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quote:It actually really astounds me that you have this much trouble with the game. I feel like if there was a recount of what you were doing, you'd probably have a lot of people just going over the way you play the game. It sounds like you just fundamentally play it in a different way than others that results in a mess of frustration. This may or may not be the fault of the game, but it does make me wonder. I suppose that a lot of us having played DS1 means we knew which abilities from the previous installment were worth cracking at first sight (Dances, Drain, etc) and which demon skills were proven well. I've beaten P3P on Maniac, P4 on Expert, Nocturne on Hard, DDS2 on hard, I also finished Devil Survivor 1 twice. I'm quite familiar with the games, the mechanics and Atlus style difficulty. I simply have less tolerance for the mechanics at this point, to be honest outside of the really stupid and cheap missions like the one where you have to stop soldiers from escaping and they get 20 turns to your one, I never had trouble in DS1. In DS2 the whole game seems stacked against you, Beldr pops up at level 30, you should be level 30 at that point, the first boss you fight in DS2 is Level 20, you'll be 8 at the most, every boss you fight is way higher than you, humans are just on a whole nother level in terms of cheapness. Yes they're broken things in the game, that doesn't make it anymore tolerable, not to mention even with all this stuff the final boss is just cheap on cheap, covered with cheap. As for my comment regarding the hidden boss, well its true, I've fought them all, Hitoshura is pure randomness, Satan is a step by step video otherwise you wipe, Lucifer in DS1 are 3 very specific and unorthodox strategies, its nuts.
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Mar 30, 2012 20:44
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Yeah, if there's one thing I'll bitch about in this game, it's how the turn order system works. Enemy units are just loving faster than you, and will generally get several turns to your one. For some reason, whenever you get attacked, your turn order is slowed down, which is complete nonsense.x I mean, the game overall isn't hard. It has its moments, and I still think the final boss (and to a lesser extent the Mizar boss) is complete horseshit, but the turn order mechanic is completely stacked against you, even when you're not using Chaos Wave/Breath or Evil Wave/Flow.
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Mar 30, 2012 20:51
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Alteisen posted:In DS2 the whole game seems stacked against you, Beldr pops up at level 30, you should be level 30 at that point, the first boss you fight in DS2 is Level 20, you'll be 8 at the most, every boss you fight is way higher than you, humans are just on a whole nother level in terms of cheapness. Uh yeah Dubhe is at level 20, but after Daichi triggers an event its stats are reduced to almost nothing (His Vitality and Agility go down to zero while his Strength and Magic go down to 4 and 3) and it becomes weak to Physical, Ice, Force, and Lightning.
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Mar 30, 2012 21:01
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King of Solomon posted:Yeah, if there's one thing I'll bitch about in this game, it's how the turn order system works. Enemy units are just loving faster than you, and will generally get several turns to your one. For some reason, whenever you get attacked, your turn order is slowed down, which is complete nonsense.x As I've said a couple times, I think this is completely fair. If it costs time to attack, then there's no reason it shouldn't cost time to counter-attack -- when you can, that is; getting delayed by a ranged attack that you can't counter is definitely bullshit (play your cards wrong and some bosses can attack you 3-4 times in a row before you get a turn). I like the mechanic because apart from kind of making sense conceptually, it cuts down on Fire Emblem syndrome where a single unit can be sent forward to massacre an army and encourages some finesse in your squad movement because a unit that initiates a skirmish gets a massive advantage. It just needs some tweaking because the way it currently works gives such a disproportionate advantage to ranged attacks, which are already pretty overpowered on their own.
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Mar 30, 2012 21:17
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Ok the 2nd fight in the last day with the Dragon Stream really irks me because it's a giant "HOPE YOU HAVE PIERCE" fight.
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Mar 30, 2012 22:19
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Dragongem posted:Ok the 2nd fight in the last day with the Dragon Stream really irks me because it's a giant "HOPE YOU HAVE PIERCE" fight. Have you tried almighty? At that stage you should at least have holy dance, probably even Megido.
