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niethan posted:Do you feel like a high level TKD practicioner would have a good time transitioning to this? He or she would have a good time picking up the technique, particularly the kicks, and probably have beautiful form soon. Then have a terrible or at least difficult time sparring and fighting. TKD practitioners tend to drop their hands, savateurs don't and are usually decent boxers. Sparring with someone with a tendency to throw combinations of punches at your head and using tons of side movement is quite the trip if your own tendency is to hop around in place with your hands by your waist looking to win the day with a single jumping tornado high kick or something  I've sparred with TKD practitioners who pick up either Savate or boxing or both. The have to seriously unlearn their style of fighting. Shame since they're so great at kicking poo poo.
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Dec 7, 2011 19:31
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Just chiming in to say that I don't think there's "excessive force" in self-defense against a lethal weapon. He brought the gun. I wouldn't even care if he got paralyzed from the neck down from the beating or if he was shot in the spine. He brought the gun.
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Dec 7, 2011 19:40
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You all sound like sociopaths  Xguard86 posted:Are you honestly defending an armed robber taking a beating after threatening to kill someone? No, but self defense ends when you're not defending yourself but kicking the poo poo out of a now helpless dude. I don't know that that's what happened here, but a lot of you are saying that it'd be fair game, that he "deserves an rear end-whooping", and that I disagree with. What happens during the "defense" part, i.e. while the dude poses a threat to your life is fair game, but instant retribution by the would-be-victim is bullshit. niethan fucked around with this message at 19:46 on Dec 7, 2011 |
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Dec 7, 2011 19:43
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Hey! How's saying TKD practitioners drop their hands make me sound like a sociopath  They DO.
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Dec 7, 2011 19:46
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Ligur posted:Hey! How's saying TKD practitioners drop their hands make me sound like a sociopath This is true. The ones around this area from McDojos also tend to throw really fast but weak kicks. They look almost horrified the first time your drive a shin into their thigh. On another note. I've been going to organized BJJ classes for almost a month and keep asking myself why I wasn't doing this before. It feels so good to just know the basics instead of trying to learn from a book.
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Dec 7, 2011 19:54
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So not to take away from the eventual 'if mma fighter had gun' debate but what are the general opinions of bjj players starting on their knees when rolling? I know this is referred to as 'midget wrestling' sometimes... Does anyone have general strategies they follow when trying to pass someone's guard (while not ending up in their opponent's guard).
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Dec 7, 2011 19:57
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niethan posted:You all sound like sociopaths I'm gonna correctly guess you've never had to defend yourself in any kind of emotionally charged situation before Congrats on your sheltered life where anyone who ever wishes ill will on anyone else for any reason is a "sociopath"
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Dec 7, 2011 19:57
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niethan posted:No, but self defense ends when you're not defending yourself but kicking the poo poo out of a now helpless dude. I don't know that that's what happened here, but a lot of you are saying that it'd be fair game, that he "deserves an rear end-whooping", and that I disagree with. What happens during the "defense" part, i.e. while the dude poses a threat to your life is fair game, but instant retribution by the would-be-victim is bullshit. It's fine that you disagree with the guy deserving an rear end whooping, and hell, I agree with you. After the guy is helpless, there's no reason to be beating on him-- but god drat, could you be any more hyperbolic about it? By your own admission, you don't know what happened in that situation, but still you jump straight onto the guy defending his life being "a piece of poo poo" and a one man lynch mob. Have you ever been in a situation where you've had a gun to your head? Assuming you haven't; for most people, being in a situation like that is probably something of a shock, and you're probably not making the best decisions in the moments after the fact. I caught a junkie stealing from a store I managed, which made him pull a knife on me; And even though I defused the situation without having to resort to violence, you bet your rear end I was fantasizing about finding the dude and pummeling his face in for a week afterwards-- while simultaneously looking over my shoulder. It's cool that you're all for due process- so am I, but it doesn't really seem like you're willing to empathize with the actual victim and what he went through, here.
