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For my money... Season 1 really was appointment television. A true thriller that didn't mind going multiple episodes without an action setpiece, I can't emphasize enough how different the first season feels. Its great and by and large holds up. Season 2 demonstrates how quickly (and repeatedly) 24 would blow its load. We go from "assassinating a president" to "a nuclear bomb detonation" as the major threat. The back half of the season makes no drat sense whatsoever, but is a nice reminder that 24 isn't some conservative whackadoo fantasy. The show's roots are purely paranoia, and this is the season that had oil companies secretly lobbying the President into a middle eastern war under false pretenses. The same year America invaded Iraq. Season 3 ditches the idea of telling two "acts" each season. This time around there's a spectacularly boring first act dealing with narco terrorism that never gets off the ground. There's a fun little tangent in Mexico that's notable for being so weird, and at least bumps up the excitement. The real fun comes in the back third, with a loony Paul Blackthorne as an ex-SAS agent out to wreck Los Angeles. Its pure pulp and one of my favorite stretches of 24. Season 4 feels like the first season of the 24 we know and, well, occasionally watch. Constant action scenes propel the not-at-all interesting central plot. The writers try to mix up the usual rhythms by giving Jack a single major bad guy to take down, but instead of streamlining the narrative it does the opposite. The sheer amount of close calls and escapes the bad guy commits makes the already Keystone Cops at CTU look amazingly incompetent. Its also the first season to try and advertise as an "All new, all different 24" with a largely new cast. Of course, the writers slowly bring back all the fan favorites, which is both a relief and slightly disappointing. Season 5 is the show firing on all cylinders, in nearly every way possible. Much as I enjoyed Dennis Haysbert, Charles Logan is mesmerizing to watch and finally makes the shows non-Bauer scenes worth watching. Everything with Logan is riveting, and the Jack Bauer side of things ain't too shabby either. The show will eventually regret some of the choices made this year, but this is one of the few seasons that never drags. Season 6 is a goddamn mess. I'm a completionist when I watch TV - that's why I still watch How I Met Your Mother, the third season of The OC, and the last few years of Sons of Anarchy. And even they pale in comparison to the absolutely mindmeltingly awful sixth year. There's an initially compelling premise that the show junks after four episodes. A broken Jack Bauer teaming up with a shady former terrorist to stop a wave of full blown Islamic Attack - they've never quite wasted their premise so badly and for so little. Nonsensical tangents into Jack Bauer's personal life, a new cast at CTU that are so bad the show fired them all, a dull and ludicrously dumb political plot.... this is the season that nearly killed the show. 24: Redemption! Bauer shoots africans in africa for two hours! It's... okay, I guess. I don't really remember much of it at all. As I mentioned before, I really did enjoy season seven. The show sends Bauer to Washington DC, and that spruces up every aspect of the show. It feels revitalized, newly confident in a way that's great to watch. The show grapples with Bauer's penchant for torture early and often, and actually manages to not go BONKERS INSANE for the first ten episodes. The plot does eventually get as large and schizophrenic as 24 often does, but the relatively quiet first act actually makes it feel earned. There are actual honest to God character arcs for someone other than Jack Bauer - Tony Almeida is the lynchpin that keeps the whole thing from falling apart. Annie Wersching is a great addition, poking and prodding Bauer in all the right ways. A lot of people can't stand the last few hours of season seven, and I've never quite figured out why. The show returns to some long dormant plot threads, including a far reaching conspiracy and Kim Bauer redeeming herself entirely. It also includes a surprisingly nuanced subplot where an islamic man offers Bauer a form of atonement for his actions that hints at the sort of murkiness that would later become Homeland's lifeblood. Season eight is like watching an exhausted, old runner struggle to finish a marathon. The first half of the season is truly dull television. Its not offensively bad, but its hard to call it anything other than utterly mediocre. The new setting of NYC completely fails to add anything new to the show, and the writers even resort to bringing back several old elements for no reason whatsoever. It really is bad. The latter half of season eight is somewhat saved by the writers realizing they were crossing the finish line. Jack truly goes full on insane, in a way I personally found believable. Stories and arcs are wrapped up rather well, all things considered.