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Mar 30, 2012 22:23
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King of Solomon posted:Have you tried almighty? At that stage you should at least have holy dance, probably even Megido. Yeah, it's less a check for Pierce and more a check for defense-bypassing damage in general. By that point in the game, if you haven't started fusing Holy Dance (or Pierce) onto things, you're likely to be having a hell of a time ANYWAY.
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Mar 30, 2012 23:58
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So, I just hit (post-game optional boss)Nebiros and, uh...what the hell am I supposed to do there? The dude breaks the rules and attacks three times per turn, and is extremely high level. How exactly am I supposed to kill him? EDIT: Gonna try reflecting phys and force. See what happens there. EDIT2: Welp, stats not high enough for that. King of Solomon fucked around with this message at 00:18 on Mar 31, 2012 |
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Mar 31, 2012 00:15
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Alteisen posted:I've beaten P3P on Maniac, P4 on Expert, Nocturne on Hard, DDS2 on hard, I also finished Devil Survivor 1 twice. I'm quite familiar with the games, the mechanics and Atlus style difficulty. Burned out? DS2 was far easier than DS1, SJ, P3P, or P1 (all I've played) and I found the "cheap" fights less so than any other in DS2. DS1 Baldr made me sell the game after I worked SO hard on a physical MC and it turned out impossible (repurchased DS: Overclocked). There are no roadblocks in DS2 that even come close to that level of bullshit. My favorite is still SJ, but DS2 comes close because experimentation was way easier and difficulty was more forgiving allowing me to go apeshit.
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Mar 31, 2012 00:18
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King of Solomon posted:So, I just hit (post-game optional boss)Nebiros and, uh...what the hell am I supposed to do there? The dude breaks the rules and attacks three times per turn, and is extremely high level. How exactly am I supposed to kill him? You want to kill his minions. Nebiros will respawn infinite minions (because if any of his minions are alive he will respawn himself.) However, his minions are significantly weaker and each one you gank raises you up a cartoonish number of levels. Just focus on farming and keep the civilians alive until they escape, then you can just stomp him once you've gained like a billion levels.
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Mar 31, 2012 00:18
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Pierce posted:Burned out? DS2 was far easier than DS1, SJ, P3P, or P1 (all I've played) and I found the "cheap" fights less so than any other in DS2. DS1 Baldr made me sell the game after I worked SO hard on a physical MC and it turned out impossible (repurchased DS: Overclocked). There are no roadblocks in DS2 that even come close to that level of bullshit. You do know, that the damage you can do to Beldr is based off level not stats, right? You could have continued with your strength based MC.
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Mar 31, 2012 00:21
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King of Solomon posted:So, I just hit (post-game optional boss)Nebiros and, uh...what the hell am I supposed to do there? The dude breaks the rules and attacks three times per turn, and is extremely high level. How exactly am I supposed to kill him? I don't know how far ahead your teams are, but you probably shouldn't bother with the optional fights until you can carry over at least 4 level 80+ demons into a new playthrough. Nebiros' gimmick is that he doesn't actually attack you; he spends all his turns reviving his minions after you kill them, and you can't kill him unless you've killed all his minions. If you have a group with a Kishin and a Dragon who can easily take out two groups, you'll do well. There's no trick to killing Nebiros himself unlike the later optional bosses; just bring your highest level demons and punch him out of the map.
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Mar 31, 2012 00:26
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Alteisen posted:You do know, that the damage you can do to Beldr is based off level not stats, right? You could have continued with your strength based MC. No, I didn't. I threw a bitch fit and sold it.
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Mar 31, 2012 00:33
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Pierce posted:No, I didn't. I threw a bitch fit and sold it. Just like I did with DS2. :iamafag: Changing the subject for a second, do you guys think we'll see another mainline SMT game ala Strange Journey and Nocturne? Or will it be the Persona stuff which seems to be much more profitable.
