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Oh man I totally forgot that they plot dumped Adachi right before he "slipped up." I really didn't like Naoto since stuff like that made her almost designed just to wrap up the plot as quickly as possible along with the "isn't she so cool?!?" stuff that the game shoves in your face constantly once she joins. I don't like it when something tries to tell me why I should like their favorite character instead of actually making them good.
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Jan 26, 2012 02:57
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I've come to think that in that scene how he reacted to being accused is the important part. It doesn't matter that the evidence wasn't perfect yet if he's going to prove his guilt at the first suggestion that it was him.
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Jan 26, 2012 04:04
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Radish posted:Oh man I totally forgot that they plot dumped Adachi right before he "slipped up." I really didn't like Naoto since stuff like that made her almost designed just to wrap up the plot as quickly as possible along with the "isn't she so cool?!?" stuff that the game shoves in your face constantly once she joins. I don't like it when something tries to tell me why I should like their favorite character instead of actually making them good. But she was SO COOL, THE COOLEST, please love her. 
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Jan 26, 2012 04:08
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In all honesty, Naoto never bugged me with that. I never honestly deduced that Adachi was the killer by anything other than "Oh... well, he's obviously the killer because he's the nice cop." and really, the game used pretty flimsy reasoning to set him up. Hell, if I didn't know the company in question's habit of bullshitting their endings, then I'd assume that Adachi just rolled with the accusation because he just wanted someone to loving catch him so he could make it more interesting. Either way though, I significantly enjoyed Naoto more than the other half of the group because she just seemed more interesting to begin with. She got a decent S. Link and was halfway competent, so she along with Chie and Kanji earned my favor... then again, she didn't have enough time to really piss me off, so maybe I should reserve judgment.
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Jan 26, 2012 04:13
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On the plus side, if Naoto wasn't there the investigation team probably would've had to wait for Adachi to actually gently caress up, which would've been equally unsatisfying. They had to magic up a character and a reason to solve the mystery because they had no idea how to solve it naturally. It's like those CYOA Sherlock Holmes books where Holmes shows up at the end and explains the mystery to you because he's a giant jerk.
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Jan 26, 2012 04:14
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It didn't help that it felt like the writers flipped a switch on the killer that turned him from nice guy cop to shifty passive-aggressive guilty is written on my face rear end in a top hat in the hospital scene. Then they flicked another switch and he became Creepy Raper Guy, and all the sloppy writing became hilariously justified in one of the most bizarre character shifts I've ever seen.
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Jan 26, 2012 04:19
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Thing is that they pretty much did just that. As another poster said, there were a bunch of rewrites that resulted into that clusterfuck of a finale. Alternatively that 'everybody has a different side' thing applies to him just as much as it does to everyone else in the game, but it's still felt like they realized they had no good way to wrap the game up. I didn't need Adachi's involvement to be obvious but there's no way for you to solve the mystery without Naoto calling him out and Adachi just deciding that he was beaten. He even admits that there's absolutely no way for them to pin anything on him because there's no physical evidence, but he decides to suddenly become a egomaniac anyway. Then Izanami happened because of course. I'm hoping they throw in a social link with Adachi. It could provide insight into his character and make the turn easier to swallow.
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Jan 26, 2012 04:43
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It would be nice if they took the extra time they have and rewrote all that a little. The kids were slowly zeroing in on the truth which was more fun than having a new addition suddenly take over everything an figure it out. Naoto in theory adding her detective experience would have been fine but she literally became the leader of the group once she joined making every decision which felt like any imaginary agency I had was gone. As you guys have said Adachi's sudden face turn was way too abupt although if they had more clues throughout the story it would have been one of those situations where the player knows what's obviously up while the characters have to be dumb or the game wouldn't work out. I think if they had his character turn into more of a "I don't really give a poo poo" rather than creepy raper guy it wouldn't have been so stark a shift. If they clean up a bunch of that I think it would be cool since it sounds like they are adding a lot of stuff up anyway and we aren't getting a new gender character to add basically a new story like with P3P. Eggplant Squire fucked around with this message at 04:53 on Jan 26, 2012 |
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Jan 26, 2012 04:50
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I figured out that Adachi was the killer because he was the only character left at the end. The other option would have been to either introduce an entirely new character, or I guess to have one of the party members be the guilty party. Ultimately the game doesn't leave you with enough of a rogues gallery to make the final deduction compelling.
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Jan 26, 2012 05:03
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It would be nice if they pretty much rewrote the whole story of P4 as it's pretty badly paced and well... the plot twists are still unbelievably silly.
