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Has there ever been a character more hated than Joffrey? There are going to be god damned parades in the street when he dies.
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Feb 20, 2014 09:57
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the jizz taxi posted:What makes Victarion so likable? He's a relatively simple character, and there is an enormous amounts of forward momentum in the few chapters he's had so far. Compare and contrast to the slow burn politics and brooding angst of Tyrion, Daenerys and Jon Snow.
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Feb 20, 2014 10:09
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Victarion's chapters are great, because he is a simple man of few thoughts and his chapters read exactly like that. The way that he jumps from action to action without any sense of self-reflection or foresight (or even hindsight for that matter) is really fun, and is a blast of fresh air when surrounded by deep politics and long-games. EDIT: "I must watch out for my brother's spies..." he says to the strange mute woman his brother gifted to him. Anonymous Zebra fucked around with this message at 11:20 on Feb 20, 2014 |
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Feb 20, 2014 11:17
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Your Gay Uncle posted:Has there ever been a character more hated than Joffrey? There are going to be god damned parades in the street when he dies. Joffrey's death in Game of Thrones is going to herald a new bull market/market bubble in the U.S. economy as consumer confidence skyrockets.
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Feb 20, 2014 12:06
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Your Gay Uncle posted:Has there ever been a character more hated than Joffrey? There are going to be god damned parades in the street when he dies. There are a few English soap opera actors who played straight up abusive rear end in a top hat villains and got loving death threats and yelled at in the street by viewers who can't tell the difference between reality and fantasy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trevor_Morgan_(EastEnders) quote:Alex Ferns (who played Trevor Morgan) received a death threat whilst working on EastEnders, believed by police to have been sent from a "crazed fan". He was told to take extra security precautions, including leaving the EastEnders set via the back exit, and not travelling alone.[15] Ferns was surprised by the strength of reactions to his role, and assessed that it was because of the domestic abuse: "You can have violence on screen and it's kind of an everyday thing but there's something about a man hitting a woman, within the confines of their own home, that people find hard to take."[3] The aggression directed at him by members of the public intensified following Little Mo's imprisonment, forcing Ferns to wear a disguise when travelling on the London Underground.[3]
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Feb 20, 2014 13:35
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It won't be hard at all for the show writers to make Shae's betrayal natural. She's already jealous as hell of Sansa. Just make Sansa have a little character development and become a little more accepting of Tyrion, or just make it look like she is while Shae is watching. Shae and Tyrion fight; it gets so bad that by the end it's not even clear whether they're still a thing or what. Shae storms out. Tywin or somebody working for Tywin approaches her. End scene. Boom, believable motivation for the betrayal without either one of them becoming uncharacteristically villainous (for the show versions of their characters, anyway). Easy.
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Feb 20, 2014 16:00
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loquacius posted:It won't be hard at all for the show writers to make Shae's betrayal natural. She's already jealous as hell of Sansa. Just make Sansa have a little character development and become a little more accepting of Tyrion, or just make it look like she is while Shae is watching. Shae and Tyrion fight; it gets so bad that by the end it's not even clear whether they're still a thing or what. Shae storms out. Tywin or somebody working for Tywin approaches her. End scene. Boom, believable motivation for the betrayal without either one of them becoming uncharacteristically villainous (for the show versions of their characters, anyway). Easy. All in 2 or 3 episodes? I have faith that the lead up will be satisfactory, but that's quite the arc.
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Feb 20, 2014 16:19
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Fatkraken posted:There are a few English soap opera actors who played straight up abusive rear end in a top hat villains and got loving death threats and yelled at in the street by viewers who can't tell the difference between reality and fantasy. Have their been any reports of Jack Gleeson getting this same kind of treatment? Because when I heard he was probably going to be done with acting after he's done on the show, I wondered if some of it had to do with people in public treating him lovely and him just losing his love for it.
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Feb 20, 2014 16:33
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Doesn't changing Shae's motivation for betraying Tyrion completely undermine his ADWD arc?
