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I think the biggest thing you guys need to do, at least for me to back it, is to really sell that you'd be able to write the sequel as well as P:T. I'm not asking for a million branching paths, because not even P:T had that, but I want what P:T did so well, being able to shape the protagonist and your interactions with the characters and the world around you. Learning about the Circle of Zerthimon with Dak'kon is a great example of this. I couldn't care less about the combat as long as its serviceable and not a slog like P:T's was.
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Feb 28, 2013 19:31
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There's one very good reason why I don't mind the Torment 2 Kickstarter going up as soon as possible: Waiting until after Wasteland 2 is released will mean Torment 2 likely won't be released until at least late-summer of 2015. Doing the Kickstarter now will mean Torment 2 might be released as early as the end of 2014. Yes, I am a very impatient person.
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Feb 28, 2013 20:31
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Accordion Man posted:Learning about the Circle of Zerthimon with Dak'kon is a great example of this. Noricae fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Mar 1, 2013 |
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Mar 1, 2013 00:06
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But how would they be able to convince us? A short story or writing sample? It'll be tough to encapsulate the way it feels to get invested in a character after 10 hours of play in just a sample conversation. It also won't necessarily show off what kind of options you'd get during the dialogue. I mean that is an ideal thing to have, but we'd need some kind of context for it to actually be convincing.
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Mar 1, 2013 02:33
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Pyradox posted:But how would they be able to convince us? A short story or writing sample? It'll be tough to encapsulate the way it feels to get invested in a character after 10 hours of play in just a sample conversation. It also won't necessarily show off what kind of options you'd get during the dialogue. I mean that is an ideal thing to have, but we'd need some kind of context for it to actually be convincing. A demo script. 
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Mar 1, 2013 04:04
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Pyradox posted:But how would they be able to convince us? A short story or writing sample? It'll be tough to encapsulate the way it feels to get invested in a character after 10 hours of play in just a sample conversation. It also won't necessarily show off what kind of options you'd get during the dialogue. I mean that is an ideal thing to have, but we'd need some kind of context for it to actually be convincing.
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Mar 1, 2013 04:22
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Pyradox posted:But how would they be able to convince us? A short story or writing sample? It'll be tough to encapsulate the way it feels to get invested in a character after 10 hours of play in just a sample conversation. It also won't necessarily show off what kind of options you'd get during the dialogue. I mean that is an ideal thing to have, but we'd need some kind of context for it to actually be convincing. We got a few approaches set up for this. I think the most important thing first is convincing people of the strength of your overall vision. Overall vision does not necessarily equate good specific writing, but that's step one: show that this is a story worth telling, a completely unique, fascinating one with sweet narrative twists, and with gameplay elements embedded and entwined with that narrative. You gotta sell the overall before you sell the specifics. After that, yeah, samples, short stories, there's different approaches you can take. The difficulty with writing samples is that in isolation it often looks worse. Like, if I'm engrossed in a game then writing is just one part of it, and it's the overall experience and context that makes it shine. I've been reading some PS:T documentation and it's just like, well, viewed in isolation it's not quite as impressive. That doesn't detract from PS:T, it just shows how important the whole package is and how hard it is to showcase something in isolation. That's just my own private musings on that tho. Not looking for excuses, just noting the challenges that I've personally seen. Brother None fucked around with this message at 06:51 on Mar 1, 2013 |
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Mar 1, 2013 04:33
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Drifter posted:A demo script. $100 pledge level: text adventure version of rough script.
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Mar 1, 2013 06:35
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Accordion Man posted:I guess have more of a focus on the world and characters so far, make them sound interesting and worth experiencing. Maybe a short story or something could help. I agree it's probably not that easy to show in a Kickstarter, but I at least want something to show that the writing won't be your average video game tripe, because that's what made P:T such a beloved and memorable game. Counterpoint: If you didn't want to spoil the whole plot, The Nameless One's introduction for a Planescape: Torment kickstarter would basically be "don't worry about his general appearance being more boring and generic than Kratos from God of War, we made sure to give him the fresh new exciting character trait of amnesia". EXCITING.
