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So all the L5R talk going on in TG made me finally buy the core book and I'm really glad I did. Aside from all the convoluted metaplot which I'm intending to basically ignore because it's really hard to know what I could do with a lot of it going just off the short blurbs in the history chapter, Rokugan feels like a really fun setting to game in and it's great how all the player options presented give a lot of variety but still convey boundaries of what you're allowed to be as a samurai. I do have one question, though - how do the Spider Clan fit into Rokugani society? Do they all claim to be from other clans? Is the Spider Clan's existence public knowledge, and if it is how do the legitimate clans handle them? I like the concept of the Spider clan but I'm not sure how they'd work in play, especially when you have one Spider PC amongst a mixed group.
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Mar 28, 2013 21:53
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1st Stage Midboss posted:So all the L5R talk going on in TG made me finally buy the core book and I'm really glad I did. Aside from all the convoluted metaplot which I'm intending to basically ignore because it's really hard to know what I could do with a lot of it going just off the short blurbs in the history chapter, Rokugan feels like a really fun setting to game in and it's great how all the player options presented give a lot of variety but still convey boundaries of what you're allowed to be as a samurai. I do have one question, though - how do the Spider Clan fit into Rokugani society? Do they all claim to be from other clans? Is the Spider Clan's existence public knowledge, and if it is how do the legitimate clans handle them? I like the concept of the Spider clan but I'm not sure how they'd work in play, especially when you have one Spider PC amongst a mixed group. The status of the Spider Clan shifts during the ccg plot. Rather than explain it all, I will just show the various states of said clan and you can do whatever you want. 1- Not a clan at all, but an slightly organized group of tainted Samurai (ie - The Lost). They would be kill on sight at this point. 2- They identify themselves as a clan, but the Empire sees them just as a group of Ronin (Early Spider Clan). Their tainted status is hidden. If one member was found tainted, they are spread out enough to not implicate the entire group as tainted. 3- An official Clan (Spider Clan now). What happens to their tainted members is up to you. Officially, all tainted members were sent to the Colonies to conquer it. So with 1, they aren't going to fit in at all. Unless you run an all Shadowlands group, no right minded samurai would group with them. This is when they start taking the Daigotsu Name. Others might claim to still be from an official Great Clan. With 2, they've settled into their Family groups, but aren't going to use them in public. They're ronin. With 3, it's completely out in the open. They worship Fu Leng, are a Great Clan, and have the Empress's blessing. But everyone else doesn't like them very much and probably looks for excuses to kill them. jadarx fucked around with this message at 22:11 on Mar 28, 2013 |
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Mar 28, 2013 22:03
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jadarx posted:The status of the Spider Clan shifts during the ccg plot. Rather than explain it all, I will just show the various states of said clan and you can do whatever you want. As for an explanation of 3: basically their clan's founder, Daigotsu (one of the CCG's darlings), dethroned Fu Leng to become Devil 2: Devil Harder, redefined what the Taint can do just because, and then used these powers to almost singlehandedly kick Totally Not India's goddess of destruction Kali-Ma out of Rokugan at the end of the last major CCG metaplot event, basically requiring the Empress to grant Spider official Clan status as a reward for saving Rokugan's rear end. All the members were double and triple-checked for Taint, and anyone who pinged positive was shipped off to be settlers in the Ivory Kingdom Colonies, with Dragon missionaries watching them to make sure they don't do anything shifty. Yeah... things got a bit weird.
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Mar 29, 2013 03:37
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Alien Rope Burn posted:It's basically classic samurai stories only with much more in terms of fantasy and some Western aspects mixed in. It's more inspired by period Japanese dramas than really trying to ape them, and it's really become its own thing than easily comparable to anything else. This in particular makes a lot of the earlier books kinda hard to read at times. There's very much a outsider looking in Japanophile skew to a lot of the setting material. One example is how heavily the books throw around the term 'Eta' for the lowest caste. Technically correct for the time period but horrendously offensive, it literally means "useless pile of poo poo".