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Dec 7, 2011 20:06
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origami posted:what are the general opinions of bjj players starting on their knees when rolling? I know this is referred to as 'midget wrestling' sometimes... Starting on your knees probably isn't too conducive for competition or real situations since you pretty much always start on your feet, but in a lot of clubs, starting standing up isn't an option due to the amount of students on a limited amount of mat space. There's also the issue of beginners injuring themselves during takedowns or takedown defese. If you don't know how to breakfall, a throw has a high likelihood of mashing you up pretty good. I'm even going to go out on a limb and say that throws and takedowns will probably result in a lot more injuries in the long run than starting on your knees would. As for passing, every time I've gone to a BJJ club where they do this, my first objective is to literally push them onto their back and then either try to pass their guard or control their legs (so I can pass their guard). A lot of people don't give much thought to the way they're sitting and they'll just plop right back with a hard enough push, and once you've got an opponents shoulders to the mat, passing shouldn't be too hard. A knee slide or some varioation thereof pass might help, too. VVV This is also true VVV Bohemian Nights fucked around with this message at 20:16 on Dec 7, 2011 |
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Dec 7, 2011 20:11
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Any time you have to start on your knees one guy should basically always pull guard or bottom position, its really cheesy and dorky when two guys try to wrestle from their knees for 5 minutes every time they restart rolling
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Dec 7, 2011 20:13
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I don't think it's fair to call people sociopaths over a reaction to a story about an aggressor being roughed up during and after a confrontation with a gun. Whether or not you support retributive action in your sense of justice there's a big gap between a culturally accepted emotional response to stories of Bad Guys Getting Theirs and psychopathic behavior. More combat talk, less combativeness. origami posted:So not to take away from the eventual 'if mma fighter had gun' debate but what are the general opinions of bjj players starting on their knees when rolling? I know this is referred to as 'midget wrestling' sometimes... I usually start low during free rolling because all my bad injuries have come during takedowns. Also wrestling is still my worst area by far and so that's how it goes until i get better at it. When passing the guard, my strategy is get my base, get good posture, make them break guard to improve their position and try to be faster than them when that happens. Go to guard breaks are shoot both hands through their guard, wrap up both legs, drive forward and stack them before passing to side control, or standing / wedging a knee through before driving it down onto their leg and trapping it. I've tried the knee in tailbone / push on hips pass, it works sometimes but i'm probably not doing a great job at it. james earl pwns posted:Any time you have to start on your knees one guy should basically always pull guard or bottom position, its really cheesy and dorky when two guys try to wrestle from their knees for 5 minutes every time they restart rolling Also fun is to try for fast triangles and armbars, people are more comfortable reaching out to you from kneeling position for whatever reason. Pinch together their head and arm to one side to throw them off balance a bit, drive a knee to the opposite shoulder across their chest, fall sideways and swing the free leg over their head as you fall and wee, fast armbar. Kind of like a flying version but lower and less likely to knock you out. r.y.f.s.o. fucked around with this message at 20:25 on Dec 7, 2011 |
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Dec 7, 2011 20:21
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Yeah I agree i was being hyperbolic. Sorry.
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Dec 7, 2011 20:27
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I love BJJ, I miss compition and having a team around you even though you flew solo through a tourney, but the way things are now I have to ask? Why is it still so expensive? In 2000 I was paying $75 from a good school with a great comp track record, now that same school is $165, which shocked me since moving back here (I went there during college). Judo is out of the question because for some reason it just doesn't exist around me. There's a club at the local university but they don't actual instruct and, well, to be honest, is full of ego and assholes. When will the cost start to go back to reasonable prices? I don't live in a huge city, but since I started showing interest again I noticed there went from one school, the school I used to train at, to at least 6 options in driving distince, and all but one are priced just as insane but one (which is taught by a purple that I can at least hang my own with). Sorry for the rant, but it is a legit question. I want to grapple, but I'm not in a financial position to pay those types of prices. Not even close.
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Dec 7, 2011 20:34
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invalid posted:I love BJJ, I miss compition and having a team around you even though you flew solo through a tourney, but the way things are now I have to ask? Why is it still so expensive? In 2000 I was paying $75 from a good school with a great comp track record, now that same school is $165, which shocked me since moving back here (I went there during college). MMA is a big fad right now and the type of people it attracts can generally afford those types of gym fees, it'll probably tone down eventually as more and more people are capable of opening a legit gym and/or the UFC fad dies down a bit
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Dec 7, 2011 20:36
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invalid posted:I love BJJ, I miss compition and having a team around you even though you flew solo through a tourney, but the way things are now I have to ask? Why is it still so expensive? In 2000 I was paying $75 from a good school with a great comp track record, now that same school is $165, which shocked me since moving back here (I went there during college).... I want to grapple, but I'm not in a financial position to pay those types of prices. Not even close. Blame the UFC. Demand has gone up, BJJ is cool now. If possible, do what I do, find a local college with a BJJ club, pay the dues and make some good connections. I'm actually trying to start one at my school to secure funding for a club there.
