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Drugs! From left to right:
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Jul 21, 2012 02:34
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Okay, now I'm excited about this game. I...don't really know what that says about me. I mean, I was interested enough to follow the thread before, but now I must play, there is no other option. Apparently a realistic post-apocalyptic wound treatment sim is everything I never knew I wanted and more. That poor little test character though, getting all torn up in the name of science. 
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Jul 21, 2012 03:01
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I hope ODing and alcohol poisoning get added as new possible ways to kill yourself.
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Jul 21, 2012 03:59
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Thompsons posted:I hope ODing and alcohol poisoning get added as new possible ways to kill yourself. I imagine they would be. At the very least drinking too much would probably cause things like vomiting (i.e. nutrition loss, ruining your hidden status, etc.), dizziness (not really sure how this would factor in gameplay-wise outside of combat), and the other stuff usually associated with drinking too much. I think it would be cool if you could end up getting addictions to various drugs too, a-la the Fallout games. It wouldn't be too hard to model I'd think - instead of just a random "You got addicted!" roll which is kind of silly, there could be an internal variable tracking your tolerance buildup to various chemicals - higher tolerance means less impact from smaller quantities of the drug, and longer/more severe withdrawl when you're sober as a result of having to take greater quantities to achieve the effect you want. Addiction behaviour would just develop naturally from that, forcing the player to keep themselves dosed to avoid withdrawl, or find a spot to hole up to fight through it and then stay clean for a while to let their tolerance drop back down.
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Jul 21, 2012 05:00
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Zoe posted:That poor little test character though, getting all torn up in the name of science. That's nothing. The new test character is barely alive.  Poor guy. Regarding the ODing/drug tolerance, isn't that system currently already implemented to a degree with sugar/caffeine? I haven't tried it since the very first builds so I'm not too familiar with it but too much soda and gummi bears used to make you addicted to sugar/caffeine I think? Perhaps someone who has tried it recently can comment? Back to the wound update: quote:This is the set of wound locations I'm going to try for now. It's not the most comprehensive, but it covers most of the body. Most wounds can be either bruised, cut, or both. The elbow and knee areas have wounds that can be bruised or fractured, but not cut, representing a fracture in that limb somewhere (not necessarily the elbow or knee). Any wound that is bandaged with clean rags causes them to become dirty within a day or so, requiring new, clean bandages or else risk of increased infection. Splints may break down over time, but shouldn't get infected.
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Jul 24, 2012 03:28
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Small news update was posted about how the new wound system means significant internal changes.quote:[...]could mean drastically different gameplay and balancing. On the plus side, the simulation of a living body is better represented, with the various systems interacting now more than ever. One good example is if the player wants to heal faster, their best served by holing up someplace, and staying warm, well-hydrated, and well-fed while they rest. I like how with every patch it's shifting towards "survival simulator". It feels like it's trying to recreate that atmosphere at the beginning of the Stalker games before you become a "one-man army". Which is great.
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Jul 25, 2012 07:23
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Xik posted:Small news update was posted about how the new wound system means significant internal changes. Yessss. I've been messing about with a combat-heavy build (Melee, Strong, Tough, Medic) and I have to say the new combat system is fun. My only quibble is that there's little incentive to play defensively - going balls-for-the-wall with tackling and attacking is generally the way to go. One little touch I'd appreciate would be a screen at the conclusion of combat showing your enemy's corpse - I feel that would add a little bit of "Oh god, what have I done" when you've literally kicked another human to death for his lighter and gelli bears. After a rainy night spent fending off multiple bandit and dogman attacks while my starving character desperately searched for food and water I am hooked. Myoclonic Jerk fucked around with this message at 16:40 on Jul 27, 2012 |
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Jul 27, 2012 16:35
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The new combat system is a lot of fun. There was a post earlier which I didn't mention but will bring it up now.quote:Since the new wound system kills via things like blood loss or septic shock, rather than simple hit point drain, the actual death tends to happen during game turn advancing, rather than immediately from damage. I had to do some reworking of the turn structure to cancel combat correctly if a creature dies. quote:In this new system, you could literally tear a creature apart, but no actual "damage" is being done. Pain is being inflicted, and wounds are opening with potentially fatal blood loss rates. The creature simply may bleed out before the next combat turn, if the wounds are severe enough. Or they'll collapse from pain-induced shock. I think this will help balance the combat a bit more because if you go all "balls-for-the-wall" like you suggest, even if you win the fight you may end the battle with life threatening injuries. So it's leaning back towards combat being more dangerous and will probably make you reconsider going into combat/be overly aggressive unless you have scrounged up enough medical items to take care of yourself afterwards.