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# ? Feb 13, 2014 02:16 |
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# ? Apr 28, 2024 22:07 |
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The first three seasons were like a little trilogy. They both tied off the Nina and Sherry storylines (great characters because you love to hate 'em for the right reasons). And am I the only one who really liked the twist halfway through season 3? (Also, other than the stuff with Kim and the weird ending, season 2 was fantastic and I won't hear otherwise.) Season 4 is where they started running out of ideas. The whole arc is "We have to get Marwan! Oh no, he's gotten away again!" but along the way, we at least got some really cool (somewhat self-contained) situations. Jack having to pretend he was robbing a liquor store or something to delay a terrorist? Intense! Jack having to prioritise saving a terrorist at the cost of a man's life! Horrifying, yet morally ambiguous. Season 5 was a little silly and they killed off too many characters and reused too many ideas. But it had some great moments and fun action. Jack Bauer versus the President was pretty cool. JohnSherman posted:Jack loses most of the people he is close to, often as a direct consequence of his actions. Renee represented his life after CTU, away from all the death and destruction that had followed him for years. Losing her meant losing this dream, and in his mind that meant he had nothing left to live for. To say that the writing was terrible because his reaction was more violent this time around is to ignore 8 seasons worth of characterization. And that's a lot of weight suddenly thrust upon Renee's shoulders, right after a string of business-as-usual for Bauer. Zypher posted:The worst of 24: And the second thing was a great moment. I totally agree with the guy who said that should've been the ending of season 5 and of the show. VagueRant fucked around with this message at 06:50 on Feb 13, 2014 |
# ? Feb 13, 2014 06:48 |
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I used to post on TelevisionWithoutPity about 24 - it was probably the first show I ever really got invested in (my household never had HBO so I only watched The Sopranos in college). And the weird thing is that despite the show having nonsensical twists and shaky moments in pretty much every season, I can STILL rattle off a good chunk of details about every season. That list image was Ricky Shroeder getting blinded by a bomb or something. It also led to me cackling like a five year old, because those last few season six episodes are epic in their awfulness.
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# ? Feb 13, 2014 07:03 |
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I'd say season 3 is probably my favorite, if only for the third act after they get back from Mexico and Chapelle's death, which is, without a single doubt, the best scene the show has ever done. That said, the first act makes no goddamn sense in hindsight. Obviously, things happened that Jack/Tony/Gael couldn't have possibly anticipated, but it's really, really hard to tell which parts went according to plan and which parts didn't. Incidentally, can anyone explain the Ricky Schroeder hate? I mean, I totally understand why season 6 sucks, but I'm curious as to why people single him out over everything else.
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# ? Feb 13, 2014 07:14 |
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My favorite part of season 6 is the fact that a nuke being detonated in an American city is pretty much forgotten about halfway through the season and is never mentioned again not once during the remainder of the series.
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# ? Feb 13, 2014 07:20 |
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BrandonGK posted:My favorite part of season 6 is the fact that a nuke being detonated in an American city is pretty much forgotten about halfway through the season and is never mentioned again not once during the remainder of the series. One thing that was fairly cool was that for a few episodes are it went off, establishing shots of the city showed the mushroom cloud gradually blowing away.
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# ? Feb 13, 2014 07:24 |
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What I liked about Season 6: 1. The first four episodes were okay, I guess. 2. Alexander Siddig 3. More Cheng Zhi (I'm a fan of Tzi Ma.) 4. Kal Penn doing his best terrorist impression and it's adorable. 5. Jack Bauer executing Fayed 6. Tom Lennox (once they downplayed his Dick Cheney role after the first few episodes and showed him being sane compared to Powers Booth.) 7. Milo getting shot in the loving face. 8. Milo getting shot in the loving face. 9. Milo getting shot in the loving face. That's about it.
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# ? Feb 13, 2014 07:25 |
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BrandonGK posted:My favorite part of season 6 is the fact that a nuke being detonated in an American city is pretty much forgotten about halfway through the season and is never mentioned again not once during the remainder of the series. I like how in Season 1 the commercial airliner being blown up is never ever mentioned again after the second episode. Not even by Palmer at his many functions that morning.