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Mar 29, 2013 03:51
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Macdeo Lurjtux posted:This in particular makes a lot of the earlier books kinda hard to read at times. There's very much a outsider looking in Japanophile skew to a lot of the setting material. One example is how heavily the books throw around the term 'Eta' for the lowest caste. Technically correct for the time period but horrendously offensive, it literally means "useless pile of poo poo". Yeah, it's problematic, but the whole social system of Rokugan is immensely unjust and classist, which is pretty much a given for that sort of setting anyway. But it's particularly unfortunate that some earlier material literally took it at face value and made peasants inferior to play, as I recently mentioned over in F&F. The family bonuses I'm willing to live with, but otherwise I think player characters should be at least rough equivalents. The samurai don't really resemble historical samurai; I generally refer to them outside of the game's context as "mythical" samurai, as they're based more on tales and movies than anything else. (This isn't necessarily bad, but it's important to make that distinction.) 1st Stage Midboss posted:I like the concept of the Spider clan but I'm not sure how they'd work in play, especially when you have one Spider PC amongst a mixed group. If I use the Spider Clan it'd probably be as more of a subtle secret society; I like some of the ideas behind it, but having festering samurai in a spiky fort eating human flesh with bone chopsticks while red lightning strikes the earth* is a bit more metal than I necessarily need from my Rokugan. But I can see the appeal. Granted, they can be way more subtle and playable - they have an entire focus on infiltrators that can fit into Rokugan - but you still have the folks that put on their human skin one leg at a time*.  * I want to point out that's all from various canon portrayals. No exaggeration.
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Mar 29, 2013 05:35
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Oh, I get the caste system and m fine with it. But don't use a real life ethnic slur to get it across, it's like if Deadlands threw friend of the family all over the place.
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Mar 29, 2013 20:26
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Alien Rope Burn posted:If I use the Spider Clan it'd probably be as more of a subtle secret society; I like some of the ideas behind it, but having festering samurai in a spiky fort eating human flesh with bone chopsticks while red lightning strikes the earth
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Mar 29, 2013 21:10
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The main problem is largely that a Daigotsu Bushi is encouraged to get as much taint as they can handle because it gives more mechanical benefits for them. Chuda Shugenja actually are good at reducing the Taint they gain, and Daigotsu Courtiers don't have any bonuses from Taint and are good at hiding it. Order of the Spider Monks get bonuses from Taint, like the Daigotsu Bushi.
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Mar 29, 2013 21:26
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Mors Rattus posted:Order of the Spider Monks get bonuses from Taint, like the Daigotsu Bushi. And the monks can take the Dark Paragon advanced class and actually SPEND taint.
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Mar 30, 2013 09:29
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I thought Monks were masters of taint-punching?
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Mar 30, 2013 15:17
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Spider monks are also kensai duel wielding what every they please. They even had an oni monk kensai. Enlightenment through confrontation is a valid philosophy in monk eyes.
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Apr 1, 2013 07:02
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An interesting anecdote:John Wick posted:The problem of breaking the rules. Even Steve Jackson is hesitant about putting sexually explicit material in his GURPS books. It’s a decision I can completely understand. After all, at AEG, my boss – John Zinser – made it simple and clear: No Sex. No Pregnancy. No Babies. Of course, we broke that rule a couple times, but every time we did (okay, not every time) I told him about it, explained why it was necessary and he either agreed or disagreed. John Wick posted:By now, you know that I don’t like to compromise when I don’t have to. When it’s necessary, I’m Compromise Daddy (note: no homosexual samurai in Rokugan).
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Apr 5, 2013 17:25
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Alien Rope Burn posted:An interesting anecdote: That rule more or less exists to this day. AEG is many things but progressive is not one of them. Hey, it's a thread. I know there are a few regular CCG tournament players on this site who know me, but, hey, I "worked" for them for years. Anyone have any questions about L5R?