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Mar 1, 2013 07:45
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Yeah it's true, and I know that since I played it whenever I mention the plot outline, or who TNO is, I mention that what really stands out how even though that's a tired trope, the game uses that and other cRPG conventions in novel and exciting ways to help tell a story. The designers were obviously very conscious of the fact that we play essentially immortal characters the way we tend to save and load in cRPGs, for instance. Amnesia, similarly, is an easy way out of the fact the player enters a story with no knowledge of where their character has come from or who he is even though he is expected to take on and shape that persona, and provides something of a blank slate for the player. The clever part of this isn't so much the commentary on these things the game offers but how it's carefully woven into the story, and the themes the game explores. It's like how a good epistolary novel exploits the fact that novels are told by the written word on the page - the people who made PS:T were very conscious that they are telling a story through a video game and have taken pains to exploit the conventions, limitations and the way the player interacts with the world to the advantage of the story. And like the point Tunahead made above, a lot of the individual elements are pretty bland if taken alone. Maybe dev diaries and the like will give a bit more of an insight into what's in store. What I'm saying is I think we should be happy these guys have looked at PS:T, have a good sense of what made it a great game, and are now saying 'yeah we want to make something like that', because so far they're doing a good job picking up on what it was that made PS:T so interesting.
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Mar 2, 2013 06:25
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Tunahead posted:Counterpoint: If you didn't want to spoil the whole plot, The Nameless One's introduction for a Planescape: Torment kickstarter would basically be "don't worry about his general appearance being more boring and generic than Kratos from God of War, we made sure to give him the fresh new exciting character trait of amnesia". EXCITING. Waking up embalmed in a morgue was pretty loving rad actually.
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Mar 2, 2013 10:00
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Tunahead posted:Counterpoint: If you didn't want to spoil the whole plot, The Nameless One's introduction for a Planescape: Torment kickstarter would basically be "don't worry about his general appearance being more boring and generic than Kratos from God of War, we made sure to give him the fresh new exciting character trait of amnesia". EXCITING. I'm sure the creators of Torment were comparing The Nameless One to Kratos 6 years before that game came out, and I agree that a heavily scarred man being woken up in a morgue by a floating skull is hella boring.
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Mar 2, 2013 11:47
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Great Rumbler posted:There's one very good reason why I don't mind the Torment 2 Kickstarter going up as soon as possible: Yeah, considering how busy I'm going to be in upcoming years with a variety of projects (and life) I'd rather get my game in earlier rather than later. Plus of course, the inevitable delays are going to be excruciating anyway, so why pile on more of them?
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Mar 2, 2013 12:51
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I think a short story or novella would be the best way to go here. Maybe 40-50 pages, introduce the world and some locations, touch on some of the major themes, and the like. It could focus on a minor character who appears briefly in the game or maybe not appear in the game at all, just create a brand new character and carry them through the arc of their own personal story. That way, you don't have to worry about spoiling part of the game or trying to properly present a slice of the game story that's devoid of its context. The story story itself would the context, since it would be self-contained.
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Mar 2, 2013 21:33
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Great Rumbler posted:I think a short story or novella would be the best way to go here. Maybe 40-50 pages, introduce the world and some locations, touch on some of the major themes, and the like. It could focus on a minor character who appears briefly in the game or maybe not appear in the game at all, just create a brand new character and carry them through the arc of their own personal story. That way, you don't have to worry about spoiling part of the game or trying to properly present a slice of the game story that's devoid of its context. The story story itself would the context, since it would be self-contained. Yeah, but no one who isn't already probably going to pledge is going to take the time to read that. Haha. That might encourage someone to increase a pledge tier or two, but really, the three to five minute video is going to make or break the Kickstarter, along with the, what, five or six paragraphs on the front page.
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Mar 2, 2013 21:58
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Aw thanks a lot thread, now I'm gonna have to play through PS:T a fifth time. I ain't got time for this poo poo. /sigh /Goes looking for the CDs.