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# ? Feb 13, 2014 07:34 |
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Erin Driscoll (the CTU Director during Season 4) was just the worst. Between her total cluelessness regarding her job, stonewalling Jack & Pals at every turn for illogical reasons, and her lovely, and the painfully melodramatic schizophrenic daughter storyline, her character was just so godawful. I actually pumped my first and shouted "YES!" at the TV like an rear end in a top hat when her daughter offed herself and then she was told to go home. If I remember correctly, everyone in the SA live episode PBP thread was pretty jazzed about that suicide, too. Because General Hospital storylines don't belong on 24, especially when there are perimeters to set up to catch Habib Marwan.....OH MY GOD POOR MAN'S DARKMAN HAS A STEALTH NUCLEAR MISSILE AHHHHHHHH! Narcissus1916 posted:The sheer amount of close calls and escapes the bad guy commits makes the already Keystone Cops at CTU look amazingly incompetent. Its also the first season to try and advertise as an "All new, all different 24" with a largely new cast. Of course, the writers slowly bring back all the fan favorites, which is both a relief and slightly disappointing. Edit: Keystone Cops describes season 4 CTU perfectly. Gonz fucked around with this message at 07:48 on Feb 13, 2014 |
# ? Feb 13, 2014 07:40 |
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VagueRant posted:The first three seasons were like a little trilogy. I've always seen it that way too, and in a way 4, 5, and 6 are the next trilogy - basically the Jack vs China trilogy. Plus, it's all after Jack leaves CTU (which, by the way, Jack has not worked for CTU officially since season 3. What the hell). It's also the rise and fall of Logan (who is a fantastic character by the way and him returning was one of the better parts of S8) and the entirety of the Jack and Audrey storyline (apparently she's coming back for LAD though so...). Also agreeing that the execution of Chappelle is one of the best scenes in the entire show. It's such an impossibly desperate situation, and Paul Schultze really sells the man-contemplating-the-end-of-his-life thing. A scene I almost tear up at; it's that visceral.
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 05:49 |
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So I quit watching after the reveal in Season 4 that the first few episodes didn't matter. Did the show continue to be a hardcore justification of torture and right-wing thinking?
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 09:10 |
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LividLiquid posted:So I quit watching after the reveal in Season 4 that the first few episodes didn't matter. Are you talking about season 3? And yes, obviously.
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 09:51 |
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It's worth noting that Antonin Scalia cited 24 as a justification for torture in AN OFFICIAL RULING OF THE SUPREME COURT OF THE UNITED STATES. Jesus Christ. I love 24, but for gently caress's sake, it's fiction. They even toned down the torture in later seasons, although I don't know if it was actually for moral reasons, or it was just getting tired as a plot device.
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 10:25 |
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24 is not a rightwing fantasy. It is, however, a paranoid crazy person's fantasyland. Which means that you'll get scenes where Bauer tortures the EVIL Human rights lawyer (a tea party favorite), but you'll also have the bad guys behind several of the attacks be members of the oil and defense industries (Hi, crazy leftwingers!). In later years 24 also veered away from "torture works EVERY TIME" as a constant story source. Instead, the show spent a bit more time about the personal cost of torturing on the torturers; both Jack and Renee's stories can be read as cautionary tales about the way torturing erodes everyone involved. And to get highly academic (apologies in advance), I can't recommend this great video essay series enough. http://www.movingimagesource.us/articles/5-on-24-pt-5-citizen-20100524 Lots and lots of interesting stuff, from 24's political leanings to its place in the TV pantheon and all the ways that 24 innovated the industry.
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 11:02 |
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It is crazy to think how big of a gamble 24 was. It was the start of huge serial storytelling on network tv. I mean there were some that did it before and better (Homicide), but it was the first that was hugly popular.
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 14:41 |
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Narcissus1916 posted:
I wish they'd had a few times where someone breaks under torture and spills the plan, but later you find he was lying and just said anything to stop the torture (like what actually happens) resulting in the real plan succeeding. It would have been a nice subversion of the normal 24 "torture always works" thing.
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 17:41 |
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GAINING WEIGHT... posted:
I am way ok with this.
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 17:54 |
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James Heller posted:I am way ok with this. You know the two of them will bond over their shared love of killing everything.
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 17:55 |
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bobkatt013 posted:It is crazy to think how big of a gamble 24 was. It was the start of huge serial storytelling on network tv. I mean there were some that did it before and better (Homicide), but it was the first that was hugly popular. The show only took off in popularity during season 4 when Fox knew how to promote and air it. (Four hour premieres on two nights. No two or three week breaks. More action and explosions.) I grew sick of having to wait more than week after each week's cliffhanger, so that was a welcomed change. It didn't help that the third season was not as good as the first two. I barely wanted to see a bad cliffhanger resolved, so why should I wait three weeks? Season 4 was also the year when the show grew popular with right wingers with the help of talk radio. "Hey look there's this show where the Muslims are bad and torture works!" These were the same folks that ignored the whole S2 arc of stopping a war based on false evidence while real America was rushing to invade Iraq. I enjoyed the 4th season, but I was really put off by the portrayal of the Araz family. And the ACLU-esque lawyer that Marwan had on speed dial. The gently caress. I'll take cougar and UNCLE JACK plotlines over that. Season 4 is probably the closest the show is to how someone who's never seen the show imagines it being. Season 6 is too, to a lesser extent, though it's more of an official parody. "She can't be a terrorist! She's a registered Republican" - Milo Pressman, CTU Analyst Echo Chamber fucked around with this message at 17:57 on Feb 14, 2014 |
# ? Feb 14, 2014 17:55 |
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Jim Heller may or may not try to get Jack to buy some gold from Rosland Capital: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCJCcnhbmr0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zqZiNcVG7Q Gonz fucked around with this message at 18:02 on Feb 14, 2014 |
# ? Feb 14, 2014 17:56 |
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Spalec posted:I wish they'd had a few times where someone breaks under torture and spills the plan, but later you find he was lying and just said anything to stop the torture (like what actually happens) resulting in the real plan succeeding. It would have been a nice subversion of the normal 24 "torture always works" thing. I remember this happening once n Season 2, when they've captured Marie and they're trying to find out where the nuke's going off.