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Apr 5, 2013 17:56
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Sega 32X posted:Hey, it's a thread. I know there are a few regular CCG tournament players on this site who know me, but, hey, I "worked" for them for years. Anyone have any questions about L5R? If you won't mind me asking - so I know what to ask about - what was your position? What'd you do?
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Apr 5, 2013 18:02
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Alien Rope Burn posted:If you won't mind me asking - so I know what to ask about - what was your position? What'd you do? I playtested, was on the story team for an arc and a half, and wrote for a few of the 3E-era RPG books. (I had no involvement in 4E except for early playtesting -- but it is by far the best version of the RPG ever.) I also played the CCG at a tournament level for over a decade.
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Apr 5, 2013 18:08
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Sega 32X posted:I playtested, was on the story team for an arc and a half, and wrote for a few of the 3E-era RPG books. (I had no involvement in 4E except for early playtesting -- but it is by far the best version of the RPG ever.) I also played the CCG at a tournament level for over a decade. What is your opinion on emperor edition and the rumor that Ivory is going to slow the game down so you would win on turn 7-8 instead of 4-5. Also Austin Kotei this year is having a full RPG event because it is taking place at a con and has things for all three days.
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Apr 6, 2013 06:22
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Sega 32X posted:I playtested, was on the story team for an arc and a half, and wrote for a few of the 3E-era RPG books. (I had no involvement in 4E except for early playtesting -- but it is by far the best version of the RPG ever.) I also played the CCG at a tournament level for over a decade. How much of the story is in planned out in advance, and how much is left open for tournament determination and other elements? Does it pretty much go as planned, or does it diverge significantly from how it's laid out? As far as tournaments, are the possible outcomes predetermined? I remember the impressive ad sheet for the Keeper of the Five Rings / Lotus Edition Gen Con tournament with its myriad possible results laid out - was that just a promotional element, or are events really laid out like that?
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Apr 6, 2013 07:21
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Alien Rope Burn posted:An interesting anecdote: That's really weird because even the most conservative Japanese historian freely admits that, like most every warrior culture, homosexuality was rather commonly accepted as A Thing, and among the samurai especially sexual relations between master and student fairly common. Like, Spartans, Samurai, that whole kinda male dominated warrior culture with regressive views on women, really common for two dudes to bone down, and in a game with such a focus on the struggle you face with honor and duty versus your true desires, that even includes a 'loveless marriage' disadvantage, you'd at least expect there to not be an active policy AGAINST talking about homosexuality.
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Apr 6, 2013 07:34
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Fallorn posted:What is your opinion on emperor edition and the rumor that Ivory is going to slow the game down so you would win on turn 7-8 instead of 4-5. Also Austin Kotei this year is having a full RPG event because it is taking place at a con and has things for all three days. I know absolutely nothing about the Ivory or whatever; I stopped playing half way through Celestial and, as a result, my interest in working on the story waned as well. I haven't even followed CCG news in months, the sets don't look interesting to me (my favorite formats were the end of Jade, the first half of Diamond, and most of Samurai -- the first two contained lots of choice in a broad control/military/honor-or-enlightenment clock/combo environments without much recursion, and the latter was my introduction to modern trait-and-theme design before it started feeling boring and limited to me). The latter sounds a bit familiar -- Gencon and even Origins used to have storyline-effecting LARPS; they were actually my introduction to the L5R RPG. I guess it could be fun?
