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pokeyman posted:Is it fair to say any future podcasts you're integral to won't be on 5by5? *nailed it* I don't care about cars either but I'm happy listening to Siracusa complain about anything.
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Jan 21, 2013 19:33
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pokeyman posted:*nailed it* Same. I won't be listening to Neutral because I drive as little as possible and my dream world is one where I never have to drive again, but I like to see new things happening with him and Marco. He was expectedly great on the Crossover, sort of like a mini-Hypercritical episode (I think Jason Snell basically said as such, something like "this is what that show would have been like if you never prepared for it" or something along those lines.) Also, I love Quit! more every week, especially now that they seem to have more of a grip on caller pacing and figuring out the general flow of the show. I think it's the only 5by5 show I've listened to where Dan is there as host rather than as co-host and facilitator, and the passion he brings to it is different from anything else I've heard him on. I think he's also done a good job of believably expanding it past the original premise and exploring ways, in general, of being happy with your work. And Marco, if you're still reading this: please make a podcast app. I'd pay for it. I use Instacast right now and it's better than Apple's app but there are things about it that drive me nuts (particularly random 30-sec skips backward when resuming a podcast), and from the sound of it Downcast and other competitors have their own problems...
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Jan 21, 2013 21:50
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patricius posted:Also, I love Quit! more every week, especially now that they seem to have more of a grip on caller pacing and figuring out the general flow of the show. I think it's the only 5by5 show I've listened to where Dan is there as host rather than as co-host and facilitator, and the passion he brings to it is different from anything else I've heard him on. I think he's also done a good job of believably expanding it past the original premise and exploring ways, in general, of being happy with your work. Dan Benjamin was basically put on this earth to do Quit!. He's ferociously passionate in it - so great to listen to.
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Jan 21, 2013 21:58
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Hey guys. There's been some discussion here in the past about Roderick on the Line. Since it's not a 5by5 show, I thought it deserved its own thread. http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3530311
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Jan 25, 2013 23:23
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Lexicon posted:Dan Benjamin was basically put on this earth to do Quit!. He's ferociously passionate in it - so great to listen to. Yeah, it really resonates a lot for me being 2 years into quitting. Even made a call this last episode, successfully avoided freaking out I think. 
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Feb 2, 2013 10:58
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Anyone who misses Hypercritical or Build and Analyze might want to subscribe to Accidental Tech Podcast. While Marco, Siracusa and Casey Liss are recording Neutral (which I think is worth listening to, even though I don't give a poo poo about cars) the discussion inevitably winds up swinging towards technology sometimes. Rather than include these discussions in a car podcast, or not release them at all, Marco has started posting them in a new feed. Given the nature of the show, we probably can't expect new episodes at any regular interval, but there are already three episodes, two of which are nearly an hour long.
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Mar 5, 2013 15:04
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Diabolik900 posted:Anyone who misses Hypercritical or Build and Analyze might want to subscribe to Accidental Tech Podcast. While Marco, Siracusa and Casey Liss are recording Neutral (which I think is worth listening to, even though I don't give a poo poo about cars) the discussion inevitably winds up swinging towards technology sometimes. Rather than include these discussions in a car podcast, or not release them at all, Marco has started posting them in a new feed. Given the nature of the show, we probably can't expect new episodes at any regular interval, but there are already three episodes, two of which are nearly an hour long. Thanks so much, I had no idea these extra ones existed.
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Mar 5, 2013 15:33
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wooger posted:Thanks so much, I had no idea these extra ones existed. Marco posted a link to the first one on Twitter a few weeks ago, but I don't think the other two were posted anywhere until last night, so you weren't missing out for too long.
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Mar 5, 2013 16:23
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Diabolik900 posted:Anyone who misses Hypercritical or Build and Analyze might want to subscribe to Accidental Tech Podcast. While Marco, Siracusa and Casey Liss are recording Neutral (which I think is worth listening to, even though I don't give a poo poo about cars) the discussion inevitably winds up swinging towards technology sometimes. Rather than include these discussions in a car podcast, or not release them at all, Marco has started posting them in a new feed. Given the nature of the show, we probably can't expect new episodes at any regular interval, but there are already three episodes, two of which are nearly an hour long. Man, I miss Hypercritical so much. The Siracusian rants on this first ATP are excellent though!