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Mar 31, 2012 00:42
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Alteisen posted:Just like I did with DS2. :iamafag: Nice! I'm hoping EO4 influences some 3DS development. I would love to see some SMT rather than Persona on the 3DS.
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Mar 31, 2012 01:07
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I'm still holding out for a PC game wahahaha who the gently caress am I kidding 
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Mar 31, 2012 01:11
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I really want a new Nocturne where I can actually see the demons I fuse. My gut tells me we'll get another Persona game though.
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Mar 31, 2012 01:14
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Heavy neutrino posted:I'm still holding out for a PC game wahahaha who the gently caress am I kidding I'm trying out Nocturne for the first time on the PS2 emulator, using a mouse and keyboard controls. It works... alright. There's not really any need for a controller in a game like this, at least.
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Mar 31, 2012 01:18
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So I just tried fighting that guy again. It took about two hours, and I game overed because I just could not kill him off. Christ.
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Mar 31, 2012 01:20
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King of Solomon posted:So I just tried fighting that guy again. It took about two hours, and I game overed because I just could not kill him off. Christ. Again, Nebiros is purely a check of how strong your demons (and those in your compendium too i guess if you want to farm a whole lot) are. If you can't beat him, try again next playthrough.
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Mar 31, 2012 01:31
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Okay, this is the second time it happened, so i have to ask: has anyone else experienced random crashes in P2? Like, suddenly the PSP just shuts off? I know i didn't touch the power button, and it has never happened in any other game. 
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Mar 31, 2012 01:32
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Heavy neutrino posted:Again, Nebiros is purely a check of how strong your demons (and those in your compendium too i guess if you want to farm a whole lot) are. If you can't beat him, try again next playthrough. Oh, I killed Nebiros himself several times. Same with all his minions. I just can't kill all of them in that short a period of time (I don't have any Kishin demons.) I may just have to wait until my third playthrough after all. 
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Mar 31, 2012 01:48
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King of Solomon posted:So I just tried fighting that guy again. It took about two hours, and I game overed because I just could not kill him off. Christ. If you can't kill him in a few tries, you won't be able to. He's absolutely incapable of losing a war of attrition, since his teams regenerate without cost. Either you can kill off the whole set of enemies in one shot, or you can't win. It's an incredibly binary fight, and the fact that you can't adjust your humans' skills mid-battle means that it's almost impossible to grind your way to victory.
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Mar 31, 2012 01:48
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Technique posted:Okay, this is the second time it happened, so i have to ask: has anyone else experienced random crashes in P2? Like, suddenly the PSP just shuts off? I know i didn't touch the power button, and it has never happened in any other game. It's never turned off on me, but it's frozen a few times. There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it, just completely random hard lock.
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Mar 31, 2012 01:56
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Alteisen posted:Just like I did with DS2. :iamafag:
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Mar 31, 2012 02:02
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Alteisen posted:Just like I did with DS2. :iamafag: They can do whatever they want with the main SMT games, just GIVE US PERSONA 5 ALREADY JESUS. 
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Mar 31, 2012 03:03
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kthegreat posted:I don't know if the demon negotiation was better in any of the other games that used it, but I couldn't stand it in SJ. In fact, its the entire reason I quit playing the game. The dungeon crawling was great, but DS and Persona have far superior ways of getting Demons/Personas. So if a new mainline game dumps that piece of crap or at least makes it not terrible to use, then I'm all for a new one. Strange Journey's demon negotiation system got a lot better once I went chaos. If you do, recruiting chaos demons is easy, and you can just not bother with the other two alignments, since you get enough of them for fusion fodder anyway. There's a nice sub-app (Relax Spray?) that makes it easier too. I assume it's the same way for law.
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Mar 31, 2012 03:09
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Rascyc posted:I really want a new Nocturne where I can actually see the demons I fuse. Kaneko doesn't seem to have it in him anymore to wanna do something like Nocturne II so I'm guessing the next game we get is Persona 5. Mild excitement, I guess.
