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Kay Kessler posted:Monomi suddenly transporting everyone to the island, quote:turning a chicken into a cow, quote:Monobear controlling the weather, quote:the Monozords I'm not saying that this is how it went down, or even that any of these are more likely or better than the VR explanation, but saying that's the only way to explain them is a bit presumptuous. On the flipside, so is outright dismissing the theory so easily, without even considering that the game could pull it off. There's the question of why though. If the setting is virtual, or even just in an artificial environment in some basement, there would have to be a narrative reason for it. Has the Monoworld messed up the sky that badly? Would open air make it too easy for a rescue team to fly in and save them? I can't imagine the game pulling off a twist just for the sake of a twist. CandyCrazy fucked around with this message at 01:31 on Jun 26, 2013 |
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Jun 26, 2013 01:19
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Kay Kessler posted:Honestly, the only way to explain away a lot of the stuff that's happened (Monomi suddenly transporting everyone to the island, turning a chicken into a cow, Monobear controlling the weather, the Monozords) would either be "this island is virtual" or "magic is real". Unlike in DR1, things have happened in this game that frankly just aren't possible in the established universe. "The only way to explain [transporting to the island] is VR or magic" Or a Super Highschool Level Engineer made teleporter or at some point during normal school life the kids were knocked out and dumped on a beach with the first part in the classroom being implanted/altered memories or the island is actually where the school is but the world has been flooded by Despair Group or some other such disaster or... "Monozords" Monobear was a machine in the last one and we didn't need VR to explain him. The monozords might stretch things if monobear didn't already laugh in the face of modern robotics. The chicken into a cow and weather aspects are more problematic (though if you want to you can go with the Truman show theory for the weather) but I think you can "it was an illusion" and technobabble our way arounds those at some point. We've still got a lot to learn. You don't need VR to explain all of these. You don't even need to explain some of these (the Monobeasts) thanks to previous knowledge (Monobear doesn't actually make any sense but still existed quite physically in DR1). The main problem I have though is that I don't see the narrative purpose yet and I've not seen anyone even vaguely speculate a decent reason. I know we're only on chapter two so I'm not expecting completely thought out reasoning but right now the theory feels like it's just there to explain current unanswered questions without thinking of the narrative. e;fb on pretty much every point.
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Jun 26, 2013 01:42
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There's some horror to be had in a simulation. "Guess what, you bastards! You're all in a simulation. All the fighting and sleuthing and murder you did? It's all for nothing. I'm gonna hit the reset button, and you're gonna go through it all over again with slightly different conditions. Did you know we've got data from nearly four hundred separate iterations of the island where Ibuki killed everyone to turn their bones into flutes? We thought it was pretty awesome the first time it happened- and we occasionally play that first album around the office these days- but it turns out that's just one of the more common scenarios. You know what determines that outcome? Ibuki's initial proximity to the convienence store. If she's got less than ten seconds' walk to the convienence store when the VR simulation starts, she ends up with new material for her album. Fascinating, isn't it?'
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Jun 26, 2013 01:46
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Didn't DR1 go something like: "How really doesn't matter. Why does." Not that I'm saying I wouldn't like to know how, but it just feels like the lesser of questions we could be solving. That said, I'm curious as to where Nidai is, and I imagine Komaeda is still tied up.
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Jun 26, 2013 02:45
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TroubleHalved posted:Maybe Kuzuryuu didn't say anything about the body because he was affiliated with the murderer? But I don't know how he'd benefit from keeping their secret. Maybe he thinks that the rules allow him to treat the actual murderer as a tool? He might think it's a loophole that allows both him and the murderer to get off the island if they're not found out. Now we all know that isn't the case, but who knows what's going on in Kuzuryuu's mind. It also raises the question of who'd be loyal enough to do Kuzuryuu's bidding, if he gave the order to kill someone. Personally, I think Peko did it- a baseball bat's not much different from a bokken from where I'm standing, and a three hour swim would be a great way to get rid of any bloodstains (and gently caress the VR theory), but why she'd do it on Kuzuryuu's orders (assuming she did), I'm not sure. Sure, the bokken is a stereotypical yakuza weapon (as far as I know), but unless she was raised as a childhood bodyguard or were childhood friends, I'd think the amnesia would keep them from knowing each other. CommissarMega fucked around with this message at 04:48 on Jun 26, 2013 |
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Jun 26, 2013 04:35
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e: nvm I have no reading comprehension
Miss Kalle fucked around with this message at 04:47 on Jun 26, 2013 |
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Jun 26, 2013 04:45
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I suspect Saionji. I feel like it might be sort of how Chihiro went down last game, how Mondo just lost control and he wound up dead? Maybe Koizumi told something to Saionji that upset her so much she killed her, then realizing what she did, ran away from the scene crying. Just a guess!