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 17:56 |
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Echo Chamber posted:The show was in constant danger of cancellation during the first season if I remember it right. I remember being one of the very few people I knew who watched it. They seriously considered changing the format for the second season. I doubt that since they ordered all 24 episodes after only 3 aired. If it was in danger of cancellation they would have ended it after 13. I think the change in format was one of the head writers ideas, and it was ignored. I mean I could understand why they would want to change it since writing a 24 season must be insane.
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 18:09 |
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ninjahedgehog posted:I remember this happening once n Season 2, when they've captured Marie and they're trying to find out where the nuke's going off. Yeah, she told Jack the bomb would go off downtown and he was basically like "nuh-uh, you're lying, therefore it must be in that hangar right over there" and it was. Gonz posted:Jim Heller may or may not try to get Jack to buy some gold from Rosland Capital: hahahaha
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# ? Feb 14, 2014 18:18 |
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First 24 Footage. I cannot wait. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=islN8Qus7hA
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# ? Mar 8, 2014 06:18 |
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Get loving HYPE AAAAAAAAAAHHHHH
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# ? Mar 8, 2014 07:05 |
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Jack Bauer is going to wreck so. many. fools.
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# ? Mar 8, 2014 08:00 |
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I'm loving pumped the show is doing London. I live in LA now, but spent two years out in a London suburb. 24 was one of a very few handful of tv shows that registered in british culture, which always struck me as hilarious. I think seeing Jack Bauer shooting the everloving gently caress out of bad guys is a universal pleasure.
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# ? Mar 8, 2014 13:13 |
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This is going to be so good. I've enjoyed every season except for 6. I rewatched Seasons 1-6 recently and I'd forgotten about so many crazy moments. Even 6 had it's good moments.
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# ? Mar 8, 2014 14:07 |
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I'm really, really looking forward to Jack Bauer screaming at a Queen's Guard. "WHO DO YOU WORK FOR?! ANSWER ME!" Just all sweaty and red-faced and hollering while the guard tries not to laugh.
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# ? Mar 9, 2014 00:36 |
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CODChimera posted:This is going to be so good. Yeah, re-watching it all at once makes it less bad, so that the why-the-hell-are-they-doing-this tangents seem shorter. But holy hell is DB Woodside a bad actor. I wonder if they killed off Wayne cause they wanted a more compelling president?
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# ? Mar 11, 2014 00:28 |
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The creators, for all their flaws, have been incredibly open about what did and did not work on 24. If you think a plot sucked, they'll usually agree. And season six started out so good - the muslim internment camps, a broken jack bauer working with a morally shady former terrorist, A rookie President trying desperately to honor his brother's legacy - there was so much potential that went utterly untapped.
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# ? Mar 11, 2014 01:57 |
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ninjahedgehog posted:It's worth noting that Antonin Scalia cited 24 as a justification for torture in AN OFFICIAL RULING OF THE SUPREME COURT OF THE UNITED STATES. No he didn't. He said that, it's a real quote, but it's not from an opinion.
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# ? Mar 11, 2014 02:02 |
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Narcissus1916 posted:The creators, for all their flaws, have been incredibly open about what did and did not work on 24. If you think a plot sucked, they'll usually agree. Season 6 had without a doubt the most 'boring' characters. Season 8 at least had Hassan (overall the second or third weakest season). I just think that having Jack's brother and father the main villains behind the biggest conspiracy to ever be on the show was one big moment. Because of the show's structure it became LITERALLY impossible to recover within the season. You can't undue damage within hours of the show. With this season's shortened structure (and less padding) this could be the best season yet. They just have to make sure they keep the core structure of the show: 1. Charismatic villains/allies. 2. Crazy- yet believable twists 3. Incomprehensible villainous plot** **this is actually the key to 24's entire success. The seasons with the least believable and most convoluted plots were the best. Any season that was just "because terrorists " came off as lame. Going over the top somehow made things better regardless if it made sense.