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Mar 5, 2013 17:24
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Diabolik900 posted:Anyone who misses Hypercritical or Build and Analyze might want to subscribe to Accidental Tech Podcast. While Marco, Siracusa and Casey Liss are recording Neutral (which I think is worth listening to, even though I don't give a poo poo about cars) the discussion inevitably winds up swinging towards technology sometimes. Rather than include these discussions in a car podcast, or not release them at all, Marco has started posting them in a new feed. Given the nature of the show, we probably can't expect new episodes at any regular interval, but there are already three episodes, two of which are nearly an hour long. Thanks for this, I have been listening to Neutral to get my dose of Siracusa (although it is a great podcast on its own) and it's nice to know there's more out there. edit: Also, I've started listening to Quit! and it's fantastic. I don't listen to a lot of the other 5by5 podcasts so it filled a bit of a gap for me since B&A and Hypercritical shut down.
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Mar 6, 2013 00:01
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Lexicon posted:Man, I miss Hypercritical so much. The Siracusian rants on this first ATP are excellent though! I've found that Debug is a very good substitute. I'm only 3 episodes in though. Guy English is brilliant and has some great insights, and they've had a pretty solid list of guests so far too. It tends to focus more on the development side of things, but I like that kind of stuff.
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Mar 6, 2013 03:14
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So forget what I said about Accidental Tech Podcast not updating regularly. It was so well received that their doing it every week now. New url too: http://atp.fm
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Mar 12, 2013 02:44
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Diabolik900 posted:So forget what I said about Accidental Tech Podcast not updating regularly. It was so well received that their doing it every week now. New url too: http://atp.fm Can't help but feel bad for Dan Benjamin. The two best tech podcasts on his network left and merged!
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Mar 12, 2013 02:52
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It seems like 5by5 has become something of an incubation system. Hosts learn how to podcast from Dan and then eventually leave when they realize they can handle the logistics on their own without sharing the cash. I'm not casting any moral judgment on it. Dan's still got plenty of shows on a growing network and there'll always be talented folks who either don't have the fame or don't have the time to launch their podcast careers solo. Either way I'm happy to have non-car Siracusa back in my life.
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Mar 12, 2013 03:07
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Siguy posted:It seems like 5by5 has become something of an incubation system. Hosts learn how to podcast from Dan and then eventually leave when they realize they can handle the logistics on their own without sharing the cash. I'm not casting any moral judgment on it. Dan's still got plenty of shows on a growing network and there'll always be talented folks who either don't have the fame or don't have the time to launch their podcast careers solo. Totally. In the meantime, it seems like he's built up a very successful business, with or without Siracusa, etc, so good on him. And even if every show folds, he'll always have Quit!. Best show on 5by5 now IMO.
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Mar 12, 2013 03:14
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Diabolik900 posted:So forget what I said about Accidental Tech Podcast not updating regularly. It was so well received that their doing it every week now. New url too: http://atp.fm Haha the favicon 
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Mar 12, 2013 03:44
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Glad to see ATP become a regular thing. Hopefully they can keep Siracusa from doing too much planning since it's off the cuff. His best shows have been the ones where he doesn't have an agenda. (Although I did love Hypercritical it could get very formulaic when John dissected a topic to bits) Marco also posted about why ATP and Neutral aren't on 5by5 which is pretty much what I expected.
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Mar 12, 2013 05:21
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Since ATP is so off-the-cuff I think it's actually better that it stay solo, at least for now. Going with a network has benefits, and I like that all the 5by5 shows (at least the ones I listen to) have a fairly consistent form and feel to them, but they are pretty 'produced' (even the ones that sit closer to the goofy side in terms of tone, like the Frequency), on purpose. It makes sense, too, since Dan's interests are in doing a modern form of traditional talk radio, so you'd expect more structure. Even the shows that aren't hosted by Dan owe something to his editorial style. The TWiT shows are the same way--I haven't listened to them consistently in a long time, but they have their own feel to them which I'm sure has a lot to do with Leo's preferences and style. It seems like the natural form for ATP (all four of which I listened to today, good stuff, I really liked the 90s gaming discussion, brought a lot of memories back) is to be more free-flowing than that. It sounds more like an After Dark, which makes sense since it essentially started as a Neutral "after dark." We have Siracusa rants back, Quit! is still amazing, and as far as I'm concerned all is right with the world. People on Twitter trying to inject drama into this are extremely tiresome. I really want to know why Siracusa hates Python so much, though. I know why Dan does, but Siracusa's comments in ATP4 didn't really go into why. Was this covered on Hypercritical at some point? I only started listening somewhere in the 50s.
