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Splicer posted:LIIR! Should this become reality, I will always, without question or hesitation, find and kill you first. And let's be honest, Liir weren't half as annoying as masterfully played Hivers.
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May 21, 2012 15:02
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I thought the UE and Sophons were really powerful when I played as them, but I just played a game as the Cravers, and I'm finding that every race seems to be a bit overpowered in their own way. With the Cravers, I feel like their penalties are far too minor considering the boost you get. To begin with, games just don't seem to go on long enough for the 100 turn penalty to come into play on too many planets, but the biggest issue is, a 25% penalty isn't that bad. By the time most of your worlds are getting to that point, you'll have used your bonuses to build a ton of enhancements which can mostly overcome that issue. And if you expand properly, those systems will be irrelevant, I just conquered a 6 planet system, fully developed, and with that 25% bonus for 50 turns, I'm churning out dreadnaughts every 2-3 turns. If their whole gimmick is supposed to be consuming a planet so bad there's nothing left, it seems like after the 100 turns, instead of just having a 25% penalty to FIDS, the penalty either needs to be more extreme, or they need to lose max population on those planets as well, leaving them as empty husks. That way, you have a requirement to expand just to survive, not just to have super-planets.
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May 21, 2012 15:10
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Unormal posted:It's in your account options on http://endless-space.amplitude-studios.com/ I guess I need that code that I kept ignoring... which I can't seem to access through the steam website. I'll give it a shot when I get home. thanks!
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May 21, 2012 15:45
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oogs posted:I guess I need that code that I kept ignoring... which I can't seem to access through the steam website. I'll give it a shot when I get home. thanks! steam library -> view cd key. It probably doesn't work from the website though so.
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May 21, 2012 16:02
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Orv posted:And let's be honest, Liir weren't half as annoying as masterfully played Hivers. Turn 2: Deploy gate. Combat: Protect the gate. Turn 3+: Gate in asteroid-chucking max-tech Dreadnoughts all day every day 
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May 21, 2012 16:17
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Splicer posted:Turn 1: Arrive in system. Combat: Fly away from planet. Don't forget having an impenatrable space wall and being able to gate in doomfleets instantly to any of your colonies. Hivers are the ultimate turtlers. 
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May 21, 2012 16:32
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Alchenar posted:I've found that what matters is researching the weapon that is unlocked by whatever strategic resource you have access to, because early on that's what will make your ships the most powerful. I think it's more useful to be able to switch to another weapon type to take advantage of your enemy's defense at any point in the game. Wars don't wait for my permission sometimes and I like the flexibility. Also, some of the armor types are on the same research as weapon types. I was just commenting about how kinetics are really pretty awesome. They kill so fast.
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May 21, 2012 17:12
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How quickly are you finding your games really start progressing? I started out one game on newbie just to get a feel for it, and current around turn 55, nothing has happened at all. I have like 7 destroyers and I'm slowly getting colonies settled. Colonizer ships build but not very slowly. Am I playing extremely slowly or do certain settings just lead to slow starting games?
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May 21, 2012 17:13
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BitterAvatar posted:How quickly are you finding your games really start progressing? Around this turn I usually already have 5 systems colonized and some serious research going on. What you want to have is an Administrative hero at the start (at least one), indicated by the crops/industiry sign on their skills. Get Director 1 and then the skill that gives +25 Labor. This is a huge boost to early colonies, making them grow much, much quicker.
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May 21, 2012 17:30
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Splicer posted:Turn 1: Arrive in system. Combat: Fly away from planet. Well when I say masterfully, I mean this happening on everyone's planets at the same time. "Hey Bob, what've you been doing all game?" "Oh, you know, nothing much." *Next turn* "AH gently caress ME."x5
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May 21, 2012 17:33
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I have around 5 - 6 systems colonized, with between 2-4 planets in each system colonized. I have an administrative hero at level 4 or 5 and an admiral with my biggest fleet of 3 destroyers. I can colonize any planet except lava I think, and my research is currently working towards cruisers. I guess maybe I'm on the right path!
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May 21, 2012 17:34
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BitterAvatar posted:I have around 5 - 6 systems colonized, with between 2-4 planets in each system colonized. I have an administrative hero at level 4 or 5 and an admiral with my biggest fleet of 3 destroyers. It's a lot like any other TBS game. You just have to play enough to get your opening moves down to a science, and then it just ticks along smoothly from there. Until the neighboring deathfleet shows up, of course.