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Jan 26, 2012 05:15
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Yeah I figured it out the same way. It's pretty obvious once they give you the prompt which includes mostly social link characters it can't be since you might have not met them, wacky teachers, several people in the hospital and your party members. However up to that point it wasn't thrown in your face which I appreciated. I just wish the thing they caught him on was actually solid instead of so flaky since it would have been a better OBJECTION! moment.Sex_Ferguson posted:It would be nice if they pretty much rewrote the whole story of P4 as it's pretty badly paced and well... the plot twists are still unbelievably silly. Considering how much they appear to be adding I wouldn't be super surprised if that happened to some extent.
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Jan 26, 2012 05:16
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I have this weird relationship with SMT games. It's a series that I highly appreciate but for some reason, I rarely ever finish the games I buy. Here are the SMT games I own : SMT Nocturne Persona Portable Persona 2 IS Persona 2 EP* Persona 3* / FES / Portable Persona 4* Digital Devil Saga* Digital Devil Saga 2 Devil Summoner Raidou Devil Summoner Raidou 2 SMT Strange Journey SMT Devil Survivor / Overclocked *'s are for games I actually finished. I was able to narrow down the reason ; it's due to the fusion system. I like the system and all but it seems to always put me into a state of vulnerability ; when you get new demons, there's a possibility that your new party will totally suck in the dungeon you're in and gently caress you over and there seems to be little you can do to make up for it. I'm trying pretty hard to overcome that feeling, started Overclocked again and got to day 5 last night (level 31 or so) and I'm doing well. Looking forward to completing the other games when I'm done with DS.
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Jan 26, 2012 05:33
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Radish posted:Yeah I figured it out the same way. It's pretty obvious once they give you the prompt which includes mostly social link characters it can't be since you might have not met them, wacky teachers, several people in the hospital and your party members. However up to that point it wasn't thrown in your face which I appreciated. I just wish the thing they caught him on was actually solid instead of so flaky since it would have been a better OBJECTION! moment. What are they adding that actually changes the story? Some halloween event and a ski trip seem more like joke events to me than they do actual events that somehow fix the story and really, I highly doubt that this new town is going to be for anything more than just some sightseeing trip. Mary's still pretty ambiguous, but she definitely isn't giving me the impression of some giant factor in the overall game.
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Jan 26, 2012 05:37
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 ~Maybe we'll invent a Cosmic Esperanto~ KATAMARI PERSONA-Y See more screenshots of the new Bike Attacks and anime intro of Persona 4 The Golden here!
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Jan 26, 2012 05:39
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I just got a PSP because everyone kept telling me to get one if I want to play JRPGs. Now I'll have to get a Vita as well. This poo poo never ends.
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Jan 26, 2012 05:41
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So how are they going to explain stcking motorcycles inside the TV?
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Jan 26, 2012 05:53
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Persona continues to have the most stylin' intros. I'm guessing we'll get a new song as well.
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Jan 26, 2012 05:56
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The Hater posted:So how are they going to explain stcking motorcycles inside the TV? Clearly no one will notice the gang driving their scooters through Junes.
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Jan 26, 2012 05:58
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Nobody will bother them because they think they're a dangerous motorcycle gang. Oh goodness I hope there's a scene with Dojima laying into the MC about scooter safety.  Sex_Ferguson posted:What are they adding that actually changes the story? Some halloween event and a ski trip seem more like joke events to me than they do actual events that somehow fix the story and really, I highly doubt that this new town is going to be for anything more than just some sightseeing trip. Mary's still pretty ambiguous, but she definitely isn't giving me the impression of some giant factor in the overall game. We don't really know yet, but all of these additions suggest that they're at least going to be shuffling things around a bit. Maybe the 'most requested feature' is better writing?  At the very least I'm hoping they'll add something a bit substantial like the social links in P3P.
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Jan 26, 2012 06:04
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The Hater posted:So how are they going to explain stcking motorcycles inside the TV? Conceal them under their uniforms. If desks and swords will fit in there, hey, why not. Regarding P4 end talk, I said as much in its thread, but if y'all want to see a really lovely ending sequence, play Catherine. It certainly is an experience! And Policenaut, you're great. I haven't been adding all of your news posts to the news section (just because I don't want it to be too long), but you're on top of things and I appreciate it.
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Jan 26, 2012 06:05
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Cheap Diner Coffee posted:Regarding P4 end talk, I said as much in its thread, but if y'all want to see a really lovely ending sequence, play Catherine. It certainly is an experience! at least they set up SOMETHING to make you wonder about the end boss because who wears sunglasses inside? gods, that's who! apparently.