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Mar 31, 2012 03:14
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Alteisen posted:Just like I did with DS2. :iamafag: There have been murmurings about Persona 5 for ages now, and they've only got so long to make the drat thing before this current generation of consoles becomes obsolete. If they do make Persona 5, I kinda hope they take a cue from DS2 and make the social links work a bit more like the FATE system: being able to advance your relationship through any event that gave you points with a character felt a lot more natural than getting someone's life story dished out to you over the course of 10 meetings in the same order regardless of what's going on with the plot.
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Mar 31, 2012 04:29
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Thuryl posted:There have been murmurings about Persona 5 for ages now, and they've only got so long to make the drat thing before this current generation of consoles becomes obsolete. Atlus is always on the tail-end of a system's lifeline. gently caress, Raidou 2 came out for the PS2 in 2009, and Persona 4 was the tail end of 2008. I wouldn't be surprised in the least to learn that P5 won't be for another year or two.
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Mar 31, 2012 05:29
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Technique posted:Okay, this is the second time it happened, so i have to ask: has anyone else experienced random crashes in P2? Like, suddenly the PSP just shuts off? I know i didn't touch the power button, and it has never happened in any other game. I played P2 a lot and never had it crash. I THINK it locked up once but I can't be sure.
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Mar 31, 2012 05:52
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Artix74 posted:Atlus is always on the tail-end of a system's lifeline. gently caress, Raidou 2 came out for the PS2 in 2009, and Persona 4 was the tail end of 2008. I wouldn't be surprised in the least to learn that P5 won't be for another year or two. The fact that they're releasing a new version of Persona 4 on the Vita mere months after the thing's launch should be considered a miracle. The same goes for Overclocked on the 3DS too. Speaking of, I'm right at that point before "that one boss" on day 3 everyone's been warning me about. I keep looking at my teams and skills and think to myself, "I just need to fix a few more things before I try." I don't think this is going to end...
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Mar 31, 2012 08:04
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Just about to start SJ. Any non-spoiler tips for, effectively, an SMT virgin that will keep me from having to restart?
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Mar 31, 2012 19:21
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It's not really possible to mess up that badly, don't worry.
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Mar 31, 2012 19:21
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Oldstench posted:Just about to start SJ. Any non-spoiler tips for, effectively, an SMT virgin that will keep me from having to restart? Don't worry too much about your alignment, there's a point where you can change it to whatever you want it to be. And fuse constantly.
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Apr 1, 2012 02:22
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Artix74 posted:Atlus is always on the tail-end of a system's lifeline. gently caress, Raidou 2 came out for the PS2 in 2009, and Persona 4 was the tail end of 2008. I wouldn't be surprised in the least to learn that P5 won't be for another year or two. Yep, it looks like persona 5 has been in development since late 2010. I would guess either 2013 or 2014 since it's apparently in a new engine. http://www.siliconera.com/2011/08/30/persona-5-is-in-development-but-wont-be-released-for-quite-some-time/ [e] I can't loving wait to see how it looks since it will be the first current gen megten game.
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Apr 1, 2012 02:38
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DrManiac posted:Yep, it looks like persona 5 has been in development since late 2010. I would guess either 2013 or 2014 since it's apparently in a new engine. I can tell I'm getting old, because I'm happy that a game I'm looking forward to has a long development cycle, rather than just wondering when it's going to come out.
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Apr 1, 2012 04:52
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Is it necessary to keep your characters roughly the same level in Persona 4? Two of mine (Kanji and Teddie) are way behind everyone else and I don't really feel like taking the time to grind out levels for them. Just wondering if it's gonna bite me in the rear end down the road
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Apr 1, 2012 05:35
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DrManiac posted:Yep, it looks like persona 5 has been in development since late 2010. I would guess either 2013 or 2014 since it's apparently in a new engine. God I hope it comes out on ps3 and not wii.
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Apr 1, 2012 05:38
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Dolphin Fetus posted:God I hope it comes out on ps3 and not wii. According to the link it's only coming to the ps3
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Apr 1, 2012 05:41
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