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Mar 12, 2013 23:34
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^ A lot of the salty old programmer dudes (Siracusa's generation) are really offended by Python's whitespace delimiting. I've worked with a bunch of guys in this mold, and every one of them hates python for that reason. I bet that's why he hates it.
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Mar 12, 2013 23:51
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Lexicon posted:^ A lot of the salty old programmer dudes (Siracusa's generation) are really offended by Python's whitespace delimiting. I've worked with a bunch of guys in this mold, and every one of them hates python for that reason. I bet that's why he hates it. Yeah, I was wondering if that was it... I know that's one of Dan's objections. I think Siracusa disliking something would probably be a little more substantive than that, though.
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Mar 12, 2013 23:54
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patricius posted:Yeah, I was wondering if that was it... I know that's one of Dan's objections. I think Siracusa disliking something would probably be a little more substantive than that, though. True, though he's not above a little bit of irrational dislike on occasion. I bet he does have some legitimate gripes also, whatever the case. Along similar lines, he's said that he dislikes Ruby because it makes too many of the same mistakes of its ancestors though he hasn't been specific on this either. I'd love to hear what this is. Marco, if you're reading this - at least two of us would enjoy to hear you guys talk more programming language stuff.
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Mar 13, 2013 01:14
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Someone asked Siracusa about this on Twitter today:@toph posted:@siracusa Is there somewhere you can point me that enumerates what you dislike about Python? @Siracusa posted:@toph The docs, I guess? Not actually informative, but I laughed.
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Mar 13, 2013 01:19
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I read his reasoning in that post but it still doesn't jive with me. What a network like 5by5 provides goes beyond podcast editing. Having total control? I guess that might make more sense to some degree but the podcasts that are really good are about good collaboration and repartee. The post sounded like "I used Dan to learn the stuff I didn't know and now I'm taking it all and going elsewhere." If he had said "I wanted to make a change because I hated the experience" or "I was tired of doing it." or "I hate Dan" I would have just nodded my head in understanding. This reason just seems kind of fickle and douchey.
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Mar 13, 2013 12:57
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he1ixx posted:I read his reasoning in that post but it still doesn't jive with me. What a network like 5by5 provides goes beyond podcast editing. Having total control? I guess that might make more sense to some degree but the podcasts that are really good are about good collaboration and repartee. The post sounded like "I used Dan to learn the stuff I didn't know and now I'm taking it all and going elsewhere." If he had said "I wanted to make a change because I hated the experience" or "I was tired of doing it." or "I hate Dan" I would have just nodded my head in understanding. This reason just seems kind of fickle and douchey. OK, so what does 5by5 provide beyond podcast editing? Neutral and ATP have a good repartee. I don't know how the collaboration works but what do I care if I enjoy the product? Assuming everyone got paid at 5by5, nobody used anybody beyond the usual capitalist sense.
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Mar 13, 2013 15:08
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pokeyman posted:OK, so what does 5by5 provide beyond podcast editing? Well it provides an audience, a platform (of like-minded podcasts (which also draws a bigger audience)), consistency with look-and-feel, the whole live broadcasting aspect. They manage the sponsorships, bandwidth considerations, the website, archiving, RSS feeds. Come on, you know it isn't just "podcast editing". It also gives the impression of a "family" of related things which drew me to it in the first place (and most others I know who got into 5by5 broadcasting on my recommendation). Sure in the capitalist sense, this is just fine and hunky dory. It is the sense beyond the capitalist that I'm talking about here. Loyalty, solidarity, friendship, etc. Really things that don't matter to most people, I guess. It just bugs me but clearly I'm in the minority. You can choose to not care if you just sit back and enjoy the product but I would posit that a lot of the things that we like wouldn't exist without a lot of other things existing in the first place. There would be no "Marco podcast product" without "Build and Analyze". That said, maybe Dan is a huge dick who is terrible to work with and people can't wait to get away from him. I doubt it but sits a lot better with me than the reason Marco gave in his post. I guess, unlike Siguy, I actually am casting moral judgement on it. That said, I realize I don't have any of the facts, just Marco's post which is.. like.. his opinion, man.