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Mar 2, 2013 22:14
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Fargo's twitter has been strongly hinting that the Kickstarter will be happening at some point this week. Or maybe there's some other big RPG announcement coming next week that Fargo knows about, and being really dense. Both are possibilities! EDIT: I meant that I was being really dense, not Fargo. Typing after drinking is a bad idea! CottonWolf fucked around with this message at 03:53 on Mar 4, 2013 |
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Mar 4, 2013 00:44
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CottonWolf posted:Fargo's twitter has been strongly hinting that the Kickstarter will be happening at some point this week. Or maybe there's some other big RPG announcement coming next week that Fargo knows about, and being really dense. Both are possibilities! Wasteland 2 is being brought on as a launch property for the PlayStation 4. It will have to be slightly modified so the UI can work on both systems, and to include multiplayer deathmatch modes. Drifter fucked around with this message at 02:12 on Mar 4, 2013 |
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Mar 4, 2013 02:10
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CottonWolf posted:Fargo's twitter has been strongly hinting that the Kickstarter will be happening at some point this week. Or maybe there's some other big RPG announcement coming next week that Fargo knows about, and being really dense. Both are possibilities! He could be talking about the live showing of Shadowrun Returns.
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Mar 4, 2013 02:35
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edit: Also, should I bother with the PS:T thread? I'm halfway done with it, but it's a lot of work if about 10 people want to talk about itDrifter posted:Wasteland 2 is being brought on as a launch property for the PlayStation 4. Source? Twee as Fuck fucked around with this message at 03:43 on Mar 4, 2013 |
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Mar 4, 2013 03:37
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Twee as gently caress posted:edit: Also, should I bother with the PS:T thread? I'm halfway done with it, but it's a lot of work if about 10 people want to talk about it It doesn't seem to get brought up much in the Old School PC RPG Megathread, but it might do better as its own thread than it does in there.
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Mar 4, 2013 03:53
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Twee as gently caress posted:edit: Also, should I bother with the PS:T thread? I'm halfway done with it, but it's a lot of work if about 10 people want to talk about it My imagination. And a strange desire. PS:T was definitely a really good game, but I think the spread of it all is pretty covered in the obsidian thread. Can you use this one? I can imagine that when the Kickstarter starts the OP might want to link your post in to their first post or something to give people reference if they hadn't heard of it or anything. Or just start a new thread and if needed OP can link it when the time comes. Either way. Drifter fucked around with this message at 04:01 on Mar 4, 2013 |
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Mar 4, 2013 03:55
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From what I have heard and read elsewhere, the launch of the Torment 2 Kickstarter is scheduled for this Friday. (Brother None might want to correct me on that.) Funnily, that means it'll probably coincide with the reveal of Richard Garriott's mystery project, also rumored to be a Kickstarter.
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Mar 4, 2013 14:15
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CrookedB posted:Funnily, that means it'll probably coincide with the reveal of Richard Garriott's mystery project, also rumored to be a Kickstarter.  Yes!
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Mar 4, 2013 14:19
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CrookedB posted:From what I have heard and read elsewhere, the launch of the Torment 2 Kickstarter is scheduled for this Friday. (Brother None might want to correct me on that.) It's Wednesday. As mentioned here: http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/03/04/out-of-exile-torment-officially-going-to-kickstarter. Lord British is kicking off his Kickstarter on Friday. Shadowrun guys are showing a live demo of their game on Friday. Busy week! Brother None fucked around with this message at 15:24 on Mar 4, 2013 |
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Mar 4, 2013 14:33
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IGN just posted an article: inXile's Kickstarter campaign for Torment: Tides of Numenera will go live Wednesday, March 6, 2013. The target release date will be revealed then. It is currently in pre-production on PC and Mac platforms. http://uk.ign.com/articles/2013/03/04/the-strange-new-world-of-torment-tides-of-numenera?page=2
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Mar 4, 2013 15:39
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This Wednesday already? Oh my oh my. I wonder if the decision to start it so early has been influenced by Lord British's countdown. By the way there's also this article at Rock Paper Shotgun, with Chris Avellone's endorsement video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8hpnATIpqQ
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Mar 4, 2013 17:25
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CrookedB posted:This Wednesday already? Oh my oh my. I wonder if the decision to start it so early has been influenced by Lord British's countdown. Nope. We had this date targeted for some time now.
