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GutBomb posted:Mine was 9:53 (my slowest was a 10:52 but i spun a couple times and rolled once on that lap) but I'm consistently slow. I think someone got a 9:18. I could really use some help to find out what I'm doing wrong. I'm mostly just winging it when I drive in this game, I've never really learned how to properly drive fast, when to downshift on a turn, what gear to downshift to, etc... but I'd love to get faster. Yeah I did a 9:18... Basically if you're in 3rd or higher, brake in a straight line, ease off it and get slowly on the gas (VERY delicately) as you enter the turn, and it sort of drives like a normal car. Do anything different, and it tries to kill you. Like when I bounced off the inner curb of the Karousel (or whatever. German is dumb.) and rolled it as the car slid up the banking. Then, as I was flipping back over, Boaz came in and tried to copy me. He failed though, only bounced off the passenger side door and landed back on all 4.
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May 31, 2012 19:56
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jonathan posted:
That was me
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May 31, 2012 19:57
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silverbullitt850 posted:Yeah I did a 9:18... Basically if you're in 3rd or higher, brake in a straight line, ease off it and get slowly on the gas (VERY delicately) as you enter the turn, and it sort of drives like a normal car. Do anything different, and it tries to kill you. I've been braking until halfway through the turn, then downshifting 1 gear (unless I'm already in 2nd) if it's not a severe angle or 2 gears (unless 2 gears would take me to first, then i only do 1) if it is a severe angle and getting back on the gas. Most of the time i stay in control, but very occasionally i lose the back and get spun around after hitting the grass. I knew I was doing it wrong, just didn't really know what to do right. I don't drive fast in real life unless I'm on the freeway and there aren't a lot of turns there. And my car's an automatic. I also don't floor it in real life so my real life driving techniques don't really translate over to the game at all. Racing with these techniques works fine against the AI even in professional difficulty, which deceptively makes me think that I'm doing it right, but then I get online and I'm so much slower than everyone else. It's not discouraging, I don't really mind coming in last all the time, I'm having fun, but still, it would be nice to know how to do it right. GutBomb fucked around with this message at 21:09 on May 31, 2012 |
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May 31, 2012 21:05
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GutBomb posted:I've been braking until halfway through the turn, then downshifting 1 gear (unless I'm already in 2nd) if it's not a severe angle or 2 gears (unless 2 gears would take me to first, then i only do 1) if it is a severe angle and getting back on the gas. Most of the time i stay in control, but very occasionally i lose the back and get spun around after hitting the grass. I knew I was doing it wrong, just didn't really know what to do right. This is a good thing for anyone to know and sometimes I feel like throwing down a wall of text in case any newbies are reading. Do some research on real-world driving technique. Focus on racing line, brakes, and gas. In the real world there's a whole process of rev matching that needs to happen to drive a race car smoothly. Forza doesn't care about stress damage to anything so that goes out the window. Bottom line: Downshifting upsets the car, and that's bad. Standard entry is to bleed all your speed and gears in a straight line. Once you're down to entry speed, nose in, aim for the apex, accelerate out. You shouldn't be coming off the power at all once you're accelerating out. If you messed up and need to drop a gear, do not shift in the middle of the turn if you can possibly help it. Time your downshift so that the little dump of power happens at the moment you return to acceleration. You might still upset the car and have trouble coming up to speed, but you won't fly off the track. You can bleed some gears and speed during the turn-in (trail braking), if you've gotten good enough to know when and where the car can handle it (and it's easier in FWD). But practicing bleeding it all off before the turn teaches you the valuable racing skill of low entry speeds. This is both the most valuable and hardest to master skill in the book. You'll seem like a complete grandmother coming to a standstill before the turn-in, but you're back on the power half a mile earlier. Sidenote regarding horsepower: With low-power cars you actually want to save a lot of braking and shifting for the turns because you're trying to conserve forward momentum above all. The more power you have, the less momentum tends to matter, because it's all a question of applying throttle as early as possible. Only once you've mastered getting on the throttle early can you match it back up to conserving momentum, and that's when you're four-wheel-drifting trying to set a qualifying time.