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Jul 27, 2012 16:59
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Some more information was posted about the direction of the new wound system. It seems it was a little too harsh in an unbelievable/unrealistic way.quote:I had to dial pain effects down quite a bit because a handful of slight wounds were causing creatures to go into shock. Realistically, it seems more like creatures should be in pretty dire straits before falling unconscious from pain. quote:Bleeding was a similar story. Just a few cuts, and creatures were bleeding out within 2-3 battle turns. It seems pretty unrealistic that a creature with a couple superficial cuts would bleed to death in the time it takes to swing a few punches. quote:The goal is for bleeding to be an immediate concern after battle, not "right this second, as the dogman is facing me." Also, NEO got some pretty positive press coverage from Indie Game Magzine. On another note, I usually don't post stuff here from BBG's personal dev blog as it's mostly targeted towards other indie game devs and not players but I think this is worth mentioning. He was approached by Desura saying they would be interested in carrying NEO, possibly as part of their Alphafunding thing. He also talks about his desire to ship NEO as a DRM-free standalone client, but obviously needs to sort out how to do it. Exciting times for Neo Scavenger and Blue Bottle.
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Jul 31, 2012 06:04
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There has been what looks like a relatively large update to the wound system. I'll try and summarize in as few words as possible:
An example battle  As you can see in the battle log, the player just smacked the dogman over the head with a crowbar and is now suffering from "Severe Pain".  To show off the updated conditions screen, you can see the player is also in pretty rough shape. He is "Bleeding", has "Minor Pain" and is "Weary". The rag-doll also shows where the player is sore and bleeding. You may also notice the addition of the little arrows on the status bars. A welcome addition IMO and is probably going to be crucial for trying to manage these new conditions.
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Aug 1, 2012 06:28
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Wow, this game looks awesome. How much is it again? (Didn't see this in the OP) Might have to give it some thought after payday. I suddenly want to have to pop a broken Humerus back into place and lash it together using a splint made out of a wrench and large serving spoon. Then drink some whiskey to dull the pain and get back to looting the dead raider who just attacked me. 
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Aug 1, 2012 06:59
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Galaga Galaxian posted:Wow, this game looks awesome. How much is it again? (Didn't see this in the OP) Might have to give it some thought after payday. Oh wow, you're right. After all this time I can't believe I didn't have that in the OP. I updated it to include the pricing information. You can get access to the beta, which also acts as a pre-order for the full game for  .There are other editions if you want to support the development more if you are so inclined. 
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Aug 1, 2012 07:25
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"The Wasteland Just Got a Whole Lot Deadlier" is the heading for the latest news post. It is definitely very apt. New conditions:
quote:Each of the above is bad enough, but many work in concert, occurring as wounds escalate. For example, moderate and severe wounds in the chest may cause fractured ribs, coughing blood, and an increased chance of pneumonia. Severe trauma to the upper chest may cause cardiac arrest (heart is destroyed by a cut or smash of severe proportions). Pulmonary bleeding happens when the lower chest is severely damaged enough. Brain trauma occurs when the head has been hit hard enough or often enough. As you would imagine, you don't want this poo poo happening to you. quote:Most of the above are untreatable, and if not fatal, must simply be waited out via resting and healing. Pneumonia can be treated by antibiotics and medical kits, and the kit will also help with coughing blood. If that wasn't deadly enough for you, check out this gem: quote:Attacks were taking a long time to reach some of the above thresholds, so I decided to double all weapon damages, and triple damages caused to unconscious targets. Wow, the pacing was a lot more fun. Oh God. An example batte:  The player has at the looter with a crowbar for a while, then gets a hit to the looters chest:  The looter starts coughing up blood and then dies to "acute bleeding in the lungs". This game 
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Aug 2, 2012 05:31
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 New beta build v0.943b
quote:Heads up: when I loaded the new copy of the game, it took quite a while the first time. Hung at 35% for close to a minute. Give it some time, and if that doesn't help, try force-reloading the page (shift+F5 or ctrl+F5 on most browsers).