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Apr 6, 2013 07:45
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Alien Rope Burn posted:How much of the story is in planned out in advance, and how much is left open for tournament determination and other elements? Does it pretty much go as planned, or does it diverge significantly from how it's laid out? Basically, as I remember it, there were specific beats that the story had to hit, and our job was to interpret results or fill in blanks. For example, the story may be "a great hero kills this bad guy" and the story would be mostly planned out, with specific scenes thought up for most clans, but whoever was assigned that story would hammer things out. I was given a lot of autonomy, I think because I was the new guy and partially because I was the least involved, to make my own single story arc for a clan. We typically had fiction schedules planned a couple months in advance with a rough outline as to what it was going to be about, and then filled in details based on tournament results. I recall that during my tenure, we wanted to have more small/medium-sized tourney results reflect on cards rather than fiction -- hence tournaments where winners got to claim wacky traits. Sometimes, we would be asked to incorporate ideas from design or the business end in the stories, but Shawn is pretty good at protecting his team's autonomy. For example, my big Bayushi Paneki fiction includes a few lines that went nowhere and don't make sense because they were going to lead into a product that never materialized (which the Paneki card was supposed to be packaged with as a promo) -- that makes me a little sad because most of my L5R fictions I don't think are very good (I was trying too hard to reference the writing styles of previous writers in a few of them), but I felt that one was, and that stuff really jumps out at me after the fact. For the two big arc-enders right before and after my tenure on the team, the overall arc was pretty much designed when we started, but with branching results based on whatever wacky metagame thing design/management came up with. I remember being kinda mad at the metagame Kotei stuff, because it was really complicated and didn't lend itself to results that were as obvious as the storyteam's proposed plan (which involved big clan-specific badguys for each clan to oppose, which was the initial pitch for the Destroyer arc that didn't exactly pan out). I was on the team at a weird time, since I started right at the end of Samurai and left right before the end of Celestial and the time jump, so I didn't get to have my long-term plans pan out so much.
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Apr 6, 2013 07:59
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Sega 32X posted:For example, my big Bayushi Paneki fiction includes a few lines that went nowhere and don't make sense because they were going to lead into a product that never materialized (which the Paneki card was supposed to be packaged with as a promo) -- that makes me a little sad because most of my L5R fictions I don't think are very good (I was trying too hard to reference the writing styles of previous writers in a few of them), but I felt that one was, and that stuff really jumps out at me after the fact. What product was that, if you can say? I've always been curious as to just how few spinoffs Legend of the Five Rings has gotten despite its age - not to say it hasn't gotten a fair number - but that AEG has always seemed to struggle to market the setting more broadly. Sega 32X posted:For the two big arc-enders right before and after my tenure on the team, the overall arc was pretty much designed when we started, but with branching results based on whatever wacky metagame thing design/management came up with. I remember being kinda mad at the metagame Kotei stuff, because it was really complicated and didn't lend itself to results that were as obvious as the storyteam's proposed plan (which involved big clan-specific badguys for each clan to oppose, which was the initial pitch for the Destroyer arc that didn't exactly pan out). Who were those badguys going to be? I admit only being familiar with broad swaths of the Destroyer arc, but would those be additional villains akin to the Ghul Lord or the Ebon Daughter?
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Apr 6, 2013 08:12
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Alien Rope Burn posted:What product was that, if you can say? I've always been curious as to just how few spinoffs Legend of the Five Rings has gotten despite its age - not to say it hasn't gotten a fair number - but that AEG has always seemed to struggle to market the setting more broadly. It was a Tomb of Iuchiban-related product, a board game or something. Alien Rope Burn posted:Who were those badguys going to be? I admit only being familiar with broad swaths of the Destroyer arc, but would those be additional villains akin to the Ghul Lord or the Ebon Daughter? Exactly. The Yakamo Oni was one I was particularly excited about; there was to be one for each clan. I think maybe one of the Dark Oracles, the weird kid from LBS that believed in every god and gained powers from them, some sort of Yodatai general, things of that sort. You can see hints of it in some characters and fictions -- the Dark Daughter, the Ghoul Lord, the First Rakshasa. They decided to go with the big complicated map metagame instead. Sega 32X fucked around with this message at 08:28 on Apr 6, 2013 |