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Feb 20, 2014 16:34
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I really don't see this as an issue. You aren't supposed to feel alright at all about Tyrion killing Shae in the books, and it always disturbs me when I see internet comments that seem to blithely forgive Tyrion because Shea was just a "lying whore" all along or something. It's impossible to determine their precise relationship in the books because we only saw it through Tyrion's love struck eyes. No doubt it was more professional than on the show, but no matter what it was, it was over the second Tyrion was placed in irons and Shae's life placed in immediate danger. Tywin or Cersei could have had her raped, tortured, or executed with a snap. Shae is a survivor, and knew what she had to do to keep her head attached. She gave a performance in the courtroom as good as any she'd give in a bedroom, and continued to use her sexuality, the only real bargaining chip she has, to stay alive and in comfort by going to Tywin. That Tyrion couldn't see her side of it in a moment of blind rage after the numerous injustices and betrayals that fell on him is unfortunate, but it's just another chapter in the tragic world that they inhabit. It needs to be a brutal act of passion. No need to blunt the impact at all.
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Feb 20, 2014 16:40
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Officer Farva posted:Have their been any reports of Jack Gleeson getting this same kind of treatment? Because when I heard he was probably going to be done with acting after he's done on the show, I wondered if some of it had to do with people in public treating him lovely and him just losing his love for it. Actually, someone in that QnA he did at that university asked him if anyone's ever harassed him in public for being Joffrey and he said no, it's never happened. Pretty amazing, really.
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Feb 20, 2014 16:42
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Universe Master posted:I really don't see this as an issue. You aren't supposed to feel alright at all about Tyrion killing Shae in the books, and it always disturbs me when I see internet comments that seem to blithely forgive Tyrion because Shea was just a "lying whore" all along or something. It's impossible to determine their precise relationship in the books because we only saw it through Tyrion's love struck eyes. No doubt it was more professional than on the show, but no matter what it was, it was over the second Tyrion was placed in irons and Shae's life placed in immediate danger. Tywin or Cersei could have had her raped, tortured, or executed with a snap. Shae is a survivor, and knew what she had to do to keep her head attached. She gave a performance in the courtroom as good as any she'd give in a bedroom, and continued to use her sexuality, the only real bargaining chip she has, to stay alive and in comfort by going to Tywin. That Tyrion couldn't see her side of it in a moment of blind rage after the numerous injustices and betrayals that fell on him is unfortunate, but it's just another chapter in the tragic world that they inhabit. It needs to be a brutal act of passion. No need to blunt the impact at all. What about telling people about his Giant of Lannister nickname? Was that necessary to keep her head? EDIT: Double post, sorry
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Feb 20, 2014 16:45
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I read the books after watching all 3 seasons and was convinced the show would treat Shae and Tyrion's eventual arc differently. Shae seems completely genuine to me in the show, but upon rewatching season 3 recently, I noticed that Tyrion gives Shae a rather thick gold chain as a gift. Very likely it's a replacement for the hand of the king chain that was in the books (and was used to strangle Shae) instead of the pin on the show. I'd be very surprised if that's not been inserted specifically for her possible strangulation. Who does the deed though, I wonder? I do find it a bit of a stretch for Show Tyrion to go that far. It's a possibility that Tywin might be the one who kills her upon realising Shae was Tyrion's whore, who he always threatened to hang if he ever discovered her. It could go either way though, I think.
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Feb 20, 2014 16:46
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the jizz taxi posted:What makes Victarion so likable?
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Feb 20, 2014 16:53
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Universe Master posted:That Tyrion couldn't see her side of it in a moment of blind rage after the numerous injustices and betrayals that fell on him is unfortunate, but it's just another chapter in the tragic world that they inhabit. It needs to be a brutal act of passion. No need to blunt the impact at all. That's kind of the point. The Tyrion/Shae situation is supposed to mirror the Tyrion/Tysha situation; the tragedy of which being that both Tyrion and Shae/Tysha are victims of Tywin's manipulations. By making it about love and giving Tyrion/Shae agency, it relieves Tyrion of some of the inner conflict he feels about Shae's murder. Tyrion should never know if Shae loved him for real because, if she did, then he can lay most of the blame at his father's feet instead of internalizing it and allowing the doubt to gnaw away at him like it did in the books.