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Aug 3, 2012 07:03
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Word to the wise: if you get a cut anywhere, whether it's just from combat or searching a collapsed building, fuckin wrap it with rags like asap. I got a single gash and figured "oh it shouldn't be too bad" only to nearly bleed out over the course of several days until I wrapped a dirty bandage over it. Edit: Wow blood supply takes like fuckin forever to regenerate, even with clean bandages and sleeping with a nice comfy campsite. PPS: Am I missing something with wound treatmeant? Like to treat a cut do I have to put more than just a bandage on, because it feels like these cuts just refuse to go away. Thompsons fucked around with this message at 12:53 on Aug 3, 2012 |
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Aug 3, 2012 09:18
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I've been following the thread for a while and with all this wound system business I decided to drop on it today. I'm just getting the hang of it but it seems neat as hell. Managed to kill a looter with a meat cleaver then promptly died of blood loss, but not before getting a gross wound message screenshot:
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Aug 3, 2012 13:04
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Those drat looters stop me from looting stuff! 
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Aug 3, 2012 13:18
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Personally I'm quite partial to the crowbar, because nothing says "beatdown" like a crowbar beatdown
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Aug 3, 2012 13:18
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All right I think I've held out long enough, it's payday so I'm definitely getting this as soon as I get home tonight.
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Aug 3, 2012 13:52
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Just had a strange bug where I couldn't end my turn, it would just do the hour glass and not give me more moves. The only thing I could do was sleep, so I did that and I just kept sleeping. I slept through multiple day and night cycles until I died of dehydration.
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Aug 3, 2012 14:54
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Xik posted:Just had a strange bug where I couldn't end my turn, it would just do the hour glass and not give me more moves. The only thing I could do was sleep, so I did that and I just kept sleeping. I slept through multiple day and night cycles until I died of dehydration. I've encountered that once or twice in the past. The trick seems to be escaping to the game menu, saving/quitting, and loading the game again. It usually takes a moment for the exit to register, but it works.
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Aug 3, 2012 15:40
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Either the dehydration needs to be slowed or more water spawned. I'm spending every waking moment desperately not trying to die of thirst. It's constantly raining for gently caress's sake, where are the rivers and streams?
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Aug 3, 2012 16:03
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If you take botany you can use it to help scavenge stuff from forests, which combined with nightvision goggles makes it super-easy to get a bunch of water and mushrooms.
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Aug 3, 2012 16:06
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The new wound system is very satisfying. Especially when you can punch a looter so hard they start coughing blood. 
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Aug 3, 2012 16:06
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Angry Diplomat posted:I've encountered that once or twice in the past. The trick seems to be escaping to the game menu, saving/quitting, and loading the game again. It usually takes a moment for the exit to register, but it works. Thanks, wish I had thought of doing that. GruntyThrst posted:Either the dehydration needs to be slowed or more water spawned. I'm spending every waking moment desperately not trying to die of thirst. It's constantly raining for gently caress's sake, where are the rivers and streams? Dehydration never becomes a problem for me (unless it bugs out  ), are you making sure you are only drinking purified water and not the normal grubby crap? Also, if you are really having trouble take the "Metabolism" perk at the beginning, you'll require less food and water.
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Aug 3, 2012 17:01
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Bet you guys don't know how to craft rivers and trees into raw materials.   (I think I broke it  )Anyways that one game must have been hosed, been having much better luck with water in subsequent games. Also the save is buggy, looks like whatever conditions you have when you save are permanent, so if you save while overburdened for instance, you can never move again. For real fun, save while bleeding heavily and see how long you can survive!
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Aug 4, 2012 03:34
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I actually only just discovered that; sometimes you'll come across a receipt that tells you how to loot forest/marsh/river tiles, which means a guaranteed source of water and branches/twigs without having to scavenge anything. Just being able to find water without having to risk getting ganked by looters is a godsend. edit: yeah as it turns out you can loot them without needing the recipe, the receipts just make you more aware of them Thompsons fucked around with this message at 06:57 on Aug 4, 2012 |
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Aug 4, 2012 05:45
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Turns out that crafting those hexes into materials is a new feature. New Beta Build v0.944b  quote:From left to right, they are trees, river, marsh, and lake. When you find a hex with one or more of these terrain resources, you can use it to get the corresponding resource. Trees give branches and twigs, and the watering holes give water. Some bug fixes too:
Also, BBG wrote up a post in reply to someone mentioning there was too much combat now. SO if you are looking for tips to avoid it, give it a read.