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May 21, 2012 17:36
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BitterAvatar posted:How quickly are you finding your games really start progressing? Start a game where you'll meet someone early on (like four empires, including you, on a small sectioned map like spiral-2) and you'll get a lot more action early on. My last game I was running 3 fleets of 4-7/7 and several 1-2 fleets doing a lot of ship trading with some aggressive (although I started it) Sophons by turn 60ish.
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May 21, 2012 17:39
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Orv posted:It's a lot like any other TBS game. You just have to play enough to get your opening moves down to a science, and then it just ticks along smoothly from there. Until the neighboring deathfleet shows up, of course. Do you learn quicker if you start a bunch of new games, play a few turns until you realize you hosed up somewhere, or is it a good idea to roll with all punches and continue playing even if you gimped your empire with a few bad decisions early on.
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May 21, 2012 17:40
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Al! posted:Do you learn quicker if you start a bunch of new games, play a few turns until you realize you hosed up somewhere, or is it a good idea to roll with all punches and continue playing even if you gimped your empire with a few bad decisions early on. That's not really something I've ever considered. Even when learning a new game of the genre, I just play until things are absolutely irretrievable, which I almost never decide they are. If you lose your homeworld in the opening 50 turns or things like that. Otherwise just roll with it, learn the whole tech tree, think about your starting moves as you make your later ones, and when you hit New Game, use all your newly accumulated knowledge to get your stuff done 5 turns faster or whatever. You'll get it eventually. Though having multiple playstyles because of race/tech always makes it more difficult.
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May 21, 2012 17:51
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Something really important that I failed to tinker with and now that I do so my play has greatly improved and the early game is way faster is lowering the tax rate so that all my colonies are at least happy. Playing on normal I almost always have all the colonies on ecstatic, at least as Horatio, giving all my colonies a significant FIDS boost (except for dust which will almost always go down except for break-even points where empire wide happiness jumps from happy to ecstatic) which is further compounded by the second happiness improvement you get.
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May 21, 2012 18:27
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By the way, unless you're into 300+ turn games, I very much recommend playing on small or medium with 4 or 5 empires. It forces conflict and some interesting fights without clicking "End Turn" 50 times before first contact. I just recently played a game as Cravers where I won by expansion victory. As soon as I sniffed the presence of United Empire ships in my vicinity, I immediately teched to Applied Casimir Effect for wormhole travel and steamrolled them with 9/9 -> 13/13 -> 17/17 fleets - of default "Defender" chassis chips. They just couldn't keep up with the level of production I was able to throw at them, despite me losing multiple full fleets in the process. I won around turn 150 or so after smashing the Horatio and Hissho nearby. Really, being able to travel via wormhole - in addition to unlocking another ship chassis and eventually warp drive - is SO important for early/mid game. Forget weapons and even colony improvements, if you get stuck behind a wormhole you're crippled.
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May 21, 2012 18:52
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Sardonik posted:There is currently an issue where using the steam overlay can sometimes force you into order queue mode because it's bound to the shift button. If you notice this happening, press the shift button alone to give orders to ships normally. THANK YOU! I bought the game, played it for hours and got crazy addicted, then the next days I was all aaugh why ships no move no more?  Though probably just as well because playing for only an hour after work each night would have most likely been impossible with a working game and got me fired or something.
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May 21, 2012 19:09
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a shameful boehner posted:By the way, unless you're into 300+ turn games, I very much recommend playing on small or medium with 4 or 5 empires. It forces conflict and some interesting fights without clicking "End Turn" 50 times before first contact. What is this 9/9 -> 13/13 ratio I keep seeing? Is it the maximum number of ships allowed in a fleet?
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May 21, 2012 19:38
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Asked a few pages ago, but no reply. How do wrenches work? If I have a fleet of 7 ships and one has a +20 "fleet HP/turn" wrench, does that heal every ship in the fleet, or just the one with the wrench?
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May 21, 2012 19:38
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I think those are for the fleet, every ship in the fleet will heal 20 hp/turn which is added up for all ships who have this.
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May 21, 2012 19:39
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BitterAvatar posted:What is this 9/9 -> 13/13 ratio I keep seeing? Is it the maximum number of ships allowed in a fleet? Yes. You have command points, and the ratio is "number of command points used"/"number of command points available for the fleet" . So a 9/9 fleet is a fleet with 9 out of 9 CP used. You start at 5, I've seen as high as 23 in my games, though I think you can go a little higher.
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May 21, 2012 19:41
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23 should be the highest, I had that much with Cravers and every fleet tech researched.