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Jan 26, 2012 06:29
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Cheap Diner Coffee posted:And Policenaut, you're great. I haven't been adding all of your news posts to the news section (just because I don't want it to be too long), but you're on top of things and I appreciate it. No problem! I just keep looking for The Golden news hoping I'll read "YES ITS COMING OUT IN AMERICA!!!" only to find this stuff.
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Jan 26, 2012 06:38
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I mentioned earlier in the thread that my first game from this series was Strange Journey, and that I decided to buy a PS2 just so I could play Nocturne, Persona 4, Digital Devil Saga and Digital Saga 2; the last two have been dispatched from Amazon but haven't arrived yet. (I also bought Okami but while I love its art direction and music I got bored of it after you first meet Susano-o and have not touched it since) After 95 hours of Strange Journey (84 hours into my initial play through after which I decided to restart on a whim because ... I have no idea, I was in Sector H and Neutral and had heard bad things about the Final Boss) I decided to try Nocturne and Persona 4. I've found them quite enjoyable so far for different reasons, and had a few questions for the rest of you guys. You all seem pretty knowledgeable about these games. 1) It's my first playthrough of P4, and while I'm not using a guide to help me like I did with Strange Journey, I did read the entirety of Fienne's LP, so I know what to expect in general. It's just that I feel a bit "unprotected" with my fusions, because I'm deciding not to plan ahead (ie. read guides), so I am not really fusing these crazy personas; I'm just getting as many personas as I can, seeing what the fusion results look like and keeping the ones that leave me with a balanced party in terms of attack-support and elemental-physical damage. Will this be enough to get me through the game? Or will I need very specific personas to beat certain bosses? Will I have to get a very good handle on the fusion system to get the most out of this game, and if so how long might that take? 2) I've played through 2 hours of Nocturne according to the game clock, having just beaten Forneus, but it's probably more like 2.5 hours due to deaths. In fact, I died once on the second encounter in the game (two Pretas) and once on the third encounter (two Kodama). I knew people said this game was difficult, but not that difficult.... Those deaths were a bit unfortunate in that they both came as a result of multiple critical hits. I probably should have healed over, but it took me a long time to figure out that I did have have the ability to recruit demons or use items in battle, I just had to press left or right to get to the menu (drat you Strange Journey for making me expect them all to be on the same screen!). To be fair though, I didn't actually mind those deaths; I actually laughed to myself at one at them. But I am finding out that Nocturne and P4 are not your typical JRPGs. Anyway, I have gone on for long enough... What was everyone else's first impressions and/or experiences with Nocturne? Edit: I've been playing Nocturne ON NORMAL manny kaltz fucked around with this message at 09:24 on Jan 26, 2012 |
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Jan 26, 2012 09:09
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Regarding Persona, no, there is never a time you may need a certain persona to beat a boss. Some might help tremendously, but there is no obligation. You might want to keep in memory what elements a boss use and get a good persona against that. for exemple, few seems to realise that for the first serious boss of the game, there is a convenient persona that void th element of the boss, ripe for the taking. So play by ear, and don't be afraid to experiment and use the Compendium. About the plot debate earlier on the page I think the complaints regarding how said character having their personality changes from good to evil on the drop of a hat are a bit overblown: During most of the game, said character has been acting like a callous hardass from time to time. I assume people kinda ignore it because it fits with the everyday's persona, but it's pretty blatant on a replay.
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Jan 26, 2012 11:19
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I've just started recently with Nocturne, so all I can really say is save often, and everytime before anyone levels up. Well, the latter is not as important, but do save often! Also a side-note, the gameover screen I think is neat.
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Jan 26, 2012 18:51
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manny kaltz posted:Will this be enough to get me through the game? P4 isn't that hard. As long as you keep a few personas around with a good variety of skills and resists, you shouldn't have too much trouble. manny kaltz posted:What was everyone else's first impressions and/or experiences with Nocturne? Pretty much "this looks pretty cool" followed by "oh poo poo, is it four in the morning already?" Nocturne is a great game.