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Dec 7, 2011 20:39
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Bohemian Nights posted:Since we're posting fighting cats, check out this fukken sweet inverted guard Must be Ryan Hall's cat. As for my 2 cents on the back-n-forth self defense debate, I always figured self defense meant doing whatever you have to do until YOU feel safe. Granted no one but you can really know if you went to far, but that's the rule of thumb I've gone by. Edit: The article said it was a UFC fighter, 33, from Chicago. I wonder if it was Stephan Bonnar cuz that would be so awesome. Omglosser fucked around with this message at 21:39 on Dec 7, 2011 |
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Dec 7, 2011 21:33
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invalid posted:I love BJJ, I miss compition and having a team around you even though you flew solo through a tourney, but the way things are now I have to ask? Why is it still so expensive? In 2000 I was paying $75 from a good school with a great comp track record, now that same school is $165, which shocked me since moving back here (I went there during college). you could try explaining your situation and see if you can quietly get a discounted deal. They may say no but maybe if you volunteer to help out with like, mat cleaning or something they'll work something out for you. I know my old gym had a sort of secret program where if you had student referals you could get a discount on tuition because the recession was in high gear. They didn't even have to actually sign up, you just had to say, "hey this guy said hes sort of interested in bjj: here is a phone number".
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Dec 7, 2011 22:55
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Thoguh posted:The thumbs straight into a single point on the trachea is a lot more force than a rear naked choke, which spreads the force out over the entire surface area of a forearm. I don't think you can legally dig your thumbs into the trachea as it is a pretty standard rule that direct trachea manipulation is not legal. For a legal rape choke to occur the digits have to be on either side of trachea. I remember hearing about how that was why Rampage/Randelman ending would have been OK'd in the states as Rampage had his fingers on either side not directly grabbing the trachea.
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Dec 8, 2011 01:20
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In a life-or-death self-defense situation, getting on mount and punching the head would probably be a really safe bet. You wouldn't compromise your base trying to get a tricky submission, nobody untrained would be able to escape it, they wouldn't be able to get a weapon out of their pockets because their arms are both stuck at shoulder height, you could look around in every direction to look for a second attacker, and you could get up and run if you saw one. That's probably what happened to that guy's face.
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Dec 8, 2011 01:20
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Someone in this very thread has a story about a friend being stabbed to death from the guy on the bottom while in top mount of a dude, so.. draw your own conclusions about going down with people like that.
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Dec 8, 2011 02:26
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If your opponent has a weapon, your first priority is take that weapon from them. Then neutralize them as need be/according to the circumstances.
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Dec 8, 2011 02:33
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Also what's to say the attacker wasn't going to get up and pull some more stuff? Just because he is disarmed and has technically lost the initial confrontation he could get up and have another go, beating him up a lot while he is a weak position would seem like the smart thing in hindsight rather than wanting to end the confrontation and not be guilty of a one man version mob justice if the attacker recovers quickly or quicker than you thought he would, so better to do more than less to a guy surely? At least, that was how I felt when the dude who through a punch at me got floored and I (stupidly looking back on it) let him get back up again and consider almost coming at me again, instead of taking full mount and beating him until he was unconscious or seriously hurt and unable to do so.
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Dec 8, 2011 02:59
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DaNerd posted:If your opponent has a weapon, your first priority is take that weapon from them You misspelled 'run away as fast as you can't.
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Dec 8, 2011 03:14
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Thoguh posted:You misspelled 'run away as fast as you can't. I always assume that people are talking about taking on people with weapons when running away isn't an option, I should not assume this because people are dumb as hell.
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Dec 8, 2011 03:19
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Maybe its me but I've seen way too many people give terrible "life or death" or "on da street" advice when they have experienced neither, have not bothered to do any real research into the topic, or have no particular training in that area. Except for the few people in the thread that have first hand or very close second hand accounts. What the hell are you guys basing your comments on? If you've actually have some experience or train specifically with that goal in mind keep posting, but if you don't then you really should not be giving 'advice' that could get someone killed.
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Dec 8, 2011 03:20
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Senor P. posted:If you've actually have some experience or train specifically with that goal in mind keep posting, but if you don't then you really should not be giving 'advice' that could get someone killed. i have real world knife defense training, please pay attention: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ah_0gia4A0
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Dec 8, 2011 03:36
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mewse posted:i have real world knife defense training, please pay attention: ok so: die. Now, what is my second move here?