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Jun 26, 2013 05:22
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CommissarMega posted:Maybe he thinks that the rules allow him to treat the actual murderer as a tool? He might think it's a loophole that allows both him and the murderer to get off the island if they're not found out. Now we all know that isn't the case, but who knows what's going on in Kuzuryuu's mind. It also raises the question of who'd be loyal enough to do Kuzuryuu's bidding, if he gave the order to kill someone. But going from what we've seen of Kuzuryuu why would he care what happens to his hypothetical 'tool' his attitude screams DR1 Togami after all.
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Jun 26, 2013 05:30
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Falling Stars posted:I suspect Saionji. I feel like it might be sort of how Chihiro went down last game, how Mondo just lost control and he wound up dead? Maybe Koizumi told something to Saionji that upset her so much she killed her, then realizing what she did, ran away from the scene crying. Just a guess! Yeah. And the lesson of that whole story to the players is: Forget motive. Motive is unimportant, because while there will be a motive established, it will only come after you've proven only one person had means and opportunity. Mondo had zero motive as far as the reader could see to kill Chihiro before the case went to trial, but there he is. So don't analyse whether or not you think someone is psychologically capable of doing something, because that doesn't matter. Of course, this trial could be the exact opposite, one where the first thing you need to prove in court is that someone had a motive, but I really doubt that's gonna happen.
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Jun 26, 2013 05:31
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Yeah, it's all about opportunity. Who could have done it? How everyone figured out how Hanamura was the killer was partly process of elimination, determining that nobody else had the opportunity to kill Togami (and to do so with a skewer). So it doesn't seem like Saonji would have killed Mahiru? Could she have, though? Yes. Absolutely yes. Also, you guys Kuryuzuu is such an obvious red herring. I wouldn't be surprised if he accidentally makes himself a suspect in every case through bad luck and surliness. 
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Jun 26, 2013 05:44
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Apollove posted:But going from what we've seen of Kuzuryuu why would he care what happens to his hypothetical 'tool' his attitude screams DR1 Togami after all. Oooh, I like that theory! But how does it explain the mask? To me, the mark means the murder is tied to the killer Kirakira (somehow). Does Saionji have a connection to that? Athar1007 fucked around with this message at 06:05 on Jun 26, 2013 |
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Jun 26, 2013 05:58
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Kuzuryuu isn't really like Togami. Togami was legitimately capable of manipulating people, while Kuzuryuu makes do with threats and boasting which no one takes all that seriously because he is so tiny and adorable.
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Jun 26, 2013 06:35
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Spatula City posted:So it doesn't seem like Saonji would have killed Mahiru? Could she have, though? Yes. Absolutely yes. If there's anything Saionji is lacking, it could be means. I can entirely believe that Saionji simply lacks the physique to successfully beat Mahiru to death, even with a baseball bat. Mahiru has a good foot of height on her, and Saionji is built like a twig and wrapped up in a kimono. That's the kind of thing that could be proven in a trial.