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Feb 20, 2014 16:53
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Universe Master posted:I really don't see this as an issue. You aren't supposed to feel alright at all about Tyrion killing Shae in the books, and it always disturbs me when I see internet comments that seem to blithely forgive Tyrion because Shea was just a "lying whore" all along or something. It's impossible to determine their precise relationship in the books because we only saw it through Tyrion's love struck eyes. No doubt it was more professional than on the show, but no matter what it was, it was over the second Tyrion was placed in irons and Shae's life placed in immediate danger. Tywin or Cersei could have had her raped, tortured, or executed with a snap. Shae is a survivor, and knew what she had to do to keep her head attached. She gave a performance in the courtroom as good as any she'd give in a bedroom, and continued to use her sexuality, the only real bargaining chip she has, to stay alive and in comfort by going to Tywin. That Tyrion couldn't see her side of it in a moment of blind rage after the numerous injustices and betrayals that fell on him is unfortunate, but it's just another chapter in the tragic world that they inhabit. It needs to be a brutal act of passion. No need to blunt the impact at all. Right, but the show has generally tried to soften Tyrion and Shae both, so my point is I wonder if they'd be willing to portray their version of Tyrion doing something like that, especially to their version of Shae, who's less petty and vindictive than the one in the books.
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Feb 20, 2014 16:55
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timp posted:What about telling people about his Giant of Lannister nickname? Was that necessary to keep her head? Quite possibly yes. She's an actress, of sorts, fulfilling the sexual fantasies of men, and she threw herself into a new role in the courtroom. They needed her to provide fantasies of a wicked dwarf monster who could be capable of regicide, and she played the role with gusto. It's the same sort of talent that has always kept her alive and in comfort.
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Feb 20, 2014 16:57
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I expect them to completely lean into the "Shae actually loves Tyrion" thing when it comes time for her death. Have Tywin bed her under a direct "you're either my whore now or you're dead" threat, have Shae legitimately glad to see Tyrion again because she assumes he's come to save her, and Tyrion snaps and kills her anyway because all he can see is that betraying whore, loving his own father now. Really amp up the tragedy of it.
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Feb 20, 2014 16:57
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Officer Farva posted:Have their been any reports of Jack Gleeson getting this same kind of treatment? Because when I heard he was probably going to be done with acting after he's done on the show, I wondered if some of it had to do with people in public treating him lovely and him just losing his love for it. Quite the contrary, he's said that one of the reasons he dislikes celebrity culture is that so many people praise and promote celebrities for the wrong reason. He seems annoyed by how often people go out of their way to treat actors as higher class citizens. It's a bit lengthy but here's the video of him discussing this topic at length: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKboLTwzFTs
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Feb 20, 2014 17:31
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I think Lena mentioned something in the commentaries about Jack getting death threats, and literally everybody who did a commentary was quick to say how great a guy Jack is in real life.
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Feb 20, 2014 17:34
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Fatkraken posted:There are a few English soap opera actors who played straight up abusive rear end in a top hat villains and got loving death threats and yelled at in the street by viewers who can't tell the difference between reality and fantasy. The actor who played Scorpio in the original Dirty Harry back in 1971 got death threats as well. I mean, how dumb do you have to be to threaten an actor because their character is a terrible person 
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Feb 20, 2014 17:42
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Irish Joe posted:I think Lena mentioned something in the commentaries about Jack getting death threats, and literally everybody who did a commentary was quick to say how great a guy Jack is in real life. Most of the commentary by the cast is just about saying how awesome whoever is currently on screen is, though...
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Feb 20, 2014 17:44
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My PIN is 4826 posted:Most of the commentary by the cast is just about saying how awesome whoever is currently on screen is, though... Which is why Liam Cunningham and Carice van Houten should just commentate everything
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Feb 20, 2014 17:48
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Universe Master posted:Quite possibly yes. She's an actress, of sorts, fulfilling the sexual fantasies of men, and she threw herself into a new role in the courtroom. They needed her to provide fantasies of a wicked dwarf monster who could be capable of regicide, and she played the role with gusto. It's the same sort of talent that has always kept her alive and in comfort. I agree that she had to sell it. But it would have been just as easy to say 'Titan of Lannister' or something just slightly different than what she always said to him in private; that way he would know that she wasn't being 100% honest and may have been able to pick up on the fact that she was being forced to testify, if that was the case. Not much sense in debating it, I guess. What happened happened. I'll just be curious to see how they handle her testimony in the show.
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Feb 20, 2014 18:40
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CapnAndy posted:He's just a big, dumb, simple brute, and in a sprawling cast full of morally grey schemers forcing you to root for six conflicting goals all at once, having one dude whose thought process is "I got a ship and a sword, imma kill everything that isn't me" is refreshing. Join the gregor fan club too please...