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Mar 13, 2013 15:27
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he1ixx posted:I read his reasoning in that post but it still doesn't jive with me. What a network like 5by5 provides goes beyond podcast editing. Having total control? I guess that might make more sense to some degree but the podcasts that are really good are about good collaboration and repartee. The post sounded like "I used Dan to learn the stuff I didn't know and now I'm taking it all and going elsewhere." If he had said "I wanted to make a change because I hated the experience" or "I was tired of doing it." or "I hate Dan" I would have just nodded my head in understanding. This reason just seems kind of fickle and douchey. I dunno - I can understand wanting to own the domain, the hosting, etc, and not having to unnecessarily share the [totally unquantifiable in my mind] profits with someone else. I've never done a podcast, and am not likely to either, but I imagine doing all the infrastructure stuff would have a certain satisfaction to it. There's a certain twinge of something in Dan's tweet about it though: https://twitter.com/danbenjamin/status/311334268016148480. Classy, but there's a note of either sadness, or regret, or annoyance. Maybe I'm reading too much into it. Lexicon fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Mar 13, 2013 |
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Mar 13, 2013 15:42
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It sounds like you're arguing with things that nobody actually said. Nobody ever said it's just about podcast editing. Marco's post specifically listed several things that 5by5 provided, and editing was only one of them. Sure, there probably wouldn't be a "Marco podcast product" without Build and Analyze, but nobody has said that there would be. I've worked at my current job for several years now and I've learned a ton here. If I were to get a new job where I applied the skills that I learned at this job, would you say I used my coworkers? And I'm not sure I even understand your point about "good collaboration and repartee". Have you listened to Neutral and ATP? I'd say that have good collaboration and repartee, and I'm not sure how being on 5by5 would really change that. I gotta recommend reading Daniel Jalkut's post about the topic. People are looking for drama where there is none.
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Mar 13, 2013 15:47
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he1ixx posted:Loyalty, solidarity, friendship, etc. Really things that don't matter to most people, I guess. It's possible you're assuming a little much about the nature of their relationship. It's entirely plausible Build & Analyze was a pure business arrangement, and switching from 5by5 to self-hosted was no different than a choice to buy Coke instead of Pepsi.
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Mar 13, 2013 15:49
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he1ixx posted:Well it provides an audience, a platform (of like-minded podcasts (which also draws a bigger audience)), consistency with look-and-feel, the whole live broadcasting aspect. They manage the sponsorships, bandwidth considerations, the website, archiving, RSS feeds. Come on, you know it isn't just "podcast editing". It also gives the impression of a "family" of related things which drew me to it in the first place (and most others I know who got into 5by5 broadcasting on my recommendation). Bandwidth, website, archiving, RSS are all easy to do yourself or to pay for. They're not what's stopping someone from starting a podcast. Sponsorships, live broadcasting, and, yes, podcast editing are the difficult parts. If joining a network helps you get that done, great! If it doesn't, great! quote:There would be no "Marco podcast product" without "Build and Analyze". And there would be no "Dan podcast network" without a dozen Marcos.
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Mar 13, 2013 16:09
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Lexicon posted:There's a certain twinge of something in Dan's tweet about it though: https://twitter.com/danbenjamin/status/311334268016148480. Classy, but there's a note of either sadness, or regret, or annoyance. Maybe I'm reading too much into it. Missed this at first. You have an extra "." at the end of your link. And I think you are reading too much into it.
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Mar 13, 2013 16:43
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Diabolik900 posted:Missed this at first. You have an extra "." at the end of your link. And I think you are reading too much into it. That's a special kind of shame I just felt: when a web developer fucks up an URL  And yeah, you're probably right.
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Mar 13, 2013 16:46
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he1ixx posted:Well it provides an audience, a platform (of like-minded podcasts (which also draws a bigger audience)), consistency with look-and-feel, the whole live broadcasting aspect. They manage the sponsorships, bandwidth considerations, the website, archiving, RSS feeds. Come on, you know it isn't just "podcast editing". The platform 5by5 offer seems to be mainly comic book podcasts these days Pretty sure look and feel are irrelevant for a podcast, especially as I subscribe and listen to them on a 3rd party podcast app. Live broadcasting is irrelevant for most if not all their listeners I suspect - I doubt they get more than 1-2% of fans listening live on 5by5, except for a post-apple-keynote broadcast. All the technical stuff you mention is trivial nowadays with services like libsyn and squarespace, so it's just the sponsorship stuff that they might actually benefit from... Seems pretty trivial for internet celebrities like Marco and John to get that too. I bet they've had tons of offers since the new podcasts were announced.
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Mar 13, 2013 17:02
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Diabolik900 posted:Missed this at first. You have an extra "." at the end of your link. And I think you are reading too much into it. In the end though, even if there was ill feelings in there, Dan's a businessman and knows better than to start a mud slinging match out in public, which would only result in BOTH brands suffering. Neither set of podcasts are going away anytime soon, so really all people need to do to support their favoured podcasts is listen to them, not get stuck manufacturing some team sport slap fight.