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Apr 6, 2013 08:23
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Tatum Girlparts posted:That's really weird because even the most conservative Japanese historian freely admits that, like most every warrior culture, homosexuality was rather commonly accepted as A Thing, and among the samurai especially sexual relations between master and student fairly common. The unfortunate thing about the accepted samurai tradition of homosexuality in ancient Japan is that it frequently blurs the line with pederasty. It was basically an apprentice / teacher relationship where the idea was that the two entered an exclusive relationship, and the apprentice was supposed to submit to the teacher's romantic and/or sexual desires. The relationship was supposed to end upon the apprentice's coming of age ceremony and lead to a lifelong "brotherhood" of sorts; it was not acceptable for two adult men to be in a relationship for the most part, though things get much more complicated once you get into the traditions of middle and lower classes. In the Edo period it was highly romanticized by some - I remember reading of a book by a samurai that declared that this was the only "true" love, and that sex with women was just for baby-making. That's not to say that's the only permutation of homosexuality in ancient Japan, it's not by far, just the form that was widely accepted amongst the samurai class. Buddhist monks had a similar tradition as well. Obviously, the whole thing isn't going to be suitable for modern RPGs; it's regressive, exploitative, and most likely abusive. If Rokugan is going to have homosexuality, you'd just have to invoke the Rokugan, not Japan clause, and have it resemble our modern, healthy homosexual traditions, or at least be similar to the geisha-samurai relationship for married samurai. And now I can't help but think that's what Yoda meant about being "too old to begin the training".  On a lighter note... Sega 32X posted:Exactly. The Yakamo Oni was one I was particularly excited about; there was to be one for each clan. I think maybe one of the Dark Oracles, the weird kid from LBS that believed in every god and gained powers from them, some sort of Yodatai general, things of that sort. You can see hints of it in some characters and fictions -- the Dark Daughter, the Ghoul Lord, the First Rakshasa. They decided to go with the big complicated map metagame instead. Was the Ivory Kingdoms ever detailed at all behind the scenes? That is, beyond the material we got in the Complete Exotic Arms Guide? It's a bit disappointing that now that it's basically destroyed, we're not likely to get further details on it as a living culture, and I was a bit curious for some upcoming game ideas.
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Apr 6, 2013 19:53
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Sega 32X posted:It was a Tomb of Iuchiban-related product, a board game or something. Probably the L5R 'Tomb' boardgame reskin that has died along with 'Art of War'. Probably for the best, since Tomb wasn't very good.
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Apr 6, 2013 20:45
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The austin Kotei RPG event will be the Heroes of Rokugon story. Side Events: We are proud to announce that in conjunction with Heroes of Rokugan, we will be running a HoR political interactive module over the course of the entire Wargamescon convention. (Exact scheduling for sessions and the exact time of the political module will follow) Mainly because the people running it love the RPG, they will also have a shiro no big deck and l5r diskwars because they have a full set and its at a wargames con.
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Apr 8, 2013 17:11
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Imperial Histories 2 should be hitting stores late this month. The distributor my FLGS deals with has the date April 29th listed, ymmv.
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Apr 10, 2013 19:18
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Just throwing this out there: I finished the layout for The Book of Fire just a few days ago, and it should go to print any day now. Expect a corresponding product page on the AEG site sometime in the near future. Not sure when it will actually go on sale, probably not until IH2 has had its adequate time in the spotlight.
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Apr 12, 2013 00:57
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Whats the delay usually between when the physical copy goes on sale and the digital version?
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Apr 12, 2013 12:47
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Spookyelectric posted:Just throwing this out there: I finished the layout for The Book of Fire just a few days ago, and it should go to print any day now. Expect a corresponding product page on the AEG site sometime in the near future. Thanks! I was curious, since Shawn mentioned it would be wrapped up early this month. As exciting as Imperial Histories has been, I admit I'm looking more forward to Book of Fire, since it'll provide a lot more immediate utility. I know, utility, how droll compared to Samurai! In! Spaaaaaaace. 