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May 21, 2012 19:42
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20 hp per turn isn't much at all when you realize the weakest base hp chassi (?) have a base 300 hp. It would probably be most beneficial to your military if you just kept building more ships and not worrying about that repairing poo poo. This is still in an alpha, tuning the various support modules to the power of stacking almost entirely offensive ships still needs to be done.
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May 21, 2012 21:35
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One thing that I've been wondering about while playing is how effective the different weapon systems are. I've seen some people talking about how stacking your ships with lots of kinetic is good, but honestly, it seems to be that way only if you're playing Hissho. I don't know if their 15% accuracy is broken, but it feels like they're just so accurate, even at long range. Regardless, my main point of contention is missiles. I was wondering what other people have found, as in my experience they're high risk, high reward, with the risk mostly weighing out. Risk: - They take 2/3 turns to actually fire, and if the other fleet is big enough, it can actually wipe out some of your ships before they get to fire. - Flak seems amazingly powerful compared to other defences. I don't really know how the point system works, but flak seem to have the highest anti-point? Reward: - They do lots of damage, and are effective at the beginning of the fight.
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May 21, 2012 21:52
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Khaba posted:One thing that I've been wondering about while playing is how effective the different weapon systems are. I've seen some people talking about how stacking your ships with lots of kinetic is good, but honestly, it seems to be that way only if you're playing Hissho. I don't know if their 15% accuracy is broken, but it feels like they're just so accurate, even at long range. One thing I've started doing is making fleets of small ships with only missiles, and sending them in the turn before a more expensive fleet arrives, or in the same turn but beforehand. They'll be wiped out by the enemy, because they have no defenses, but their missiles will usually damage or destroy the entire enemy fleet since they hit even after death, so I don't have to risk losing my big ships against the enemies main fleet.
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May 21, 2012 22:03
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Palleon posted:One thing I've started doing is making fleets of small ships with only missiles, and sending them in the turn before a more expensive fleet arrives, or in the same turn but beforehand. They'll be wiped out by the enemy, because they have no defenses, but their missiles will usually damage or destroy the entire enemy fleet since they hit even after death, so I don't have to risk losing my big ships against the enemies main fleet. This is pretty much all I use missles for, kinetics/lasers seem superior in non suicide fleets.
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May 21, 2012 22:11
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ShinsoBEAM! posted:This is pretty much all I use missles for, kinetics/lasers seem superior in non suicide fleets. Lasers seem far superior to kinetics unless the enemy happens to be tanking them. While kinetics can still do some damage at long range in large enough numbers, beams are far more damaging even at lower concentrations, and then are at their optimal range a stage earlier. If you use the card that gives you +100 armor per ship (it's an engineering card, I don't recall when it unlocks), you should be pretty much immune to any kind of kinetic damage at long range, and if you are focusing on beams, there won't be a whole lot of survivors to mid-range.
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May 21, 2012 22:15
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Palleon posted:Lasers seem far superior to kinetics unless the enemy happens to be tanking them. While kinetics can still do some damage at long range in large enough numbers, beams are far more damaging even at lower concentrations, and then are at their optimal range a stage earlier. If you use the card that gives you +100 armor per ship (it's an engineering card, I don't recall when it unlocks), you should be pretty much immune to any kind of kinetic damage at long range, and if you are focusing on beams, there won't be a whole lot of survivors to mid-range. I thought armor was generic to everything, I could be wrong but it seems dumb to not have it that way. But yeah I think I have to agree with getting more bang for my buck with lasers. Reflect is Kinetics Absorb is lasers Flak is Anti Missle
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May 21, 2012 22:20
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ShinsoBEAM! posted:I thought armor was generic to everything, I could be wrong but it seems dumb to not have it that way. But yeah I think I have to agree with getting more bang for my buck with lasers. I agree, I think you're right, but the point being that given how inaccurate and weak kinetics are at range anyway, that +100 armor seems to be enough (in most fleets) to completely negate any damage it can do. Beams and missiles still get through because they're far more effective at that range, but it seems to stop almost all kinetics cold. Maybe in the late game it won't be enough, but if you've gotten that far, you're probably capable of throwing up some kinetic-specific defenses too if you know your opponent is using them in large enough numbers to actually do damage.
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May 21, 2012 22:22
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It just occurred to me. Why isn't the thread subtitle "My God, it's full of YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH"? Or "My God, it's full of one liners." Something. As for beams vs kinetics, I definitely prefer the beams, for the reasons Palleon has already put forth. Being able to strike at optimal a full turn ahead is a huge asset against an enemy who typically doesn't field much Absorb tech.