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Aug 4, 2012 06:37
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So how big is the game world in this game's current state? It's hard to tell in the screenshots. I love the idea of this game and will probably be jumping in sooner or later.
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Aug 4, 2012 15:11
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Overwined posted:So how big is the game world in this game's current state? It's hard to tell in the screenshots. I love the idea of this game and will probably be jumping in sooner or later. It's pretty darn big, but that isn't really all that significant since one forest/ruined city/abandoned village is more or less the same as another. There's really no reason to venture incredibly far afield; you can pretty much just meander around in between the handful of storyline-related sites that are already in the game, and still experience everything that's currently implemented. That said, "everything that's currently implemented" is quite cool and in-depth, and the storyline sites are spaced far enough apart to give you a really good wasteland survival/difficult journey kind of feel.
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Aug 4, 2012 15:26
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Another small build:
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Aug 4, 2012 21:47
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Angry Diplomat posted:It's pretty darn big, but that isn't really all that significant since one forest/ruined city/abandoned village is more or less the same as another. There's really no reason to venture incredibly far afield; you can pretty much just meander around in between the handful of storyline-related sites that are already in the game, and still experience everything that's currently implemented. That said, "everything that's currently implemented" is quite cool and in-depth, and the storyline sites are spaced far enough apart to give you a really good wasteland survival/difficult journey kind of feel. The layout of the hexes themselves is randomly generated anyway, save for a few key areas, so the world "size" is effectively infinite since starting a new game gives you entirely new tiles. I love the new combat and wound system, it's exactly the kind of thing I was hoping for, and such an improvement over the old damage model. One thing the conditions screen could use is tooltips when you mouse over injuries to make it a bit clearer what you're looking at (it's not too difficult to read right now but it seems like something that would be fairly simple to implement). Also there seems to be a weird bug in combat where if you attack an unconscious creature, sometimes time won't advance (so you just keep clicking confirm over and over and it does the "Player attacks creature... and hits! Creature: zzz" without actually causing anything to happen). You can still get things to happen if you choose an action besides attacking or just do nothing at all.
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Aug 4, 2012 21:50
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BBG, this game is amazing, and gets even better as you keep working on it. Best beta purchase I've made in a while. Is it just me, or is Punch far, FAR more effective at killing than a crowbar? Also, I can't really see a difference between melee and no melee; both result in PLAYER ATTACKS... AND MISSES! x5142 followed by a PLAYER ATTACKS... AND SMACKS THE LOOTER'S LEFT ARM! LOOTER RETREATS. Then I repeat this forever. Yet, with punches, I seem to kill faster, with a mere 2500 misses between hits. Hyperbole, but really, combat is a string of misses for me, every game. I've gotten guns more often though, and even without ranged they seem to be reliable to hit people. In general, do people move towards Hatter/the dome or just explore off the bat or what? Also, wow, tackling and then kicking while they're down works great. I didn't have kick before, weird. Tempora Mutantur fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Aug 5, 2012 |
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Aug 4, 2012 22:47
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S.T.C.A. posted:Is it just me, or is Punch far, FAR more effective at killing than a crowbar? Also, I can't really see a difference between melee and no melee; both result in PLAYER ATTACKS... AND MISSES! x5142 followed by a PLAYER ATTACKS... AND SMACKS THE LOOTER'S LEFT ARM! LOOTER RETREATS. Then I repeat this forever. Yet, with punches, I seem to kill faster, with a mere 2500 misses between hits. I haven't had any problems like that with the melee, have you tried tackling them to the ground?