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Jan 26, 2012 19:12
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manny kaltz 1) If you beat Strange Journey, I don't think you'll have any trouble with Persona 4. P4 is simpler that SJ in a lot of ways (less "gently caress you" status effects, more forgiving with what persona you need for what boss, etc.). Despite what Personae you end up with, you always have a roster of party members for versatility as far as skills and strengths go. In storyline boss fights, the best thing to remember is that the best thing the MC's Personae can do are best buffs and debuffs. Also, one other thing about the ending writing in Persona 4: DISCLAIMER: The writing in the later parts of Persona 4 Pretty much from Naoto's dungeon to the end IS a giant clusterfuck that really could have used a rewrite, but I don't think that flaw is so bad as it ruins the game to anything below one of the Best Games Ever.  But one thing about some of the near-to-end reveals that I know disappointed a lot of people but I actually really liked was Adachi's revealed motivation for why he committed the murders and strung the team along. I think he really felt like a "real" serial killer. He was a combination of self-absorbed, frustrated, high opinion of self and low opinion of others, and personality that lacks any or enough empathy/understanding of other people.. From a storyline perspective, it has a terrible payoff; but from somewhat of a believabilty perspective, Adachi feels like a "real" serial killer with a "real" motivation. I've found that in real life, the explanations that killers give are somewhat understandable when you know the factors, but very, very unsatisfying.
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Jan 26, 2012 22:22
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Wait, did they confirm how to get a license for a scooter yet?
Dogbutt fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Jan 27, 2012 |
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Jan 27, 2012 00:10
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Dogbutt posted:Wait, did they confirm how to get a license for a scooter yet? From what I understand, the part where the gang gets their scooter licenses is part of the story now.
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Jan 27, 2012 00:16
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Nocturne is one of those games that blows your mind in the first twenty minutes, when the world ends. Masterpiece of a game.
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Jan 27, 2012 00:16
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OK so I got to the Second Kalpa, and a light told me to stop. I said no. Did this screw me over for the neutral ending?
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Jan 28, 2012 03:29
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Dogbutt posted:OK so I got to the Second Kalpa, and a light told me to stop. I said no. Did this screw me over for the neutral ending? If I remember correctly, the only choices that matter for the Neutral ending are the ones when you talk to Yuko in the park. E: And obviously, you avoid getting any other endings.
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Jan 28, 2012 03:38
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I'm pretty sure that choice doesn't do anything at all, though it's been a while so I don't remember for sure. I'm actually not sure how you get the regular Demon ending at all.
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Jan 28, 2012 03:47
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Finally beat the True Ending of Persona 4 today, after dying twice and reassessing my strategy. Gotta say, that's easily the best RPG I've ever played. Part of me wishes it had an equivalent to the Monad Depths where I could grind up to level 90 and barely break a sweat, but lacking that made me actually strategize against the final boss instead of brute forcing it like I wound up doing in Persona 3 and I think I like that better.
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Jan 28, 2012 07:26
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Re: Persona 4's ending and discussion of the culprit The only problem I really have with trying to fit in Adachi as a Social Link is, while it would definitely hide him better (let's face it, process of elimination makes it pretty loving easy), the only choices he could really have for a Social Link are all way too obvious and would single him out. He'd pretty much have to be Death, Devil or Judgment, and any genre-savvy player is going to pick up on that instantly. I agree with the whole "serial killers don't have to have reasoning" idea. I just wish they had dropped more hints along the way. More than that, though it has done a great number of things well, the show hasn't really dropped very many hints either, and possibly even fewer than the game, relatively speaking. I'm interested to see how they will go about doing that. I never even thought I would touch a Vita, but if they're seriously adding as much stuff as they are, I might be forced to reconsider.
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Jan 28, 2012 08:19
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Gwyrgyn Blood posted:I'm pretty sure that choice doesn't do anything at all, though it's been a while so I don't remember for sure. Fail to qualify for any other ending at all.
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Jan 28, 2012 14:29
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Strange Matter posted:Finally beat the True Ending of Persona 4 today, after dying twice and reassessing my strategy. Gotta say, that's easily the best RPG I've ever played. Hey, I just beat it yesterday. I was kind of worried about the last boss seeing I was only level 79, but Yoshitsune and Trumpeter absolutely truck hosed Izanami. Hassou Tobi is just such an awesome ability.
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Jan 28, 2012 15:15
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So I finally got to the Highway in Nocturne. And you know who is there. Should I wait till I battle him, or battle him now? I'm Level 32.
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Jan 29, 2012 17:44
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Dogbutt posted:So I finally got to the Highway in Nocturne. And you know who is there. Should I wait till I battle him, or battle him now? I'm Level 32. That Fiend isn't one of the hard ones, you shouldn't have much trouble fighting him.
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Jan 29, 2012 18:03
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jonjonaug posted:That Fiend isn't one of the hard ones, you shouldn't have much trouble fighting him. I just got really intimidated by his Hell Exhaust. Edit: For some reason I thought he had Dekunda. He really was easy... Dogbutt fucked around with this message at 18:21 on Jan 29, 2012 |
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Jan 29, 2012 18:10
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