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May 21, 2012 22:37
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Yeah Lasers need a bit of a nerf, most likely in the sense that Absorb defences should probably be buffed up a fair way to counter the fact that they are good in all 3 phases. The fact that Kinetics optimum phase gives the enemy effectively 2 free rounds of shooting at you means that to really be viable a) they should be loving powerful to make up for the last 2 rounds and b) there need to be correspondingly powerful tanking modules you can research so you can actually survive those rounds. All in all, modules need to do a lot more to allow you to customise your ships along certain tactics it's assumed you are going for. To repeat the above example, Kinetic heavy ships should be built like bricks so they can absorb punishment and then deliver it all back in one round. Maybe for missile heavy ships you'd instead get a maneuvering module to give a chance to increase the length of the long range phase for another round of shooting. That kind of thing.
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May 21, 2012 22:46
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Palleon posted:I agree, I think you're right, but the point being that given how inaccurate and weak kinetics are at range anyway, that +100 armor seems to be enough (in most fleets) to completely negate any damage it can do. Beams and missiles still get through because they're far more effective at that range, but it seems to stop almost all kinetics cold. Maybe in the late game it won't be enough, but if you've gotten that far, you're probably capable of throwing up some kinetic-specific defenses too if you know your opponent is using them in large enough numbers to actually do damage. I don't think I have ever seen close range combat everything dies at long range and just sometimes you hit mid range but the other side is already dead. I was saying earlier but barrier is basically why I max HP the computer doesn't seem to catch onto my strategy of mash barrier every single turn so I take zero damage every turn, unless they decide to counter engineering.
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May 21, 2012 22:47
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ShinsoBEAM! posted:I don't think I have ever seen close range combat everything dies at long range and just sometimes you hit mid range but the other side is already dead. I was saying earlier but barrier is basically why I max HP the computer doesn't seem to catch onto my strategy of mash barrier every single turn so I take zero damage every turn, unless they decide to counter engineering. Now that I think of it, the only times I've ever seen combat get to melee is in the early game against pirates. I normally stick missiles on my ships early on, so that if I do run into something, and die, at least I take them down with me. But once you get beams researched, yeah, I can't think of a single case where both sides survived mid-range.
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May 21, 2012 22:48
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All three weapon types are viable against the AI it seems, it doesn't look to be very reactive at all to type of weapons you use in your fleet.
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May 21, 2012 22:59
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I still think 'My God, it's full of Horatios' works the best. There's just something nigh-obscene about winning a game by completely saturating the galaxy with untold trillons the same dude over and over again. I can't wait for them to fully institute per-race heroes. My latest game (as Horatios) I got two Sophon admin / corporate heroes to start and at turn ~200 I have an entire academy full of level 20 versions and own more than half the galaxy. I feel like I should get a screen full of grinning Horatios when I check empire management, but instead it's a bunch of ugly alien dudes running the show. The only reason I haven't crushed everyone is that you need other races around to trade with, and I'm running 12 or so corporates so I still make a profit at 0 taxes from trade alone. I didn't even use a fleet commander this game! Nothing but cloned admins shuffled from new colony to new colony getting them up on their feet after 10 turns instead of 30. Too bad the second tier academy tech is so far up the tree. I tried to beeline for it but it's not viable to get it incredibly early, especially if you have a war on.
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May 21, 2012 23:05
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Palleon posted:If their whole gimmick is supposed to be consuming a planet so bad there's nothing left, it seems like after the 100 turns, instead of just having a 25% penalty to FIDS, the penalty either needs to be more extreme, or they need to lose max population on those planets as well, leaving them as empty husks. That way, you have a requirement to expand just to survive, not just to have super-planets. You still very much need to expand to 'survive', it is just exceptionally easy to win the game before being put in a situation where you can no longer expand but still need to compete with factions that don't have to.
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May 21, 2012 23:27
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Orv posted:It just occurred to me. Why isn't the thread subtitle "My God, it's full of YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH"? Or "My God, it's full of one liners." Something.
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May 21, 2012 23:30
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Pocket Billiards posted:All three weapon types are viable against the AI it seems, it doesn't look to be very reactive at all to type of weapons you use in your fleet. Whenever I've fought a proper war it's been a constant rock paper scissors back and forth as they swap weapons and armor so that I have to swap weapons and armor so they swap again until I research Cruisers and can just defend against all their available techs at once and use lasers (since they seem to be the best relative their own specialized armor) because I get too lazy to redo designs every dozen turns.
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May 21, 2012 23:37
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Splicer posted:...you have just completely changed my view of Horatio. I apologize for the hack job this is. 
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May 21, 2012 23:43
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