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Mar 4, 2013 17:38
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 That's some thumb Mr. Avellone.
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Mar 4, 2013 17:51
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For Project: Eternity a couple of Goons put together this Google doc https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjRsTwF0aHv6dFVwaTF1WTI5b24tbGxpQUdQNU1TSHc#gid=14 that was pretty fantastic. It ought to be fairly easy to set up something similar for the Torment Kickstarter, and I'd be willing to help out if anyone is feeling particularly  . It'd give better estimates of what kind of stretch goals Torment has a chance of hitting than Kicktraq's wildly innacurate estimates.
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Mar 4, 2013 19:33
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Great Rumbler posted:I think a short story or novella would be the best way to go here. Maybe 40-50 pages, introduce the world and some locations, touch on some of the major themes, and the like. It could focus on a minor character who appears briefly in the game or maybe not appear in the game at all, just create a brand new character and carry them through the arc of their own personal story. That way, you don't have to worry about spoiling part of the game or trying to properly present a slice of the game story that's devoid of its context. The story story itself would the context, since it would be self-contained. Monte Cook's Numenera website has a short story that introduces the setting up on it. It's here. Not exactly what you were looking for, but it might give you a feel for the world. I imagine it's pretty unlikely the Kickstarter page will link to it though.
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Mar 6, 2013 00:12
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Brian Fargo's been busy getting ready for the new campaign on Twitter recently, including posting a picture of a rather interesting sculpture:Brian Fargo posted:I was so excited when I saw this #Torment sculpture that I had to show it off. It's the First Castoff character. https://pic.twitter.com/RbWf5uQ8h3 I don't know what the hell a First Castoff character is, but considering the kickstarter will supposedly be very information-heavy I think we'll probably find out. Also this art style is really cool. It looks like he's wearing a hoodie made out of his own skin. If there's one thing I'm not even slightly worried about for Torment it's the visuals.
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Mar 6, 2013 00:59
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I kind of want to play PS:T again, but Im intimidated by having forgotten all the little tricks that make the game good. I know I want to have a high intelligence character, but are there any specific builds (or patches or add-ons) i wanna use? I havent played the game in ~10 years.
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Mar 6, 2013 01:09
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Rinkles posted:
What's wrong with his thumb? 
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Mar 6, 2013 01:11
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Fintilgin posted:What's wrong with his thumb? It has an exceptional curvature, but I've met some people with similar thumbs. Maybe I'm the one with odd thumbs? 
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Mar 6, 2013 01:14
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Rinkles posted:It has an exceptional curvature, but I've met some people with similar thumbs. Looks okay to me.  Seriously, I didn't even know there was anything unusual about my thumb until my wife said she thought it was creepy. She thinks I'm purposefully trying to gross her out if I flex my thumb or steeple my fingers. I'm just stretching. 
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Mar 6, 2013 01:21
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antidote posted:I kind of want to play PS:T again, but Im intimidated by having forgotten all the little tricks that make the game good. I know I want to have a high intelligence character, but are there any specific builds (or patches or add-ons) i wanna use? I havent played the game in ~10 years. http://www.gog.com/news/mod_spotlight_planescape_torment_mods_guide
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Mar 6, 2013 01:25
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Fintilgin posted:Looks okay to me. Yeah, I didn't even notice that was odd or anything because I'm so used to mine doing the exact same thing.
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Mar 6, 2013 01:34
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If you post a picture of someone with NES-thumbs in a thread full of old school rpg players, expect no one to think the picture is off in any way 
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Mar 6, 2013 01:40
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Pyradox posted:Yeah, I didn't even notice that was odd or anything because I'm so used to mine doing the exact same thing. It's called a hitchhiker's thumb, it's a recessive trait. There are two types of people, those with hitchhiker's thumbs, and those who go "OH GOD UGH" when you bend the thumb back 90 degrees as a stupid human trick. I thought my thumb was just like everyone's too until that happened.
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