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Feb 20, 2014 18:41
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Lovechop posted:Which is why Liam Cunningham and Carice van Houten should just commentate everything Nikolaj Coster Waldau and Gwendoline Cristie need at least one too.
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Feb 20, 2014 18:42
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whalestory posted:Join the gregor fan club too please... I imagine a Gregor POV chapter would be the up close narration of tormenting the Riverlands mixed with the occasional "kill it" and "rape it" thoughts.
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Feb 20, 2014 19:14
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whalestory posted:Join the gregor fan club too please... Victarion is too entertainingly stupid for me to not like him.
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Feb 20, 2014 19:24
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lifts cats over head posted:I imagine a Gregor POV chapter would be the up close narration of tormenting the Riverlands mixed with the occasional "kill it" and "rape it" thoughts. Remember what the Jaime POV chapters did. If there was a Gregor POV chapter there's about a 50% chance that everyone would consider him a misunderstood tragic hero by the end of it, and that they'd be right.
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Feb 20, 2014 19:41
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Well it's already been alluded to that he's in constant agony from his migraines, though that may no longer be an issue unless he's got some serious phantom pain.
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Feb 20, 2014 20:06
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Beeez posted:Well it's already been alluded to that he's in constant agony from his migraines, though that may no longer be an issue unless he's got some serious phantom pain. Huh. I must have forgotten about this little detail. If he had a brain tumor all along he'd basically be Fantasy Junior Rennie. e: For context, Junior Rennie is a character from Under The Dome who is a fratboy who has a brain tumor and suffers from concurrent debilitating migraines and murder sprees.
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Feb 20, 2014 20:15
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loquacius posted:Remember what the Jaime POV chapters did. If there was a Gregor POV chapter there's about a 50% chance that everyone would consider him a misunderstood tragic hero by the end of it, and that they'd be right. Those children were going to burn King's Landing! You had no right to judge me, Sandor.
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Feb 20, 2014 20:15
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loquacius posted:Remember what the Jaime POV chapters did. If there was a Gregor POV chapter there's about a 50% chance that everyone would consider him a misunderstood tragic hero by the end of it, and that they'd be right. Well the Jaime POV chapters developed his character and put him through several really awful ordeals to break him from being a stereotypical good looking blonde douche. His two prison stints with the Tullys and the mercenaries broke his ego and his hand getting chopped off humbled him from being invincible with a sword. Gregor would need some crazy rear end explanations for people to start sympathizing with him.
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Feb 20, 2014 20:18
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I'm sure a flashback to his agonising death followed by his decapitation would do it. I don't want a Robert Strong POV. Unless as a prologue/epilogue one off.
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Feb 20, 2014 20:21
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Doltos posted:Well the Jaime POV chapters developed his character and put him through several really awful ordeals to break him from being a stereotypical good looking blonde douche. His two prison stints with the Tullys and the mercenaries broke his ego and his hand getting chopped off humbled him from being invincible with a sword. A POV chapter of him explaining how traumatic it was when Sandor stole his toy
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Feb 20, 2014 20:21
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Doltos posted:Gregor would need some crazy rear end explanations for people to start sympathizing with him. http://www.tubechop.com/watch/2063035
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Feb 20, 2014 21:16
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Glokta posted:I'm sure a flashback to his agonising death followed by his decapitation would do it. I would love it if we got a POV chapter from one of the undead characters, especially if they somehow retain memories of dying and/or whatever happens in between.
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Feb 20, 2014 21:31
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George has said there will be no new POV characters. I remember when I saw there was a chapter called "Cat of the Canals" I thought it would be Catelyn Stark (because she decomposed in a river... I was excited, and then super bummed that it was just Arya selling shellfish. Jon Snow is a possible undead/resurrected POV
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Feb 20, 2014 21:47
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Jon Snow becomes a white walker and infiltrates their ranks only to fall for zombie Ygritte. Later he betrays the white walkers when he won't stand menacingly on top of a frozen hillock with them.
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Feb 20, 2014 21:51
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escape artist posted:George has said there will be no new POV characters. Turns out Robert Strong is actually wearing Ned's head, so he too will just count as a revived POV 
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Feb 20, 2014 22:00
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