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Apr 12, 2013 13:54
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Gravy Train Robber posted:Whats the delay usually between when the physical copy goes on sale and the digital version? It's usually a month or two, and that's only because of how Drive Thru handles the digital files. When I first started handling this, I'd assumed they just wanted the print-ready PDF, but that's not the case. They want all of the source files and they make their own PDF from that in-house. I was a little surprised when I learned that, but I can see why they prefer to do things that way. Alien Rope Burn posted:Thanks! I was curious, since Shawn mentioned it would be wrapped up early this month. As exciting as Imperial Histories has been, I admit I'm looking more forward to Book of Fire, since it'll provide a lot more immediate utility. I know, utility, how droll compared to Samurai! In! Spaaaaaaace. I got to write about swordsmithing and poetry, so I'm happy with it.
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Apr 12, 2013 18:04
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So, wonder how much things are going to be distracted while the Story Team leader does his big pathfinder kickstarter roll out that just finished. (a remake of an old computer game, too)
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Apr 15, 2013 08:11
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SirFozzie posted:So, wonder how much things are going to be distracted while the Story Team leader does his big pathfinder kickstarter roll out that just finished. Probably none? Shawn is pretty much a consummate professional in regards to the Story Team stuff he does, which is why he is the dude that gets paid (nowhere near enough, probably) to do story/RPG stuff for the game, and why he has been the longest-running story lead ever. I find the kickstarter stuff exciting since it's both a property he enjoys that he got the rights to and it's also the first chance, really, to see what he can do beyond the ridiculous AEG/L5R fanbase.
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Apr 15, 2013 08:32
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Help me L5R thread, you're my only hope! I'm playing a shugenja and I want to buy Chosen by the Oracles (air). My ST is half-willing to let me buy it, but he wants me to do/have something as a prerequisite. What that something is, he doesn't know. And I am not versed enough in L5R lore to have any clue either. So, any ideas of what an IR2 shugenja could do to gain the favor of the oracle of air? I am not averse to courting the dark oracle of air
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Apr 25, 2013 18:03
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Let rip the most impressive fart imaginable, thus demonstrating your mastery of the element of air. I never have serious answers to that sort of thing.
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Apr 26, 2013 00:59
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Not near my books right now, but isn't the point of "Chosen By the Oracle of..." not that you've already done something, but that you will be/do something in the future and that's the reason they're watching you?
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Apr 26, 2013 03:15
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The advantage says "For reasons beyond your understanding, you have caught the notice of one of the Oracles..." so I guess it could be a thing you have done or will do or have a talent for doing.
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Apr 26, 2013 03:35
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Yawgmoth posted:Help me L5R thread, you're my only hope! I'm playing a shugenja and I want to buy Chosen by the Oracles (air). My ST is half-willing to let me buy it, but he wants me to do/have something as a prerequisite. What that something is, he doesn't know. And I am not versed enough in L5R lore to have any clue either. If you're that tapped for ideas, I would look at what skills you have off of ref/awa and just go with 'holy poo poo I like exploded like a sixty once'.
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Apr 26, 2013 04:06
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Yawgmoth posted:Help me L5R thread, you're my only hope! I'm playing a shugenja and I want to buy Chosen by the Oracles (air). My ST is half-willing to let me buy it, but he wants me to do/have something as a prerequisite. What that something is, he doesn't know. And I am not versed enough in L5R lore to have any clue either. Allright this is what you have to do Step 1: Go to Benten Seido in Cold wind pass Step 2: Jump off the cliff like the Crane's champion daughter of legend Step 3: Very important. Don't die! (You can achieve this via being saved by the winds) For more info check page 198 of your Emeral Empire book
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Apr 26, 2013 05:03
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What catches the attention of the Oracles has always been kept awfully vague, presumably you could justify it with some amazing feat of Air (any skill using reflexes or awareness) in your past or future, or some act with a symbolic connection with Air (protecting a monastery high in the mountains, surviving a high fall, seeing through a grand deception, etc.).
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Apr 26, 2013 12:58
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Is LBS worth the $25 price tag? I'm looking for a good, Arabic setting, and I already like L5R, but that's a pretty high price tag, and I don't know how well the free conversion works.
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May 4, 2013 02:58
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