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Dec 8, 2011 04:02
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mewse posted:i have real world knife defense training, please pay attention: How so?
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Dec 8, 2011 04:59
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Xguard86 posted:ok so: die. Now, what is my second move here? i don't know, i just laugh uncontrollably every time i play the video
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Dec 8, 2011 05:04
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mewse posted:i have real world knife defense training, please pay attention: sorry, to busy getting stabbed to death
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Dec 8, 2011 05:15
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I do the prison stitching drills in FMA quite a bit and it's hard as gently caress to defend against. The first stab is defendable, but good luck with the second, third, fourth, fifth....
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Dec 8, 2011 06:10
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willie_dee posted:How so? What don't you get? Nobody except superhard motherfuckers who get stabbed multiple times is ready for a knife attack.
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Dec 8, 2011 07:00
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Was just wondering where you get that kind of realistic training that basically involves you being told "you are hosed"
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Dec 8, 2011 07:57
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The Folsom prison, unless you die first or before whoever attacks you is overwhelmed by the guards before he can finish his stitching. I'm guessing military combat pre-50s or so if you got a time machine. For real, maybe the Dog Brothers? I've also seen law enforcement training with what's called "realistic knife attacks" that is, someone just charging you and machine-gunning puncture wounds and short slashes on your body at a pace of five per second with hyper aggression and no fancy extras. edit: And once even Krav training where that was done :O Mostly to show that it's really hard to defend and nobody trained in, say, ring fighting or competitive grappling is nowhere near ready to defend against blades in the real world. Not that anyone probably really is but you know. Ligur fucked around with this message at 12:21 on Dec 8, 2011 |
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Dec 8, 2011 12:17
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r.y.f.s.o. posted:Blame the UFC. Demand has gone up, BJJ is cool now. I'll start looking for the club option. I'm a bit worried about the quality but I guess anything's good right about now! There is a no-budge on that sign a new guy up at my old school. They have people out the door and turn folks away even. I wore my Affliction tee and everything!
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Dec 8, 2011 16:08
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One of the nicest things when you substitute for a class as an instructor on short notice because the regular is injured, traveling or whatever, is when you notice a bunch of them trained at your basic course or summer classes 6 months ago, and when they in turn notice that you step in front break out with wide smiles or happy nods and start visibly having fun (like, more fun than a moment ago), come talk to you after etc.  Of course the opposite is when people ask "if this geek is running this class usually" behind your back and never come back or those who start avoiding your sessions, but who can please everyone anyway  edit: invalid posted:I wore my Affliction tee and everything! Yeah that's certainly going to give a favourable impression
Ligur fucked around with this message at 18:20 on Dec 8, 2011 |
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Dec 8, 2011 18:16
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Whenever I instruct, I'm referred to as, "the nicer, but not as smart" one. Thanks guys? E: I made a case for, "Nicer, but less experienced", but then I remembered I spent the end of last class gushing over Skyrim, and discussing proper powering-up techniques (Grunt with the diaphragm, look like you're trying to pass a Buick). I guess I'll accept what I can get. TheStampede fucked around with this message at 19:12 on Dec 8, 2011 |
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Dec 8, 2011 19:02
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Today I instructed that I know nothing of instructing a class like this, that you are supposed to throw up by the end of the class (it was an intense anaerobic workout set, like on of 'em hardcore aerobic pumps or whatever - not my strong suit since I generally never instruct anything but technique) and the one before, we pumped up the volume to some good tunes and started dancing around the gym. That's little better than giving out Skyrim instructions though IMO  Tomorrow, I'll have to ask people how many play Fallout: New Vegas, I recently got into it again. Maybe get some good tips or can give some, today we only discussed throwing when your arms are dead tired and what the wrist wraps do - inferior information against the benefits of a tuned up hunting rifle with hand load ammo in the Wasteland.
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Dec 8, 2011 19:20
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The best part about training in a college town is that pretty much everyone in my class are nerds. Nerds who like to kick things, but nerds. My couch became very crestfallen when he realized half of his fight team gets together for Magic:TCG on the weekends. And seconding the sweet jams in class. I made everyone listen to Girl Talk yesterday. I get a strange pleasure from the looks we get.
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Dec 8, 2011 19:40
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TheStampede posted:I made everyone listen to Girl Talk yesterday. I get a strange pleasure from the looks we get. "face down, rear end up, thats the way we like to gently caress" x 30
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Dec 8, 2011 19:43
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