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# ? Mar 11, 2014 02:14 |
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CaptainHollywood posted:I just think that having Jack's brother and father the main villains behind the biggest conspiracy to ever be on the show was one big moment. I think just the fact that the villains were Jack's relatives wasn't what killed the season. Having that weird bald bluetooth guy in season 5 without an explanation and then revealing him to be Jack's estranged brother was pretty cool. It's when Jack's dad goes "well, one of my only two sons, you've done a great job with absolutely everything I asked for, but I think I'll just go ahead and kill you to protect [vague motivations related to his company]." It's like...no. No way. Sayid Ali, who was going to set off a nuke in LA in season 2, was motivated by the health and safety of his family. No way would a father kill their son in cold blood like that for no goddamned reason. So the problem was that every plot development was motivated not by "what makes sense and cohesively advances the story" but "what will shock the viewers the most". Plus, there was the ever-present 24 problem of defeating the main villain about 2/3 of the way in only to have some other tangentially related macguffin drop in out of nowhere so that the rest of the episodes could limp along to a conclusion.
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# ? Mar 12, 2014 00:51 |
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One thing that's a bit convenient in Seasons 3-6, how many non-CTU, DC-centric characters and families had ties to L.A. In Season 2, they at least had Palmer start off in Oregon. It was implied in Day 1 that the Palmers were not from California. Palmer was a senator from Maryland according to his official bio; not sure if it was confirmed on the show. In Season 3, Sherry Palmer had a home in LA for some reason. David Palmer and Keeler debated in LA, even though presidential debates are rarely in big cities like that. Alan Milliken lived in LA, but turns out Palmer's entire subplot could have been set in any city since they don't physically interact with Jack or CTU anyway. In Season 4, Heller's son had a home in LA, so it's implied they're from there. Air Force One was conveniently flying over the Mojave. In Season 5, they had the Logans come from California, and they had a nice private residence there. Wayne Palmer had an apartment in LA too. Season 6 confirmed that James Heller also lived in LA. Also Martha and Aaron Pierce were living in Caifornia... maybe he moved just for her. He was back in DC for Day 7. With a change of scenery in Seasons 7 & 8, they didn't need Taylor to be from California. I'm not complaining or anything. Just pointing it out for fun; all things considered it's obviously one of the less unrealistic things on the show. Still a bigger mystery is how Wayne Palmer ended up being president when he present at a murder/suicide. Echo Chamber fucked around with this message at 04:20 on Mar 12, 2014 |
# ? Mar 12, 2014 02:03 |
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In the show's defense, Nixon came from California so a guy based off of him being from there. Also LA is a nice place to live if you're rich.
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# ? Mar 12, 2014 02:27 |
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24 is a good example of why people talk about consistent logic over Capital L Logic. It should make no goddamn sense that Bauer can stroll into the White House while he's in DC, but its a hell of a lot more believable than all of the MANY contrivances they had to use to keep the show in LA. Washington Dc opened up a bunch of new opportunities. New York... did not.
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# ? Mar 12, 2014 12:09 |
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GAINING WEIGHT... posted:I think just the fact that the villains were Jack's relatives wasn't what killed the season. Having that weird bald bluetooth guy in season 5 without an explanation and then revealing him to be Jack's estranged brother was pretty cool. It's when Jack's dad goes "well, one of my only two sons, you've done a great job with absolutely everything I asked for, but I think I'll just go ahead and kill you to protect [vague motivations related to his company]." It's like...no. No way. Sayid Ali, who was going to set off a nuke in LA in season 2, was motivated by the health and safety of his family. No way would a father kill their son in cold blood like that for no goddamned reason. I thought he killed him since Jack was torturing him, and he did not want to be found out.
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# ? Mar 12, 2014 15:34 |
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Echo Chamber posted:One thing that's a bit convenient in Seasons 3-6, how many non-CTU, DC-centric characters and families had ties to L.A. I think the reason for a lot of these is because usually the writers hadn't finished writing the seasons by the time they started shooting. So while the Palmers never interacted directly with Jack in Seasons 2 or 3, they didn't know that, so they put them in LA in case the plot called for a face-to-face interaction. And I'll forgive season 2, because the shot of Palmer looking at the nuclear explosion out the window of Air Force One is absolutely worth it.
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# ? Mar 12, 2014 15:52 |
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# ? Apr 28, 2024 22:07 |
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ninjahedgehog posted:And I'll forgive season 2, because the shot of Palmer looking at the nuclear explosion out the window of Air Force One is absolutely worth it. I really can't remember this. Do you know what episode it was?
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# ? Mar 12, 2014 16:49 |