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May 31, 2012 23:12
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GutBomb posted:I've been braking until halfway through the turn, then downshifting 1 gear (unless I'm already in 2nd) if it's not a severe angle or 2 gears (unless 2 gears would take me to first, then i only do 1) if it is a severe angle and getting back on the gas. Most of the time i stay in control, but very occasionally i lose the back and get spun around after hitting the grass. I knew I was doing it wrong, just didn't really know what to do right. The line through a turn that allows you to get onto the throttle the earliest is the quickest way if the turn exits to a straight. In a series of connected turns, the line that allows you to get onto the throttle on the last turn is the quickest, even if you have to take the non-ideal line through the earlier turns. If you're not on the brakes hard, like maximum braking, and then immediately on the throttle, you're leaving time on the table. There is no situation where you should just be coasting except for a decreasing radius turn.
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May 31, 2012 23:19
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[quote="TannhauserGate" post="404168487"] Downshifting upsets the car, and that's bad mmkay?
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May 31, 2012 23:54
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TannhauserGate posted:Sidenote regarding horsepower: With low-power cars you actually want to save a lot of braking and shifting for the turns because you're trying to conserve forward momentum above all. The more power you have, the less momentum tends to matter, because it's all a question of applying throttle as early as possible. Only once you've mastered getting on the throttle early can you match it back up to conserving momentum, and that's when you're four-wheel-drifting trying to set a qualifying time. And the lower your HP, the less you want to be shifting. I stuck that Pinto in 3rd and kept it there, occasionally you'll have to drop to high 2nd and occasionally you get into 4th for long straights. For the most part slower cars have slower gearboxes, and less powerband outside of one or two main gears - so changing gears a lot just reduces Time You Could Be Using The Throttle To Maintain Momentum. And Momentum is the key to driving slow cars quickly. Even when I'm on the brakes and downshifting, I'm almost always giving some throttle (10-15%) in lower class cars as well. A) It approximates revmatches, and B) Brakes in those cars are really just for dipping the front end so you can turn, a quick stab is usually all you need 100 yards before the turn just to get the front tires to hook up. Keeping your foot in it also keeps you from losing forward trajectory as well, and once you figure out the exact level before tire spin occurs, you can use the throttle to save a slightly iffy cornering angle of attack by simply Motorin' On Down the Road.
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Jun 1, 2012 00:26
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This is how you don't overtake. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dTtLXP1Nu0
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Jun 1, 2012 00:49
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Cojawfee posted:This is how you don't overtake. TannhauserGate posted:Bottom line: Downshifting upsets the car, and that's bad.
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Jun 1, 2012 01:47
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I find that heel-toe downshifting is the best way to keep the balance of the car comfortable when cornering and downshifting.
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Jun 1, 2012 02:07
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Cojawfee posted:This is how you don't overtake. One of my favorite glitches is lag spikes glitching cars through other cars without ghosting them, here's one I posted way early in the thread https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncJui49hd4E As an added bonus as you may have noticed we were racing with damage it....it wasn't a good race to be me.
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Jun 1, 2012 02:29
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General Probe posted:One of my favorite glitches is lag spikes glitching cars through other cars without ghosting them, here's one I posted way early in the thread 
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Jun 1, 2012 04:06
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There is a chance the BMW 507 and VW Karman Ghia will be in next weeks car pack. The Toyota Celica ST185 GT4 is a confirmed car.
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Jun 1, 2012 14:34
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I said come in! posted:There is a chance the BMW 507 and VW Karman Ghia will be in next weeks car pack. The Toyota Celica ST185 GT4 is a confirmed car.  Ghia ain't a beetle but I ain't complaining, vintage VW is still vintage VW.
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Jun 1, 2012 14:41
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Sure would like a 4 door Rubicon and a notchback version of the fox mustang. Both would be rather easy to modify from existing vehicle mesh.
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Jun 1, 2012 14:47
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LiquidRain posted:Oh my god that is hilarious. Actually that's perfect.  As you gain confidence you will find you can save just a bit of braking and shifting for the turn, but until you master entry speeds, this is what to do.
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Jun 1, 2012 16:25
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jonathan posted:Sure would like a 4 door Rubicon and a notchback version of the fox mustang. Both would be rather easy to modify from existing vehicle mesh. And I'd like the 03 SRT-4 they had in F3. Let's just file that under "Cars We Drive IRL and Want Video Game Versions Of But Will Never Happen"
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Jun 1, 2012 16:33
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jonathan posted:a notchback version of the fox mustang. Just drive a crappy 80s econobox, it looks the same.