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Aug 4, 2012 23:22
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Yeah I tend not to have too much trouble hitting enemies. The last time I took the melee skill I actually did really well just using basic stuff like a cooking pot or wrench, actually having several fights where I seriously injured the enemy without taking any hits myself. As for what I like to do in the beginning, usually it's attempting to secure basics supplies like the stuff needed to make a campfire and purify water, possibly a decent weapon (though that comes down more to luck than anything else), before heading off to the glow. What are some things that people would like to see in the game in the more distant future? One thing I've been thinking about is how the start screen has "Basic Human" listed for the first four skill slots, which got me thinking about mutations from games like ADOM or Crawl, or Caves of Qud. I don't think the game should have race selection or anything, but maybe there could be the possibility of picking up mutations during play (which could be either beneficial or harmful, but are totally random) by being exposed to radiation or something. It would be a bit of a fine line because you'd need to get enough exposure to radiation to get dosed but not enough that you'd just die from it (maybe chronic exposure would be more likely to mutate you than sudden intense exposure). If you wanted to avoid mutating you could wear appropriate hazmat suits when entering highly contaminated areas, and if you are exposed to quickly flush your system with various anti-radiation drugs (which would probably have a bunch of temporary nasty side effects while they're working, like vomiting or increased food/water consumption, since purging your system is not a gentle process). Basically, the general idea would be that mutations, once acquired, would be like extra skills/disabilities that couldn't be acquired any other way, and like existing skills might even open up unique interactions with things depending on their effect. Some other minor ideas I've had: -Medkits should, instead of just being basic consumable items, be containers that spawn decently stocked with various useful medical supplies like clean bandages, different kinds of pills, etc. The current nanokit effect could still exist in the form of an autoinjector (which would also have a chance of spawning in a new medkit). The idea would be that finding a medkit would give you a nice supply base for dealing with sickness/injuries, but they'd also be pretty rare so you wouldn't be able to rely on them for the whole game. -It's kind of silly, but it would be awesome/hilarious if you could amputate your own limbs if they get badly infected, a-la Robinson's Requiem. Obviously this would be a big deal and give you a pretty significant penalty (maybe one that could be slightly compensated for if you had say, crutches, which you could equip as a "vehicle" if you were short a leg), but it's just one of those things that would make the game more interesting by virtue of being available, even if in practice nobody would ever use it. The Cheshire Cat fucked around with this message at 03:37 on Aug 5, 2012 |
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Aug 5, 2012 00:51
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I hate to double post but my last post was a while ago so I don't want to just keep tacking on more edits. I just ran into a rather amusing bug: I can only assume it's a bug, since I was only mildly injured at worst (a few bruises and cuts, the latter of which were bandaged with clean rags), and hadn't eaten/drank anything poisonous or contaminated that I recall. Even if I did, I didn't have any symptoms leading up to pooping myself to death. It was just "End turn -> Death by Diarrhea"
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Aug 5, 2012 07:19
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The Cheshire Cat posted:I hate to double post but my last post was a while ago so I don't want to just keep tacking on more edits. I just ran into a rather amusing bug: I've had this happen more than once. Every time I've blamed me accidentally drinking unpurified water, which is something that is way too easy to do in the current UI. I assume eventually it will be a condition that you have to treat rather than a "you have died" screen, but yeah, for now it's a bit annoying.
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Aug 5, 2012 12:41
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The Cheshire Cat posted:-Medkits should, instead of just being basic consumable items, be containers that spawn decently stocked with various useful medical supplies like clean bandages, different kinds of pills, etc. The current nanokit effect could still exist in the form of an autoinjector (which would also have a chance of spawning in a new medkit). The idea would be that finding a medkit would give you a nice supply base for dealing with sickness/injuries, but they'd also be pretty rare so you wouldn't be able to rely on them for the whole game. Seconding this one, I really like it. It would make more sense as part of a realistic wound treatment system than just as a magical consumable that makes you feel better.
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Aug 5, 2012 13:54
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Ahaha holy gently caress I'm in pain over here. I just imagine some hardass wasteland wanderer getting a severe case of the shits, throwing his hands up in anguish, and saying, "welp, that's it. That's my limit. I can deal with getting shot, stabbed, clawed, dehydrated, starved and irradiated, but diarrhea? gently caress this." And then he just goes and makes some squirrel snares and lives as a bitter uncontrollably making GBS threads hermit in a whiskey-filled hobo palace for the rest of his life. vvv Whiskey is the best painkiller anyway. Disinfect a cut with whiskey, drink some whiskey to manage the pain, drink water to manage the dehydration, drink whiskey to manage the hangover, drink water to manage the dehydration, and so forth. Drunkenly beat a dogman to death with a crowbar. Goto 1. vvv Angry Diplomat fucked around with this message at 09:37 on Aug 6, 2012 |
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Aug 6, 2012 09:25
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Has anybody found any aspirin or codeine at all? Like I've occasionally found whiskey but no painkillers.
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Aug 6, 2012 09:33
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