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What could lead be used for? I imagine having a bunch of hardened lead at the bottom of your firepit would be more novel than useful.  Isn't it amazing that Homer described boar tusk helmets, long after they'd fallen out of use?
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Oct 8, 2015 12:53
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Considering Homer was just an amalgamation of a many bronze age poets who passed stories along in oral tradition, no not really.
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Oct 8, 2015 12:56
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*is Egyptian* *is pathologically obsessed with semen*
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Oct 8, 2015 13:25
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Frosted Flake posted:What could lead be used for? lead in the ancient world had a lot of minor uses, just nothing particularly important or pivotal. the romans used it for all kinds of poo poo b/c it was a significant byproduct of their silver smelting operations so it was available in large quantities, buy in less sophisticated polities it was probably a scrub-tier trinket metal which only shone when you needed density (for projectiles) or a low melting point (for easy casting) the important bit is that the accidental smelting of lead demonstrates that you can take a weird brittle old rock and subject it to heat and a reducing atmosphere and get large masses of metal, like the kind we normally have to scour riverbeds for or luck into tripping over. nobody -needs- lead but a demonstration that you can probably do the same with copper- an enormously important metal- was massive.
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Oct 8, 2015 15:36
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Whorelord posted:*is Egyptian* And they spent all their time getting ready to die. The first goons.
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Oct 8, 2015 15:58
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stabbing
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Oct 13, 2015 01:53
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Bronze age cave in is basically my life I guess humans been loving it up since they first humed
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Oct 13, 2015 03:40
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