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Jun 1, 2012 16:56
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I want and Ugly Cars pack for some reason. I want to be able to race Azteks against FJ Cruisers
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Jun 1, 2012 16:57
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Mac Tonight posted:I want and Ugly Cars pack for some reason. I want to be able to race Azteks against FJ Cruisers Fiat Multipla and SsangYong Rodius would just be the end-all of this one.
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Jun 1, 2012 17:02
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I want all the bad guy cars from Cars 2. We've already got a Pacer, now let's have a Gremlin and Yugo.
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Jun 1, 2012 17:04
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Falken posted:I want all the bad guy cars from Cars 2. We've already got a Pacer, now let's have a Gremlin and Yugo. I'd kill for a gremlin in this game, especially if I could upgrade it to R3
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Jun 1, 2012 17:07
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I said come in! posted:BMW 507 This is all I saw.
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Jun 1, 2012 17:08
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LiquidRain posted:I'm a scrub. I drive manual w/o clutch. (paddle shifters) What I do is what you say for standard entry, except I'm downshifting while I'm still braking since I have to move through gears sequentially and want to be in the right gear on the way out. Since I don't have a gearbox, I feel like I'm not really left with any alternative. Do you have a fanatec CSR or CSR Elite wheel? If so you can get the latest firmware here which has a new autoclutch feature for the paddles so when you shift it simultaneously pushes the clutch in for slightly faster shifting when using the paddles. If you hold in the paddle it's like holding in the clutch. You'll switch from "manual" to "manual w/clutch" in the game settings and enable ACL in the in-wheel settings.
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Jun 1, 2012 17:09
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captainOrbital posted:This is all I saw. These are the the confirmed cars so far apparently; http://www.forzamotorsport.fr/news/des-legendes-de-automobile-pour-le-meguiar-car-pack-96518.html Also not pictured is a RUF Yellow bird. I'll be very happy if the BMW 507 makes it in.
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Jun 1, 2012 17:13
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LiquidRain posted:I'm a scrub. I drive manual w/o clutch. (paddle shifters) What I do is what you say for standard entry, except I'm downshifting while I'm still braking since I have to move through gears sequentially and want to be in the right gear on the way out. Since I don't have a gearbox, I feel like I'm not really left with any alternative. I'm not even doing manual transmission yet... I'm only on hard mode. (I've only had the game for a couple days though, and I'm pretty new to non-Kart racers.) Easy and medium are a little too drat easy - the game practically plays itself. I noticed on hard mode, you really gotta listen to the racing line for curves. If you don't break when it tells you to, you're going to go headfirst into a wall.
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Jun 1, 2012 17:22
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Oh my god, Sauber C9? Really Turn 10? Can I have your babies.  Gammatron 64 posted:I noticed on hard mode, you really gotta listen to the racing line for curves. If you don't break when it tells you to, you're going to go headfirst into a wall. (Or, just drive around a circuit slowly and pick up speed. That's how it's done). You can't learn a circuit by welding your foot to the floor and just going for it. e: I turned off the racing line 1 lap into a downhill run of Kaido in Forza Motorsport 1. 
Falken fucked around with this message at 17:31 on Jun 1, 2012 |
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Jun 1, 2012 17:27
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^^^^^^ Depends on the track, honestly. For half the Nurburgring you can safely ignore the line, for Laguna Seca the line's pretty accurate save for the fast left-hander before the Rahal Straight.Gammatron 64 posted:I'm not even doing manual transmission yet... I'm only on hard mode. (I've only had the game for a couple days though, and I'm pretty new to non-Kart racers.) Easy and medium are a little too drat easy - the game practically plays itself.  Most folks you'll be playing with here have been playing for years or are very acclimated to simulation racers. For what it's worth, I've been playing Forza since 3 came out about 2-2.5 years ago and I still play with the racing line on braking only most of the time. (though everyone's different)
LiquidRain fucked around with this message at 17:32 on Jun 1, 2012 |
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Jun 1, 2012 17:30
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Falken posted:Oh my god, Sauber C9? Really Turn 10? Can I have your babies. It's like they heard my plea's for more Group C cars (to be fair, lots of people were begging for these) and delivered in spectacular fashion.