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Mar 13, 2013 17:40
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Yeah, even when Gruber did his thing with the Talk Show, Dan was super classy the entire time. I mean, he even did a whole podcast just about Gruber leaving and was level headed the entire time. In any case, 5by5 seems to be doing well, I'm sure moving to Austin didn't hurt. Marco just strikes me as the kind of guy who wants to be in complete control of whatever he is working on, which seems to be based on whatever itch he wants to scratch right now. He started Instapaper because he wanted a service to save URLs, turned it into a full time business. He caught the publishing itch and started The Magazine. I saw the car podcast thing coming a million miles away because of how much he talked about cars on the later B&A's. Siracusa, on the other hand, seemed like he was just getting burned out on Hypercritical because of the amount of work he put into prepping for each episode. I also wonder how much follow-up he was getting and reading through, because I feel like he was getting overwhelmed. During the lead up to WWDC and new Mac OS versions coming out you could just hear in his voice how tired he was and kinda stressed trying to get his crazy review together. It's a breath of fresh air to hear him talk with no prep on Neutral and ATP because he's so much more relaxed.
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Mar 14, 2013 00:44
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Wow, so in other news, 5by5 just bought the 70 Decibels network (!).
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Mar 14, 2013 03:50
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Lexicon posted:Wow, so in other news, 5by5 just bought the 70 Decibels network (!). I was surprised no one posted this sooner. CMD+Space is a great show, and I haven't really listened to any of their other shows, but they seem like they should fit in quite well with 5by5. I didn't realize before that Myke Hurley has a full-time job outside of podcasting. Makes it even more impressive that he was able to build 70 Decibels up as he much as he did.
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Mar 14, 2013 04:04
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Congrats to them. 5by5 is the model for people who want to do a bunch of podcasts independently. That 70dB dude did it while also working full time gives hope to us all.
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Mar 14, 2013 04:11
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Diabolik900 posted:I was surprised no one posted this sooner. CMD+Space is a great show, and I haven't really listened to any of their other shows, but they seem like they should fit in quite well with 5by5. I didn't realize before that Myke Hurley has a full-time job outside of podcasting. Makes it even more impressive that he was able to build 70 Decibels up as he much as he did. I don't know much about their other shows, but Merlin's appearance on Generational last month (I think?) was pretty great. I don't even have kids and won't have any in the foreseeable future, but I found the discussion of the sorts of things they consider in raising a kid to be a good person really thoughtful. I've been listening to Hypercritical #15 (Bridges of Siracusa County, the original) because it focuses on high-level programming languages and I thought it might reveal a bit more about how John feels about Python. It's definitely bringing back the sadness.  By the way, it seems like an unsung hero, but I've been sampling Systematic here and there when the topic/guest interests me and I really like it. There are some really interesting guests on Screen Time occasionally, too. A few weeks ago I listened to the interviews that Moisés did with Andrea Romano (voice director for almost every cartoon worth remembering over the past few decades... notably Batman TAS, Animaniacs, etc.) and they were fascinating.
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Mar 14, 2013 04:30
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Diabolik900 posted:I was surprised no one posted this sooner. CMD+Space is a great show, and I haven't really listened to any of their other shows, but they seem like they should fit in quite well with 5by5. I didn't realize before that Myke Hurley has a full-time job outside of podcasting. Makes it even more impressive that he was able to build 70 Decibels up as he much as he did. Yeah - he comes home from a marketing job all day and then fires up Skype most nights apparently. Pretty impressive...
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Mar 14, 2013 04:33
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patricius posted:I don't know much about their other shows, but Merlin's appearance on Generational last month (I think?) was pretty great. I don't even have kids and won't have any in the foreseeable future, but I found the discussion of the sorts of things they consider in raising a kid to be a good person really thoughtful. Merlin on Gabe's show was incredible. I have liked Generational since the beginning since he and I are kindred spirits. I was a guest on episodes 19 and 22 so I guess this means I somehow made it on to the 5by5 network in a roundabout way?  Generational #24 (text editor show with Dr. Drang, David Sparks and Brett Terpstra) is pretty epic. I'm glad for Gabe and the 70db crew. I like a lot of what they have going on there.The last Systematic with Rob Corddry was pretty great. Lots of good apps discussed.
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Mar 14, 2013 12:49
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