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Jun 26, 2013 07:10
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I've noticed, looking over previous updates, that Koizumi mainly refers to the other girls by their first names, but not always. She: - calls Owari 'Akane-chan' (twice) - calls Pekoyama 'Peko-chan' (twice) - calls Tsumiki 'Tsumiki-chan' once and (later) 'Mikan-chan' once - calls Saionji 'Hiyoko-chan' (several times; the first time she addresses her by name is when she's trying to comfort her about her inability to tie her obi) - calls Nanami 'Nanami-chan' (once) And she calls Sonia 'Sonia-chan', but that doesn't tell us anything; nobody addresses Sonia by her last name. If this inconsistency is deliberate, maybe she's addressing her former classmates by first name? In that case, Owari and Pekoyama are strong candidates for being characters in Twilight Syndrome Murder Mystery. Maybe Saionji, but I feel that, given the context in which Koizumi first addressed her (and the fact that Koizumi switched fairly quickly from 'Tsumiki-chan' to 'Mikan-chan'), she could have been aiming to create a sense of familiarity rather than calling on familiarity that was already there. (EDIT: I'm overthinking this. If Koizumi's naming habits have any significance, Saionji was probably there.) If this theory holds any water, Tsumiki and Nanami are probably innocent, at least. No idea either way for Sonia. On the one hand, it seems unlikely that the princess of Novoselic attended an ordinary Japanese school before being scouted for Hope's Peak; on the other, I'm increasingly worried that Sonia might have planned this murder and called all the girls together nearby to widen the pool of suspects. Koizumi and Sonia are two of my favourites so far, so I'd hate to lose both in the same chapter. Rith fucked around with this message at 08:00 on Jun 26, 2013 |
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Jun 26, 2013 07:29
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Serious Frolicking posted:Kuzuryuu isn't really like Togami. Togami was legitimately capable of manipulating people, while Kuzuryuu makes do with threats and boasting which no one takes all that seriously because he is so tiny and adorable. I don't remember Togami ever successfully manipulating anyone not named Fukawa. I would say Kuzuryuu and Togami isn't a like because they two different motivations and only share a similar abrasive exterior. And even that is not too similar because Kuzuryuu behavior seem to be mostly just an act while Togami legitimately despised his peers.
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Jun 26, 2013 07:30
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Well Kuzuryuu probably didn't kill Mahiru personally. Maybe it has something to do with his sister? But Saionji's the only one who looks similar to him. And I think the Kirakira thing is too suspicious. Two famous high-school student serial killers in Japan that both end up in the game of mutual killing? That doesn't really make sense. TroubleHalved fucked around with this message at 08:01 on Jun 26, 2013 |
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Jun 26, 2013 07:58
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TroubleHalved posted:And I think the Kirakira thing is too suspicious. Two famous high-school student serial killers in Japan that both end up in the game of mutual killing? That doesn't really make sense. If you were an evil mastermind trying to organise games of mutual killing, serial killers would be excellent students to recruit? That assumes, of course, that someone on the inside of the despair schemes has sufficient power to affect recruitment decisions, which is the sort of information we might eventually get out of DR0...
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Jun 26, 2013 08:36
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I think we might just be seeing a scenario where someone is imitating the style of a murderer. None of the cast, save for Mikan and possibly Nagito, seem to exhibit the kind of strange traits that Fukawa had in the previous game. Speaking of, there's something I was wondering about Fukawa. Originally, I thought it was kind of odd that they never seemed all that concerned about letting a serial killer go free at the end of the game. But she never actually DOES kill anyone over the course of the game. So, maybe she got some kind of therapy or something sometime after her last few murders? I mean, she still has a split personality, but the worst she does is give someone a mild cut. Blueberry Pancakes fucked around with this message at 08:48 on Jun 26, 2013 |
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Jun 26, 2013 08:43
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Hobgoblin2099 posted:I think we might just be seeing a scenario where someone is imitating the style of a murder. None of the cast, save for Mikan and possibly Nagito, seem to exhibit the kind of strange traits that Fukawa had in the previous game. Genocider Syo only targets handsome men, and the only man in Hope's Peak that met her criteria was smart enough to not get killed.
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Jun 26, 2013 08:45
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I had always assumed she never killed him because she remembered them being classmates. She didn't seem particularly interested in murdering him aside from a few offhand comments.