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Jun 1, 2012 17:31
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I'm trying to figure out tuning front wheel drive cars and they're pretty fun to race when you get them balanced right. It's fun being able to precisely modulate your oversteer through sweeping turns just by letting up on the throttle a bit, and if you start to slide out of control you can point your car in the right direction and floor it and they'll instantly straighten out again. I don't totally understand how the limited slip differential works on them though, I'm pretty sure the description in Forza is wrong.
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Jun 1, 2012 17:52
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IIRC the differentials in Forza are some weird type of differential that nobody actually uses.
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Jun 1, 2012 18:26
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The racing and braking lines are not very useful, they're not the fastest lines, they're not the lines anyone uses online, so all they do is train you to know the track wrong. And then you crash into people who are driving the track based on knowledge of the corners. Like Falken said, half the time the line is flashing bright red on a 2 mile straight with a 5 degree kink. If they're that inaccurate on 'easy' calls, how likely are they going to be good on more sophisticated corners? Just drive a slower car until you learn the circuit, problem solved.
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Jun 1, 2012 18:44
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Cowwan posted:IIRC the differentials in Forza are some weird type of differential that nobody actually uses. There's been explanation's in this thread, I just forgot where, about how it works. Basically the way I understand it is that it's not very realistic. A lot of what Forza 4 does is like a one size fits all thing for every car.
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Jun 1, 2012 18:46
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I said come in! posted:There's been explanation's in this thread, I just forgot where, about how it works. Basically the way I understand it is that it's not very realistic. A lot of what Forza 4 does is like a one size fits all thing for every car. I hadn't looked at the differentials before, but I noticed some of that from poking around in the game's database, like all of the cars seem to use the same generic suspension model, with a slight exception for cars with live axles. Maybe they'll improve some of that in the next Forza now that they have such a nice tire model. I want to experience the terror of high speed racing with a legit swing axle model.
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Jun 1, 2012 18:52
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Forza is still a simulation for sure, and there are some things it does really well, that are true to real life. While other things not so much. Basically the same deal as all racing sims out there.
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Jun 1, 2012 18:58
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I think Dan (or someone at T10) mentioned at one point that their secret sauce is getting a load of test data and specs from manufacturers on their cars, and then plugging it into a car physics modeler, and bam there's your Forza car. It is literally one-size-fits-all physics modeling on the cars. The looks of the cars are just that: looks. I just want my open wheeled cars. 
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Jun 1, 2012 20:37
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After dumping endless hours into Forza 2 and 3, moving out on my own and not having a 360 when the 4th was released, to finally getting one again, is it worthwhile to buy the game, drop a fortune on the DLC, or is there an ultimate edition on down the line like there was with the previous two?
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Jun 1, 2012 20:49
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LiquidRain posted:I think Dan (or someone at T10) mentioned at one point that their secret sauce is getting a load of test data and specs from manufacturers on their cars, and then plugging it into a car physics modeler, and bam there's your Forza car. It is literally one-size-fits-all physics modeling on the cars. The looks of the cars are just that: looks. That's not true at all, as two cars with an identical PI rating will handle completely differently. Power, aero, weight, balance and torque curves all have a huge effect. Yes they have a blender that they throw numbers into to generate averages, but I think that's used on performance upgrades more than the base cars.
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Jun 1, 2012 20:59
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metallicaeg posted:After dumping endless hours into Forza 2 and 3, moving out on my own and not having a 360 when the 4th was released, to finally getting one again, is it worthwhile to buy the game, drop a fortune on the DLC, or is there an ultimate edition on down the line like there was with the previous two? No ultimate edition is expected so far. How much did you like the DLC in Forza 2 and 3? More importantly how big of a fan of cars are you? If you get a raging boner over car porn, then yeah, buy the season pass and everything else included on the market place.
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Jun 1, 2012 21:12
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metallicaeg posted:After dumping endless hours into Forza 2 and 3, moving out on my own and not having a 360 when the 4th was released, to finally getting one again, is it worthwhile to buy the game, drop a fortune on the DLC, or is there an ultimate edition on down the line like there was with the previous two? It's totally worth it, because F4 owns, but there probably will be some kind of edition that includes most or all of the DLC somewhere down the road. That's just idle speculation, but they did the same thing with 3, so... Honestly I haven't bothered with much of the DLC. I bought a couple of cars a la carte, then the Top Gear pack and the Porsche pack, but there's there's so much stuff included in the base game already that I don't really care.
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Jun 1, 2012 21:13
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