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Jun 26, 2013 08:56
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Groghammer posted:Genocider Syo only targets handsome men, and the only man in Hope's Peak that met her criteria was smart enough to not get killed. Pretty much. He essentially went and turned the serial killer that would target him into his fangirl. She might have still killed him if he had given her any leeway but that wasn't who he was... I miss Fatogami. I think he would have been the best hero. Is this how fanfiction is born?  As for current affairs I have had the strong feeling for a while that Kuryuzuu wouldn't actually kill anybody. As people have said it's almost like he's too obvious... But on the other hand he is SHSL Gangster and I assume he's done some things to reach that level. What would that really entail? Leading people? He doesn't seem like the leader gangster type, or if he is he has been completely off put by being on the island. Carrying packages secretly? We have seen his terrible ability at doing that already. He also raises alarm bells that he's doing something suspicious almost every time we have seen him. So what exactly about his ability is SHSL? Killing people? I personally don't think it is but it is something to keep in mind.
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Jun 26, 2013 09:21
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I'm not sure Kirakira is a useful avenue of inquiry with the scant info we have. I want to talk about ice cream instead.orenronen posted:
So hey, funny thing about ice cream. It melts, and it does so especially quickly in warm weather (like, say, on a tropical island). If Nanami got the ice cream out before heading over to the beach house, killed Mahiru, and only then wandered over to the diner it would all turn into mush at best, and possibly into a lukewarm sludge. There's a minibar in the beach house but no freezer, so she couldn't have stored any there. If Mahiru was killed relatively recently, this might be enough to serve as Nanami's alibi. Alternatively, if we find the temperature in the minibar has been turned way down or there's a portable freezer lying around that's enough circumstantial evidence to make her very likely to be the culprit. I don't remember if anyone's mentioned this yet, but by the letter of the law it might be possible to wear a swimsuit under your clothes, commit the murder, then undress to show up at the diner in your swimsuit. The rule is that you cannot change clothes in the beach house; there is no restriction about removing clothes if you aren't replacing them. Of course, you would need a way to either dispose of your old clothes without breaking the rule against littering or a way of secretly taking them with you. We should be on the lookout for anything like that during our investigation. Also, while we're bringing up parallels to the second case in the first game let's not forget we have no idea who the first person to discover the body was, when they found it, and most importantly whether they touched any part of the crime scene (I'm assuming Saionji was the second and Souda was the third; these assumptions are reasonable but are not confirmed yet). Though Togami is gone, someone else may have taken up the SHSL Corpse Mover mantle. TheArchimage fucked around with this message at 11:01 on Jun 26, 2013 |
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Jun 26, 2013 10:02
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I thought it would be fun to eat lunch together... so I brought ice cream for everyone.
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Wait a second. Ice Cream! *Draws lines between various wall scrolls*
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Jun 26, 2013 10:36
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Voisk posted:Pretty much. He essentially went and turned the serial killer that would target him into his fangirl. She might have still killed him if he had given her any leeway but that wasn't who he was... You imply that he had an actual choice in the matter.  Syo kept her hands clean throughout the first game because making the serial killer be one of the actual killers wouldn't have been nearly as funny. Rith posted:And she calls Sonia 'Sonia-chan', but that doesn't tell us anything; nobody addresses Sonia by her last name. Which is a terrible shame.
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Jun 26, 2013 11:52
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Mazed posted:Which is a terrible shame. Life's hard enough without every conversation turning into an Abbott and Costello skit.
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Jun 26, 2013 12:24
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Mazed posted:Which is a terrible shame. Yeah but Sonia's a no-poo poo princess, and I can't think of anywhere besides Tsarist Russia where princesses ever were referred to by their surname (and they did it in Russia because the title Princess didn't mean what it means everywhere else). Also what Ratoslov said.
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Jun 27, 2013 00:43
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I'm almost completely certain that Saionji and Akane are going to be red herrings. The mask is childish and will make the trial first point to Saionji as the murderer. Her running away crying after "killing her" will be brought up. Akane is just too obvious. Making her bloody is just too easy for Dangan Ronpa, I think. The most suspicious is Peko at this point, swimming for such a long time and not finding anything. Though I suspect that there are no surrounding islands is probably going to be brought up in the future, I'm guessing she was more preoccupied with other things, such as killing her and placing the mask by the body to direct attention to Saionji.
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Jun 27, 2013 04:08
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While I don't have any theories to throw out before evidence is found, I do have a stupid drawing of Hinata I drew. So here you go. Enjoy SHSL Kickflipper from "Stupid Joke SHSL Titles My Friend And I Were Making Up"
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Jun 27, 2013 05:45
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Whatever his actual SHSL title is, it can't possibly measure up to that.
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Jun 27, 2013 09:23
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I now cant decide if a SHSL Skateboarder or SHSL Surfer would be more amusing in terms of the way they'd probably speak. Either way, great job! I like your colouring style.
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Jun 27, 2013 10:14
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Nafleky posted:SHSL Kickflipper It was the most dangerous SHSL power of them all. One that would bring ruin to *$@#^'s plans. It was decided the only option was to erase all memories leading to the ability... and make sure he never saw a board again. What match were Monobeasts to those moves? It would be like kicking candy from a baby.
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Jun 27, 2013 18:38
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I get the feeling that with the main thing behind this motivation being a video game, Nanami has got to be involved somehow. The writers of this series aren't exactly known for their subtlety. Monobear probably counted on Nanami being the only one who could finish the game and made it so that she saw something that would make her want to murder someone. E: I'm a dumbass, messed up the names. Dezmonik fucked around with this message at 06:16 on Jun 28, 2013 |
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Jun 27, 2013 19:31
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Dezmonik posted:I get the feeling that with the main thing behind this motivation being a video game, Hinami has got to be involved somehow. The writers of this series aren't exactly known for their subtlety. Monobear probably counted on Hinami being the only one who could finish the game and made it so that she saw something that would make her want to murder someone. Serious question here: do you mean Chiaki Nanami, SHSL Gamer? Shoopuf fucked around with this message at 19:38 on Jun 27, 2013 |
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Jun 27, 2013 19:35
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Dezmonik posted:I get the feeling that with the main thing behind this motivation being a video game, Hinami has got to be involved somehow. The writers of this series aren't exactly known for their subtlety. Monobear probably counted on Hinami being the only one who could finish the game and made it so that she saw something that would make her want to murder someone. Hinata didn't even really do anything if I remember correctly, and he got a game over. He didn't even get to see two of the days. The game could be rigged to show different parts depending on who plays it, but I don't think it's dependent on their ability to play said game. E: that's a drat snazzy picture
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Jun 27, 2013 20:15
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Shoopuf posted:Serious question here: do you mean Chiaki Nanami, SHSL Gamer? I think it's their ship name.
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Jun 27, 2013 20:19
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Man, was anyone else starting to feel like Koizumi was going to turn out to be the Kirigiri helper-character of this game? I have to say that one really shocked me.
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Jun 27, 2013 23:21
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Calico Heart posted:Man, was anyone else starting to feel like Koizumi was going to turn out to be the Kirigiri helper-character of this game? I have to say that one really shocked me. Nah, the game's obviously pushing Hinata, Nanami, and Nagito as the sort of main three like Naegi, Kirigiri, and Togami respectively were in the first game.
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Jun 27, 2013 23:30
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So far, at any rate. They may not play favorites or ironclad roles this time, despite the fact I want Nanami to live all the way through... I was more expecting that Koizumi's camera skills would be used during at least half the trials to help place events/evidence in proper context...though given that her camera bag and presumably the camera were missing from her death scene, they may still yet play a role.
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Jun 27, 2013 23:35
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Calico Heart posted:Man, was anyone else starting to feel like Koizumi was going to turn out to be the Kirigiri helper-character of this game? I have to say that one really shocked me. I can't say that I was but with her "Protect me" request I wasn't expecting her to die so soon. I thought they'd build her up a bit more before that gut punch. Hell, with that line I had the tiniest thought that she might kill someone. Well, that line and that she was voiced by Yuu "Incomprehensible angry screaming" Kobayashi. It's like hiring Nolan North and not having him go "No. No, no, no no, no, no! (No!)"
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Jun 27, 2013 23:41
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Calico Heart posted:Man, was anyone else starting to feel like Koizumi was going to turn out to be the Kirigiri helper-character of this game? I have to say that one really shocked me. I was expecting Koizumi to be the relatively normal, down-to-earth member of the cast, like Aoi was in the first game. I certainly wasn't expecting her to go so soon.
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Jun 27, 2013 23:59
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